The Writers of Criminal Minds: Our Scribes

[ForeverAlone]

I honestly can't figure out why Erica keeps Kim around. She has to realize her episodes are the weakest. I mean, even Erica's episodes are better than Kim's, though not by a whole lot. There are plenty of quality writers out there who have written for crime dramas. Why not invest in some superior writing talent? 

[MCatry]

Two quick notes:

I am glad both Dunkle and Barrois are gone to work on that 'spinoff', since I don't have any desire to watch it, ever, and I really don't like their writing styles.

And regarding Harrison, she shouldn't be hired as a writer or a producer. No show deserves her, no matter how bad it may be. And I though RD was an item with Nick Hoeh...

[zannej]

One thing I will say of Kim's writing is that while it is not suited to CM, I think she can create compelling and interesting new characters--- like she did with some unsubsa nd she would probably be decent on another show or just writing for a different genre. She could totally make it in the Lifetime Movie channel with her stuff. There were elements fo her writing that were actually good. Unfortunately, she is weak at writing the things that are important to me (and a lot of longtime viewers)-- the intellectual side, the profiling, good dialog, and the stuff involving the team. She is probably very nice and I think that Erica may have a hard time with separating a friendsihp from the work. And it also seems that both Erica and Janine have questionable judgment about what is "good", so maybe they read her scripts and think they are fantastic.

Edited May 15, 2015 by zannej

[Russet29]

Agreed about KH doing well in another genre. I think all of the writers are capable of writing for a major network. I doubt this is an easy job to get so I imagine they all have certain qualifications. CM just doesn't seem to be a good fit for her. Also in defense of her character, someone posted a really funny vine last year of MGG walking out of her office half naked and her reaction was great, so I think she's probably easy to get along with. She's definitely a better actor than Breen proved to be in his vine with Gubler.

 

Regarding JSB, I wonder if she's moving to the spinoff or another show entirely. I remember her signing a production deal with ABC a while ago and maybe something is finally happening with that.

[normasm]

I forgot about that vine with KM and MGG! That was funny. I loved that Breen's acting sucked, too.

[Bookish Jen]

To me, the most important aspect of a TV show or a film is the quality of the writing. All scripts start with a nugget of an idea in a writer's brain. I'm not at all demeaning the work the cast and crew do; I also place a high level of responsibility on their shoulders. After our love, the greatest gift we can give to the world is our labor, whether we are working on a Hollywood set, a factory shop floor, a hospital's ER, a downtown office, a rural farm or within the confines of our home.

 

That being said, I would love CM to find some new writers with some fresh ideas. There are so many fledgling talented writers looking for their break; I want their voices heard.

[normasm]

I agree, the writing is key to the integrity of a show. If the writing's lousy, MGG and TG, etc. are just window dressing, and, at times, offensive because they are ill-used. I hate wasting actors's (and others's ) talent on bad writing.

[Bookish Jen]

I agree, the writing is key to the integrity of a show. If the writing's lousy, MGG and TG, etc. are just window dressing, and, at times, offensive because they are ill-used. I hate wasting actors's (and others's ) talent on bad writing.

Preach! Writers and actors must work in tandem to create strong and compelling characters. Writers are the private, behind-the-scenes aspect of a character whereas actors are the public, front and center aspect of the character. When these two components approach developing a character with a mutual understanding and affinity, they can create magic.

[zannej]

I really think that with losing some of the writers to the spinoff, it would be the perfect opportunity to bring Andrew Wilder back.

[ForeverAlone]

It would, but CBS (or maybe it's ABC who pays the writers) would need to open its wallet, because Andrew Wilder is a writer on Secrets and Lies. But I wish nothing more than Andrew Wilder comes back. 

[Saje]

Looks like he would not say no to that:

 

http://criminalmindsfans.com/exclusive-interview-andrew-wilder-talks-criminal-minds/

[Cobalt Stargazer]

Great article, and I'm really amused that Thomas is giving him this look that's like, "Dude, you're touching me again." :-P

[zannej]

I think we need to let CBS know that we want Andrew back. Maybe he can join for season 12 (if he has free time from Secrets and Lies).

[normasm]

That was a wonderful article. He's a very interesting guy. I may have to give his series a try. Too bad he can't come back.

[Saje]

To me he gave the impression that he would come back, if it could be worked out schematically. I liked what he had to say about Thomas and of course Reid especially.

 

I like your idea, zannej, about letting CBS know we'd enjoy having him back. I wonder if we could get enough voices. Like banding together for a common goal, joining forces.

[smoker]

Looks like he would not say no to that:

 

http://criminalmindsfans.com/exclusive-interview-andrew-wilder-talks-criminal-minds/

 

thanks for sharing the link, amazing interview!

[zannej]

We could start a petition or something.

[Droogie]

I'd sign it!

He definitely did not say "no."

Edited June 11, 2015 by Droogie

[Saje]

No he did not.

[MCatry]

I think the 'old girlfriend' analogy says it all.

I cannot express how much I would love to see him returning to CM, but unlike AW, which seems to be deadly serious about respecting the job of the other writers, the current ones didnt bat an eye at ruining canon by disregarding many established features of every single character. That would make his work next to impossible, since the features he designed and wrote for Hotch, Reid, Rossi and the others have been just changed or ignored for so much time now.

[normasm]

That's a spot-on observation. It's impossible to go back and retcon all the retcon that has occurred since he left. Since he "doesn't watch" the show, he may not know how badly certain canon characters have drifted. If he did, he would likely not see a way to come back and essentially write for new, less interesting versions of those he helped create.

[Saje]

Something tells me that if he were to come back, the characters would quickly show much more of their earlier personas. But that's just me.

 

I also think he does watch. 

[normasm]

Saje, I would hope that would happen, but he almost would have to be in charge for the tide to turn that drastically back to canon, and for better writing to be insisted upon. My opinion. I admit, I don't know how TV show writing groups really work.

[smoker]

Something tells me that if he were to come back, the characters would quickly show much more of their earlier personas. But that's just me.

 

I also think he does watch. 

I wish you were right

[Saje]

Even if he weren't able to push back the tide, I think we'd get some remarkable episodes, more along the lines of Mr. Scratch and the one with the plane crash. He talks like he's mesmerized by the psychology of it all, and that is what I'd love to see, what I miss in current episodes. 

[Droogie]

If CM had retained the core writers/show runners and if Elle and Gideon had never left, what do you think the show would be like now? Would it have lasted ten seasons?

I think Reid and Elle would've been closer than he and JJ, and I think we would've seen some rebellion/conflict between he and Gideon. I also wonder if they would've let Hotch and Haley remain married and delved more deeply into her possible "affair."

[smoker]

If CM had retained the core writers/show runners and if Elle and Gideon had never left, what do you think the show would be like now? Would it have lasted ten seasons?

I think Reid and Elle would've been closer than he and JJ, and I think we would've seen some rebellion/conflict between he and Gideon. I also wonder if they would've let Hotch and Haley remain married and delved more deeply into her possible "affair."

 

I have to say I don't think Mandy P. would have stayed so long even under the best of circumstances, he would have finished his contract sooner than later. 

 

Reid and Elle had a great friendship, actually rewatching, JJ was closer to García and Hotch what is pretty logic. However, we don't know for sure what happened there and it was after season 1 so I'm going to let that alone.

 

I would have liked more insides in the Hotchners marriage, I know it sounds morbid but if the point was witness the damage the job does to a family life it wasn't enough, there are so many guesses... and Haley became a weeping bitch in a couple of scenes, I really want to know about that call too, it was a lover, some flirt or her divorce lawyer??

And after that, the thing it goes under my skin is how circumstances have made of Haley a martyr, just because Hotch never dealt with the afterwards of his divorce. In my opion it is unrealistic Haley didn't got some boyfriend after the way she finished things and after 2 years.

In my fantasies she didn't die, and Hotch (and I) got our resolution, I don't even care if they made things up or they got over their marriage for good. I think a good chance of this happening lands on Mandy P, if he would have stayed longer maybe the tragic death had been his departure storyline instead of Haley's.

 

the cons of my theories are Gideon was reckless and he was around as a unit chief only when it was convenient for him, we can't forget Mandy was the star, Hotch character was great in season 1 already, but he was more "the chief" later. Another con, it's the lack of Rossy, I do like him or I did like him when he arrived to the team and he has some great scenes and I would miss them. Besides,  my major complain still could have been well done but I don't blame only the writers, CBS is highly qualified in crappy personal storylines in almost any show 

 

finally, I think I didn't follow your idea, so I do apologize, I was going to when I started this comment, but in my opinion the first half of the show is more or less balanced it's not perfect but it's done with professionalism and it's entertaining. I'm afraid if I had to rewrite last seasons I would run out of words

Edited June 16, 2015 by smoker

[Bookish Jen]

While watching the opening credits, I always keep my eyes peeled to see who wrote the script. I'm more concerned about this than who directed the episode (sorry, Matthew). Seeing Andrew Wilder's name always puts a smile on my face.

[Droogie]

Check out Tari's newest interview, with Erik Stiller:

http://criminalmindsfans.com/exclusive-cm-staff-writer-erik-stiller/

[zannej]

Erik seems like a cool guy. I admit I don't like that he likes to show the unsub early though. I'm hoping he can come up with scripts where the reveal is delayed.

[ForeverAlone]

I was looking through the list of Criminal Minds episodes, just to refresh my memory on who wrote what, and I was pleasantly surprised to realize that I loved most of Erica Messer and Debra Fisher's episodes. BUT after poor Debra was fired, I only like a handful of Erica's episodes she has written solo. Seriously, maybe about five at the most of the her solo efforts. 

[Bookish Jen]

I was looking through the list of Criminal Minds episodes, just to refresh my memory on who wrote what, and I was pleasantly surprised to realize that I loved most of Erica Messer and Debra Fisher's episodes. BUT after poor Debra was fired, I only like a handful of Erica's episodes she has written solo. Seriously, maybe about five at the most of the her solo efforts. 

Maybe Erica writes best when she works with a partner to help her reign in the goopy stuff. I think having Kirsten co-wrote Nelson's Sparrow helped make this particular episode a stand-out in a particularly meh season.

[Bookish Jen]

Okay, I've been thinking about CM's less than stellar scripts for the past few seasons and I'm asking myself, "Bookish, what would you do if you were hired to write for CM?"
 

As I've mentioned elsewhere at these parts, I have worked as a professional writer. However, I have never really written a script, so I would quickly buy a bunch of books on writing TV scripts and study them until they became a part of my DNA.

 

Then I would do a ton of research on the FBI and the art and science of profiling because it was the profiling that really hooked me on CM.

 

I would binge watch CM, especially the earlier seasons-oh, wait, I already do that.

 

Now if the stars aligned appropriately, Ed is brought back to run the show (maybe Messer falls into a volcano or something) and our beloved Andrew Wilder would be brought back as head writer.

 

Once on the set, I would sit down with the cast, both individually and as a round table, and ask them about their characters and how they connect with them and their hopes and desires for their future characterization, plot ideas and any other future developments they'd like me to consider.

 

And yes, my sugar mint cookies would somehow be involved.

Edited October 24, 2015 by Bookish Jen

[normasm]

Another thing to do, Booky, is get copies of scripts of TV and movies that you thought were stellar, at least that's what I would do. 

[missmycat]

Sadly I had thought CM would show some vast improvement once Janine left and Breen took over as head writer. Unfortunately that has not been the case so far. CBS more than anybody is to blame.They could not have done a better job of sabotaging our beloved show were they to have done it on purpose.Their blatant stupidity in messing with a cast that did not need to be messed with cost us the characters of Emily Prentiss and the original and better JJ. But even worse than that, we now know it caused CM to lose Ed Bernero.Which of course enabled Erica"unsub loving" MESSer to be able to take over the running over the show. Ed would never have allowed the focus to be taken off of the team and the profiling and put on the unsubs themselves the way she has done.

 

I believe the only reason the unsub gradually started taken over in season 6 is because Ed had one foot out the door and MESSer (who once called the unsubs the stars of the show,while Dunkle her right hand man called them the show's bread & butter) now had one foot and was soon to have the other in the door. Than add in the fact that you have a bunch of these so called "johnny come lately" writers who weren't around for the creation of our beloved CM characters.And under MESSer these writers were allowed to write just about anything in regards to these characters whether or not it violated the character's canon history. Last but not least you have a bunch of writers who just love to show off their shiny new creations(unsubs and characters other than our team) and a show runner(ruiner) only too willing to oblige them. So is it really any surprise that we've been getting the crap we have since MESSer took over, sadly not to me it isn't.

Edited October 24, 2015 by missmycat

[normasm]

 

I believe the only reason the unsub gradually started taken over in season 6 is because Ed had one foot out the door and MESSer (who once called the unsubs the stars of the show,while Dunkle her right hand man called them the show's bread & butter) now had one foot and was soon to have the other in the door. Than add in the fact that you have a bunch of these so called "johnny come lately" writers who weren't around for the creation of our beloved CM characters.And under MESSer these writers were allowed to write just about anything in regards to these characters whether or not it violated the character's canon history. 

I partially agree/disagree with this MMC. The unubs "took over" because it's much easier to write a new, depraved killer every week than keep up with characters that have been interesting and compelling for several years. The less you write for those 7 characters, the less you'll get called out for messing them up, so, just do little touches and toss a few bouquets their way. People just watch this show for the depravity, right? Except most of us don't and never have. I watch (or used to) because it's a team of smart people committed to figuring out who's killing people before they can again, and using every psychological or experiential trick in the book to do it. Their skills complement each other's, they bounce ideas off each other, they don't just let a computer track someone down magically, and then go in with guns drawn to subdue and shoot at those unsubs. 

 

Except, now, I guess they do. The show runner doesn't know this show used to be good, so she can't possibly know how to keep it good. She goes from one to two to three until she gets to the end and then she starts again. Keep the ball in the air, but for heaven's sake, don't put it into skillful play.

[ForeverAlone]

It's much easier to show the audience all the unsub's actions, throw in some generic profiling and call it a day. It is MUCH harder to write the show from the team's perspective where they have to  build a credible profile and arrest strategy just from looking at the victims and the crime scenes. And frankly, I don't think most of the writers are up to that challenge, since it requires an understanding of criminal psychology and behavioral analysis. Either they can't do it, or they don't want to do it. 

[zannej]

I really hope that if this show makes it to season 12 that they bring back Andrew. I know I might sound like a broken record, but I think he could save the show.

[normasm]

Hate to say it, zannej, and this is just MO, but they don't do justice and redemption in broadcast TV. When they backtracked after firing AJ and essentially firing Paget, they had already stepped in their own shit, and when they tried to put it back right, they tracked the stuff everywhere. 

 

I know Andrew said he would have fired himself back then, because he was drug-fueled and acting out, but someone like Messer doesn't see the beam in her own eye, so she can't fix what she thinks isn't broken.

 

There also could be an agenda in place among TPTB that the Mothership is simply there so that they can launch the Othership. The people who need to stay around because they are popular may land on Beyond Boredom™ but I bet they don't care if CM is finished after this season.

[Saje]

I really hope that if this show makes it to season 12 that they bring back Andrew. I know I might sound like a broken record, but I think he could save the show.

 

I love this, and I agree. I wish there was more any of us could do to bring this to the attention of those ABOVE Erica. I did hear that keeping his name seen on twitter is one important thing we can do. And to include @CrimMinds_CBS when we tweet it.

[Bookish Jen]

Another thing to do, Booky, is get copies of scripts of TV and movies that you thought were stellar, at least that's what I would do. 

Funny, I was thinking the same thing last night. After work I went to the library and picked up a DVD called "Tales from the Script." According to the DVD's copy, this documentary features screenwriters, both newbies and legends, discussing the craft of writing a really good script and the journey of storytelling for the visual art of film. I'm going to watch this DVD sometime next week when I get the free time. A guess what? There is also a book. I checked my county's library system and the downtown library has a copy. I think I will read this book and then write a review for my blog. And yep, I'll post a link once I do.

Edited October 24, 2015 by Bookish Jen

[SSAHotchner]

Funny, I was thinking the same thing last night. After work I went to the library and picked up a DVD called "Tales from the Script." According to the DVD's copy, this documentary features screenwriters, both newbies and legends, discussing the craft of writing a really good script and the journey of storytelling for the visual art of film. I'm going to watch this DVD sometime next week when I get the free time. A guess what? There is a also a book. I checked my county's library system and the downtown library has a copy. I think I will read this book and then write a review for my blog. And yep, I'll post a link once I do.

Sounds interesting. I'll let my husband know. This sounds like something we'd enjoy watching together. 

[Bookish Jen]

It's much easier to show the audience all the unsub's actions, throw in some generic profiling and call it a day. It is MUCH harder to write the show from the team's perspective where they have to  build a credible profile and arrest strategy just from looking at the victims and the crime scenes. And frankly, I don't think most of the writers are up to that challenge, since it requires an understanding of criminal psychology and behavioral analysis. Either they can't do it, or they don't want to do it. 

So much word to this!

 

With the unsubs all you have to do is show them killing people and going through their day being their wicked selves, lots of blood, severed limbs, shoot outs or stabbings, terrified victims, and so on. Then mix in some brief profiling about shitty childhoods, sociopathic tendencies, text book psychiatric phrasing, substance abuse, the possibility of sexual assault, and the victims of the unsubs. Boom! You got an episode of current day CM.

 

But when it comes to the actual BAU, the people we actually give a darn about, well, that requires more nuance and more craft and care because these characters are truly the life blood of CM. Reid, Hotch et al are the reason why so many of us tune in week after week (and then some). And I want more consideration to be put into these truly potent characters. Yes, I know the CM writing staff works on strict deadlines; I know all about deadlines. But quit taking the easy way out. It's insulting to the viewing audience and a slap in the face of a very talented cast.

[smoker]

Funny, I was thinking the same thing last night. After work I went to the library and picked up a DVD called "Tales from the Script." According to the DVD's copy, this documentary features screenwriters, both newbies and legends, discussing the craft of writing a really good script and the journey of storytelling for the visual art of film. I'm going to watch this DVD sometime next week when I get the free time. A guess what? There is also a book. I checked my county's library system and the downtown library has a copy. I think I will read this book and then write a review for my blog. And yep, I'll post a link once I do.

I've watched it and I own it, I recorded it when it was shown on tv, that one and Casting by, they are really good

Edited October 25, 2015 by smoker

[normasm]

Sharon Lee Watson is no longer a writer on the show. That's terrible news for Reid fans. Kim Harrison is gone, but most of us are happy about that. Apparently their replacements are Stephanie SenGupta and Gigi Bannon. Unknown to me.

 

Bon voyage, Sharon

Edited July 11, 2016 by normasm

[Old Dog]

That's so sad - she was one of the only writers who still managed to capture the real heart of the show. And she knew how to write for Reid consistently. I think she has moved to ABC's new show, Notorious.

[ReidFan]

awwww CRAP..... Kim being gone was okay by me, but man, I liked Sharon Lee Watson :-(  Gigi Bannon has been a producer on the show for years (dunno what capacity though..finance? scheduling? consulting? who knows) but SenGupta is new.

dammit all

I hope Breen writes more this year then

[Droogie]

Oh no!  This isn't good news at all.  I mean, I certainly won't miss KH, but Sharon?  A loss!  If only it could've been Virgil...

[MMC]

6 hours ago, normasm said:

4 hours ago, ReidFan said:

awwww CRAP..... Kim being gone was okay by me, but man, I liked Sharon Lee Watson :-(  Gigi Bannon has been a producer on the show for years (dunno what capacity though..finance? scheduling? consulting? who knows) but SenGupta is new.

dammit all

I hope Breen writes more this year then

Sharon Lee Watson is no longer a writer on the show. That's terrible news for Reid fans. Kim Harrison is gone, but most of us are happy about that. Apparently their replacements are Stephanie SenGupta and Gigi Bannon. Unknown to me.

 

Bon voyage, Sharon

This information comes per IMDb. Stephanie apparently wrote for the show Reign back in 2013.Gigi not surprisingly appears to have no previous writing experience. I'd say based on past experiences that this does not bold well for those of us who are already concerned about the quality of this show when it comes to it's writing. If only we'd be lucky enough for one of them to turn out to be another Sharon Lee Watson. My fear though, it'll probably be more along the lines of another  Kim Harrison, Karen Masser or even Erica herself.

 

ETA: Well it appears that Stephanie has had experience writing for a crime drama. She has written for Law And Order, Law And Order:Crminal Intent as well as Hawaii Five-0. I must say this bit of information has me feeling a whole lot better about her having joined the writing staff for this show.

Edited July 11, 2016 by MMC
updating information

[Bookish Jen]

Well, at least Stephanie has some experience writing for crime procedurals; that's a plus.

But Gigi has none? What the ever living you know what! I am so sick of writing being so cheapened in our society that a complete novice, with zilch writing experience gets a prime writing gig when so many talented writers who are working crappy McJobs get ignored. And this doesn't just happen with screenwriting; it happens in journalism, organizational communications, grant writing, etc. A few years ago I lost a prime writing gig to someone whose only writing experience was updating her social media feed.

And no more Sharon? Now I'm really pissed off.

Bookish Jen thinks about her worthless communications degree and weeps