Spoilers and Spoiler Discussion: How's Your Head?

[formerlyfreedom]

Spoilers ahoy!

 

Please post spoilers and spoiler discussion here. If you do not want to be spoiled, please back out slowly, and close the door behind you!

 

Also, do not spoiler tag in here. Now that this is a dedicated Spoiler thread, tags will be removed if used.

Edited January 12, 2015 by stacey
updating information

[HalcyonDays]

Okay, so I assume I can post this here, in an attempt at some season 2 discussion here, right?

During Paleyfest, and other articles I have read on what's to come in season 2, what does everything think of...

1 --> That Abbie will get a "love interest".

2 --> There will be a higher up from New York that will take over for Frank Irving, at least for a bit. Will Abbie and Crane have as much free reign as they did before?

3 --> That the show will delve into Abbie/Jenny's family background.

4 --> Katrina will have a much larger presence in the show season 2.

5 --> Crane (and Tom Mison) is going to learn to drive and hop on an airplane!

Edited April 12, 2014 by HalcyonDays

[riley702]

1. Sure. She deserves a good relationship.

2. Bah. It's been done to death Oh, noes! The team is broken up - for 2 or 3 episodes and then everything goes right back to the way it was before. Oh, no, our fearless leader is in trouble and might be replaced by a humorless, by the book replacement! Except not. Boss is cleared, replacement goes away and then everything goes back to the way it was before. Lather, rinse, repeat.

3. YES! I want to see this!

4. Can she just die in a fire, already? Wasn't she supposed to have done just that? As others have noted, every time she appears on screen, time seems to drag. Headless ex can keep her as far as I'm concerned. Except I might start feeling sorry for him.

5. Can NOT wait to see this! I predict hijinks will abound and I will be most entertained.

Edited April 13, 2014 by riley702

[Crackedmuse]

1 --> As long as it's not one of Moloch's decomposing minions or some 21st century cop toting a Motorola Razr - tis' fine.  With Katrina back, Ichabod now has the opportunity to take "comfort" breaks from reading the bible all day, and Abbie definitely should have the same.  It equalizes the emotional investment and raises the stakes for Abbie.  So the next time a duty vs. loved one situation occurs she'll be bringing more than theory to the table.  It's not difficult giving up something you don't have.  But like Ichabod with Katrina or Frank with Macey, or even Abraham and Katrina, things aren't so simple when it's real vs. intellectual.  Love is always good.  The vulnerability that love brings is even better.  And dare I say it... jealousy - even when you don't know that's why you're throwing a hissy fit - can be the most revealing, or at least the most entertaining!  (Destinies entwined dammit!)

2 --> Riley702 said it best.  Nothing to see here.

3 --> As long as Dad is not the head of a super secret spy agency or Mom a terrorist for hire trying to kill the POTUS, any history they want to provide is cool.  It's all nonsensical filler fodder anyway, just to fill up the hour and let the actors have fun dressing up.  And of course, to keep the "destiny" hammer swinging and the "prophecies" coming.  Ain't no random in the Hollow - past or present.

4 --> So she goes from 18 minutes a season to 27.  Don't care.  Most of it will undoubtedly still be flashbacks, and whatever she does in the present can't possibly be any more distracting than the Irving family non-drama.  And Katrina really does have to be here since Jeremy! Gone! Wild! is due to parental abandonment issues, which will require Mom and Pop to tackle him together.  We'll get the standard perilous predicaments, spells gone awry, and lots of tears, candles, and billowing hair - interspersed with the joy of modern slang and trips to the Reenactment clothiers.  Just passing time until the Darth Vader/Anakin redemption.  And dare I say it... jealousy - even when you know it's prophecy and not a threat - can be highly entertaining!  (Destinies entwined dammit!)

5 --> Sounds like fun.  But as some of you know... a lot can happen between the parking lot and the terminal - so there's no guarantee he'll actually make the flight.  Last I heard, Ichabod and Abbie were still stuck at the tram stop! [Apologies. A little PM "stuff" from TWoP]

[formerlyfreedom]

As long as Dad is not the head of a super secret spy agency or Mom a terrorist for hire trying to kill the POTUS, any history they want to provide is cool.

*SNORK*

That was me, shooting good beer out my nose, Crackedmuse! Right there with you!

[Crackedmuse]

That was me, shooting good beer out my nose, Crackedmuse! Right there with you!

Damn straight, Stacey girl.  We do NOT need that mess in the Hollow!

Have a good night.

[Indi]

1. Dare I hope for a long-lasting healthy relationship with a great sexy guy? Because their track record has been dumping either monsters or cowards on her. I don't know what TPTB think about Abbie's worth, but I think she deserves a stand up hot guy, who values her, which excludes Ichabod, Andy and Luke. I'm not sure if I should be optimistic about this. However, now that the Cranes will spend S2 enjoying a blissful marriage, Abbie should get lots of screentime developing her own relationships.

2. Boring! It was a terrible idea to have Frank confess in the first place, so nothing good can come from it. Frank's family drama was more interesting than that.

3. Give me that NOW!

4. Terrible character + more screentime? Seems like a good idea... NOT! But then they can't depict marriage bliss without half of the pairing. Pity they did such an awful job with the casting. Anyway, enjoy the sex scenes, guys!

5. Who is going to teach him to drive? Is he getting another partner to replace Abbie, while she's in Purgatory?

I wish they'd answered the most important question: How long are they going to sideline Abbie keeping her in Purgatory? A few episodes? Half a season? The whole season?

[HalcyonDays]

Riley702 said: 4. Can she just die in a fire, already? Wasn't she supposed to have done just that? As others have noted, every time she appears on screen, time seems to drag. Headless ex can keep her as far as I'm concerned. Except I might start feeling sorry for him.

Ha! I love this. Though technically she was burned at the stake, right? The witches said that, and her soul didn't move on, I think? I hope that gets clarified.

Apparently we are to see stuff on Katrina's family, which from the hints, states that they were around for a while, and also hints at Katrina being around for a while. Like in the 1600's and before. This was touched on a bit, but I would like confirmation if she is long-lived. The four witch Sisters were long-lived, as was Reverend Knapp. Because that would have some implications to the Crane marriage. Ichabod grows old, but Katrina does not.

Indi said: 5. Who is going to teach him to drive? Is he getting another partner to replace Abbie, while she's in Purgatory?

Abbie of course. It's got to be in her car. The comic possibilities alone are endless!

Cracked Muse said: Last I heard, Ichabod and Abbie were still stuck at the tram stop! [Apologies. A little PM "stuff" from TWoP]

*Ahem*, I fully expect a special PM detailing how Abbie teaches Ichabod all about the Mile High Club. *ahem*

 

[Crackedmuse]

*Ahem*, I fully expect a special PM detailing how Abbie teaches Ichabod all about the Mile High Club. *ahem*

Sigh... I haven't forgotten.  Who knew Airport Long Term Parking could be so distracting?  And who says Abbie is the instructor? But anyway, back burner for now. Once Hannibal is done we'll see.

Back on topic:

6 --> Len says John Noble is also on tap for increased scenery chewing in S2, so we better prepare now for lots of snarling extreme close-ups in HD.

What I find most interesting, is that given everyone's perilous situation in the finale, all the spoiler talk has been about everything EXCEPT - "How will they ever manage to escape/survive their predicaments?"  So I'm thinking a quick "911" on that flip phone is going to get all the players back in the game pretty quick.

[HalcyonDays]

What I find most interesting, is that given everyone's perilous situation in the finale, all the spoiler talk has been about everything EXCEPT - "How will they ever manage to escape/survive their predicaments?"  So I'm thinking a quick "911" on that flip phone is going to get all the players back in the game pretty quick.

Good point, CM. No one is like, well, how are they all going to survive? I think mostly it's because the survival will be pretty obvious. Ichabod's got to get out first, only because no oxygen/water/food will make him a dead man very quickly. Unless the vines keep him alive....hmmm. 911 call, very possible though.

Jenny will NOT be dead, just maybe in a hospital, found by a driver passing by on the road. I know they say "Well, she could be dead, but dead doesn't mean dead", but there is no way Lyndie Greenwood is going to be promoted to regular, and they have her in Purgatory or a ghost. She is too good of a character to waste. So someone drives by, called ambulence, she's fine.

Katrina, hopefully rescues herself. Abbie will be in a few days, learn some valuable stuff, get forgiveness from Jenny (or someone else), and is out.

Now our illustrious quadruple can focus on crazy scene-chewing Jeremy/Henry.

And who says Abbie is the instructor?

Well, someone has to tell him what the Mile High club really is. The rest, well, maybe some cross-era instructionals can be shared. You know, things in the 18th century were like this, 21st century like this....

Edited April 13, 2014 by HalcyonDays

[Indi]

6 --> Len says John Noble is also on tap for increased scenery chewing in S2, so we better prepare now for lots of snarling extreme close-ups in HD.

Ugh! More Katrina and more Jeremy. Awful! 

Abbie will be in a few days, learn some valuable stuff, get forgiveness from Jenny (or someone else), and is out.

I actually hope she finds another way out on her own in the first episode. If she has to wait for Jenny to forgive her, she could be there forever and I don't like the idea of her spending who knows how many episodes being sidelined for the Cranes.

[Crackedmuse]

Well, someone has to tell him what the Mile High club really is. The rest, well, maybe some cross-era instructionals can be shared. You know, things in the 18th century were like this, 21st century like this....

What is a plane but a big carriage?  Good grief, we are polluting the thread. No more talk of this.

[jhlipton]

HalcyonDays

During Paleyfest, and other articles I have read on what's to come in season 2, what does everything think of...

1 --> That Abbie will get a "love interest".
      Yes, please.  And someone who is Abbie's equal, not beneath her (Andy) or above her.

2 --> There will be a higher up from New York that will take over for Frank Irving, at least for a bit. Will Abbie and Crane have as much free reign as they did before?
      No, NO, and NO!!!  Gah.

3 --> That the show will delve into Abbie/Jenny's family background.
     Yes, please!  (But no SpyDaddy!  LOL)

4 --> Katrina will have a much larger presence in the show season 2.
     Ugh, no.  However, I think Katrina will adapt to modern clothes (which will make Ichabod even more of a fish out of water).

5 --> Crane (and Tom Mison) is going to learn to drive and hop on an airplane!
     Only makes sense.  Alas, I think we'll have to provide the Long Term Parking and Mile-High Club scenes in our sordid imagination (and fanfic posts)

[riley702]

I think she deserves a stand up hot guy, who values her, which excludes Ichabod...

 

I think we're just going to have to agree to disagree on that one.

But as some of you know... a lot can happen between the parking lot and the terminal - so there's no guarantee he'll actually make the flight.  Last I heard, Ichabod and Abbie were still stuck at the tram stop! [Apologies. A little PM "stuff" from TWoP]

Who knew Airport Long Term Parking could be so distracting?

 

I believe my comment was, "Damn! They're going to set that plane on fire, aren't they?"

[Crackedmuse]

Indi said: I think she deserves a stand up hot guy, who values her, which excludes Ichabod...

to which Riley702 said: I think we're just going to have to agree to disagree on that one.

Ichabod is excluded because he is married, is in love with his wife, is not in love with Abbie, or even thinks about her in a romantic way - nor does Abbie view or think about Ichabod in a romantic way.  So any value judgements are moot because he doesn't want her and she doesn't want him.

When things change at some point in the future and those type of feelings emerge, we'll have to see what the situation is at that time and whether it's one-sided, mutual, result of a magic spell, hypnotism, side effect of witches brew, Succubus induced, prophesied by God - or just an End of the World quickie because, you know, it's the end of the world - and go from there.  But as it stands now, only demons and minions of demons are excluded.

#DestiniesEntwinedDammit!

[Indi]

1 --> That Abbie will get a "love interest".

      Yes, please.  And someone who is Abbie's equal, not beneath her (Andy) or above her.

Above her? Do you mean someone with superpowers? Anyway, we haven't met anyone, who could be Abbie's equal yet. All the potential love interests we've met are way beneath her.

Ichabod is excluded because he is married, is in love with his wife, is not in love with Abbie, or even thinks about her in a romantic way - nor does Abbie view or think about Ichabod in a romantic way.  So any value judgements are moot because he doesn't want her and she doesn't want him.

This is absolutely correct. I can only hope it stays that way and she doesn't ever fall for him. She should remember his henious behavior in the finale (in the second half of the season, really) and what an unworthy Witness he is. We're looking for an equal for her here.

[jhlipton]

1 --> That Abbie will get a "love interest".

      Yes, please.  And someone who is Abbie's equal, not beneath her (Andy) or above her.

Above her? Do you mean someone with superpowers? Anyway, we haven't met anyone, who could be Abbie's equal yet. All the potential love interests we've met are way beneath her.

 

I was thinking of "above" as someone she obeys, whether out of choice, duty or compulsion.  I respectfully disagree -- I believe that Ichabod is her equal.  They have a real partnership already, where neither is "in charge".  If Abbie is to have a romantic relationship (and I hope she does), that's the kind of man I want her to have it with (and don't see her accepting anything else).

Edited April 14, 2014 by jhlipton

[Indi]

I was thinking of "above" as someone she obeys, whether out of choice, duty or compulsion.  I respectfully disagree -- I believe that Ichabod is her equal.  They have a real partnership already, where neither is "in charge".  If Abbie is to have a romantic relationship (and I hope she does), that's the kind of man I want her to have it with (and don't see her accepting anything else).

I agree, I wouldn't want her to hook up with Frank or anyone else in a higher rank. Ichabod her equal though? I'm pretty sure he thinks she is his inferior. That was one of the aspects of the second half of the season that bothered me the most. He expected her to take care of every single of his needs, like a dutiful servant, and not once did he express any kind of gratefulness, quite the opposite actually. But then, he and his wife had that glorious scene, where they praised the wonders of having free black people in subservient positions, so his attitude makes complete sense.

"Destinies entwined!" He said repeatedly, as long as he needed her help in this strange world. But then Moloch wanted Abbie's soul and he he got his wife back in the process. Then it was an "Hasta la vista, bitch!" That's definitely not an equal.

[HalcyonDays]

I was thinking of "above" as someone she obeys, whether out of choice, duty or compulsion.  I respectfully disagree -- I believe that Ichabod is her equal.  They have a real partnership already, where neither is "in charge".  If Abbie is to have a romantic relationship (and I hope she does), that's the kind of man I want her to have it with (and don't see her accepting anything else).

Ichabod is definately her equal and they really do have a nice relationship in which they can give and take. They keep each other on their toes, play off each other really well, respect each other's opinions and learn from each other. Honestly. that is what I see..

I mean, here we have Abbie, who never told anyone about her family issues, never seemed to trust anyone, including Luke. She is completely open with Ichabod. He too - never holds back, tells her everything as soon as he can. Crane's stuck in a rock and a hard place, honestly.

Crane had already had a positive influence on Abbie too: She has found her "meaning in life", reunited with her sister, gained some closure on the stuff that happened from her childhood, had a good relationshop with her boss Irving. Already positives. Okay, stuck in Purgatory not so good, but she is going to get some good information and personal growth out of that, guarenteed.

I mean, think of the second last show, where Abbie is "paging" Crane. The smile on her face, a little bit of glee, etc. She deserves someone to give her happiness, be a equal partner, challenge her, learn from her, and work as a team.

But since Katrina is back (hopefully temporarily), let Abbie have some hot romance for a bit, have some fun then realize how important/valued the connection is between her and Crane.

Edited April 15, 2014 by HalcyonDays

[jhlipton]

Indi, I think we're going to have say "YMMV" and "Chacun à son goût".  And that's fine by me.

[CinnamonCW]

1 -->  It’s expected and appropriate. But do we want to see Abbie and love interest folding laundry as they discuss the monster of the week? I sure don’t! So it should be temporary and function as a means to explore Abbie as a character as well as the show’s mythology. Full disclosure: I’m an Ichabbie end-gamer that prefers years of flirting, chemistry, and perhaps jealousy over meeting parents, pregnancy scares, and the mediocrity of tv relationships. I find they dull down engaging programs when too much a focus.

2 --> I don’t think this will be dragged out for too long. That said, if it is, I do think it can lead to some interesting stories as long as they put a fresh spin on it. That’s essentially what the show is so I have faith in TPTB. Their only real misstep has been the botching of Katrina.

3 --> I’m glad because it is aching to be told. I don’t want too much given away at once, however.

4 --> They can’t go back and fix the underwhelming slapdash that’s been Katrina. What’s done is done. So hopefully they’ve learned it isn’t enough to have her described or narrated, they have to show us this season and make it make sense. I don’t hate Katrina at all; she’s just been a non-factor which is problematic considering she’s a lead’s wife and a powerful witch who is also a woman ahead of her time. For starters they should have her escape on her own. There’s also potential for comedy and to endear her to us as she discovers modern life. As mentioned I bet she’d be more at ease with modern life than Ichabod.

Bottom line, they need to improve this character if she’s going to have a bigger presence.

5 --> This should be funny! Just don’t overdo it.

I also hope the show takes on darker and more sensual tones. Not exclusively or anything, but similar to how ‘The X-Files’ weaved in and out of different tones.

Edited: fixed for clarity

Edited April 16, 2014 by CinnamonCW

[HalcyonDays]

1 -->  It’s expected and appropriate. But do we want to see Abbie and love interest folding laundry as they discuss the monster of the week? I sure don’t! So it should be temporary and function as a means to explore Abbie as a character as well as the show’s mythology. Full disclosure: I’m an Ichabbie end-gamer that prefers years of flirting, chemistry, and perhaps jealousy over meeting parents, pregnancy scares and the mediocrity of tv relationships. I find they dull down engaging programs when too much a focus.

<snip>

4 --> They can’t go back and fix the underwhelming slapdash that’s been Katrina. What’s done is done.  <snip>  For starters they should have her escape on her own. There’s also potential for comedy and to endear her to us as she discovers modern life. As mentioned I be she’d be more at ease than Ichabod.

5 --> This should be funny! Just don’t overdo it.

I also hope the show takes on darker and more sensual tones. Not exclusively or anything, but similar to how ‘The X-Files’ weaved in and out of different tones.

Point 1 -- Here here, I'm an Ichabbier too, so as long as we have great bonding scenes between them, however trivial or not, then I'm good. Just think of the Baseball Bow. But pregnancy scares? Yikes, no. And Ichabod's parents are long dead. The only parents to meet are Abbie's and one's gone and the other's in a mental ward. Hmmm...should be interesting. Can you imagine if the mother meets Ichabod (she's in the mental ward) and actually totally believes him on being from the 18th century.

Point 4 -- yeah, I think Katrina would be ripe with comedy and I think she will acclimatize very quickly to the 21st century. She'll fit in with no issues, contrasting stubborn Ichabod.

Point 5 - No, I don't think they won't overdo it, like with the jeans thing and other little things he discovered. I know the show said they would be filming in New York City and in London. Abbie and Ichabod hop on a plane to London and him seeing how the city has changed. Man, that would be an eye-opener. I think Ichabod will need several valiums just to cope.

Big X-files fan and I agree with the darker and more sensual tones. They are fighting the apocalypse after all. Weaving back and forth high tension to more comedy/laid back will suit the show and characters really well.

Edited April 16, 2014 by HalcyonDays

[CinnamonCW]

I missed where I'd forgotten to fix a sentence before you'd quoted me, sorry about that!

Here here, I'm an Ichabbier too, so as long as we have great bonding scenes between them, however trivial or not, then I'm good. Just think of the Baseball Bow. But pregnancy scares? Yikes, no. And Ichabod's parents are long dead. The only parents to meet are Abbie's and one's gone and the other's in a mental ward. Hmmm...should be interesting. Can you imagine if the mother meets Ichabod (she's in the mental ward) and actually totally believes him on being from the 18th century.

 

Those were just examples of what I think are the type of boring, mundane plots when relationships are the focus. Not that they'd depict those scenarios in particular. Ichabod and Abbie have intense chemistry IMO so I don't want that squandered in a rush to get them together. Let's enjoy the ride!

Regarding the darker and sensual tones, the show is on at 9pm. I do hope TPTB are willing to go there! They've got something very special here.

 

[Indi]

1 -->  It’s expected and appropriate. But do we want to see Abbie and love interest folding laundry as they discuss the monster of the week? I sure don’t! So it should be temporary and function as a means to explore Abbie as a character as well as the show’s mythology. Full disclosure: I’m an Ichabbie end-gamer that prefers years of flirting, chemistry, and perhaps jealousy over meeting parents, pregnancy scares, and the mediocrity of tv relationships. I find they dull down engaging programs when too much a focus.

Absolutely not! But I still want her love interest to be a real one and for her to form a family with him. Hopefully the guy will be interesting and somehow part of the fight against Moloch and the Horsemen, so that Abbie can have scenes with him, that are not exclusively romantic. This doesn't mean she'll be folding laundry, just like Ichabod formed his own family and it wasn't an impediment for him to keep fighting. Abbie doesn't deserve any less than that and she certainly doesn't deserve to have a half-baked filler romance, until she can become Katrina's replacement for Ichabod.

[millahnna]

I'm cautiously optimistic about increased Katrina screentime.  While she hasn't been the most well used character, I don't have the large problems with her others do and even if ultimately she will be removed from the show (I've been guessing she'll be killed off eventually since her first appearance) I think her place in Ichabod's life (past and present) needs to be resolved.  I'd rather they dealt with her than just forgot she existed.  Writing her off the show with minimal explanation would disappoint me more than any of the questionable decisions they've already made with her character. 

Also, I find the idea of an already semi-adjusted to the present Ichabod trying to help her adjust somewhat amusing.  It sort of puts him in Abbie's place from season one and I think there's some comedy gold to be mined there.

[HalcyonDays]

CinnamonCW said: Ichabod and Abbie have intense chemistry IMO so I don't want that squandered in a rush to get them together. Let's enjoy the ride!

There had better be a good ride because then that insane chemistry will go to waste!! Like I said, I love them together, they almost glow in each other's company and are definite equals that bounce off each other so well.

I am curious to see if we will learn why Abbie didn't give Luke another chance. I am also curious to see how much chemistry Abbie is going to have with future hunk that she can have some fun with, because she should! It will be interesting to compare her relative dismissal of Luke and how she acts with the new guy, to how she is with Ichabod. Just like we all know there is a huge chemistry difference between Abbie/Ichabod and Ichabod/Katrina.

Indi said: But I still want her love interest to be a real one and for her to form a family with him

Real yes (temporarily). Family no. Already enough babies/children, though looking back at the Jeremy/Henry reveal, okay cool, that was awesome. I do not want Katrina or Abbie  (or Jenny) having the possibility of popping out a kid. No way.

I will be interested to see how secure new guy is. Most men might become very jealous of their girlfriends spending lots of time with Tall Dark Handsome British guys. Just saying.

Millahnna said: While she hasn't been the most well used character, I don't have the large problems with her others do and even if ultimately she will be removed from the show (I've been guessing she'll be killed off eventually since her first appearance)

I've wondered this too. Nicole Beharie did chemistry tests with both Tom Mison and Lyndie Greenwood, so obviously how those two played off Beharie was important to the show. But I have not heard that Katia Winter did a chemistry test with Mison, which is a bit strange. Wouldn't the "greatest love affair ever" kinda warrant that?

I'm leaning towards killed off too, either in a show of sacrifice (assuming she's all around good), or consequences her suspect actions and decisions.

Edited April 17, 2014 by HalcyonDays

[Indi]

Real yes (temporarily). Family no. Already enough babies/children, though looking back at the Jeremy/Henry reveal, okay cool, that was awesome. I do not want Katrina or Abbie  (or Jenny) having the possibility of popping out a kid. No way.

I hope it's not a temporary love interest and that he's her lover for the duration of the show, but I agree I don't want babies. Jeremy is already awful enough. When I said "form a family", I meant live together or get married and maybe plan to have babies in the future, after the end of the the seven years of tribulation. I wouldn't be opposed to a baby in the very last season if the pregnancy and birth happens during the hiatus and the baby only gets a couple of heartwarming scenes. But making the baby an important part of the story? Hell no!

Wait... didn't Katrina already pop out a kid? Why can't Abbie then?

I will be interested to see how secure new guy is. Most men might become very jealous of their girlfriends spending lots of time with Tall Dark Handsome British guys. Just saying.

 

Luckily for him Abbie seems quite immune to Ichabod's rather elusive charms. I haven't seen any attraction on her part and I hope, for her sake, she's not dumb enough to fall for him. That would be disappointing.

I've wondered this too. Nicole Beharie did chemistry tests with both Tom Mison and Lyndie Greenwood, so obviously how those two played off Beharie was important to the show. But I have not heard that Katia Winter did a chemistry test with Mison, which is a bit strange. Wouldn't the "greatest love affair ever" kinda warrant that?

The only explanation is that they think Tom and Katia make a more "natural" romantic couple, therefore no need for chemistry tests. A huge blunder, but that's what we're stuck with till the bitter end.

It looks like Nicole wants to be part in the casting process of Abbie's love interest, which is very smart! If the chemistry fails here, which with Nicole is next to impossible, it can only be intentional.

[HalcyonDays]

I hope it's not a temporary love interest and that he's her lover for the duration of the show, but I agree I don't want babies. Jeremy is already awful enough. When I said "form a family", I meant live together or get married and maybe plan to have babies in the future, after the end of the the seven years of tribulation. I wouldn't be opposed to a baby in the very last season if the pregnancy and birth happens during the hiatus and the baby only gets a couple of heartwarming scenes. But making the baby an important part of the story? Hell no!

Wait... didn't Katrina already pop out a kid? Why can't Abbie then?

If there is any marriage or babies happening besides the one we have now, then it will be the Jump the Shark moment for the show, IMO.

The show is about Abbie and Ichabod being the two Witnesses who have to save humanity from the coming Apocalypse. Abbie being nine months pregnant running around the forests heaving her belly along is going to be a bit of a problem. I don't want to see any of that. No weddings, no marriages, no more babies, etc. That's why there is birth control! Abbie can have her kid (if she wants them - you're assuming she does) after the show ends. If Katrina is smart in the modern time, she'll hit Abbie up for birth control advice ASAP.

This includes when/if Abbie and Ichabod get together. I honestly do not want to see any weddings, babies, or any of the sort between these two. Honestly. Strange that I am an Ichabbier but don't want this. OT, but I used to watch Castle all of the time, and now with the wedding thing going on, and some recent episode with them cooing over a baby - Yuk. Completely turnoff to me. The show lost what made the two mains so awesome because of the typical focus on "Everyone must have Marriage and Baby." Why can't they just be together and enjoy each other?

Have a nice proposal, commitment to each other and that sappy marriage/baby stuff can be fanfic'ed by someone after the show ends.

The only explanation is that they think Tom and Katia make a more "natural" romantic couple, therefore no need for chemistry tests.

This makes no sense. Nicole and Lyndie are "natural" sisters, but they did a chemistry test also. I think is has to do more with Nicole/Abbie being the main and those around her need to mesh well with her and everything revolves around Abbie (and Ichabod) anyway. As CinnamonCW stated above, I can see why Katia was excluded if the ultimate goal is a season 2 kill off. (I dare hope?). Also, from what I understand, or more accurately haven't heard, Orlando Jones did not do any chemistry tests with anyone also, so there you are.

Abbie seems quite immune to Ichabod's rather elusive charms.

I'll just bring up the second last episode where Abbie finds out Ichabod redrew the map, he says "Admit it, you appreciate me a little." and she gives a coy little smile and flirtatiously snarks "microscopically." Love that!

Edited April 17, 2014 by HalcyonDays

[CinnamonCW]

 millahnna,

 

I'm cautiously optimistic about increased Katrina screentime.  While she hasn't been the most well used character, I don't have the large problems with her others do and even if ultimately she will be removed from the show (I've been guessing she'll be killed off eventually since her first appearance) I think her place in Ichabod's life (past and present) needs to be resolved.  I'd rather they dealt with her than just forgot she existed.  Writing her off the show with minimal explanation would disappoint me more than any of the questionable decisions they've already made with her character.

 

I want to second everything you’ve said, emphasizing that abruptly killing her off would make a bad thing worse. I don’t hate or dislike Katrina, I’m rather disappointed. “Cautiously optimistic” is an appropriate way to put how I feel also.

 

I hope it's not a temporary love interest and that he's her lover for the duration of the show, but I agree I don't want babies. Jeremy is already awful enough. When I said "form a family", I meant live together or get married and maybe plan to have babies in the future, after the end of the the seven years of tribulation. I wouldn't be opposed to a baby in the very last season if the pregnancy and birth happens during the hiatus and the baby only gets a couple of heartwarming scenes. But making the baby an important part of the story? Hell no!

Wait... didn't Katrina already pop out a kid? Why can't Abbie then?

 

I could see it leading to the implication that even an non forth-coming white woman deserves an “epic” romance with an adoring husband plus a child whereas a black woman doesn’t. Yet bringing a man in for a long-term relationship can imply a black woman must be rushed into a relationship and pregnancy in order to shove her in the corner story-wise. IMO, it’s a testament to our culture that there’s such a line to walk.

However, I think it’s too early for either of those conclusions to be anything but a simplification. As it is, IMO, Abbie is a rich, nuanced character.

[Indi]

Yet bringing a man in for a long-term relationship can imply a black woman must be rushed into a relationship and pregnancy in order to shove her in the corner story-wise.

I don't think it's necessary to rush it. I don't know how many seasons this show is going to have, but if they introduce her love interest next season, the serious stuff like marriage and pregnancy could happen in the last one. In the meantime, she can have all the fun and sexy times, when she's not fighting demons.

However, I think it’s too early for either of those conclusions to be anything but a simplification. As it is, IMO, Abbie is a rich, nuanced character.

Who was gently but firmly shoved to the background in the second half of the season and carelessly abandoned in purgatory in the finale. I don't really have much reason to be optimistic, that they'll handle that story well. Realistically, I know this is not the kind of show that would allow her to have a family and relationships, because Ichabod must absolutely be the center of her world, although the opposite is not true, because he is allowed to have his epic romance, family and side stories. But knowing this doesn't mean I cannot resent it. If the show proves me completely wrong and they actually give her a meaningful long lasting relationship with this new character, just like they did with Ichabod and Katrina. I'll be very happy to say I was wrong. Until then, I can only judge by what they have already done, which doesn't make me very hopeful.

[HalcyonDays]

Cool - interesting information /spoiler for season 2. Possibly Irving's temporary replacement?

Lauren P.: I miss Sleepy Hollow so much. Got any season 2 scoop?
Yep! There's a new sheriff in town, and she's kind of a far cry from Corbin. Described as "smart, forceful, highly trained and commanding but also has a warm and maternal side," Sheriff Vasquez apparently used to live in Sleepy Hollow before moving to Texas to work for the U.S. Border Patrol. We hear that's not a very chill job, so we're thinking she's not going to be very tolerant of the headless time-traveling supernatural nonsense that's taken over the town as of late. We'll see how that goes.

From link: E online spoilers

[CinnamonCW]

I don't think it's necessary to rush it. I don't know how many seasons this show is going to have, but if they introduce her love interest next season, the serious stuff like marriage and pregnancy could happen in the last one. In the meantime, she can have all the fun and sexy times, when she's not fighting demons.

This will only be the second season though, and there were just 13 episodes of the first season. Again, it is IMO too early to say but both scenarios can lead to negative implications if not handled carefully.

Who was gently but firmly shoved to the background in the second half of the season and carelessly abandoned in purgatory in the finale. I don't really have much reason to be optimistic, that they'll handle that story well. Realistically, I know this is not the kind of show that would allow her to have a family and relationships, because Ichabod must absolutely be the center of her world, although the opposite is not true, because he is allowed to have his epic romance, family and side stories. But knowing this doesn't mean I cannot resent it. If the show proves me completely wrong and they actually give her a meaningful long lasting relationship with this new character, just like they did with Ichabod and Katrina. I'll be very happy to say I was wrong. Until then, I can only judge by what they have already done, which doesn't make me very hopeful.

 

 

That doesn’t make much sense to me because Abbie’s story was front-and-center for the first part of the very short season. Even once the focus shifted, Jenny’s confession to Abbie and the start of a healing process in their relationship was the most compelling story.

Additionally it’s been brought to light that Katrina kept things from Ichabod, things we now see impact the world at large (not just Ichabod). It doesn’t appear Ichabod and Katrina have the “epic” relationship Ichabod thought they did when he first awoke. So I guess I don’t see how wishing that on Abbie reflects wanting a pleasant or “meaningful” relationship and offspring for her. Unless you mean the only “good” way to handle Abbie is to put her in a long-term relationship that eventually produces offspring, in which case a thousand gallons of “I disagree.”

[Carrie Ann]

Yeah, I feel like this is a two-lead show, and to me the focus is shared equally between Ichabod and Abbie. But if anyone is the main protagonist, I think it's Abbie because Ichabod is the outsider, the visitor from another land. We'll see how Season 2 handles things, but I was pleased with the balance this season.

[Indi]

Cool - interesting information /spoiler for season 2. Possibly Irving's temporary replacement?

Lauren P.: I miss Sleepy Hollow so much. Got any season 2 scoop?

Yep! There's a new sheriff in town, and she's kind of a far cry from Corbin. Described as "smart, forceful, highly trained and commanding but also has a warm and maternal side," Sheriff Vasquez apparently used to live in Sleepy Hollow before moving to Texas to work for the U.S. Border Patrol. We hear that's not a very chill job, so we're thinking she's not going to be very tolerant of the headless time-traveling supernatural nonsense that's taken over the town as of late. We'll see how that goes.

From link: E online spoilers

Interesting news. I'm looking forward to this.

Additionally it’s been brought to light that Katrina kept things from Ichabod

But other than the secret about Jeremy, he never minded it at all. It would be weird for him to start questioning now. The time for that was in S1. I think their relationship is as strong as ever. In theory, because it never succeeded on screen, but that doesn't really matter.

Unless you mean the only “good” way to handle Abbie is to put her in a long-term relationship that eventually produces offspring, in which case a thousand gallons of “I disagree.”

I'm not sure it would be the only good way, but it would certainly show some fairness. Surely Ichabod can't the only one deserving a family? An offspring or even the hint of a future offspring in the series finale would be a nice addition, but not really necessary.

[millahnna]

 

It would be weird for him to start questioning now.

I don't think it would be weird.  Now that she's actually in front of him, his perspective could shift in a lot of ways (not the least of which is "you don't get to fade into the mist every time I try to get some information").  In season one, his priority in regards to Katrina was just to get her out of purgatory.  Now that she's in our timeline with him, some of the things he  wasn't questioning may come to the surface of his thoughts more.  I mean, they may not and the writers could just let it lie.  But I don't think it would seem weird for him to question stuff now.  Her coven was directly involved with Washington's plans in ways that he doesn't fully understand.  I think it would be natural for him to ask Katrina if she knows anything about... whatever, as things come up. 

[HalcyonDays]

"you don't get to fade into the mist every time I try to get some information"

 

Ha! So true and this is honestly what she did everytime there was a scene with Katrina warning Ichabod. How many times were the words "There's no more time!" spoken by Katrina and how many times did we see Ichabod question his wife, and she just looks teary-eyed and weepy and looks down to the floor unwilling to answer. Everytime. Hell, even when Ichabod actually went into Purgatory (with Henry's help), he pointedly said to wife "What are you not telling me."

 

So yeah, he will confront her and she will have to answer and there is no mist or imminent threat to interrupt them. Finally.

 

Her coven was directly involved with Washington's plans in ways that he doesn't fully understand.

 

I'm looking forward to these flashbacks, actually, because then we (and Crane) will get an understanding of why him (and Abbie).

Which leads to this tiny spoiler from eonline.

 

Melissa: In desperate need of more season two spoilers for Sleepy Hollow! The wait is killing me.

Prepare to meet another one of the Founding Fathers! The Fox hit is set to welcome Benjamin Franklin in season two. Franklin will appear alongside Ichabod in a flashback to 1775 and show off his scathing sense of humor. (The character was briefly seen in season one, but a recast is going down.)

 

TVGuide has a small blurb about why the relationship (platonic) between Ichabod and Abbie is the best and why many of us invested in Ichabbie (platonic or not) have nothing to worry about.

 

Season MVPs

Edited April 23, 2014 by HalcyonDays

[Carrie Ann]

Ugh, I hated those stupid fade-into-the-mist scenes so much. I still have hope that she's evil, and I almost want to give the writers credit and say that her withholding information was intentional, but chances are slim.

 

It's been a few months, so I may be misremembering, but I still don't understand why Katrina never told Ichabod or Abbie that in order for her to leave Purgatory, someone would need to take her place. I mean, she knew what they were trying to do, right? So Ichabod keeps his promise to save her and she's suddenly shocked and appalled. She waited until they're already there to say that someone will have to stay if she goes. If the audience isn't supposed to dislike and mistrust her, I really don't understand the way she was written at all.

Edited April 23, 2014 by Carrie Ann

[Indi]

I really don't understand the way she was written at all.

The reason was misdirection, apparently. They needed to distract us away from Henry/Jeremy and make us believe she was manipulating everyone. This did an already weak character a huge disservice, because she doesn't make any sense and seems dumber than a box of rocks. It's not only that she didn't tell Ichabod how to free her (by the way, Ichabod didn't ask her either although he knew that she knew), it's that she lied to direct questions, like the reason why she was in purgatory at all and kept secrets for no reason whatsoever, like her being a witch or him a Witness, before they married.

 

I hope they forget S1 Katrina completely. Discussing her lies in S2 will just remind me of the mess they did with this character and Ichabod's willful blindness. Ichabod swallowed every single thing she said and thought it was perfectly fine. He realized Katrina had kept valuable information on how to get out of purgatory, but it was okay, because it was convenient for him to leave Abbie behind. He learned she had lied to him about her true identity, but he claimed it was "cool!". I don't feel like watching some fabricated melodrama about Ichabod confronting Katrina, because after the finale he doesn't have any moral high-ground to stand on and her excuses can only be nonsensical and, worst of all, useless. The answers won't help Abbie out of purgatory and the damage is already done. What I do hope, however, is that Abbie learned her lesson and questions everything the Cranes tell her, because they sure as hell love to lie and deceive.

[ChelseaNH]

Surely Ichabod can't the only one deserving a family?

Abbie has a family.  Frankly, I don't think she would be ready for a long-term relationship until she dealt with the baggage of her childhood and the fallout from the encounter with Moloch.  I think it's fair to say she has trust issues.  I wouldn't mind some romance if it evolved organically, but I can't see her making it a priority at this juncture.

[HalcyonDays]

Abbie has a family.  Frankly, I don't think she would be ready for a long-term relationship until she dealt with the baggage of her childhood and the fallout from the encounter with Moloch.  I think it's fair to say she has trust issues.  I wouldn't mind some romance if it evolved organically, but I can't see her making it a priority at this juncture.

 

Yeah she does have lots of trust issues. We saw it early on with her interactions with Jenny, Luke and even with Corbin. She wouldn't open up to anyone except - Ichabod. And I find that really interesting and wonder if they will ever explain it (besides plot). Ichabod is the only one she has ever been completely honest with, which is such a sharp contrast to everyone else.

 

Ugh, I hated those stupid fade-into-the-mist scenes so much. I still have hope that she's evil, and I almost want to give the writers credit and say that her withholding information was intentional, but chances are slim.

 

It's been a few months, so I may be misremembering, but I still don't understand why Katrina never told Ichabod or Abbie that in order for her to leave Purgatory, someone would need to take her place. I mean, she knew what they were trying to do, right? So Ichabod keeps his promise to save her and she's suddenly shocked and appalled. She waited until they're already there to say that someone will have to stay if she goes. If the audience isn't supposed to dislike and mistrust her, I really don't understand the way she was written at all.

 

I can explain it with one word - Plot. If Katrina was forthright and revealed information that we wanted her to, half of the season wouldn't exist. You wouldn't have the whole episode where Ichabod Interrogates the Horseman. You wouldn't have the Golem episode at all. Not the Sin Eater episode (and technically Ichabod would probably be dead then), and the final two episodes either, since Abbie and Ichabod would know that a soul-swap had to take place, and they'd figure out a way around it before entering Purgatory. So even though Katrina's behaviour is quite suspect and shady, it's all for plot purposes.

 

Which disappoints me, because I was so hoping for more....The information is being withheld but it's more due to plot and the writers than the character.

 

But I would still like the show to go there anyway and address this I hope.

Edited April 24, 2014 by HalcyonDays

[Scarlett45]

Hello everyone. Just introducing myself. I am looking forward to the new season!

Ps I am a TWOP refugee, same screen name.

[CinnamonCW]

Some spoilers below! First episode title, cast and character(s), and the "theme" for season two. Never did this before so here goes...

http://au.ibtimes.com/articles/550171/20140430/sleepy-hollow-season-2-episode-1-update.htm#.U2GSFtGKDIU

http://www.ibtimes.com/sleepy-hollow-season-2-spoilers-episode-1-title-leaked-online-what-will-happen-during-1577256

Season Two, Episode One will apparently be called 'Hellfire.' One of the themes will be redemption, though I believe this was already
mentioned.

There's also a casting call for what appear to be Revolutionary War soldiers.

Edited May 1, 2014 by CinnamonCW

[Blackhoney]

I doubt Abbie will get a love interest. At least not one of importance. Like Luke, we’ll see him once in a blue moon and he’ll be decoration more than anything. The higher-ups don’t seem all that interested in giving Abbie a life outside of Crane. I don’t see that changing in season 2. If anything, it will only get worse.

As the season progresses I think we’re gonna get a lot more Katrina and Crane together, with Abbie stuck in purgatory, neutralized to make room for that epic love story the writers keep telling us about.

Irving will drastically see his screen time decrease as they make room for a new Captain, a woman I heard. So they’ll wanna pander to that as much as possible, just one of many mistakes I see coming in season 2.

With only 13 episodes, and based on what the writers and producers have said, I see more of a focus on the supernatural and less of a focus on the personal relationships and that to me will be the show’s undoing.

Honestly, I don’t hold out much hope for any character being treated well except for Crane. He’ll be the golden boy as always. Making bad decisions, risking everyone’s life and then whining about being 250 years old.

Edited May 6, 2014 by Blackhoney

[formerlyfreedom]

Season Two filming has apparently started -  http://twitter.com/dougaa/status/463310940138897408/photo/1

[HalcyonDays]

Season Two filming has apparently started -  http://twitter.com/dougaa/status/463310940138897408/photo/1

Finally!! And I'm calling it now...

 

Jenny (duh - survives the car crash) and rescues/digs up Crane. ---> http://37.media.tumblr.com/19d4d00db71db77db2354307e669bd13/tumblr_n53o8eCcxo1qhozbxo1_1280.png

 

Editing my own post since I don't want to double-post.

 

Fox "chief" Kevin Reilly talks about TV - Point # 4 mentions Sleepy Hollow - specifically how many episodes they may do this year and also the expected airing schedule. Not surprising what he says - the show was filming scenes a bit more than ONE WEEK before airing the actual episode in December, that's how close they were cutting it. I'm very happy about what he says.

Edited May 6, 2014 by HalcyonDays

[SimoneS]

Based on the writers' comments and their determination to integrate Katrina more, I don't see an Ichabod/Abbie romance ever happening so I am glad that Abbie is getting a love interest, even if we rarely see him.

 

If I had my way, Andy would redeem himself, become human again, and Abbie would slowly fall for him because I love John Cho and want him to become a regular member of the cast.

 

I just read that casting call for Revolutionary era soldiers. Many enslaved Africans escaped and fought for the British so they could cast some black men to play some of those soldiers.

Edited May 7, 2014 by SimoneS

[caseylane]

I don't want Abbie in some long term romance. My end game is Abbie/Ichabod so, in my opinion, let the woman have some casual boyfriends until Katrina either dies or learns the joys of modern divorce. (Not that I'm sure how a divorce from a marriage performed 200 years ago would be done).

 

I also don't think she has to start popping out children to show how happy she is. She's a cop, having a child has some serious repercussions on your job once a woman gets pregnant. It isn't to be taken lightly. As far as saying she deserves it because Ichabod/Katrina had a child, well, they didn't exactly get to coo over the layette and watch those first steps.

 

Also don't think Abbie will have her presence diminished because I feel she's a co-lead, not a co-star. Of course I've heard the complaints about Scandal so what do I know. I just know that all of the talk is about her and Ichabod with much less about the wife.

Edited May 7, 2014 by caseylane

[SimoneS]

And when Abbie and Ichabod's romance never happens? What then, Abbie misses out on a great love waiting for a man who will never fall in love with her? 

 

As for diminished airtime, most of the airtime and scenes are Abbie and Ichabod so if they are pushing Katrina, the airtime will likely be taken from Abbie or they will put Abbie in scenes with the supporting characters more.  

Edited May 7, 2014 by SimoneS

[Indi]

And when Abbie and Ichabod's romance never happens? What then, Abbie misses out on a great love waiting for a man who will never fall in love with her?

The question for me is, would I ever want a romance between them? Because I don't think Ichabod has it in him to feel anything for someone like Abbie, even less anything close to the Epic Love he's supposed to feel for the special snowflake that is his wife. He threw her under the bus the first opportunity he had. This is not the guy, who'd risk everything for Abbie, like he did for Katrina. This is not the guy who'd value, adore and love her passionately. He gave her up to Moloch, so it's not like he even cares, whether she lives or dies! This is the guy who used and sacrificed her, to get what he wanted and I'm convinced he'll do it again.

 

Let's imagine he somehow loses Katrina and turns to Abbie to fill a void. Why would I want something that bland and wishy-washy for Abbie? She deserves so much better!

 

I don't think I have to worry though. The producers have been rejecting the possibility of a romance between them very firmly from the beginning. They seem to hate the very idea of Ichabbie and maybe that's why they made Ichabod such a douchebag to Abbie in the second half of last season.

 

As for diminished airtime, most of the airtime and scenes are Abbie and Ichabod so if they are pushing Katrina, the airtime will likely be taken from Abbie or they will put Abbie in scenes with the supporting characters more.

One thing is certain, Abbie will be the one to suffer the consequences of more Katrina (and Jeremy), not Ichabod.

[HalcyonDays]

If I had my way, Andy would redeem himself, become human again, and Abbie would slowly fall for him because I love John Cho and want him to become a regular member of the cast.

 

I just read that casting call for Revolutionary era soldiers. Many enslaved Africans escaped and fought for the British so they could cast some black men to play some of those soldiers.

 

War and Redemption are the themes for season two. I too love John Cho and would love to see him redeem himself and resume his humanity and fight the good fight. I'm gonna doubt Abbie will want a relationship with Andy. First, he creeps her out a bit (now), and second, she told Ichabod to "take his head" during the Horseman interrogation scene. I don't think she'll suddenly change her tune, especially since she would have HUGE trust issues with Andy.

 

I would like to see him redeemed. No information on if he's to return, I notice. John Cho also is starring in his own TV show.

 

Enslaved Africans fought for both sides. The British offered freedom to any Africans who would fight for their cause (many did) but reneged at the very end or the war. Go figure. Washington initially allowed Africans in some of his units and got major backlash from slave-owners so he eventually said no, but some units were comprised of former slaves, etc.

 

I wonder if they will address this on the show - that would be very interesting actually. Crane is portrayed as so modern and enlightened, yet his own Patriots were the ones who were far more accepting of slavery. There is a certain cultural mentality, since Britain (and Canada - a British colony - much earlier) banned slavery by the early 1800's, yet the US had to go through a Civil War and still had segregation in the 1950s. Blanket statement, somewhat, since many other factors were in play, but still....

it would be very interesting in terms of storyline.