S14.E01: Break Down the House; S14.E02: Get Off on the Pain

[Blonde Gator]

The problem with Owen & Amelia is that they never had any chemistry to begin with, so their relationship has been forced from the beginning.   I never saw them as being anywhere near to being right for each other.

Amelia is a bundle of psychosis, and Owen is no paragon of mental health himself.  But the chemistry has always been off. 

I don't have a clue who would find Amelia's behavior remotely attractive, she bounces from hither to yon in her emotions like a ball in a pinball machine.  She's manic depressive, and massively depressing to watch (IMO).  I've never liked her character, at all....although I didn't watch PP, so maybe I'm missing part of her history.  But her Grey's personna I find to be about as palatable as Eliza Minnick's.

Owen, OTOH, I've always loved.  He's passionate about his work, and he's got a sweet heart under that tough Army guy.  Look how he brought April back to the hospital and mentored her.  I thought he worked really well with Callie Torres and the veterans.  I'd have loved to see them pair up, instead of wasting Callie's character with that insipid Penny or in the never-ending saga with Arizona.   I think Owen & Callie would have had a great run in partnership, both in their love life (kids, kids, kids) and as doctors, working with the veterans returning from the sandbox.  Missed opportunity for both characters.

I hate that the writers have turned Owen into a broody asshole, on a scale of Jon Snow in the broodiness department.  He's written dark & twisty enough right now to encompass the entire Grey's staff.  I have no interest in seeing him with Teddy, either.  They need to take him in another direction, maybe mentoring the next set of interns (and please, not these sub-I's, what a bunch of charicatures they are!).   I hope they kill Amelia off fast, the "3 Sisters Show" is one which I can definitely do without.

[Efzee]

2 hours ago, Ohwell said:

I don't think he was asserting that all of the problems were hers.  He was just trying to tell her that she needs help, which she so obviously does, whether it's the tumor or something else.  Nothing "condescending" about that IMO.

I felt the way he spoke to her and the way he phrased his words were condescending as heck. But then I've always thought he was bad at communicating in a relationship/marriage (not that Amelia is any better). His "that concerns me" could by an emotionally unstable Amelia easily be interpreted as 'OMG my family and person don't like you and that worries me' rather than him expressing his concern over the different side of herself she's showed lately (since his family and person arrived). If he'd said something along the lines of the following, it would have been a lot more mature and understanding:

"I know I've been preoccupied with Megan, but I feel like we've barely seen each other. How are you, are you feeling okay? Is this... too much? I mean, because of Derek?"

Then she could have told him that no, she's not okay and yes, it hurts because of Derek but she's also really happy for [Owen] and Megan and she's sorry that she hasn't been in to see/support them more and that she'd like to get to know his family, but right now that might be too hard on her. They could actually, you know, talk and maybe then he could suggest her getting some professional help, like therapy and maybe leave the medication out of the conversation for now unless she says something like suffering from insomnia or whatever (but mentioning any kind of medication, especially mood stabilizers, might not be the best idea right off the bat, especially not to a recovering drug addict who clearly has mental issues).

[statsgirl]

17 hours ago, only1shoe said:

 He said that "his family isn't seeing the amazing person I know you are, and that concerns me" and then he suggested she get some help

If his family isn't seeing the amazing person that she is, he should either 1) tell his family how amazing he sees her as being or 2) tell them to STFU.

Why is it Amelia's job to suck up to his family and BFF on top of dealing with her own pain and the incredibly complicated and risky surgery she's trying to do so a boy doesn't lose his quality of life?  Why isn't it enough for Owen's family that she was there when Megan arrived and then she went off to do her job?  None of them needed her and this idea that what they want is more important than Amelia herself much less the boy she's operating on is their own massive self-importance.

If Owen had been complaining about Amelia then yes, they could weigh in. But Owen gave them no indication of problems with Amelia and they decided to pass judgement anyway.  And then Owen made the burden of proving she's good enough lie with Amelia rather than Owen himself.

Quote

it wouldn't have killed her or them if she just put on a smile and stopped in for 30 seconds to say hello before telling them she had to go back to work. I'm sure Owen's family would have understood, but instead she just didn't show up at all.

I get that she's still hurting over Derek but put on a fake smile and say high to your long lost sister-in-law. Its not like a 30 second hi and bye would've killed her!

She did, she  stopped in to say hello to Megan before going to work.  Then she overheard Teddy comforting Owen and left them alone from then on.  The combination of still grieving Derek and seeing Teddy with Owen in a very intimate way caused her to check out of the situation.

As I said, it's not up to Owen's family to decide how much Amelia needs to be around, it's up to Amelia and Owen.

If Owen had come to her and told her he needed her while Megan was in surgery, I"m pretty sure she would have been there for him unless she was operating herself.  But he didn't need her (he had Mom and Teddy and Nathan and Megan herself), and she needed to be away from the situation.

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I understand Amelia being mad at Meredith for not letting her say goodbye, but it just got to be too much. Like we get it you're angry, I don't need to see you screaming at someone for the millionth time...

That's on the writers.

In many ways, Amelia is a broken person.  She saw her father killed in front of her when she was just a child, she's an ex addict, the partner she loved died, her child grew with no brain and she decided to carry him to term so he could be an organ donor, and her beloved brother who she had put in the place of her father died and she couldn't be there to help or say goodbye.

Maggie is the sister Amelia needs, not Meredith. Meredith was always too cold to understand someone like Amelia. 

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 Everything always has to be all about Amelia all the time *eyeroll*

This is Grey's Anatomy. Name me one person who doesn't act like it's always about them.  It's hard to find a more self-centred group of people on scripted TV.

How many people has Bailey or Richard or Meredith or Arizona or April or any number of other characters hurt because it's always about them?  Even Jackson turned down helping Amelia with the jaw surgery because he made it all about him and the mistake he made before.

Edited October 3, 2017 by statsgirl

[Bort]

Ok, I think the Owen vs. Amelia debate has ceased being about what happened in these episodes. Feel free to debate further in the relationships thread, but let's move the topic along to something else in here, please.

[only1shoe]

9 hours ago, Blonde Gator said:

The problem with Owen & Amelia is that they never had any chemistry to begin with, so their relationship has been forced from the beginning.   I never saw them as being anywhere near to being right for each other.

Amelia is a bundle of psychosis, and Owen is no paragon of mental health himself.  But the chemistry has always been off. 

I don't have a clue who would find Amelia's behavior remotely attractive, she bounces from hither to yon in her emotions like a ball in a pinball machine.  She's manic depressive, and massively depressing to watch (IMO).  I've never liked her character, at all....although I didn't watch PP, so maybe I'm missing part of her history.  But her Grey's personna I find to be about as palatable as Eliza Minnick's.

Owen, OTOH, I've always loved.  He's passionate about his work, and he's got a sweet heart under that tough Army guy.  Look how he brought April back to the hospital and mentored her.  I thought he worked really well with Callie Torres and the veterans.  I'd have loved to see them pair up, instead of wasting Callie's character with that insipid Penny or in the never-ending saga with Arizona.   I think Owen & Callie would have had a great run in partnership, both in their love life (kids, kids, kids) and as doctors, working with the veterans returning from the sandbox.  Missed opportunity for both characters.

I hate that the writers have turned Owen into a broody asshole, on a scale of Jon Snow in the broodiness department.  He's written dark & twisty enough right now to encompass the entire Grey's staff.  I have no interest in seeing him with Teddy, either.  They need to take him in another direction, maybe mentoring the next set of interns (and please, not these sub-I's, what a bunch of charicatures they are!).   I hope they kill Amelia off fast, the "3 Sisters Show" is one which I can definitely do without.

Omg yes I agree with everything. Except I'm not sure about Callie and Owen, I can see how they would've worked on paper but I remember they were super awkward in that "what if" episode when they were supposedly married. But who knows maybe it would've worked?

I also hate that they've made Owen completely depressed. As much as I know people here didn't like Cristina and Owen's relationship, she really made him a happier character. I feel like he hasn't actually smiled since she left! I get that Kevin Mckidd is awesome at the really emotional/sad scenes, but it gets very tiring to watch him always be so broody and depressed. I just want the poor guy to be happy for once

[cycworker]

Forgive the post above; I don't know how to delete it. 

I really enjoyed the premiere. Don't think Alex & Mer are going to end up together, thank God. I'm really starting to like her with Riggs, and I think that's where they're leaning. Don't believe he loves Megan; he's just trying to do the 'right' thing. I have to say I loved the way Meredith & Megan interacted. 

God, have I ever missed Teddy. I could genuinely be happy with Teddy & Owen leaving together. That said, I don't want Amelia to die. And I actually do like her with Owen. 

I am not going to be able to put up with Carina DeLuca for very long at all. She irritates me only slightly less than Minnick. 

Bailey felt like Bailey for the first time in a long time. 

I still don't care about Jo & Alex, but Jo, as a character, doesn't irritate me nearly as much as she used to. 

I can't get on board this Maggie/Jackson thing, and it's not just because her dad is married to his mom. 

[Maharincess]

I'm not understanding the Maggie and Jackson being step siblings thing. Have they ever done any testing to see if Maggie really is Richard's child?  From what I remember, they haven't. It seems like a half black daughter of Ellis shows up and they all just assume she's Richard's kid.  If Ellis was the kind of person to have an affair while married, maybe Richard wasn't the only one she slept with. I don't see Maggie and Jackson as step siblings at all. 

I know I've been torn a new one here over this opinion before but it's still my opinion that Maggie may not be Richard's kid and I don't know what they all assume she is. They're in a hospital but they have never said anything about DNA tests being done. 

Edited October 5, 2017 by Maharincess

[Court]

I agree with you @Maharincess that she may not be Richard's kid. I find it baffling that no paternity test was done. 

However, I still hate the Maggie/Jackson pairing. I see zero chemistry there nor do I see any evidence of either one liking the other. So I hope it doesn't happen . 

I would love if we had some Meredith/Jackson scenes as friends. Bonding over having such genius parents and their relationship with them. We should have had it seasons ago.

[Maharincess]

O

3 minutes ago, Court said:

I agree with you @Maharincess that she may not be Richard's kid. I find it baffling that no paternity test was done. 

However, I still hate the Maggie/Jackson pairing. I see zero chemistry there nor do I see any evidence of either one liking the other. So I hope it doesn't happen . 

I would love if we had some Meredith/Jackson scenes as friends. Bonding over having such genius parents and their relationship with them. We should have had it seasons ago.

This is what I mean. They're in a hospital but haven't done any testing? To me, that makes it look like it's going to come out eventually that she's not his.  Ellis was a cheating asshole so why do they all assume that Richard is the only one she cheated with? 

[HazelEyes4325]

1 hour ago, Maharincess said:

I'm not understanding the Maggie and Jackson being step siblings thing. Have they ever done any testing to see if Maggie really is Richard's child?  From what I remember, they haven't. It seems like a half black daughter of Ellis shows up and they all just assume she's Richard's kid.  If Ellis was the kind of person to have an affair while married, maybe Richard wasn't the only one she slept with. I don't see Maggie and Jackson as step siblings at all. 

I know I've been torn a new one here over this opinion before but it's still my opinion that Maggie may not be Richard's kid and I don't know what they all assume she is. They're in a hospital but they have never said anything about DNA tests being done. 

I agree that it is strange that neither Maggie nor Richard asked for a paternity test.  However, there are 2 things that are enough for me to believe that Maggie is Richard's daughter.  I think it was mentioned that Maggie, when looking for her bio-mom, had gotten her birth certificate and wouldn't it have Richard's name?  Also, there was an episode dedicated to the situation around Maggie's birth that made it clear that Ellis was pregnant with Richard's baby, Richard wouldn't leave Adele, Ellis took Meredith off to Boston, where she gave birth, put the baby up for adoption, and then have a nervous breakdown.  

Unless the show wants to hash out the Ellis back story yet again, that's enough for me.

[DearEvette]

1 hour ago, Maharincess said:

I'm not understanding the Maggie and Jackson being step siblings thing. Have they ever done any testing to see if Maggie really is Richard's child?  From what I remember, they haven't. It seems like a half black daughter of Ellis shows up and they all just assume she's Richard's kid.  If Ellis was the kind of person to have an affair while married, maybe Richard wasn't the only one she slept with. I don't see Maggie and Jackson as step siblings at all

I could understand why people might have some lingering question because this is a soap after all and people come back from the dead.  But frankly the idea of Ellis sleeping with some other black guy (never seen or even hinted at) at the exact same time she was having an affair with Richard is something that simply hasn't been supported on screen or in story canon.  Over the years the show has made pains to establish the true love, serious relationship between Richard and Ellis.  She was the only woman and he was the only black guy surgeon on staff in the early 80s.  That is what drew them together, their outsider status and working so closely together. But they were so in love they were ready to run away together and leave their spouses.  It was heavily implied in the episode with the carousel that she left anyway to go to Boston even without Richard because she was already pregnant with his kid and couldn't stay in Seattle.

Obviously, the show could retcon it. They are famous for retconning stuff for drama.  But if they do, imo, given all that they have established with the flashback episodes and Ellis' journal, it would feel like and obvious retcon for drama.

[gator12]

50 minutes ago, Court said:

However, I still hate the Maggie/Jackson pairing. I see zero chemistry there nor do I see any evidence of either one liking the other. So I hope it doesn't happen . 

 

Spoiler

Oh they are happening allright, the new showrunner said they will be funny and joyful.

All I see is no chemistry, bad acting and bad story telling. 

[taanja]

On 10/2/2017 at 4:36 PM, Madding crowd said:

You think a man who wants to be a parent is really a woman? Should all men hate children then?

Only Owen.

[KaveDweller]

On 10/5/2017 at 7:32 PM, Morksmate said:

I agree that it is strange that neither Maggie nor Richard asked for a paternity test.  However, there are 2 things that are enough for me to believe that Maggie is Richard's daughter.  I think it was mentioned that Maggie, when looking for her bio-mom, had gotten her birth certificate and wouldn't it have Richard's name?  Also, there was an episode dedicated to the situation around Maggie's birth that made it clear that Ellis was pregnant with Richard's baby, Richard wouldn't leave Adele, Ellis took Meredith off to Boston, where she gave birth, put the baby up for adoption, and then have a nervous breakdown.  

Unless the show wants to hash out the Ellis back story yet again, that's enough for me.

Maggie didn't know Richard was her father when she first showed up, so his name couldn't have been on her birth certificate (at least, not one Maggie had scene).

It's certainly plausible that Ellis slept with someone else, especially with this show's history of "twists." But, I think it was established that Ellis was in love with Richard and wasn't just sleeping around on Thatcher.  It would be a major retcon to add someone else to mix at this point.

[lavenderrose]

Great episode! Krista Vernoff is off to an entertaining start imo.

-Although Megan has every right to be angry and depressed about her condition, I like that they made her funny and insightful instead. 

-Teddy! I didn't value Teddy as a character when she was a main character, but I loved seeing a familiar face. Hate to see her return marred by Owen's "lingering" feelings for her with two marriages to his name since meeting her.

-I liked Meredith going hard for Megan. 

-They resolved Jolex's separation in 2 episodes; the new writers aren't playing around!

-I was indifferent to Meredith and Rigg's relationship and still am. I always felt like he was just someone Meredith used to pass her time. I'm okay with Meredith remaining single for however long the show goes on with the occasional fling.

-Amelia having a brain tumor still doesn't explain why she's still so unlikable though.

-Deluca's sister showing up and sweeping Arizona off her feet with her Italian accent isn't sexy. I really wish they would find an interesting woman for Arizona because Eliza and the new hot OB are just not it. It just makes me miss Callie even more.

-If Deluca's sister is an OB, why is she the one doing MRI scans and accidentally discovering tumors?? I hate that this show doesn't stick to actual job descriptions.

- I've always liked April as a character before Japril. They just bring out the worst in each other and should just remain friends and co-parent. It is sad that the first serious and mature conversation they had is being noticed by their fans; they've been portrayed together for 5 years and this is the only conversation that had them acting like adults.

-I like direct women. I love that Maggie was the one to bring up the awkwardness and not April. For folks not seeing chemistry, I think that's the point. They're literally at point zero to show how new this is for them and how to approach feelings that may or not be there. There wasn't instant chemistry with Japril; their friendship was shown developing until the bathroom moment where April snapped. I like that Maggie and Jackson are going at a slow pace and discovering that there may be more. It's awkward to think about someone you've been friends with for a period of time in a romantic light. I don't know what Maggie and Jackson will be like as a couple, but I'm looking forward to it. 

This was a great start to the season and it was entertaining. I don't know that Grey's could ever be described as "fun," but this season definitely lifted the cloud hanging over it since season 11.