Lorelai and Richard

[moonb]

Richard's character summary in the Gilmore Girls wiki got me thinking about his relationship with Lorelai, secondary though it is to hers with Emily. I think the description of him as "somewhat close" to Lorelai is a little simplified, although he grows to admire her and by the series finale they're on friendly terms. However, I also think their relationship is perhaps the more brutal of Lorelai's with her parents. 

 

There's a lot of argument that Richard doesn't love Lorelai quite like he does Rory, and maybe that's true: Richard and Rory connect really easily because of similar literary tastes, academic and travel interests, and being introverted only children of devoted mothers they're very close to. Lorelai and Richard, on the other hand, don't appear to have anything in common or any ability to connect with each other, and yes, sometimes don't like each other very much. Emily and Lorelai, for all their vicious fights, use their words a lot to tear into each other, and though they go about it in really different ways, a lot of their lives are dedicated to events, hospitality, charity and socializing. To Richard, most of Lorelai's life since her pregnancy must seem like a huge rejection of himself and everything he values, and to her, Richard is ashamed of her, dislikes her, and so she tries her hardest not to be around him too much. Imo, that's always underneath their worst scorched-earth moments together - their arguments in season 1's Christopher Returns, in season 2's Richard in Stars Hollow, season 3's Let the Games Begin, and season 4's  Afterboom, where he says of course he expected Lorelai not to care about her family, making it seem like he's preemptively decided not let her hurt them again. And vice versa, since she quits Friday night dinners but always goes back to them.  And the shows hints a couple times that Lorelai's childhood relationship with Richard was pretty distant too, since he was a typical father of his generation who would have left Lorelai-related issues to Emily, or to nannies. Though they did have their moments of growth and bonding over Lorelai's business talents and dealing with college-era Rory in later seasons. 

 

I'm curious to see how

Richard's death and/or funeral will affect Lorelai in particular in the revival. Losing a parent you have a complicated history with is as difficult as losing one you're very close to.

 

[txhorns79]

To Richard, most of Lorelai's life since her pregnancy must seem like a huge rejection of himself and everything he values, and to her, Richard is ashamed of her, dislikes her, and so she tries her hardest not to be around him too much. Imo, that's always underneath their worst scorched-earth moments together - their arguments in season 1's Christopher Returns

 

I always find that argument between them in Season 1 so interesting.  Richard expresses some serious hurt to Lorelai, and she responds very defensively, going into a kind of martyr mode, without any real suggestion that she understands the depth of what her leaving did to Richard and Emily.  The show doesn't stay with that moment for long, but I think she really destroyed her parents and I wish we had gotten a little more into the three of them just having it out entirely and moving on.   

[dustylil]

the shows hints a couple times that Lorelai's childhood relationship with Richard was pretty distant too, since he was a typical father of his generation who would have left Lorelai-related issues to Emily, or to nannies

 

With respect, I would say Richard may have been more likely a typical father of his class, than of his generation. Or perhaps it was simply a matter of personal choice on his part. In the seventies when Lorelai was a child, it was much more common for fathers to be more nurturing and  involved with their children than they had been in earlier years. 

I do recall being surprised at what little engagement Richard had with his only child.  Particularly things they both might have enjoyed - like attending the Harvard-Yale game and participating in its various rituals. And even more astonishing to me was in a tradition-bound family like the Gilmores  there seemingly had never been an expectation that Lorelai - a top student at her prep school - would attend Yale.

[txhorns79]

With respect, I would say Richard may have been more likely a typical father of his class, than of his generation.  Or perhaps it was simply a matter of personal choice on his part. In the seventies when Lorelai was a child, it was much more common for fathers to be more nurturing and  involved with their children than they had been in earlier years.

 

I'm not sure how common that actually was.  I'm sure there are always anecdotal stories, but I would presume that Richard, as the primary breadwinner, would necessarily not have a lot of interaction with Lorelai when she was growing up due to his work schedule.  From what we saw in the show, he traveled often for work, and presumably had to put in long hours to work his way up in the firm to get to his position.  That would probably limit his time with Lorelai.          

 

I can't really speak as to their expectations for Lorelai as to Yale.  In the other times it was brought up, I recall it being mentioned that Lorelai wanted to go elsewhere, but I don't recall what was mentioned as to Emily and Richard's expectations.  Perhaps if someone has a better recollection of those events, they could share them.   Besides, Lorelai was only 15 when she became pregnant, so she was still a couple of years from applying to colleges anyways.

[chessiegal]

I think Richard and Emily definitely expected Lorelei to go to college. Didn't Emily go to Smith? From Emily's generation, that was typical to go to a sister Ivy League school. I agree with Richard's work, he most likely had less interaction with Lorelei than Emily. That's the way it was with my Dad, but in my case, for a very different reason - he worked night shifts in a factory, lol.

 

One of my favorite Richard/Lorelei moments is when Emily invited that very boring insurance guy to dinner for a set up, and she's climbing outside her bedroom window to escape and he finds her and she says "Please Daddy?" So cute.

[elang4]

I think Richard and Emily definitely expected Lorelei to go to college. Didn't Emily go to Smith? From Emily's generation, that was typical to go to a sister Ivy League school. I agree with Richard's work, he most likely had less interaction with Lorelei than Emily. That's the way it was with my Dad, but in my case, for a very different reason - he worked night shifts in a factory, lol.

One of my favorite Richard/Lorelei moments is when Emily invited that very boring insurance guy to dinner for a set up, and she's climbing outside her bedroom window to escape and he finds her and she says "Please Daddy?" So cute.

Oh yeah I loved that! Especially because they had that awful fight the week before but Richard found Chase really boring as well. It was nice to see them bond over it. :)

[txhorns79]

I think Richard and Emily definitely expected Lorelei to go to college. Didn't Emily go to Smith? From Emily's generation, that was typical to go to a sister Ivy League school.

 

I agree.  I just didn't remember if they ever brought up whether they expected Lorelai to go to Yale. 

 

 

It was nice to see them bond over it. :)

 

It was.  They had so few nice moments together, I thought.  The writers did seem a lot more interested in the Lorelai/Emily relationship than they did Lorelai/Richard.  I understand it, but it's also a shame. 

[moonb]

Yes, I think Richard was probably typical of his class...but I'm remembering right, his father died when he was young, which left him with Trix (I don't think the show is consistent with this either, lol). I can't imagine the upper class Gilmores being really hands-on parents, so Richard was probably the same kind of parent his own parents were.   He clearly had very high expectations for Lorelai though, whether the college they had in mind was Vassar, Yale, or Smith. 

 

Richard expresses some serious hurt to Lorelai, and she responds very defensively, going into a kind of martyr mode, without any real suggestion that she understands the depth of what her leaving did to Richard and Emily.

Yep, she suggests that she's horrible and they should adopt Christopher..responding just like a teenager would. :)  And Richard has the exact same tendency to treat her like one;  when they fight, she's being dramatic, angry, an impossible girl, or not thinking at all...all words you'd use to describe a 16-year-old. It shows how thoroughly their relationship ended when she left, and how badly they communicate. I do think this changes a little bit in later seasons. 

 

Forgot to mention that I do think Lorelai and Richard sometimes share a similar sense of humor, especially in their teasing of Emily. 

[dustylil]

.

but I'm remembering right, his father died when he was young, which left him with Trix (I don't think the show is consistent with this either, lol

 

In Let the Games Begin we are told that Richard while at Yale brought Emily home to meet his parents. Of course, he could have been extremely precocious and completed college as a young boy. But then what on earth was he doing messing around with women like Emily and Pennilyn :)

I agree with Richard's work, he most likely had less interaction with Lorelei than Emily

 

I agree with that as well. But if he had the time to make attending the Harvard-Yale game with Emily a long standing tradition (he told Rory that they had been going for more than thirty years), why was Lorelai never included in this family custom?

[JayInChicago]

I apologize for the derail but do people in real life really escape from second floor bedrooms/ balconies that often? I had a second floor bedroom and I'd never like rappeled down the side of the house. I mean did she "shimmy down the drain pipe" or what?

[txhorns79]

I mean did she "shimmy down the drain pipe" or what?

 

Was there a tree of some kind she used? 

 

 

why was Lorelai never included in this family custom?

 

It seemed like they considered it an "adult" event.  I mean, they were drinking and visiting with friends during the tailgate, so they probably didn't want to bring Lorelai when she was a child, and from what we saw of the history, I can imagine a teenage Lorelai simply declining to go, even if invited. 

[hippielamb]

I think Richard and Emily definitely expected Lorelei to go to college. Didn't Emily go to Smith? From Emily's generation, that was typical to go to a sister Ivy League school. I agree with Richard's work, he most likely had less interaction with Lorelei than Emily. That's the way it was with my Dad, but in my case, for a very different reason - he worked night shifts in a factory, lol.

One of my favorite Richard/Lorelei moments is when Emily invited that very boring insurance guy to dinner for a set up, and she's climbing outside her bedroom window to escape and he finds her and she says "Please Daddy?" So cute.

God, I love that scene. Also, when he gives her a cheque for her graduation and tells her to use it on something fun. She calls him Daddy then too. It's like she reverts to being a little girl whenever he does something nice.

Richard tells Rory that Lorelai said she wanted to go to Yale when she was a little girl but I don't remember which episode it was in. Maybe during season 5 or 6? I think they wanted her to go somewhere prestigious. And apparently she had the grades to carry it off. Richard called her the brightest in her class.

I apologize for the derail but do people in real life really escape from second floor bedrooms/ balconies that often? I had a second floor bedroom and I'd never like rappeled down the side of the house. I mean did she "shimmy down the drain pipe" or what?

Lol I used to climb in and out of my bedroom window until I got locked out one night. Also climbed in windows when I lost my keys, all 1st floor thankfully.

I do wonder about that balcony. Was it easy to climb down or what. Lorelai also stated there were multiple ways out of that house so I guess if balconies weren't your thing you could climb out the basement window.

[andromeda331]

It was in Let the Games Begin that Richard told Rory, Lorelai told him she wanted to go to Yale when

she was eight. He said she took his diploma and kept it for awhile. I don't remember how long he said

she kept it. I always made me wonder if Lorelai did at one point dream of going to Yale. And what her

plans for college were. Did she change her mind and want Harvard or was that just something that

came up after her relationship with her parents got strained. I always liked the story Lorelai tells

Luke after Richard's heart attack about climbing the tree as a kid and seeing her dad and how

small he was. And how he now looks small again. Then later she tells him, that he's big again.

[readster]

It was in Let the Games Begin that Richard told Rory, Lorelai told him she wanted to go to Yale when

she was eight. He said she took his diploma and kept it for awhile. I don't remember how long he said

she kept it. I always made me wonder if Lorelai did at one point dream of going to Yale. And what her

plans for college were. Did she change her mind and want Harvard or was that just something that

came up after her relationship with her parents got strained. I always liked the story Lorelai tells

Luke after Richard's heart attack about climbing the tree as a kid and seeing her dad and how

small he was. And how he now looks small again. Then later she tells him, that he's big again.

I loved all those scenes, but Richard's reaction when he finished telling Rory the Yale story. He was so chocked up and sad at that point and Rory saw it too. 

[Minneapple]

My favorite Lorelai/Richard episode is Help Wanted. I love the scenes at his office, at the office supply store, etc. I love when he tells Lorelai that his new secretary is "no Margie" when he clearly wanted to say that she's "no Lorelai," but he couldn't say it because, well, he's stubborn old Richard Gilmore. But he didn't have to say it because Lorelai understood. 

 

Lorelai also talked to her dad about her insurance issue in season five (So...Good Talk). Later that season he told her he was proud of her for making something of herself. So I do think Lorelai and Richard bonded over business sometimes. They had that in common, they were both business owners. 

[elang4]

My favorite Lorelai/Richard episode is Help Wanted. I love the scenes at his office, at the office supply store, etc. I love when he tells Lorelai that his new secretary is "no Margie" when he clearly wanted to say that she's "no Lorelai," but he couldn't say it because, well, he's stubborn old Richard Gilmore. But he didn't have to say it because Lorelai understood.

Lorelai also talked to her dad about her insurance issue in season five (So...Good Talk). Later that season he told her he was proud of her for making something of herself. So I do think Lorelai and Richard bonded over business sometimes. They had that in common, they were both business owners.

And that bit at the Bon voyage party when he told her that it would take a remarkable person to inspire it all. So sweet! :)

[dustylil]

And that bit at the Bon voyage party when he told her that it would take a remarkable person to inspire it all. So sweet! :)

 

It was a lovely bookend to that sardonic remark he made about her work at the "motel" in the very first episode of the series.

[elang4]

It was a lovely bookend to that sardonic remark he made about her work at the "motel" in the very first episode of the series.

Yeah you could tell that finally he really respected how she made a life for herself and Rory and he was proud of her.