Shame-Free Zone

[MaryHedwig]

Hello.  I am binge-watching (no pun) My 600-pound life for the first time. I would like to start a shame-free thread where we can discuss with others the challenges that these individuals are facing.

 

I know what it is to be stuck in life.  I am so happy that this doctor is willing to treat these people that the world has mostly given up on.  I loved the passion in Dr. Now's voice when he expressed concern for Marla. 

 

I think I will stop here to see if there is anyone out there willing to dialogue with me.  I really think there is a lot to discuss here that will teach us a lot of ourselves and the times we live in.

[notyrmomma]

My theory has always been that these people don't want to be 600+ pounds, their is something off in their mind that prevents them from stopping eating.  For some the feeling of just being hungry is extremely painful. 

 

The puzzle that I want to solve, and the real reason I watch these shows (sometimes over and over again), is why or how they keep eating, even after the surgery.  I have had the surgery and I am on various chat boards with others who have had the surgery, and there's  a consensus that for at least until the first six months to a year, weight loss is a kind of a sure thing.  So it baffles me that some  on this show go to their first few post-op weigh ins and either have lost nothing or like two pounds.  Their will to eat should be the subject to scientific studies!

 

I believe Dr. Now is genuinely a good person (not just the face he shows on TV).  At the end of the day, he basically risks his medical license to operate on these people who no one else will touch because this surgery is their only hope.  In this respect, this show reminds me of those Hoarder shows, yes, it's better and healthier to coax the people into losing weight on their own or clearing out their hoard on their own, but time's up! The city's coming in to condemn your house or you're going to be dead in six months if this weight isn't gone.   People like Marla, Pauline, and Penny really need to pull their head out of their butt and realize the incredible gift of a second chance in life that they were given by this show and Dr. Now.

[HalcyonDays]

This thread is a great idea, MaryHedwig. Thanks for creating it. I would like to see some good intelligent and - as you said - shame free discussion on the various individuals profiled on the show. Remember the old adage - to truly understand a situation, walk a mile in their shoes.

[QueBueno]

My thoughts... These people are addicts. If you watch Intervention, those folks aren't always successful with their first, second, third rehabs. It's a tough thing to treat. I'm not sure how much therapy the patients on M600PL get, but for sure they need counseling, and significant training on nutrition and portion size. How many times have we seen them say "I thought eating (some really unhealthy food) was okay!" or "I was only eating two tacos instead of six!". They don't seem to get it for a while. I can tell that I have at least some food addiction. I've "been good" at a restaurant and not ordered dessert, and the entire next day I just can't stop thinking about that dessert. Actually feeling sad that I passed up dessert and thinking how good it would have tasted. I've eaten an entire dozen donuts, I've eaten a whole pizza. Those kinds of urges are tough to ignore.

[HalcyonDays]

My thoughts... These people are addicts.

 

I think this is exactly what it is, tbh. Eating food (especially crap food) tends to release endorphines that make one feel better. This people are most likely addicted to food because it makes them feel better. It's comforting. No different than an alcoholic or someone into hard drugs. Food is the vice that these guys use to deal with their problems or depression or personal demons. Some down a mickey of vodka to dull the pain, some eat too much. It's sad but human reality. Humans easily fall into addiction. I've done my fair share of downing some booze to deal with my anxieties and depression and stress in life. And before I start work today, I'm going to be puffing on a smoke to mellow my nerves. I KNOW it's bad for me, I KNOW it makes me feel like shit, but then that one part of your brain takes over and you succumb to your vice.

[scowl]

I think that food is the only thing in their daily lives that makes them feel good.

[ethalfrida]

There is a new one called Living With The Enemy on Lifetime. Only 1 episode has aired so I am putting in the request to add it to the forum. You can catch a rerun on OnDemand.

[MaryHedwig]

I just watched the Chay episode.  I was sadden that he really didn't have a sense of what he was supposed to eat.  I think all of them need to have a nutritionist clear out and stock their kitchen and go shopping with them.  All of them need that nutritionist to help them create a notebook of healthy recipes that they like best.

 

If any of you feature on the show are reading this, I think you all need to eat some lean protein, some raw and cooked vegetables, and a measured portion of oil (or olives or avocado) at every meal.  Have a small bowl of fresh fruit everyday.  Against Dr. Now's advice, I think some of you might do better having three meals and two snacks, all five with a measured combination of protein, vegetable, fat.  Try to buy as much organic as possible and drink lots of water.  Try to give up almost all processed foods.

Edited July 12, 2015 by MaryHedwig

[ethalfrida]

I think a good start for them would be to simply change what they ate then work in portion control slowly. It is overwhelming to have to change everything at once. When they start to realize that eating better foods doesn't mean starving it may put them on a more comfortable plan.

[MaryHedwig]

I am wondering why bypass surgery is always the solution.  Perhaps if some of these people cut out carbs and sugar for a while, their cravings to overeat would cease.  I not sure if all of them are eating to fill up the "watermelon" that is now their stomach,  could some of them just be eating because of the chemical endorphin rush?  I sure know a lot of people who have had grave complications from weight-loss surgery and wish they had tried a healthy eating plan instead.

[notyrmomma]

Some of you just don't get it.  Do you really think they have never tried "healthy eating?" (OK, the fact that Chay didn't know wheat bread is still bad for you and Angel's husband didn't know OJ is loaded with sugar would make a person assume they never dieted a day in their life, but I doubt that is true).  Nothing would annoy me more as a fat person as someone telling me to just eat less and move more.  Oh how I wish it was that easy!

Edited July 12, 2015 by notyrmomma

[MaryHedwig]

Some of you just don't get it.  Do you really think they have never tried "healthy eating?"

I really do think that some of them had never tried healthy eating.  Am I wrong here?

[ethalfrida]

I really do think that some of them had never tried healthy eating.  Am I wrong here?

I think you are right and it is a reasonable conclusion. If the effort to get them to eat better isn't made then just leave them as is. What's the point in having them in a program if you just keep handing them the food that got them fat and unhealthy? Eaing better, more movement, less enabling and more responsibility are key components to healthier living along with nutrition education. Some of these people were the three year olds you saw with the 32 oz cokes at McD's. Yes, they need to be re-educated...

[HalcyonDays]

Well, it's nice to say "hey, just start eating better" or "stop smoking that cig" or "yeah, you know what, heroin is a bitch, you can just stop shooting up without any repercussions" or tell the alcoholic to just stop at one drink. Yeah....no. That's not going to happen. Doesn't work that way.

 

Food is their addiction and it makes them feel better. It's not about nutrition at all, it's about feeding (sorry) their addictions and a way for them to cope with whatever personal, emotional and mental issues they have.

 

I would say that in some cases, some of them don't know about healthy eating. I mean, commercials and media brain wash us to think one way. So that yeah, whole wheat is supposed to be better for you. Organics are better for you (it's a marketing term, and meaningless), don't eat so much fat (but you need some fat to be healthy), processed foods are bad (yes, but who can afford the fresh produce at Whole Foods), etc etc.

 

Also, when was the last time you guys went out to dinner somewhere? I'm not talking about fast food. Like, at a nice sit down restaurant and ordered maybe an appetizer, entree and maybe even dessert? Every wonder about how much calories are in there. There is a reason restaurant food tastes fabulous. Fat, fat and more fat. You may think that the steak and salad you ordered was low calorie, but I guarentee it was more calories and fat than a McDonalds Big Mac.

 

Also, there is the issue with cost of food. Meat today is incredibly expensive. If one is low income (these guys are) they are not going to be able to afford that healthy fresh food because it's way too costly. Ramen noodles, Kraft Dinner and canned veggies at just around a dollar a package is what they can do, not $4.00 a bunch of veggies and $10 for a pack of two chicken breasts. Fast food is cheaper in many cases and how they can stretch the dollar.

[notyrmomma]

I really do think that some of them had never tried healthy eating.  Am I wrong here?

Maybe they didn't know they were fat either.  Maybe more people should remind them.  That worked for me.  /sarcasm

[ethalfrida]

Maybe they didn't know they were fat either.  Maybe more people should remind them.  That worked for me.  /sarcasm

So, what did work for you? /not sarcasm... I am really interested in diet and maintenance styles. Nothing like a broader mind to help one along one's own path which is what helped me.

[notyrmomma]

So, what did work for you? /not sarcasm... I am really interested in diet and maintenance styles. Nothing like a broader mind to help one along one's own path which is what helped me.

Surgery.

 

I grew up a fat kid and was teased mercilessly.  I went on my first official diet when I was 8 years old, it was in a group type setting with other "fat kids."  It didn't work.  The summer before my freshman year of high school I was put into a treatment facility for eating disorders for 6 weeks.  I really didn't have an eating disorder, I was just fat, but it was easy to assume I did because I was so big.  That actually helped me a lot and I was able to get through high school being a "pleasantly plump" girl at about 150 pounds.  150 wasn't skinny by far, but it was small enough not to be a total outcast in high school (funny, that's my goal weight now).

 

Fast forward through college and my 20's, I probably yo-yo'ed between 220 to 280 all while making several attempts at Weight Watchers, low fat, and the Atkins diets.  When I started having kids (in my late 20's), my weight ballooned up to the low 300's, then since I had more money, I was able to dump more money into diets.  I paid $4k for "Doctor's Quick Weight Loss" and got myself down to 250.  I also did Medifast to the tune of $300 a month and was able to briefly get down to 200.  I could write book on nutrition.  In 2012 I started to show signs of Multiple Sclerosis.  I was probably about 250ish when the symptoms first started, so I read a lot of books that said a lot of neurological symptoms are caused by eating junk, so for one year I ate mainly organics, no red meat/dairy/artificial sweeteners/low fat/low carb and I still gained weight and my health deteriorated further.  I will never forget, it was May 2014 and my neurologist strongly suggested that I look into having the surgery done and Sept 2014, I had the gastric sleeve. 

 

I'm only 10 months out, so who knows what could happen in 10 years, but what the surgery has done for me, which no other diet was able to, do was make me "cheat proof."  If I try to eat more than I should or something too greasy, or sometimes for no reason at all, I will puke....and it's painful. You can't just say, oh, It's my birthday, I'm going to eat whatever I want!  Nope!  (*vomits in fancy restaurant bathroom*)

 

I nearly went back and deleted that comment because it was really nasty and argumentative, and I'm really  not that kind of person.  I guess I have a whole lifetime of resentment of trying to over come being a fat person and I am just so tired of people who have never been obese in their life (or only for 9 months when pregnant) not understanding why we can't just do this on our own.  It's a very hard and very public struggle, everyone seems to know the answers but you.

[DangerousMinds]

No offense meant, but I am amused by some here thinking that their suggestions for Dr. Now's patients would be preferable to his own. I am confident that he knows exactly what he is doing, and the patients do have more access to nutritionists, therapists, and physical therapy than we have seen on the show.

Edited July 13, 2015 by DangerousMinds

[MaryHedwig]

 

No offense meant, but I am amused by some here thinking that their suggestions for Dr. Now's patients would be preferable to his own.

No offense taken, but Dr. Now is not showing us the other tools he is using with his patients.  I don't think that it would offend him if we tried to figure out what those tools might be.

Edited July 13, 2015 by MaryHedwig

[DangerousMinds]

Fair enough.

[MaryHedwig]

It's a very hard and very public struggle, everyone seems to know the answers but you.

What, if any, help would you have liked from the public?

Edited July 13, 2015 by MaryHedwig

[notyrmomma]

What, if any, help would you have liked from the public?

None.  I meant when you are overweight, people can see that about you immediately, whereas if you were an alcoholic, smoker, drug addict, sex addict, one would have to know you to know that.

[MaryHedwig]

What, if any, help would you have liked from the public?

I have struggled with my weight all my life, weighing so much at times that my struggles were obvious to the public.  I can imagine how much I would have been helped from a compassionate person coming up to me and saying, "is there anything I can do for you, would you like to talk, can I invite you over to my house and cook for you?"

 

That never happened so maybe I would also have been offended by that as I was the insensitive drive-by comments.

Edited July 13, 2015 by MaryHedwig

[HalcyonDays]

Alright guys. Let's try not to get snippy with each other.

 

The intent of the shame-free thread - I thought - was a place that people could discuss the issues those portrayed on the show deal with, without the typical blanket statements of "omg, why don't they go on a diet and exercise more" and accusing them of making their own problems. Yeah, because if diets actually always worked for everyone, then everyone would be thin in the world.

 

We all have our issues that we are dealing with but one person's method won't work for everyone. It also looks like many posters here are struggling with weight (or other problems) so here, let's share our stories and personal experiences and maybe we can learn from each other.

 

Thanks.

[notyrmomma]

One more point from me, I promise!  Just because you are skinny doesn't mean that you are a nutritional genius either.  I will never forget, my husband's grandmother back in 2002 when my first child was a toddler.  She did not understand why I didn't want to give him pure apple juice (I would water it down 1/3 juice 2/3 water) to drink.  I told her it was because it was loaded with sugar and she was like, "What do you mean?  The bottle says 100% juice" LOL ;)  Despite this, she never had a weight problem in her life.

[HalcyonDays]

One more point from me, I promise!

 

Why one more! Share share share!! Always share *grin*

 

Some people just have that high metabolism (naturally or those that have hyperthyroid, for example). Also, it all depends. My mother (originally from Eastern Europe) cooks everything with lard. Like, orginally because of WWII, she was used to cooking meat and save the rendered fat to be reused. She would sometimes simply spread the spreadable but somewhat solid drippings onto plain bread and eat that on its own. She also said that growing up, they only are meat once or twice a week, and mostly ate fruit and veg. They also did lots of manual works. She taller and thinner than I am now, and my reasons are purely diet, alcohol and laziness. However, she eats very little in terms of portion size, but lots of fatty dairy or fruits. So here is an example of someone eating what we may consider bad (lard, high fat cheeses, homogenized milk) yet I guarentee you, she's healthier than me.

 

So basically one person's "bad eating" maybe isn't so bad after all, and that "healthy" 100% juice isn't a good choice either.

 

That's why this thread will be awesome for sharing!!

[MaryHedwig]

I just watched Joe's story.  To my recollection, he was the first participant who lived alone.  He still had a sister and a mother who loved him and were trying to care for him as best as they knew how.  His mother ends up accompanying him to Houston.

 

I loved how that a dietician came to his home and actually looked in his refrigerator.  I wish there was a third alternative to home or hospitalization.  I can imagine a beautiful setting in the country where Joe and his cohorts are pampered, affirmed, and are fed delectable fruits and vegetables. 

 

I think a lot of these people need someone to tell them that they are brave and wonderful.

 

Of course, we could all use a little of that...

[scowl]

One more point from me, I promise!  Just because you are skinny doesn't mean that you are a nutritional genius either.

 

You don't need to be a nutritional genius to understand what a calorie is. I'm not "skinny" but I've been managing my weight by eating less, exercising and monitoring my weight. If I ate whatever I wanted I would be certainly be 30-40 pounds overweight. 

[MaryHedwig]

I'm not "skinny" but I've been managing my weight by eating less, exercising and monitoring my weight.

In order for me to lose weight, I have to eat less and entirely cut off anything triggers cravings, especially anything that combines white flour, sugar, and fat.

[scowl]

I avoid cravings by just keeping busy. I've found that If I'm working on something important and it takes all my concentration, I stop thinking about food.

[ethalfrida]

A few thoughts...

 

The 600 pound, extremely obese phenomena is a recent epidemic in various cultures. Cravings probably are not. So, what is different? There has to be something in these societies that is supporting this epidemic. One of the things is people moved more in the not too distant past. Another is food did not contain tons of chemicals, sugars, salts and unhealthy processed fats.

 

Having sympathy for someone's struggle is noble and I completely disagree with fat shaming. However, I do agree with the equation that healthier food and more movement is the bottom line. Even with the operation it still boils down to healthier foods because as posted earlier eating poorly makes the person who had the operation sick. 

 

It is a struggle to adopt a new attitude even when dealing with other things besides food. Sometimes we do not know what is needed. For example, there used to be 8 or more people living in my house at one time. Shopping for groceries always meant large quantities of things. After the kids grew up and my parent passed away it took me years to notice how I constantly had to toss fresh foods because they spoiled before I could eat them. Or how I really did not need a whole three layer cake to myself. I love cake more than any dessert. After losing my 30 pounds, researching healthier options and how to cook for one the next best decision was a Foodsaver so I could freeze foods that I overstocked. As for the cakes, I bake, I enjoy a couple of slices and then give it away without regret. I am absolutely satisfied and happy to share.

 

Or like smoking. OMG, I'd smoked since 1964. In 2011, I decided I didn't want to anymore so I joined an esig forum, researched all the info I needed, got recommendations as to the model to start with and then ordered. From the first day of its arrival I have never smoked another real cigarette. Anyone can smoke around me, people can smoke in my house, etc., and it doesn't bother me in the least. I hardly ever think about smoking and forget most times that I did. Funny thing, though, after one month of using the ecig I forgot I had it and although they are still around and I have loads of ecig juice I don't even think about using them.

 

And like Scowl, activity makes all the difference. I lift weights and do other workouts. Knowing that I need at least a two hour difference between meals and workout activity, there is a timing thing that has to be done. 

[notyrmomma]

So I saw an article today that reminded me of this discussion.

http://bredred.com/study-probability-of-obese-people-reaching-normal-weight-less-than-1/

There was a study done in the UK that watched obese men and woman and found that they had a less than 1% chance of every getting to a normal weight. And these were just the regular obese, the morbidly obese had even a smaller chance! The study showed that many of them were able to lose 5% of their excess weight, but half gained that back in five years. This study omitted anyone who had bariatric surgery..... to me this is more evidence that surgery is the only way to help these people.

[HalcyonDays]

And like Scowl, activity makes all the difference. I lift weights and do other workouts. Knowing that I need at least a two hour difference between meals and workout activity, there is a timing thing that has to be done.

 

It's a simple formula if most other things are normal. Burn more calories than you consume (until you want to maintain weight). I think the problem with these people is that some of them are at a point that their bodies don't respond to that formula. I remember reading that for serious obese like this, their body metabolism changes so that even if they were to consume only say 500 calories in a day, most of that gets converted into the white fat (not brown fat, that is good for the body) and the body doesn't utilize those energy stores properly, so the regular rules don't apply.  Their metabolism is completely shot. They have to somehow lose enough weight and kickstart the metabolism to burn the right fat, but at that weight, it takes a long time to kick that system into motion. That's why it's so hard for them.

 

Not everyone, just some. For others, doing the bypass means they essentially go on a starvation diet, and eventually their body responds. However, I wonder if like anorexics, it means their body thinks it has to save every calorie (because it thinks it's starving), and therefore anything eaten gets converted to fat (energy). The experts here can correct me, by all means!

 

Otherwise, if one's body is working normally, then yes, diet and exercise will work. But for diet, eliminating fat completely is wrong. Eating bacon is fine, it's just in moderation. Same with eggs or steak. The body needs a little bit of fat to be healthy, but portion size and like I said, burn more calories than consuming is the way to go. Lke I said, that's just how I understand it.

[scowl]

We older people know how metabolism can turn against you. Ten years ago I could eat 4,000 calories a day and not gain a pound. I guess my older body now thinks I can't hunt and gather like I used to, so it's kindly storing those extra calories that it used to throw away. Maybe these people's bodies are using a similar strategy.

[ethalfrida]

I am watching Fed Up. I thought I'd seen it but hadn't. It is a really super informative and supportive documentary on childhood obesity and obesity in general. It puts things in perspective and defies unreasonable assumptions as to why this is a new epidemic. It is worth watching to clear up any misconceived theories on why we are now suffering from this phenomena, especially in children.

[algebra]

Maybe they didn't know they were fat either. Maybe more people should remind them. That worked for me. /sarcasm

 

Occasionally I encounter people who don't seem to realize it. They don't look in the mirror, don't weigh themselves, they are in denial.

I do alterations. Had a girl tell me she wanted me to fix the way a dress was protruding in places. It wasn't the dress. Near as I can figure, until she walked into the store and tried on a dress, she hadn't been in front of a mirror for a very long time. So when she saw a lot of lumpy protrusions in the dress, she thought it was the dress.

[algebra]

We older people know how metabolism can turn against you. Ten years ago I could eat 4,000 calories a day and not gain a pound. I guess my older body now thinks I can't hunt and gather like I used to, so it's kindly storing those extra calories that it used to throw away. Maybe these people's bodies are using a similar strategy.

Before I retired I could burn off 3000-4000 calories a day. Now I'm retired and according to an online calculator, I need only 1143 calories a day. I managed to gain about 15 pounds over the last year and am now on a 1000 calorie/day diet. After 4 weeks the scale says I've lost 4#

That's it. At 1000 calories a day, I can lose 1#/week. Increasing activity is difficult as I retired because my knees are shot.(and my shoulders) And according to the treadmill, I burn only 100 calories per mile. So I would have to walk 30 miles just to burn off one pound of fat.

Adding to my frustration, the scale at my doctors office always adds 5-10 pounds. Last time I made a point of weighing myself as soon as I got home, in the same clothes, and it was a 7# difference.

They like to tell you your blood pressure is higher in the doctors office because you're nervous. Why do I weigh more? LOL?

[AnJen]

^ It's normal for weight to fluctuate. I can go up or down about 5lbs on the same scale at my house within a 24-hour period.

 

And 1lb/week is actually a really healthy rate of weightloss! Everything I've read recommends losing between .5lbs and 2lbs per week, so you're right in the middle of that.

 

I think something people forget is that weight loss really is simple. Not easy, by any means, but simple. It's calories in and calories out, basic thermodynamics. And the food/diet industry has a lot of lies floating around about what it takes to lose weight, and there's so much misinformation and a genuine lack of understanding, but that's what it comes down to is the energy balance.

 

I would agree that a lot of overweight and obese people have no clue of their true size. Personal story time: My heaviest weight was 310lbs, and even though I weighed myself regularly and knew what size of clothing I wore and knew that I was obese, it was like it never clicked in my head...I knew I was bigger than everyone around me, but I didn't feel 310lbs. I only ever noticed how very large I had gotten when I saw photographs of myself, which was rare because I was self-conscious and avoided photographs! 

 

I also deluded myself, hugely, into thinking that I was healthy. As I'm sure a lot of members of this forum know (since it was briefly discussed on Zsalynn's episode) there's a Fat Acceptance movement; and some of the things they parrot are things that I completely bought into: that I had no control over my weight, that weight was largely genetics, that BMI isn't an accurate measurement and has no bearing on health, that metabolic conditions made it too difficult for me to lose weight, that I could be healthy at any size, etc.

 

I ignored a huge amount of health problems when I was 310lbs because of things like the Fat Acceptance movement. I'd see my pre-diabetes and attribute it to a family history of diabetes. I'd see my weight and attribute it to having fat genes. My bad knees were blamed on an old injury, not the weight pressing on my joints. My BMI being in the 40s didn't matter because it didn't take muscle mass into account! I blamed my constant tiredness and soreness on poor posture. 

 

I don't know what the catalyst for me was, but about a year and a half ago, I decided to lose weight. I've lost 70lbs so far, and have 107 more to lose before I'm at my healthy BMI weight. 

 

I will be honest: the biggest hurdle in losing weight is recognizing all the lies and excuses we tell ourselves. And it's a process. I still find myself falling back into old ways of thinking. But I had to look at myself and accept that the reason I was obese was not because of PCOS or because of genetics or anything other than the fact that I was consuming way more calories than I was burning. 

 

It's been a process, and a learning curve, but I've finally figured out for myself, that if I want to lose weight I have to let go of those lies and accept the truth: I need much fewer calories than what my brain *wants* to eat. I do have an addition to food, and I had to stop excusing that.

 

So here's what I do: I calculated my TDEE (total daily energy expenditure...aka the amount of calories my body burns in a day), and I eat 1,000 calories less than that each day. My TDEE is 2500 calories, so I stick to a 1,500 calorie/day diet. When obese people (including my past self) hear 1,500 calories/day, our initial reaction is to balk at how small that is...and if you eat the way I used to eat, it's easy to understand why. I had to change not only the amount of calories I ate, but the foods I ate. If I eat junk food (and yes, even homemade dishes full of organic produce can be junk food!) it's easy to end up at 3,000 calories in a day, or more! 

 

So now I eat a ton of fresh produce, whole grains, lean proteins, etc. and I measure and weigh everything that goes into my mouth. 

 

A typical day's meals for me might be: 

- Breakfast: chocolate peanut butter protein shake

- Snack: large navel orange

- Lunch: Tilapia with lemon/dill greek yogurt, broccoli, sweet potato

- Snack: cucumber slices with red wine vinegar and salt

- Dinner: black bean and quinoa veggie burgers (homemade), stewed zucchini, and salad with italian dressing

 

Often, I still have 100-300 calories left over at the end of the day, and I can afford to have a sweet dessert, like a cup of strawberries with a tablespoon or two of nutella, or a small brownie.

 

This is a hugely long post, but I think it's important to recognize that our entire society at large has such a lack of information about dieting and how to lose weight or how to eat right. I really do think this is, in large part, fed by the food and diet industries. As I've lost weight, I've realized how much this lack of information has influenced society. People will ask me how I've lost the weight, and refuse to accept what I've told them. They think it's too easy or too hard or too good to be true, and instead everyone wants a quick fix while they continue to eat whatever they want in whatever amounts they want, because we've become a culture with a lot of food addiction and emotional eating. I've heard so many people insist that they count calories or diet constantly and "just can't lose the weight" and it's hard to hear, because I know that I used to be the exact same way, but it wasn't that my body was just "holding" all this extra weight...it's that I was eating too many calories, even if it was healthy foods. 

 

That's something I wish Dr. Now would be more open and upfront about on the show. It's tiptoed around, because weight is such a sensitive subject for all of us, even the viewers. But I feel that someone being really frank and blunt about this issue would help a lot. I had to be blunt with myself, but it took me 310lbs to get there.

[scowl]

I'm taking a few weeks off from my sit-on-my-ass job. I thought I would gain weight because I'm not as active. Wrong! In two weeks I've lost seven pounds just by moving around the house all day. I guess I'll have to be careful when I go back to work.

[HalcyonDays]

I am watching Fed Up. I thought I'd seen it but hadn't. It is a really super informative and supportive documentary on childhood obesity and obesity in general. It puts things in perspective and defies unreasonable assumptions as to why this is a new epidemic. It is worth watching to clear up any misconceived theories on why we are now suffering from this phenomena, especially in children.

 

That would be a fascinating documentary. And I can somewhat guess the conclusions. A) All of the processed foods we have today, especially the fake sugar that makes our bodies not process sweets properly. The cheaper crappier food out there is being consumed too much by the kids, B) Because of this stupid bubble-wrap generation of parents who won't let their kids move an inch for fear of injuring themselves, none of these kids get to go outside and play. They can't ride their bikes for hours at a time (like I did), and they can't rough-house outside but these parents are so paranoid these kids will get hurt. Kids will get bruises and scratches and cuts. Fact of life. C) The availablilty of video games and the internet and kids don't WANT to go outside, therefore they never get any excercise at all.

 

I'm just horrified at the stories of these poor mothers being charged with child abandonment when they kid is alone in a playground. What the hell do you think I did as a kid?? Went to the playground by myself. This generation of parents, I don't know man...

[legaleagle53]

I'm just horrified at the stories of these poor mothers being charged with child abandonment when they kid is alone in a playground. What the hell do you think I did as a kid?? Went to the playground by myself. This generation of parents, I don't know man...

 

Yes, but what were the odds that you'd be kidnapped right out of the playground -- or worse -- compared to what's going on in 2015?  It's sad to say it, but the safer world we grew up in hasn't existed for a long time.

[HalcyonDays]

Yes, but what were the odds that you'd be kidnapped right out of the playground -- or worse -- compared to what's going on in 2015?  It's sad to say it, but the safer world we grew up in hasn't existed for a long time.

 

When I was a kid, everyone warned us about the "white van with the tinted windows" driving around the park. We were also warned not to go into certain areas of the park, which had hidden away places that older kids partied and looked at porn (there were mags and old bottles everywhere). My aunts house was broken into in broad daylight twice. And I grew up in a smaller city without that much crime.

 

The same threats were there long ago - kidnappings happened back then, just as they do now. The difference is we have social media and the internet to make people more paranoid then before and get people into a flurry of fear. I walked to school by myself as a kid (elementary school) for years. I made my own lunches. Today, it would be considered child abandonment. I managed quite fine as did many of my peers. And why was I a latchkey kid? Because my parents had no choice in the matter, just like those parents arrested had no choice.

 

Crime hasn't changed. The paranoia of parents has.

[AnJen]

Yes, but what were the odds that you'd be kidnapped right out of the playground -- or worse -- compared to what's going on in 2015?  It's sad to say it, but the safer world we grew up in hasn't existed for a long time.

 

Hard to believe, but there are actually less kidnappings now than in the past. The problem is that our world is now much more connected than it ever was before. In the 80s a kid could be kidnapped and you might not hear about it, because of the time it would take the story to make it into national news from local news. These days, a kidnapping would be local news within the hour, national news within a day, and within 24 hours people on the other side of the world could have seen that child's face on an Amber Alert or a viral social media campaign to find them.

 

Internet, cell phones, social media, etc. makes us more connected to the world we live in than we ever were in the past, which makes it seem that there are more kidnappings than ever before, but that isn't true. The number of missing children (I believe that number includes kidnapped *and* runaways) is 40% lower now than it was in 1997! That's a massive improvement, and yet we see danger lurking around every corner, not because there's more danger but because we are hyper-aware of the relatively few instances when it does happen.

 

It's similar to the shark attack anecdote from Freakonomics (which is really worth a read, if you're interested!). There were less shark attacks that summer than ever before, but because the few that had happened had been so widely-reported, the beaches saw a massive drop in vacationers and experienced an economic downturn because of it. People were panicked about shark attacks, when in reality the actual numbers of shark attacks were extremely low. 

[notyrmomma]

They also didn't have sexual offenders register when I was a kid, so now you know who the preditors are - which I think also cut down on child molestations. However, if you go to one of those websites that map where the sexual preditors live, I wouldn't blame you if you though that kids left outside by themselves for one second would get nabbed because those people are everywhere! The saddest thing is that for the most part, the worst preditors are actually friends or family.

I try to let my kids play outside as much as I can alone, even when they were younger (they are 10 and 13 now), but it's hard because all of their friends (even neigborhood friends) are online on xbox live! Between that and all the easy prep crap food (chicken nuggets and kraft mac and cheese, i'm talking to you!), that's why our kids are fat. We live such overscheduled lives, who has the time or energy to bake a chicken at 8:30 pm after football practice? If you can get mom or dad back in the kitchen at night and let the kids roam free for a little, the childhood obesity problem would be mostly solved. GOOD LUCK with that!

[Brooklynista]

I couldn't agree more. When was the last time you saw a kid with his arm in a cast because he fell out of a tree? Do kids climb trees anymore? When I was coming up here in NYC we played tag, jumped double Dutch, played handball. We MOVED! We had recess. Does recess still exist??

We might have had a soda, but we spent the better part of the afternoon running it off like maniacs. On the weekends our mothers would put us out of the house so they could clean. We couldn't leave the block, but we were outside where mom could see us. We didn't go in until the street lights came on. Well, we had lunch but still.

I feel so sad for these kids now. They're fat. Young, fat and inactive. You don't have too look further than their fat parents to see the problem. On the way to work on the mornings there is always at least one kid with a soda and some chips for breakfast. They're headed to school where they will sit all day and then home where they will prob in front of the TV for the rest of the night.

They don't stand a chance.

Edited August 5, 2015 by Brooklynista

[scowl]

I couldn't agree more. When was the last time you saw a kid with his arm in a cast because he fell out of a tree?

 

If you want to see kids with injuries, hang out with skateboarders. Kids are regularly "abandoned" (with their friends) at skate parks but they're fairly safe because creepy adults without boards are not welcomed. And they'll let you know if you're not welcome there.

[HalcyonDays]

They don't stand a chance.

 

None of them do, because they are bubble wrapped and coddled by their parents and their teachers, etc. Like, in my school system, you no longer can fail a student for lack of work. If they literally didn't do anything in a year, the school system would not allow them to fail, because it might "hurt their feelings"

 

Biggist pile of BS ever, Let the kids be. If they refuse to work, let them realize the result. If they work hard, let them be rewarded. If they get a cut or a fracture, so be it. They will learn. It is part of the learning experience of youth.

 

But today's mess of parents...I don't know, man.

 

And to relate this to this thread - how many of these profiled individuals believe they are not responsible for their well-being. But then, now many of these "doctors" abuse the system, and pretend to diagnose what is obvious, but then never offer help. It is very sad.

[ethalfrida]

Sometimes my mom worked outside of the home but regardless we always had homecooked, slow cooked meals. We played baseball in the street, hunted pollywogs under the bridge. I remember flying down the bridge on my bike with no hands on the handle bars.

 

Anyway, the documentary covers all that you all have said and more. No, the parents do not think it is their fault. I think one 14 year old had the operation even after his father said he could not deny his son the things he wanted to eat. There is another documentary two-parter where an obese child's mother blamed it on the custards at school. It's called Junk food Kids and is on Youtube.

[Mybrainhurts]

I would agree that a lot of overweight and obese people have no clue of their true size. Personal story time: My heaviest weight was 310lbs, and even though I weighed myself regularly and knew what size of clothing I wore and knew that I was obese, it was like it never clicked in my head...I knew I was bigger than everyone around me, but I didn't feel 310lbs. I only ever noticed how very large I had gotten when I saw photographs of myself, which was rare because I was self-conscious and avoided photographs!

 

I also deluded myself, hugely, into thinking that I was healthy. As I'm sure a lot of members of this forum know (since it was briefly discussed on Zsalynn's episode) there's a Fat Acceptance movement; and some of the things they parrot are things that I completely bought into: that I had no control over my weight, that weight was largely genetics, that BMI isn't an accurate measurement and has no bearing on health, that metabolic conditions made it too difficult for me to lose weight, that I could be healthy at any size, etc.

I ignored a huge amount of health problems when I was 310lbs because of things like the Fat Acceptance movement. I'd see my pre-diabetes and attribute it to a family history of diabetes. I'd see my weight and attribute it to having fat genes. My bad knees were blamed on an old injury, not the weight pressing on my joints. My BMI being in the 40s didn't matter because it didn't take muscle mass into account! I blamed my constant tiredness and soreness on poor posture.

I don't know what the catalyst for me was, but about a year and a half ago, I decided to lose weight. I've lost 70lbs so far, and have 107 more to lose before I'm at my healthy BMI weight.

 

First off, congratulations on losing the weight you've lost. It really sounds like you are well on your way to your goal weight and you have a great attitude.

 

My story is a bit different and I really don't take my weight loss very well.  I started out at 392 pounds although I didn't know it at the time.  I knew I had health problems due to my weight (high blood pressure) although I was lucky not to have diabetes (or even prediabetes) and my cholesterol levels were fine.  I really didn't have time to follow any diet program because my wife had a stroke and I was too busy taking care of her to take care of myself so I just didn't think about it too much.  Sadly, my wife passed away three months ago and I tried to commit suicide the same day.  For some reason that I still don't understand, I survived.  The funny thing that happened was that all of my health problems were taken care of by being in the hospital.  What's even stranger is that I have lost about 75 pounds in these past three months due to the medication I'm taking and loss of appetite.  The one thing that everyone talks about is the weight loss as if something wonderful has happened.   Even my doctors don't seem all that worried because obesity is so bad.  I feel like screaming every time that someone compliments me because to me, it's just a reminder of all that I've lost.  I don't know why I'm sharing this--maybe it's just because people are obese for different reasons and people lose weight for different reasons.  I don't know if I will ever get to a "normal" weight at any point--it's too soon to say at this time whether or not I can follow through or even if I want to do so.  I don't think I'm being a Penny or Pauline about this (I'm not bedbound by any means and can even wash all the parts of my body!) but motivation to change is a hard thing to find sometimes.  Maybe the motivation will come to them (and myself) at some point--there's always a chance that it will.

[algebra]

^ It's normal for weight to fluctuate. I can go up or down about 5lbs on the same scale at my house within a 24-hour period.

And 1lb/week is actually a really healthy rate of weightloss! Everything I've read recommends losing between .5lbs and 2lbs per week, so you're right in the middle of that.

I think something people forget is that weight loss really is simple. Not easy, by any means, but simple. It's calories in and calories out, basic thermodynamics. And the food/diet industry has a lot of lies floating around about what it takes to lose weight, and there's so much misinformation and a genuine lack of understanding, but that's what it comes down to is the energy balance.

I would agree that a lot of overweight and obese people have no clue of their true size. Personal story time: My heaviest weight was 310lbs, and even though I weighed myself regularly and knew what size of clothing I wore and knew that I was obese, it was like it never clicked in my head...I knew I was bigger than everyone around me, but I didn't feel 310lbs. I only ever noticed how very large I had gotten when I saw photographs of myself, which was rare because I was self-conscious and avoided photographs!

I also deluded myself, hugely, into thinking that I was healthy. As I'm sure a lot of members of this forum know (since it was briefly discussed on Zsalynn's episode) there's a Fat Acceptance movement; and some of the things they parrot are things that I completely bought into: that I had no control over my weight, that weight was largely genetics, that BMI isn't an accurate measurement and has no bearing on health, that metabolic conditions made it too difficult for me to lose weight, that I could be healthy at any size, etc.

I ignored a huge amount of health problems when I was 310lbs because of things like the Fat Acceptance movement. I'd see my pre-diabetes and attribute it to a family history of diabetes. I'd see my weight and attribute it to having fat genes. My bad knees were blamed on an old injury, not the weight pressing on my joints. My BMI being in the 40s didn't matter because it didn't take muscle mass into account! I blamed my constant tiredness and soreness on poor posture.

I don't know what the catalyst for me was, but about a year and a half ago, I decided to lose weight. I've lost 70lbs so far, and have 107 more to lose before I'm at my healthy BMI weight.

I will be honest: the biggest hurdle in losing weight is recognizing all the lies and excuses we tell ourselves. And it's a process. I still find myself falling back into old ways of thinking. But I had to look at myself and accept that the reason I was obese was not because of PCOS or because of genetics or anything other than the fact that I was consuming way more calories than I was burning.

It's been a process, and a learning curve, but I've finally figured out for myself, that if I want to lose weight I have to let go of those lies and accept the truth: I need much fewer calories than what my brain *wants* to eat. I do have an addition to food, and I had to stop excusing that.

So here's what I do: I calculated my TDEE (total daily energy expenditure...aka the amount of calories my body burns in a day), and I eat 1,000 calories less than that each day. My TDEE is 2500 calories, so I stick to a 1,500 calorie/day diet. When obese people (including my past self) hear 1,500 calories/day, our initial reaction is to balk at how small that is...and if you eat the way I used to eat, it's easy to understand why. I had to change not only the amount of calories I ate, but the foods I ate. If I eat junk food (and yes, even homemade dishes full of organic produce can be junk food!) it's easy to end up at 3,000 calories in a day, or more!

So now I eat a ton of fresh produce, whole grains, lean proteins, etc. and I measure and weigh everything that goes into my mouth.

A typical day's meals for me might be:

- Breakfast: chocolate peanut butter protein shake

- Snack: large navel orange

- Lunch: Tilapia with lemon/dill greek yogurt, broccoli, sweet potato

- Snack: cucumber slices with red wine vinegar and salt

- Dinner: black bean and quinoa veggie burgers (homemade), stewed zucchini, and salad with italian dressing

Often, I still have 100-300 calories left over at the end of the day, and I can afford to have a sweet dessert, like a cup of strawberries with a tablespoon or two of nutella, or a small brownie.

This is a hugely long post, but I think it's important to recognize that our entire society at large has such a lack of information about dieting and how to lose weight or how to eat right. I really do think this is, in large part, fed by the food and diet industries. As I've lost weight, I've realized how much this lack of information has influenced society. People will ask me how I've lost the weight, and refuse to accept what I've told them. They think it's too easy or too hard or too good to be true, and instead everyone wants a quick fix while they continue to eat whatever they want in whatever amounts they want, because we've become a culture with a lot of food addiction and emotional eating. I've heard so many people insist that they count calories or diet constantly and "just can't lose the weight" and it's hard to hear, because I know that I used to be the exact same way, but it wasn't that my body was just "holding" all this extra weight...it's that I was eating too many calories, even if it was healthy foods.

That's something I wish Dr. Now would be more open and upfront about on the show. It's tiptoed around, because weight is such a sensitive subject for all of us, even the viewers. But I feel that someone being really frank and blunt about this issue would help a lot. I had to be blunt with myself, but it took me 310lbs to get there.

Ditch the Tilapia, ASAP.it has the wrong kind of Omega acid in it, I have forgotten which it is, but you want fish with Omega 3.

http://www.genesmart.com/100084/tilapia-nutrition-omega-3-study/

Here. It's Omega 6 that's bad for you. I have heard about and read this in multiple places. You want to eat salmon