S05.E16: Conquer - Episode Discussion with Comic Spoilers

[HalcyonDays]

Here is your discussion thread for the Season 5 finale: Conquer. This thread will open at 10:20 pm Sunday.

 

This thread is intended to provide an area for everyone to talk about the episode and also be able to mention the comics without worry!

 

Discussion about the Comics is ALLOWED! Comic spoilers are ALLOWED! No Spoiler Tags are needed.

 

If you want to discuss the episode without any comics spoilers, please go to S05.E16: Conquer.

 

As always, remember to please keep all discussions polite and respectful.

[AimingforYoko]

Ha! Morgan's timing is just perfect. Last time they saw each other, he was the crazy (looking) one.

[Watcher0363]

I was reminded of Beverly Hills Cop. Rick man you have changed! But that was a strange finale. Glad everyone is still alive but I think everyone is just a little bit more different. Except maybe for Glenn. Glenn your big heart will be the end of you some day.

 

Every show needs a good prayer circle.

[mandolin]

I hope Morgan's arc going forward is somewhat different than the books. Hope he and Rick can buddies without too much angst.

[Watcher0363]

Well it looks like the Wolves storyline is going to be a mash up I guess of The Savages and probably the Saviors. Because these wolves are very organize and cruel.

[Dr. Opossum]

I think Morgan could make it a bit longer than in the comics because the writers know fans like him and don't want another black guy dying soon. But Lennie James might not want a long-term commitment, so who knows? I hope they will pair him with Michonne like in the comics.

I am a little surprised they went with the Wolves as an original threat instead of the Saviors. I guess the writers want to avoid a Game of Thrones scenario where they catch up to comics continuity and delay Negan further.

Edited March 30, 2015 by Dr. Opossum

[mandolin]

I think the wolves name has to foreshadow "little piggie, little piggie let me in." Big bad wolves.

[Watcher0363]

I think Morgan could make it a bit longer than in the comics because the writers know fans like him and don't want another black guy dying soon. But Lennie James might not want a long-term commitment, so who knows? I hope they will pair him with Michonne like in the comics.

I am a little surprised they went with the Wolves as an original threat instead of the Saviors. I guess the writers want to avoid a Game of Thrones scenario where they catch up to comics continuity and delay Negan further.

Yeah I wondering how soon the show would catch up with the comics. Seems like to me that with season six they should be pass the comics and into new material.  we know Negan has to show up soon. Or perhaps they will introduce a new community or something. Because the wolves can not last for more than a few episodes with out it becoming real boring.

[mandolin]

Soon after this, in the books, Rick leads Alexandria into shoring up their defenses, etc. I'd like to see some time on that. I don't think Negan will be too soon. (I hope.).

Oh, and I thought they did a good job bringing page to screen this ep. The Pete/Reg stuff. Wish it had been daytime though.

Rick's band aids were totally from the books.

Edited March 30, 2015 by mandolin

[Watcher0363]

When I watch this episode again. I am going to post more detail thoughts. 515 in the morning is coming quick. I am wondering what they are setting us up for next season. The more you lose, the harder you become, until you become so hard you break and become. Well something different like Maggie and Morgan.

[LeafontheWind]

I am so very glad that we did not get introduced to Negan at the end of this finale. It is way too early for him. My husband read a (clearly false) spoiler about how Glenn was supposed to be killed by someone named Lucille this episode. I told him Lucille was not a person and there was no way they were going to hit that plot point so soon.

I feel like next season we will get to settle in to ASZ a bit before the wolves come calling. I guess the real question will be is Negan the leader of the Wolves, or will he be the big bad for 6B or even season 7? They said they would be sticking more closely to the comics now, but the Wolves are clearly new... So much to ponder for the next seven months!

[Evie]

Yeah I wondering how soon the show would catch up with the comics. Seems like to me that with season six they should be pass the comics and into new material. we know Negan has to show up soon. Or perhaps they will introduce a new community or something. Because the wolves can not last for more than a few episodes with out it becoming real boring.

There's still a lot to cover before Negan shows up or before the show catches up to the comics. I don't think the wolves will be a long arc. A couple episodes maybe. Then there's no way out, which if done right, should last several episodes. Rebuilding, the into of Hilltop, etc ... I don't see Negan showing up until the end of next season at the very earliest, and there's several seasons worth of ground to cover after that.

Given the timing, I think the Wolves are the Scavengers, just changed up a bit like the Termites were the Hunters changed up a bit.

Edited March 30, 2015 by Evie

[JBody]

I think Morgan could make it a bit longer than in the comics because the writers know fans like him and don't want another black guy dying soon. But Lennie James might not want a long-term commitment, so who knows? I hope they will pair him with Michonne like in the comics.

I am a little surprised they went with the Wolves as an original threat instead of the Saviors. I guess the writers want to avoid a Game of Thrones scenario where they catch up to comics continuity and delay Negan further.

 

I don't want to pick on you Dr. Opposum (I like 'possums!) but this cracks me up: every time Lennie James is mentioned in connection with TWD someone has to comment about his busy schedule.  Every single time.  The dude is free, people.  This is TV's #1 drama.  Low Winter Sun is done.  

 

Negan won't be around until S7 at the earliest -- maybe his intro will be the season finale.  We're talking another couple of years, real time. SG & RK claimed to have up to S12 sketched out so I don't think we'll be seeing him any time soon.

[mandolin]

Comparison:

http://www.thewalkingdead.com/season-5-episode-16-panel-to-screen-comparison/

[JBody]

I liked this episode but I was kind of hoping for a wide crane shot of a hoard of zombies a la end of S2's prison shot, or maybe the Wolves (Scavengers) prowling around the outskirts, but I'll take a Rick-Morgan reunion (that just made my heart grow three sizes).  How long will the Wolves/Scavengers story play out?  All of S6 or just 6A?  Someone has to say, "Little pig little pig let me in."  If it's just those two scrawny, desperate dudes with no bullets it's going to be a tad anticlimactic.

[Nashville]

I liked this episode but I was kind of hoping for a wide crane shot of a hoard of zombies a la end of S2's prison shot, or maybe the Wolves (Scavengers) prowling around the outskirts, but I'll take a Rick-Morgan reunion (that just made my heart grow three sizes).  How long will the Wolves/Scavengers story play out?  All of S6 or just 6A?  Someone has to say, "Little pig little pig let me in."  If it's just those two scrawny, desperate dudes with no bullets it's going to be a tad anticlimactic.

A W/S storyline could have potential for an entire season's worth of conflict - so if the past is any judge, it'll probably get crammed down into three episodes - four, tops. :P

[JBody]

Nashville, I suspect you are completely right about this.  After the build up of Terminus/the Hunters over S4, and to have it be dispatched in 3 eps or less, I wouldn't put it past them to take care of this story line ASAP.  I call them offing a major character or two in the S6 premier, to make up for the lack of deaths in the finale, too.

[Bongo Fury]

I think the Pete story was done better in the comic, his story was less black and white on TV. In the comic Pete actually lashed out as Regina, his attack was much more deliberate. While on TV it seemed like it was more of an accident that Reg had his throat slashed. And leading up to that final conflict I seem to remember Rick having much more support from ASZ, while on TV they painted Rick as a raving lunatic and he had little support outside of CDB. 

 

I don't see the Negan/Saviors story line starting for a long time. We are at approximately issue 77 in the comic, with the current issue being 139, and Negan appearing around issue 100. So, averaging about 15 comic issues per TV season, we should see Negan in the middle to end of S7.

[Watcher0363]

Well if this episode was a sexual encounter, I would be left with a case of blue balls. I would not have minded this kind of teasing if this was not a season finale. But all of this, will they live or die was not as enjoyable as it could have been. Seeing how we knew that Pete was going to die, that death was rather anticlimactic.

 

A few episode back I referred to the ASZ as Peyton Place, which I am afraid this show will become to a certain degree. Even though some have said that they have plenty of stories to exploit from the comics. I do not see them playing out effectively over a full season. That is why I was hoping they would wrap the show up in season 7 or so.

Now for the episode. Glenn what is your problem. Kill the sob. He shot you, he beat on you and left you to fight off 2 walkers. And you let him live. You are straying into 'to stupid to live' territory. So snap out of it. How you are going to explain yourself to Rick I do not know.

 

Michonne I heart you. Like Rick I want to sleep with Jessie, but I heart you and your loyalty. You have become the ying to his bat shit crazy yang.

Abraham great speech. Best Ricktator endorsement of the bunch.

 

Sasha, you sleep with the zombies. But you won't do the world a favor and kill FPP. Shame on you and your morality.

Glad Tara woke up.

 

Carol, I will yield to your Lady Macbethness.

I am looking forward to finding out just how many wolves there are. Because that was one elaborate setup. And was the red poncho part of the wolves and they killed him for not standing watch.

 

Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid sitting in a car. It is not the cigs and no helmet that will kill you, it is the raved out zombies. That was some macho stuff in that car. Let me finish my cig then I will distract them so you can make a run for it. But no we be the two Musketeers, one for all and all for one.

 

I might start calling Morgan. Master Poe.

Edited March 30, 2015 by Watcher0363

[Bongo Fury]

A few episode back I referred to the ASZ as Peyton Place, which I am afraid this show will become to a certain degree. Even though some have said that they have plenty of stories to exploit from the comics. I do not see them playing out effectively over a full season. That is why I was hoping they would wrap the show up in season 7 or so.

 

Things were always going to slow down a bit when they made it to ASZ, building a society and re-establishing civilization is a big change from where they had been previously and it isn't as exciting and action packed as fighting off walkers and marauding bad guys. Oh there will still be walker fights and bad guys to deal with, but things should get more heavily character driven, as they deal with more internal conflicts. Which doesn't make me optimistic at all because I didn't think the Pete story line was well executed, I thought Pete's 'sins' weren't well enough exposed or developed. And it seemed rushed, I found Pete's leap from fighting off Rick when he entered his home and interfered with his family, to the next day attacking the town meeting with a sword confusing, I didn't work for me, Pete needed more to reach that point, IMO. And I think the Jessie story is also weak. So I am not confident the writers are up to the challenge of writing more character driven shows. 

[GreyBunny]

I think Morgan could make it a bit longer than in the comics because the writers know fans like him and don't want another black guy dying soon. But Lennie James might not want a long-term commitment, so who knows? I hope they will pair him with Michonne like in the comics.

I am a little surprised they went with the Wolves as an original threat instead of the Saviors. I guess the writers want to avoid a Game of Thrones scenario where they catch up to comics continuity and delay Negan further.

 

I hope so too and they keep Morgan around longer, maybe dispensing with Ezekiel and giving his story (running The Kingdom) to Morgan.  Though it would be funny to see them try to CGI Shiva.

[Watcher0363]

Things were always going to slow down a bit when they made it to ASZ, building a society and re-establishing civilization is a big change from where they had been previously and it isn't as exciting and action packed as fighting off walkers and marauding bad guys. Oh there will still be walker fights and bad guys to deal with, but things should get more heavily character driven, as they deal with more internal conflicts. Which doesn't make me optimistic at all because I didn't think the Pete story line was well executed, I thought Pete's 'sins' weren't well enough exposed or developed. And it seemed rushed, I found Pete's leap from fighting off Rick when he entered his home and interfered with his family, to the next day attacking the town meeting with a sword confusing, I didn't work for me, Pete needed more to reach that point, IMO. And I think the Jessie story is also weak. So I am not confident the writers are up to the challenge of writing more character driven shows. 

I was a very big fan of the first half of season two. But most of the people I worked with hated it. Me and one other woman were always defending Daryl's search and all of the farm personal intrigue. I hope if they go this route with season six, I hope they still have some of Frank Darabont's writers on staff. Also I hope they are willing to spend money on more actors so they can introduce other groups.

[placate]

I hope so too and they keep Morgan around longer, maybe dispensing with Ezekiel and giving his story (running The Kingdom) to Morgan.  Though it would be funny to see them try to CGI Shiva.

I could go for that only if they some how keep Shiva, some how.  I just want to know how hard it is to work with a tiger.  I also want to hear if any of the walker extras piss themselves when pretending to be mauled by a tiger.

[HalcyonDays]

Hey Everyone. Just a quick heads up about all of the season 5 episodes. If you are looking for them on the main page and going "OMG!! Where are they!", all of the episode threads have been moved into the S05 subforum.

 

To find them, either on the main Walking Dead page, look UP (near the top of the page) and you'll see a Past Seasons, then S01 through S05. To find the actual episode threads for season 5, click S05 to find them. Or you can click here. Past Seasons/S05

 

On the main page, I've left two links to the actual episode thread as a shortcut to that folder. This will be here temporarily just as a helpful link to S05, but I will be removing it in about a week. Also, the links cannot be pinned, so won't appear at the top of the page, unfortunately.

 

Just wanted to give everyone a heads up, since it looks like your episode threads suddenly disappeared!!! Thanks.