Childhood’s End - General Discussion

[Jordan27]

My sister keeps asking something that was never addressed.  What happened to the plane and the pilot that landed in Barbie's cornfield at the beginning of the episode?

[Macbeth]

I love Charles Dance - this is probably the most empathetic character he has ever played.  He  radiated  warmth and kidness while playing an Alien that looks like Satan.  That takes mad skill.  I don't know how they convinced him to do all of that prosthetics.  I wouldn't think Syfy had that $.

[Ghost of TWOP Past]

It's odd that a Grand Cosmic Consciousness needs scary huge red monster guys to drive spaceships here and there.

 

It has more important thinks to do, and delegates the routine tasks to its underlings. 

[Netfoot]

What happened to the plane and the pilot that landed in Barbie's cornfield at the beginning of the episode?

 

Presumably taken away by truck.  It wasn't there later in the episode, but there was a visible disturbance where the corn had been flattened.

 

It looked like a Piper Pawnee or something very similar.  Like all crop dusters, they crash-land with alarming frequency and are designed to come apart easily and to be trucked away for repair.

[Ghost of TWOP Past]

The other confusion is when Milo gets back, it shows Jennifer in the volcano light beam, but still a little girl. She should have been 80 years older. 

 

The children were no longer fully human, and we not aging. In the book, they stand out in the wilderness like that for (I believe) years. 

 

Maybe I'm alone in this, but I feel that SyFy has never respected science fiction, and often talks down to its audience. In this instance, the protagonist of the book was the head of the UN. But SyFy decides to make him a blue collar everyman? As if to say, "Yes, we're the science fiction channel, but we don't like effete eggheads any more than you do." So now he's a farmer, who has all kinds of free time because he sure never works on his crops. Also, SyFy doesn't seem to believe we will care about the end of the world, so they need to punch the story up by giving him a personal crisis in the form of a dead spouse he can't get over. I fast-forwarded through most of the relationship arguments/scenes in part 3, and they still seemed to go on forever. Then he gets some fatal disease from being on their ship? WTF? 

 

A small but glaring point that really bugged me was that the Overlords inexplicably can't make a second dose of the miracle cure-all. But then, they couldn't visit his house without tearing it half apart and blowing the door out, so it seems SyFy would have us believe that they're not all that competent. 

 

Lastly, and I know that this is a matter of personal taste, but it always seemed to me that the book was actually the story of the Overlords, and their tale is a tragedy. The human tale is sorrowful, in that the last generation loses its children. But the human race moves on to something grander, and that's not a sad story. But the Overlords are an evolutionary dead end, the tale of their racial destiny is over, and they will never be more than useful servitors of the Overmind. This is what stuck with me over the years from the book, but that aspect was barely present in this version. 

 

Overall, it was not as bad as I was afraid, but neither can I say that I liked it. 

 

Last but not least, the sound frequently would stop working during the ondemand commercial breaks, and I'd have to stop and restart the program to get it back. Very aggravating.

Edited December 20, 2015 by Ghost of TWOP Past

[Netfoot]

And if a big faith isn't the truth, an overwhelming number of mankind have it wrong.

 

The number of adherents boasted by a religion doesn't mean anything.  Remember, 100% of the planet once believed that the earth was flat.  Since religious beliefs are, generally, not based upon any sort of evidence, the fact that a lot of people believe it doesn't make it any more likely to be true.

[Netfoot]

Lastly, and I know that this is a matter of personal taste, but it always seemed to me that the book was actually the story of the Overlords, and their tale is a tragedy. The human tale is sorrowful, in that the last generation loses its children. But the human race moves on to something grander, and that's not a sad story. But the Overlords are an evolutionary dead end, the tale of their racial destiny is over, and they will never be more than useful servitors of the Overmind. This is what stuck with me over the years from the book, but that aspect was barely present in this version.

 

I don't know if it's true to say that the main arc of the story was the tragic tale of the Overlords.

 

At the beginning, they seem to be a race of all-powerful entities that we can only envy.  It is later revealed that they are in fact low man on the totem pole, and that while humanity has not surpassed them, we soon will.  I do think their tragic misfortune to be ever denied the opportunity to ascend could have been emphasized a little more.

 

But when all is said and done, the show is about the advancement of humanity from the physical to the non-corporal, shared consciousness.  And about the difficult and painful nature of the transition.  The Overlords, it turns out to be, only have a small part to play, functioning as guide and guardian.  They are only the Nannies, sent by the Overmind, to see to the proper development of the children into adulthood.  Hence the name of the book/series.

[Gel]

Except, it was the piece of music (which I didn't recognize) that was to be the memorial for our planet.

I was completely taken out of the grand memorial moment because the visual that came to mind was a small blinking orb where the Earth used to be with a sign saying, "Please press Play."

Because otherwise, the Overlords were going to somehow leave sound in space. To which, just, sigh.

[jhlipton]

One thing that hasn't been mentioned but stood out to me:  The Overlords appeared in all these cities at the same time, right?  But they also appeared in broad daylight in all these cities.  That just doesn't work!

 

It was completely jarring to me.

[Bruinsfan]

I think the idea was that they would memorialize the human race by sharing the music amongst themselves.

 

Though really, Jennifer/the human children taking all their memories of Earth (including the telepathically read ones) with them when they ascended means that info will last until the end of the universe, even if the Overmind doesn't actually care very much about it.

Edited December 21, 2015 by Bruinsfan

[Bruinsfan]

I suppose it's also possible that for each person, their belief system will turn out to be true. I mean, we're talking about metaphysics, it might not be a case of being limited by a binary right/wrong choice.

[shapeshifter]

I think that is one thing that most people know, but don't express very often.  Most want to be tolerant of other's beliefs.  But, the point is that either there is a heaven or not, there is either a hell or not, Jesus died for our sins or he didn't, we have lived before or we haven't, and there is either a God or not, etc.  All of these can't be true and exist on a reality level.    And since there is no majority belief in the world, most of mankind have it wrong.  And if a big faith isn't the truth, an overwhelming number of mankind have it wrong.

How about a story of alternate universes for each religion with wormhole travel between them? The point would be, "When in Rome, do as the Romans do."

[Anela]

Depressing. It sounds like the book was a lot better. I'll have to read that.

 

I wish they would come up with a way to tell a story, without bringing a magical baby into the mix. I know this story was written years before I was even born, but so many shows use that. I always end up losing interest in a story once the child is introduced. 

[Hanahope]

I just finished watching this last night, yay for FF and no commercials, which is really good, because wow, what a downer of a movie and makes me glad I never read the book as a kid.

 

After thinking a bit about it, I came to realize that the "Overmind" is 'God'.  Its an all powerful, all seeing entity, omnipresent entity and the children 'ascended' into 'heaven' to be 'one with God.'  And the 'devil' was one of the Overlords that broke away from the others early to 'warn' Earth that maybe 'God' isn't so great, its not really what you think. But the Christians (following a prophet, Jesus, who maybe was an early evolved person?) resisted his message and made the rogue overlord the personification of 'anti-god', i.e. 'evil.' So, yeah the Christians are right, sortof.  Hope they are happy.

[Bruinsfan]

No, there wasn't any contact with the Overlords in the past. Supposedly what was happening was that humanity's image of devils was a collective premonition of the whole race's not-particularly-happy end thanks to their future intervention. The Overmind does pretty well fit the definition of God in most respects except that it arose from the physical world rather than creating it.

[Netfoot]

The Overmind does pretty well fit the definition of God in most respects except that it arose from the physical world rather than creating it.

 

Not to mention that there would be no need for mankind to "ascend" to become one with the Overmind, since according to the religious tomes, that is exactly what we all do, individually, after death.  Also, there was no suggestion that only children who were believers ascended, leaving non-believing children behind.  

[kminfinity]

Ghost of TWOP Past

...it always seemed to me that the book was actually the story of the Overlords, and their tale is a tragedy. The human tale is sorrowful, in that the last generation loses its children. But the human race moves on to something grander, and that's not a sad story. But the Overlords are an evolutionary dead end, the tale of their racial destiny is over, and they will never be more than useful servitors of the Overmind. This is what stuck with me over the years from the book, but that aspect was barely present in this version. 

 

I very much agree with this.  I'd add that from the human POV it is also a tragedy that to 'ascend' and evolve, one must give up the very things that define one's humanity.  So the twist is that existence is tragic either way.

 

I'm not sure the caterpillar/butterfly metamorphosis metaphor applies.  I guess it does if you agree both the butterfly and the children as Overmind are destined.  But the tone of the novel and, to its credit, the mini series, is about loss, so that seems to rule out a happy future.  I guess there's a case to be made that 'progress' or evolution is its own justification, but you'd think ACC would have made a stronger case for that POV or else shown why joining the Overmind is a good thing.  But he doesn't.

 

 

 

[Ghost of TWOP Past]

I'm surprised that so many people see this story as tragic. To Neanderthals, the arrival of homo sapiens ended their story, but started our own. That's what's happening here. Now, it's our turn to pass the torch. 

[fauntleroy]

Neanderthals coexisted with Homo sapiens for thousands of years. They even interbred. They disappeared relatively gradually.

 

Change in a species of the magnitude shown in this story would take thousands of years, not a generation or two. Which is why I assumed the Overlords precipitated it.

 

This is not to say the end of humanity is inconceivable of course. But this particular scenario, in which the next generation is so different from the previous that it barely acknowledges it as life at all let alone life worth worrying about, doesn't make sense to me.

 

It seems to me greater, not less, compassion for life in a wider variety of its forms is a hallmark of advanced human consciousness. This compassion may be coming too little too late, we are still violent and short-sighted and we may ruin the planet. But it contradicts the direction of our progress so far that our descendants would have such a complete indifference to the life that brought them into the world.

Edited December 23, 2015 by fauntleroy

[Jordan27]

The number of adherents boasted by a religion doesn't mean anything.  Remember, 100% of the planet once believed that the earth was flat.  Since religious beliefs are, generally, not based upon any sort of evidence, the fact that a lot of people believe it doesn't make it any more likely to be true.

Didn't say it did.   Just that if the truth is not widely believed, then most of mankind got it wrong.

[Jordan27]

I very much agree with this.  I'd add that from the human POV it is also a tragedy that to 'ascend' and evolve, one must give up the very things that define one's humanity.  So the twist is that existence is tragic either way.

 

Not so.  The only thing humanity was giving up was their negativity and moving onto the divine, which is what many faiths teach.

Last but not least, the sound frequently would stop working during the ondemand commercial breaks, and I'd have to stop and restart the program to get it back. Very aggravating.

 

I'm so glad you mentioned this.  It's been happening for a short while on many shows on demand.  It just happened again tonight. Need to call the cable company and let them know.  Thanks for saying something.  I thought maybe it was something wrong with just my TV.

Edited December 29, 2015 by Jordan27

[SmithW6079]

The best thing about this episode was the Eva Cassidy cover of "Imagine" at the beginning. (She also has a great rendition of Sting's "Fields of Gold.")

[SmithW6079]

This just got stupider and stupider. The big ascension scene? Was hi-larious! Wait, was it supposed to be dramatic? All I could think of was the Rapture scene in an early Christmas episode of "American Dad."

What a waste of time.

[lucindabelle]

I haven't read the book in ages, and don't really remember it...

 

The only part that felt off was the oil and water bit with the Ayyyyyrabs.  That was a jerk move, and the West have been jerks to that part of the world since the Crusades.  And "You can't drink oil" is just too trite.

 

The "Devil" as the personification of evil is a totally Christian thing.  Most religions don't have a truly Eeeeeeeeeevil temptor -- the closest would be the Trickster -- Loki, Coyote, The Monkey King, etc.  So all the non-Christians would be wondering what the fuss over this particular meme would be.

Yeah Jews don't either it's just not a thing. Satan is then antagonis or justi he evil I coin action. his apple. Acne would be unsettling be undettling don't i believe in hell anyway it would make me more curious than frightened.

[lucindabelle]

Ugh, what is tePONT of an over mind? Why is one mind better than many? The overlord was quoting William shakespeare. Show me your William shakespeare, over mind.

I didn't see any positive aspects to evolution whatever. This over in character is just a tyrant.

Fwiw I also found the end of 2001 to be one of the creepiest things I'd ever seen ever. That movie gave ne nightmares.

Basically, seems like Arthur c, Clarke is purveying a kind of vague hippy dippy transcend kind of theory which makes zero sense.

He's asking the reader (viewer) just to accept in blind faith, really, that this evolution is a good thing,,, based on zero evidence.

[Chinspinner]

I am late to this show, but catching up with it on Now TV. So far I have watched the first two episodes. Unfortunately I am struggling with how the central conceit has been handled in the show. It is essentially an "evil genie" story, but barely anyone on the entirety of Earth was sceptical? Even when the creature is revealed as a literal devil. This should have been a dark comedy, because it is unintentionally funny regardless.