Marvel Comics: All-New, All-Different

[starri]

6 minutes ago, Lantern7 said:

Question Because I'm Too Lazy To Look Up The Answer: What happened to Young Angel's wings?

Long Answer:  during a crossover event with the Guardians of the Galaxy, he was exposed to a Celestial relic called the Black Vortex and got cosmic powers.  He told X-23 it was because he wanted to avoid turning into Archangel in the future.

Short Answer:  Because reasons.

[starri]

Marvel swears Events are going on hiatus for a year and a half.  Color me skeptical.

[Joe]

4 hours ago, starri said:

Marvel swears Events are going on hiatus for a year and a half.  Color me skeptical.

Good. Events and crossovers always put me off. Perfect time to stop reading.

[starri]

You know, I was made extremely uncomfortable by the anti-Semitism that got sneaked into X-Men Gold #1, but seeing the stuff that Marvel amended after the artist got himself fired, it's somehow even worse than I thought.

That panel of Kitty appearing to take a baseball bat the face can't me a coincidence, and it's disgusting. 

[Lantern7]

Lots going on in Chicago. Just found out Priest will be writing an Inhumans miniseries. Phil Noto will be the artist.

[Morrigan2575]

Did Marvel do something horribly bad recently?

Someone o follow on Twitter keeps retweeting these other fans about Mavel that makes them sound like Nazi loving anti-Semitic, racist, sexist, every other ist imaginable 

 I see what @starri posted which seems to be a artist think which Marvel fixed (fired artist, tried to correct the book) but, this mostly seems to be directed at Captain America books.

Just to clarify, i know about Captain being a Hydra agent and villain now. I guess I'm just wondering if Marvel has actually done something horrible or is this just an fan angry over a storyline they don't like.

Hope that makes sense.

Edited April 22, 2017 by Morrigan2575

[scriggle]

They turned Captain America into a Hydra sleeper agent, Magneto will apparently be a Hydra villain in the upcoming Secret Empire event.

This article, Secret Empire #0 Review, sums it up pretty well. Spoilers in the article. 

A couple more articles here and here.

Edited April 22, 2017 by scriggle
additional links

[Lantern7]

I like the idea, but isn't the whole thing centered on a sentient Cosmic Cube screwing things up royally? I think the idea of Cap-as-main-villain works because nobody there would see it coming.

ETA: Inhumans miniseries to come with two-page Lockjaw stories. Well, he is the cuddliest Inhuman . . . at least before Ms. Marvel and Moon Girl.

[scriggle]

For anyone who's interested, here are some good articles about Secret Empire and why many are disgusted/offended by it:

No Fascist Cap: Why I Won’t Review Secret Empire

Secret Empire, explained The history of Marvel’s most controversial and unintentionally topical plotline in years

Marvel's Secret Empire kicks off by doubling down on Captain America’s Nazi past 42 comments A fundamental change to the history of World War II in Marvel Comics

[starri]

I can't really find myself as part of the outrage machine on this one.  I completely understand why people are unhappy, and I'm certainly sympathetic to the LCS employees who balked at decking themselves out in Hydra apparel.

But no, I'm not reading this one.  In parts, it's event fatigue.  In a bigger part, I just can't find any entertainment value in something that's uncomfortably close to actual reality.

Maybe if this ends with Wanda saying "No more Events."

[Morrigan2575]

@scriggle thanks for the links, I'll take a look

[Dandesun]

There's just so much wrong with the whole thing. I did read the first issue of Cap: Steve Rogers where the initial bombshell was dropped and all of the stuff where the Red Skull was recruiting for Hydra was extremely uncomfortable because it read exactly like a Trump rally. Then Cap saying 'Hail Hydra' at the end was... unsettling. And I suppose that's what you want for a story sometimes but it was so unsettling that I didn't want to go any further. I didn't want to read anymore Red Skull speeches that sounded like what was happening in real life at the time (and still are) because I didn't want any more of that shit than I was already getting on a daily basis.

That was when I needed Cap to be the paragon of freedom and opportunity... not a fucking sleeper agent with Red Skull influencing a toddler Cosmic Cube to rewrite Steve's entire history to make him Hydra from when he was four years old.

And the excuses at this point are fucking ridiculous. "He's not a Nazi! Hydra isn't Nazis! See? Elise (or whatever the fuck her name is) was totally against Hitler and Red Skull! Hydra is more just general fascism not Nazism... come on! To prove it, we'll have Cap actively work with Nazis during World War 2 and also have Magneto -- HOLOCAUST SURVIVOR -- be a Hydra agent too! See? NOT NAZIS!"

There was a germ of interest early on when I was thinking that the influence of the Cosmic Cube didn't actually change Steve Rogers at all... it just changed his history and that he was actively working to shift Hydra into the exact opposite of what the Red Skull wanted. That it was still Good Steve Rogers but... no...

He's got a giant octopus tattooed on his chest. He may be actively working against Red Skull but that doesn't mean he's a good guy when his visions of the future, the vision he wants for the world, involves white kids wearing Hydra shirts chasing and throwing rocks at a black kid. This is Steve Rogers is Evil. Period. It doesn't matter what name they call it anymore. Whinging about how he's not REALLY a Nazi is a mealy-mouthed response to the backlash of shitting on everything Steve Rogers stands for.

I don't know how they bring Steve back from this because this is them changing everything that ever was about him.

Although if Wanda does say 'no more events' ... well, I wouldn't hate THAT part.

[scriggle]

@Dandesun, I wish I could give your post a million likes.

[Lantern7]

Given that nobody really went berserk at a grief-stricken (concentration camp survivor) Magneto giving himself to Apocalypse (a Pharaoh) in last year's movie, maybe Marvel figured that shaking reality into making him a Hydra agent wouldn't piss most readers off. I'll get the FCBD book and maybe the first issue with a blank cover, but I'm thinking that Agents Of SHIELD is doing a similar concept better.

[starri]

You know, I have no interest in the Secret Empire story.  I understand why people are upset by it.  But some (not all) of the handwringing over it is really starting to annoy me.

[scriggle]

Either Disney's worried the comics are beginning to hurt the MCU brand or pre-orders of Secret Empire really really suck. Or both.

Marvel asks readers to be patient with Hydra-Captain America in official statement (And gives away the ending of Secret Empire?)

[Joe]

1 hour ago, scriggle said:

Either Disney's worried the comics are beginning to hurt the MCU brand or pre-orders of Secret Empire really really suck. Or both.

Marvel asks readers to be patient with Hydra-Captain America in official statement (And gives away the ending of Secret Empire?)

I don't know how far in advance comics are scheduled or written, but people have been loudly worried about this from the moment it publically kicked off. And it's only gotten louder as time has gone on. Some people have sworn off Marvel comics entirely. Don't take my words as hard data, though. It's just what I've seen on IO9.

[Morrigan2575]

Looking at Comic Sales, Secret Empire #0 was the Number 1 seller for April but it didn't reach the heights of Black Panther

http://www.comichron.com

However, Marvel is still leading the pack as far as monthly sales goes.

Looking at Steve Rogers #1 it started at 99k in May 2016. It dropped to 31.5k by March 2017, around a 68% drop in almost a 10 months (13 issues).

By comparison, Punisher #1 started in May 2016 at 110k and dropped to 28.4K by March 2017 (10 issues), roughly at 74% drop.

Black Panther #1 started at 286.7k in April 2016 and dropped to 35.4k in February 2016. Roughly an 87% drop in 10 months (11 issues).

I'm not really sure exactly what that means, is this comic as wildly hated as people on the Internet claim? Is it suffering normal drops? Will Secret Empire crash and burn?

Guess we'll have to keep an eye on monthly sales to see how Secret Empire is received by the paying public Vs Social Media.

Edited May 5, 2017 by Morrigan2575

[starri]

9 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I'm not really sure exactly what that means, is this comic as wildly hated as people on the Internet claim?

Because people love to complain, and then buy the damned thing anyway.  If you really hate it that much, don't buy it.

[starri]

I'm sure this will make people apologize for threatening Nick Spencer.  No, who am I kidding?

[Morrigan2575]

Just look at the comments ?

[starri]

50 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Just look at the comments ?

It's funny.  "He's the Chuck Austen of the '10s!"

People loved Chuck Austen at first.  You might almost call their opinions...a retcon.

[Twilight Man]

So........... Two Steve Rogers???

This reminds me of when Marvel made Tony Stark evil, then they brought in teenage Tony Stark, and when all was said and done, Marvel had to reboot their entire universe (OK, so maybe there was "other" circumstances that caused that, but still, there was no way that they could write their way out of that, so they didn't bother).

[Morrigan2575]

I remember that.  I was only reading the X Titles at the time, the Heroes disappeared and came back without me really noticing/caring.

[starri]

I wish the interior art on Generation X was as good as Terry Dodson's cover. Some of it's okay, but I hate the way Amilcar Pinna draws Jubilee.  Actually, a lot of the female characters don't look quite as good as the male ones.  

They've kept Jubilee as a vampire, which kind of surprised me.

[Morrigan2575]

On 5/23/2017 at 2:35 PM, starri said:

I wish the interior art on Generation X was as good as Terry Dodson's cover. Some of it's okay, but I hate the way Amilcar Pinna draws Jubilee.  Actually, a lot of the female characters don't look quite as good as the male ones.  

They've kept Jubilee as a vampire, which kind of surprised me.

I want her to go back to the Firecracker I loved but, they never seemed go take her powers seriously (ranging from sparkles to blowing up buildings).

As a Vampire she has Some pretty cool powers, pity Wood never saw a reason to use them on the all female X-Men title. Guggenheim had her voice but once again brought others like M into the book and didn't seem to do much with Jubilee. Granted I only read his first arc on the book (when they were on the space station)

[Morrigan2575]

https://www.bleedingcool.com/2017/05/26/x-men-editor-daniel-ketchum-let-go-marvel-comics/

[starri]

They seem to have brought back Sally Floyd for Secret Empire, a move that I'm assuming about zero people were clamoring for. 

[Lantern7]

"How dedicated to the Hydra dream are you really, Captain?" To brighten the mood, here's a "remix" of Cap's monologue from the days of Civil War.

[Captain Carrot]

Has anyone checked out the new Nick Fury book by Robinson and Aco? So far it's a fun throwback with Steranko-ish art and single issue stories.

 

[starri]

I'm not sure where else this might belong, so Joan Lee, Stan's wife of 69 years, as well as the inspiration for Gwen Stacy, passed away at 93.

Quote

"I took one look at her – and she was the girl I had been drawing all my life," Stan recalled to The Hollywood Reporter. 

[Morrigan2575]

Yeah, i saw that on Twitter earlier today. So sad and, given their long life together I imagine Stan will not be far behind. ?

[starri]

Joe Quesada's official statement on behalf of Marvel was really beautiful.

Quote

While most of the world may simply remember Joan as Stan’s beloved wife, for all of us here at Marvel, for every kid who has opened one of our comics, watched our cartoons, TV shows and movies, for those who have fantasized about swinging on a web between the skyscrapers of New York City, or has had their imagination sparked and dreamt of one day writing and drawing stories about the greatest heroes ever created—the truth is that there would be no Marvel Universe without Joan Lee. She was its big bang.

[Danny Franks]

Quote

She was its big bang.

She really was, because the story I've heard is that he was about ready to quit the comic book business, sick of writing formulaic monster books. After someone at DC told him of the success they were having with the Justice League book, it was Stan's wife who told him to just 'write it the way you want to, it doesn't matter if they reject it, you're leaving the business anyway', when he was considering a superhero team book of his own. And obviously, that book became Fantastic Four #1, and the birth of the Silver Age of comic books.

[Morrigan2575]

Damn, that is a beautiful statement.

[starri]

So, after five years and a smooshed-together universe, Spider-Men II finally introduces us to Miles-616.  Who appears to have some history with Taskmaster, to the point that I'm wondering if maybe he was a SHEILD agent.  There's probably no way he's making it out of this alive, since I doubt they'd have two separate characters with the same name running around.

[starri]

So, in this whole Legacy event (or not event, I can't quite tell), they're doing a story about the Avengers of 1,000,000 BC, with prehistoric versions of Iron Fist, Phoenix, and Black Panther, plus Agamatto subbing for Dr. Strange, Odin subbing for Thor, and the first Starbrand subbing for Hulk.  But this is the best one.

[Lantern7]

I know, right?!? We're had Ghost Riders on horse, cycle and car . . . but wooly mammoth?!? Holy shit! And is the mammoth undead? So many questions!!! Come on, I want an event where Ghost Rider 1MBC terrorizes shit, and that the mammoth barfs up Johnny, Danny, Robbie and Zero, as well as their respective vehicles.

ETA: And Alejandra. Shouldn't forget her.

[Dandesun]

Ghost Rider on a flaming woolly mammoth?

I mean... fuck! I'm not made of stone, people!!

Also, prehistoric Phoenix? Yes please!!!

[Twilight Man]

and now........  Future Ghost Rider, who, of course, is ...........  Frank Castle!!!!

So, Marvel has gone "Bat-Crazy" now that "The Punisher" is a successful show on Netflix.

and has become even more invested in Castle than they were back in the 90's.

First, Present Day Castle is taking over the War Machine armor.

And now this.........

In the future, Castle makes a deal with Mephisto and becomes the "new" Ghost Rider,

and eventually gets cosmic powers from Galactus as well.

Why don't they just bring back Venom Castle as well???

(OK, that was technically a What If story, but still....)

[Lantern7]

Ever read Space Punisher? It's actually pretty good, with a lot of Marvel mainstays getting sci-fi makeovers.

[starri]

FrankenCastle, anyone?

I wish I was less meh on the whole "Fresh Start" thing.  They just need to stick with something for more than six months.

[Joe]

17 minutes ago, starri said:

I wish I was less meh on the whole "Fresh Start" thing.  They just need to stick with something for more than six months.

I remember jumping into X-Men with 287 or something. Maybe I didn't fully understand it. But I bought it, and kept buying it. It must have done something right. These days they keep relaunching books but I have very little interest in reading them. The complete opposite.

[starri]

I also don't know what I think about some of the creative teams.  Ta-nehisi Coates on Captain America is intriguing, but I don't know how Mark Waid, who I really like, will do with Antman.  Nick Spencer on Spider-Man at least sounds good on paper, but Dan Slott on Defenders?

[Captain Carrot]

What's wrong with people?!

 

https://news.avclub.com/stan-lees-life-has-gotten-really-dark-ever-since-his-wi-1825160142

[rainbowmonkey]

Which comic book will you suggest to a person who hasn't read any comics beforehand?

[Joe]

14 minutes ago, rainbowmonkey said:

Which comic book will you suggest to a person who hasn't read any comics beforehand?

What sort of fiction does this person like? There's comics on all sorts of topics and themes.

[rainbowmonkey]

On 4/17/2018 at 11:46 AM, Joe said:

What sort of fiction does this person like? There's comics on all sorts of topics and themes.

Action, crime or romance. Both 3 will work.

[Captain Carrot]

Maybe Ed Brubaker's Velvet. (He's the writer of the Captain America run that gave us The Winter Soldier). It's a spy thriller set in the 70's with a woman in the Bond role. I think the first series ran for 15 issues, and Brubaker has tentative plans to return to the character.

[starri]

I wish Marvel had had the balls to allow Jane Foster to remain as Thor forever.  I do give them a lot of credit for letting it continue for almost four years, but the return to status quo just seems...lesser, somehow.  I know this story always had an expiration date, and I know that at the conclusion of the third act of Aaron's Thor epic (this was Act 2), she'll probably get a hammer of her own, but they took something the could have been gimmicky and cheap and made it amazing.