Supercouple Discussion

[BuckeyeLou]

On ‎1‎/‎31‎/‎2019 at 4:56 AM, WendyCR72 said:

Oh, God no. He had a thing with Diana, Isabella (whom he started with as Roman and married as John Black; she died of cancer mere months after Brady was born), not to mention had flirtations with Yvette DuPres [who was also involved with Victor - messy], a blonde shrink whose first name was Whitney, forgot her last name...RoJohn got around while Doc was "dead"!

Here is a video with RoJohn/Isabella, a.k.a. Brady's mother:

These 2 had magical chemistry!  Such Romantic scenes(they don't seem to write romantic stories anymore), Stacey was So beautiful & Drake had that leading man chiseled face....Thanks for posting...it was neat to see these scenes again. 

[WendyCR72]

39 minutes ago, BuckeyeLou said:

These 2 had magical chemistry!  Such Romantic scenes(they don't seem to write romantic stories anymore), Stacey was So beautiful & Drake had that leading man chiseled face....Thanks for posting...it was neat to see these scenes again. 

You're welcome! I adored this pairing. So much so, I hated when Doc came back from the dead but was glad when Roman soon joined her. LOL! I miss these two. Drake is no master thespian but he sure knows how to generate chemistry.

As an aside, I wonder how two pretty decent people (John's OOC crap with Steve recently notwithstanding!) could create such a moron as Brady? (That hurt to type, but it's sadly true!)

[WendyCR72]

1 hour ago, Black Knight said:

John wasn't serious about Rebecca, though. He got involved with her as a casual rebound after the twin upsets of Isabella's death and Marlena not leaving Roman. He met and fell for Kristen while still involved with Rebecca, and Rebecca realized that Kristen was the one he had real feelings for, so she ended the fling.

Needless to say, John falling for Kristen was when she was sane and good, working as a social worker with Alice Horton! She went over the edge when she realized John still loved Marlena, etc.

[Apprentice79]

4 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

Needless to say, John falling for Kristen was when she was sane and good, working as a social worker with Alice Horton! She went over the edge when she realized John still loved Marlena, etc.

I often wonder what would have happened if Drake had remained Roman and Marlena came back. Sherry said that the affair was going to happen one way or another.. Not to mention, Isabella was very jealous of Marlena and I can see Victor manipulating things in her favor.   

Drake should have remained Roman. It was the worst mistake that the show had ever made. 

Edited February 2, 2019 by Apprentice79

[WendyCR72]

On 2/1/2019 at 11:04 PM, Apprentice79 said:

I often wonder what would have happened if Drake had remained Roman and Marlena came back. Sherry said that the affair was going to happen one way or another.. Not to mention, Isabella was very jealous of Marlena and I can see Victor manipulating things in her favor.   

I'm kind of glad things shook out as they did then. Because I'm sure Isabella would have become the heavy - much like Kristen - thus ruining a truly good woman for John and Marlena's epic twu wuv. Excuse me while I vomit.

So, as sad as it is, I'm glad that Isabella died as that good person with a piece of John's heart rather than be sacrificed.

As an aside, though, I think that jealousy worked both ways. I won't deny Marlena was truly supportive of Isabella before she died. But I also remember her in tears in Mexico when she spied John and Isabella sharing a romantic moment. And her reaction to the pregnancy was sort of gobsmacked, too.

[Black Knight]

38 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

As an aside, though, I think that jealousy worked both ways. I won't deny Marlena was truly supportive of Isabella before she died. But I also remember her in tears in Mexico when she spied John and Isabella share a romantic moment. And her reaction to the pregnancy was sort of gobsmacked, too.

Absolutely, but that reaction made sense, because Marlena knew that the revelation of the pregnancy had just resolved the entire quadrangle without her or John ever actually making a choice about who they really wanted to be with. John had been torn between Marlena and Isabella while having romantic moments with both of them, and then Roman turned up and Marlena was torn between him and John. But Isabella's pregnancy meant she got John by default, and Roman got Marlena by default. John and Marlena were both too decent of people back then to think of choosing to be together under those circumstances, especially when John did truly love Isabella and Marlena did truly love Roman. I remember the very sweet and moving scene in which Marlena and John, post-pregnancy-reveal, admitted that they loved each other but knew this was how it had to be. Isabella and Roman were still great loves of John and Marlena and so the whole thing went on well enough, with John and Marlena burying their feelings for each other under friendship while devoting themselves to their spouses, until Isabella died.

One story I know got rewritten was the effect on John of being an Alamain. Originally he was supposed to start going darker, getting corrupted, and Isabella was going to be upset about the changes in him. But then Greason decided to leave, so that was all dropped and replaced by the cancer storyline, with John/Isabella remaining a solid couple to her death.

[Apprentice79]

1 hour ago, WendyCR72 said:

I'm kind of glad things shook out as they did then. Because I'm sure Isabella would have become the heavy - much like Kristen - thus ruining a truly good woman for John and Marlena's epic twu wuv. Excuse me while I vomit.

So, as sad as it is, I'm glad that Isabella died as that good person with a piece of John's heart rather than be sacrificed.

As an aside, though, I think that jealousy worked both ways. I won't deny Marlena was truly supportive of Isabella before she died. But I also remember her in tears in Mexico when she spied John and Isabella share a romantic moment. And her reaction to the pregnancy was sort of gobsmacked, too.

I don't think Isabella would have been like Kristen, if Drake had remained as Roman and had affair with Marlena.

Marlena was never shy about being jealous of Isabella. Isabella had a bond with her 3 kids, she had Rojohn. She admitted her jealousy in a conversation with Bo.  I always loved the Bo/Marlena bond and we never got to see it more over the years. As a Jarlena fan, I loved their goodbye in Mexico.  It was bittersweet, heartfelt and it was the right choice for both of them.  There was an interesting scene between Roman and Isabella in Mexico where they were both relieved that she was pregnant with Brady.  It was never explicitly said, but, it was all subtext. Sherry at her best..  

Edited February 2, 2019 by Apprentice79

[Irlandesa]

4 hours ago, BuckeyeLou said:

These 2 had magical chemistry!  Such Romantic scenes(they don't seem to write romantic stories anymore), Stacey was So beautiful & Drake had that leading man chiseled face....Thanks for posting...it was neat to see these scenes again. 

It was the last time I really loved John.  (John and Isabella/Roman and Marlena were my couples of choice from the quad).  I think it's because Isabella was one of my favorite female characters from DOOL.  She was one of the last examples that I can think of from soaps of a good (decent) character being a good (interesting) character.  I guess it was good that she left before the show ruined that.

Edited February 2, 2019 by Irlandesa

[WendyCR72]

2 hours ago, Black Knight said:

One story I know got rewritten was the effect on John of being an Alamain. Originally he was supposed to start going darker, getting corrupted, and Isabella was going to be upset about the changes in him. But then Greason decided to leave, so that was all dropped and replaced by the cancer storyline, with John/Isabella remaining a solid couple to her death.

Do you mind if I ask how you know this? I'm intrigued! That said, while I do like Drake Hogestyn, even knowing his limitations, I think it is because of those limitations that I don't think he could have played that all too well. He seemed to "fit" as a good guy, as he was with Roman and most of John's tenure. Frankly, I think he just should have remained a Brady - since he was connected to the family already (and helped set up the pub for Caroline and Shawn!) rather than, like almost every other version of John's past, get ditched just so Theresa and Brady could screw. To me, it wasn't worth it at all.

[nilyank]

God, I loved RomanturnedJohn & Isabella and Roman & Marlena, and I think it was their best pairings on the show. When the affair happened between married Marlena and widower John, I was as equally angry as Sami was when she discovered them on the conference table. Perhaps, that is why I always supported Sami and the crazy things she did as she reeled from that discovery.

Who I am kidding, Sami is my favorite character from this show and I have loved her since AS came on the show as a teen Sami ran away from Colorado 

I always found the affair to be tawdry and selfish. And no I didn't buy the excuse that John was pushing down his feelings away from Marlena when he had several years to mourn and move on with other women that he loved deeply (Diana, Isabella and then Kristen). As for Marlena, her feelings were John were always a hot mess because she thought he was Roman when she disappeared/died and still believed that he was Roman when she came back from the dead. When she found that the real Roman was alive and imprisoned for years away from her and their children, she should have been thrown how easily she believed that John could be Roman. And it annoyed me that even after knowing that John was not Roman, he still used things that were established with WN's Roman such as calling her Doc and the whole bit with strawberries.

[WendyCR72]

1 hour ago, nilyank said:

God, I loved RomanturnedJohn & Isabella and Roman & Marlena, and I think it was their best pairings on the show. When the affair happened between married Marlena and widower John, I was as equally angry as Sami was when she discovered them on the conference table. Perhaps, that is why I always supported Sami and the crazy things she did as she reeled from that discovery.

But, see, this is why I hate SORAS. Because the show can say Sami and Eric knew their bio-dad and push that loyalty and "history", as the show now does, but the reality is - on screen - John was the ONLY dad that the twins would have remembered. If anything, I think the show got Carrie and Sami ass backwards: Sami - based on the actual show - would/should have felt loyalty for John while Carrie, who was considerably older, would be all jumbled, angry, and confused over the affair. (This is with the caveat that I do find Carrie's continued bond with John interesting and refreshing, even knowing the whole story now.)

But to go back on topic, I imagine some "Roman" traits would stick with John, seeing as he was Roman for actual years, so the appropriation of "Doc" never really bothered me.

[Apprentice79]

5 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

But, see, this is why I hate SORAS. Because the show can say Sami and Eric knew their bio-dad and push that loyalty and "history", as the show now does, but the reality is - on screen - John was the ONLY dad that the twins would have remembered. If anything, I think the show got Carrie and Sami ass backwards: Sami - based on the actual show - would/should have felt loyalty for John while Carrie, who was considerably older, would be all jumbled, angry, and confused over the affair. (This is with the caveat that I do find Carrie's continued bond with John interesting and refreshing, even knowing the whole story now.)

But to go back on topic, I imagine some "Roman" traits would stick with John, seeing as he was Roman for actual years, so the appropriation of "Doc" never really bothered me.

Remember Carrie was reeling from discovering that John was not Roman before Sami came back as a teen. Carrie had an unhealthy crush on Lawrence Alamain and she actually got in his bed naked trying to seduce him. Lawrence was going to take her up on her offer since he was a pig.  John came in and saved Carrie from herself. He pulled a gun on Lawrence to protect Carrie, thinking that Lawrence was going to rape her.

 

7 hours ago, nilyank said:

I always found the affair to be tawdry and selfish. And no I didn't buy the excuse that John was pushing down his feelings away from Marlena when he had several years to mourn and move on with other women that he loved deeply (Diana, Isabella and then Kristen). As for Marlena, her feelings were John were always a hot mess because she thought he was Roman when she disappeared/died and still believed that he was Roman when she came back from the dead. When she found that the real Roman was alive and imprisoned for years away from her and their children, she should have been thrown how easily she believed that John could be Roman. And it annoyed me that even after knowing that John was not Roman, he still used things that were established with WN's Roman such as calling her Doc and the whole bit with strawberries.

John not being Roman was a retcon. John was always supposed to be Roman. Deidre came back to the show and wanted her best friend Wayne to come back as Roman and the show acquiesced. It was a big mistake because Drake was awesome as Roman.  Roman is so insignificant now and it was not worth it to retcon Drake's Roman.  According to Sherry, Drake was Roman and her story to bring back Roman as Drake was wonderful and well done.  

Edited February 2, 2019 by Apprentice79

[Black Knight]

13 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

Do you mind if I ask how you know this? I'm intrigued! That said, while I do like Drake Hogestyn, even knowing his limitations, I think it is because of those limitations that I don't think he could have played that all too well.

There had actually been official spoilers in the soap opera magazines about John's turn to the "dark" Alamain side and how it was going to upset Isabella. We saw the set-up of that future story onscreen, when John began work at Alamain - there was stuff with him and Lawrence arguing for different things at board meetings, with John taking the idealistic/principled position - but with Greason's decision to leave the writers dropped the corporate storyline before the gradual turn to the dark side could begin. We hardly even saw John at Alamain again.

Quote

 

But, see, this is why I hate SORAS. Because the show can say Sami and Eric knew their bio-dad and push that loyalty and "history", as the show now does, but the reality is - on screen - John was the ONLY dad that the twins would have remembered.

 

I actually think it's quite the reverse - it's only because Sami was SORAS'd that fans even think that John should be the one she really thinks of as her father. That's because Sami's SORAS happened not too long after Wayne's return as Roman. But I remember that whole storyline, and Sami (and Eric) were still extremely young children when Roman returned. I'm not sure what their precise age was supposed to be back then, but I have a particularly specific memory of the scene in which the twins were told that John wasn't their father, Roman was. John asked if he could put the twins to bed and Roman and Marlena agreed, and John picked up both twins - one in each arm - and carried them upstairs. They were that young and small. (Also so young and small that when Roman was first introduced to them, so they could get to know him first before the whole "he's your father" reveal was made, he went by a silly nickname, the sort of dumb nickname that no child over 7 would tolerate using. It was Mr. Puddles or something like that.)

SORASing confused the issue because Sami went from that age to 15-16 overnight, but leaving aside that it happened due to SORASing, it means that she spent the majority of her childhood with Roman as her father, and most of her time with John was at that very early age that people tend not to have many memories of. It's very different with Carrie, who did most of her growing up with John and only had Roman return when she had just become an adult.

Edited February 2, 2019 by Black Knight

[Apprentice79]

7 hours ago, Black Knight said:

There had actually been official spoilers in the soap opera magazines about John's turn to the "dark" Alamain side and how it was going to upset Isabella. We saw the set-up of that future story onscreen, when John began work at Alamain - there was stuff with him and Lawrence arguing for different things at board meetings, with John taking the idealistic/principled position - but with Greason's decision to leave the writers dropped the corporate storyline before the gradual turn to the dark side could begin. We hardly even saw John at Alamain again.

I actually think it's quite the reverse - it's only because Sami was SORAS'd that fans even think that John should be the one she really thinks of as her father. That's because Sami's SORAS happened not too long after Wayne's return as Roman. But I remember that whole storyline, and Sami (and Eric) were still extremely young children when Roman returned. I'm not sure what their precise age was supposed to be back then, but I have a particularly specific memory of the scene in which the twins were told that John wasn't their father, Roman was. John asked if he could put the twins to bed and Roman and Marlena agreed, and John picked up both twins - one in each arm - and carried them upstairs. They were that young and small. (Also so young and small that when Roman was first introduced to them, so they could get to know him first before the whole "he's your father" reveal was made, he went by a silly nickname, the sort of dumb nickname that no child over 7 would tolerate using. It was Mr. Puddles or something like that.)

SORASing confused the issue because Sami went from that age to 15-16 overnight, but leaving aside that it happened due to SORASing, it means that she spent the majority of her childhood with Roman as her father, and most of her time with John was at that very early age that people tend not to have many memories of. It's very different with Carrie, who did most of her growing up with John and only had Roman return when she had just become an adult.

Sami and Eric were 7 when Roman and Marlena came back.  They spent 5 years with John as their father with Carrie, Diana and Isabella serving as maternal figures at different stages in their lives.

[Apprentice79]

On ‎2‎/‎1‎/‎2019 at 9:58 PM, Black Knight said:

John wasn't serious about Rebecca, though. He got involved with her as a casual rebound after the twin upsets of Isabella's death and Marlena not leaving Roman. He met and fell for Kristen while still involved with Rebecca, and Rebecca realized that Kristen was the one he had real feelings for, so she ended the fling.

It is like When Bo got involved with Emmy, it was a casual fling where it was about a physical need for Bo, grieving Hope and not about love, until he met Carly.  

[WendyCR72]

27 minutes ago, Apprentice79 said:

Sami and Eric were 7 when Roman and Marlena came back.  They spent 5 years with John as their father with Carrie, Diana and Isabella serving as maternal figures at different stages in their lives.

I thought they were a bit older by then. So, yeah, they were young, but by age 7, I'd think they would have been DEEPLY attached to John, no matter being told he wasn't their father. Which he basically WAS, as he loved and cared for them all that time.

So I still say the whole deal with being loyal mainly to Roman is forever bogus.

A part of me still wishes Days had gone outside the box and had John sue for visitation or custody. It would have given every member of the Brady family something to play, showing divided loyalties, etc. I think just having John let them go was ridiculous. But I do remember Carrie being out of sorts at first when she heard John and Isabella were having a baby. She did come around not long before Brady was born, though.

[Apprentice79]

9 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

I thought they were a bit older by then. So, yeah, they were young, but by age 7, I'd think they would have been DEEPLY attached to John, no matter being told he wasn't their father. Which he basically WAS, as he loved and cared for them all that time.

So I still say the whole deal with being loyal mainly to Roman is forever bogus.

A part of me still wishes Days had gone outside the box and had John sue for visitation or custody. It would have given every member of the Brady family something to play, showing divided loyalties, etc. I think just having John let them go was ridiculous. But I do remember Carrie being out of sorts at first when she heard John and Isabella were having a baby. She did come around not long before Brady was born, though.

They could have been slightly older than 7. Eric also was not having it about leaving John.  I also remember Marlena cautioning Roman in not overwhelming the kids with his presence.  She was uncomfortable about taking the twins away from John.  It always seemed like Marlena became all about pleasing Roman to compensate for not loving him the same. Whereas before their respective disappearances, she used to stand up to him more regarding his domineering ways.  

I love the Carrie aspect of the story and I wish that the show had delved deeper into that. I always felt that Carrie was the biggest loser in the whole John is not Roman.  She lost Roman for a while, then John came back as Roman with a different face, Carrie had a hard time with that and it took a while for her to bond with him, Carrie calling Rojohn dad again was such a beautiful scene written beautifully by Sherry.  Carrie then lost Anna, Marlena, Diana and Isabella as her mother figures. However, the show under JER became all about Sami. It was a shift that I felt the show never recovered from, the villainesses drove stories instead of the heroines.  Carrie became secondary to Sami, she became reactive to Sami's schemes of the day, losing her relevancy.  Christy Clark was such a great actress as a kid, She was a natural and the show always gave her complex scenes to play. Carrie lost something special after her creator Sherry Anderson left the show. 

[404notfound]

Here are three videos of Cruz and Eden. I know they are a non-Days supercoule but the transcendent magic created by A Martinez and Marcy Walker was phenomenal. We will probably never see something like this on American soaps ever again. What a shame! 

Edited February 14, 2019 by sweetautumn

[WendyCR72]

5 hours ago, sweetautumn said:

Here are three videos of Cruz and Eden. I know they are a non-Days supercoule but the transcendent magic created by A Martinez and Marcy Walker was phenomenal. We will probably never see something like this on American soaps ever again. What a shame! 

I realize this is probably heresy, but I much preferred Mason and Julia on Santa Barbara. 🙂 But nice clips.

[paisley]

If they were to rerun Santa Barbara I would watch it In a heartbeat. Cruz and Eden were the only supercouple I ever believed in, although I loved Mason and Julia. I truly miss Santa Barbara.

[404notfound]

3 hours ago, paisley said:

If they were to rerun Santa Barbara I would watch it In a heartbeat. Cruz and Eden were the only supercouple I ever believed in, although I loved Mason and Julia. I truly miss Santa Barbara.

I second that!  I adored Mason and Julia as well but Mason and Mary will always hold a special place in my heart.

Edited February 15, 2019 by sweetautumn

[WendyCR72]

3 hours ago, paisley said:

If they were to rerun Santa Barbara I would watch it In a heartbeat. Cruz and Eden were the only supercouple I ever believed in, although I loved Mason and Julia. I truly miss Santa Barbara.

Apparently, a big issue is the show used a lot of popular music. Dominic Messenger, SB's former music director, had stated he would have been willing to re-score so it could be broadcast again. But, sadly, he died (I believe of a brain tumor) before that could happen.  😞

[paisley]

Santa Barbara 's music was always on point. The original songs like 'Let's Slow Dance' for Mason and Julia and 'Moments In Love' by The Art of Noise were perfect enhancements to the stories being told. I didn't know about the music issues. Thanks for the info Wendy.

[WendyCR72]

2 hours ago, paisley said:

Santa Barbara 's music was always on point. The original songs like 'Let's Slow Dance' for Mason and Julia and 'Moments In Love' by The Art of Noise were perfect enhancements to the stories being told. I didn't know about the music issues. Thanks for the info Wendy.

You're welcome! I just wish it wasn't an issue. I miss it. And YT keeps removing videos.

[Silver Raven]

One Life to Live used to be great with tying the musical cues to what was going on in the front of the screen.  Like when Todd didn't know that he was Victor Lord's son (but the audience did), the song they played for him was "What's your name? Who's your daddy?  Is he rich like me?"

[howmanywords]

On 2/15/2019 at 4:53 PM, paisley said:

Santa Barbara 's music was always on point. The original songs like 'Let's Slow Dance' for Mason and Julia and 'Moments In Love' by The Art of Noise were perfect enhancements to the stories being told. I didn't know about the music issues. Thanks for the info Wendy.

So true! Santa Barbara used not only amazing music that fit the stories and the couples but the songs they used were legit hits back in the 80's. Joe & Kelly's song IIRC was "If Ever Your In My Arms Again" which was pretty huge back then.  Oh how I would kill for old SB episodes with the actual music they used!