BabySpinach

I completely disagree that Dean's choice was a "tragic hero fall," or that it remotely compares to Sam's Book of the Damned shenanigans in S10. Let's break it down. Sam actively made the world worse by releasing the Darkness with the BotD. Dean helped to save it by killing a super-charged Lucifer, preemptively saving multitudes of innocents. The removal of the Mark of Cain resulted in multiple innocent casualties (Suzie, Oskar, Charlie) and only helped one person. Dean's choice directly saved two people (Jack and Sam) and killed no one. Both archangels had already invaded the world before Dean made his choice. If he hadn't, they'd have two vicious archangels to deal with instead of one. The best was made of a bad situation. Neither Michael nor Lucifer are exactly upstanding, moral people, but at least Michael hasn't been shown to be needlessly sadistic, whiney, or childish. If we had to pick one, I'd go with Michael. And since Dean's the one he's inhabiting, I suspect he'll have a harder time taking over the world than he anticipated.

Ugh, yes. How hard would it have been for Michael to walk right past the camera and briefly flash his eyes blue with a sinister smirk? WTF

The only time I find a finale exciting is when the cliffhanger is directly connected to/driven by the two main characters. It seems like a no-brainer, but S12 did the opposite of that and left me rolling my eyes and mostly uninvested. Needless to say, I'm very excited (and apprehensive) for S14, and I sincerely hope they'll learn from Demon Dean's too-short reign this time.

Ha, I see what you did there...

Except that this archangel is being played by Jensen Ackles, and I have complete faith in him.

I think if Death herself is looking out for Dean because he's "got work to do," whatever choice he makes must be for a greater purpose than just saving Sam.

Billie did say "see you soon" in 13.19. There's no way we don't see her for the season finale. Whatever "impulsive" fuckery Dean gets up to, he seems to have the backing of Death, so it can't be THAT bad... right?

At this point, I'm just clutching at the "it's been a long time coming" hint, Billie's definite involvement in what happens with Dean, and her assertion that he "has work to do". That sounds more like Dean fulfilling some necessary cosmic purpose that him potentially dooming the world for Sammy. At the very least, Billie is pushing him toward something, so it's got to be important rather than just cataclysmic for everyone. PLEASE let it be framed that way.

I like to think that Lucifer actually didn't dare touch Michael because he knew he'd get his ass kicked. Maybe Michael retreated into himself to block out his annoying little brother and Lucifer interpreted that as insanity.

Holy shit, guys. I know we've been speculating about Rowena opening the cage to release Michael, but I haven't heard anyone mention how Billie figures into this. Remember how Death just strolled down into the cage to get Sam's soul out, and how he had the ability to put up walls so he would stay sane? What if Billie is the one who gets Michael out and fixes whatever state he's in? That would take a much shorter run time to accomplish than getting Rowena to do it. Given Jensen's remark that he hasn't really had a chance to play the character yet (aside from the closing shot, probably), then the Dean that's fighting Lucifer in the church might still be Dean. He gets some sort of power up that is temporary and maybe deadly. When(?) he wins, his body starts to fall apart from the inside. Billie comes along at the moment of his supposed death ("see you again, soon"), with Michael in tow to save his life (and maybe to save the angels in heaven as the "important work" Billie mentioned). Boom, Michael gets his true vessel and he leaves. It all fits!

I had no problem with him pushing Lucifer away from the portal, either. Mostly because I don't buy Lucifer's redemption for a second, and after all of the terrible shit he's done PERSONALLY to the Winchesters and to the world, this is nowhere close to what he deserves. Ketch's redemption was done better, because he 1. showed remorse and 2. tried to make amends for his past. It's really not hard, yet we're supposed to sympathize with Satan because he cried a tear and looked sad.

Yeah, but then the show would turn into something completely different if they keep shoving in alternate versions of existing characters and opening endless portals to endless worlds. I think one universe is more than enough. Helps to keep the stakes a bit more grounded, or as much as they can be. I personally didn't care much for the Apocalypse World to begin with.

There's been a lot of little hints given as to the character Jensen will play: 1. It's been a long time coming. 2. It's a character we haven't seen in many years. 3. It involves Dean "stepping up" in some way, so this character is going to directly impact Dean ie. possess him, rather than just be a doppleganger that looks like him. Only our Michael, not even AUMichael, fits with these hints. Death is a possibility, but a long shot in my opinion. Plus, our Michael's connection with Dean was unceremoniously dropped and never referenced again, so there's material to explore there that actually directly affects one of the main characters.

That's my fear as well. I wonder what's going to happen right after they crash into each other. Is it a vicious brawl, or hopping around like monkeys? Pleeeeaaasseeee be the former....

I have to agree a bit, seeing all those people together in the bunker was weirdly gratifying. It made me think of season 1, and how it used to just be Sam, Dean, and John hunting one single demon. Things have certainly changed, for better and for worse, but I'm always a sucker for big groups of scrappy, embattered people united and having some down time for once.

I also wonder (but highly doubt) if they're going to address the fact that Michael vs. Lucifer would scorch half the planet. There's a thin justification in the AU that AUMichael just wanted to disarm Lucifer rather than kill him, but would it have been so difficult to have the ground rumbling, rocks flying while they were duking it out? Same with Gabriel and Lucifer versus AUMichael in the latest episode. I do think that AUMichael's actor sells his formidable strength and deadliness, but the environment doesn't quite back him up.

It was pretty contrived for Sam to get taken down by two vampires. Made him look like a bit of a chump, and reminds me of all the plot and character stupidity required to get Charlie killed off. I heavily disliked her, but even I got angry at the ridiculous situation that played out to get to that end point. What really stood out to me about Sam's death was Dean turning mute. I don't recall him ever reacting like that before, and it was very effective for him to stay silent and let that Single Man Tear/OPT do all the talking. The flashback of Sam's death to explain Dean's emotions was completely unnecessary, though. The editing doing what it does, as always...

In regards to the sneak peek.... I'm sure that Mary will be proven right in her self-imposed heroic duty and the boys will be framed as needy and unable to let her be her super duper awesome self. *barf* Seems like Mary throws herself at anything that will keep her a long distance away from her sons. She'd rather stay in a hellish apocalyptic world, fighting someone else's war, than see her own family ever again. It's the kind of unfeeling choice a cold, logical robot would make, not a sympathetic/loving human. It's not like the resistance's strength relies on her, anyway.

Moved to bitter spoilers.

Fkin' Mary....

Yeah, it totally kills what should have been a long, uncomfortable single take on Dean's crumbling mind. It also reminds me of 7x13 when Dean's first sex scene in forever was cut in between some poor guy getting tossed into a wall and getting his hands and feet cut off in spectacular gory fashion. What exactly were we supposed to take away from those two tonally opposite scenes being smashed together besides whiplash? Or is it punishment for daring to enjoy the eye candy?

Given that it's a discussion, too, elaboration on why you have that opinion may open up it up for conversation a bit better. Your opinion was brief and blunt, so I matched it in my response, that's all.

I wish they'd stuck with the creepy giant rabbit head all the way through! It was simultaneously terrifying and hilarious. The genuine creep factor was what made the episode stand out to me, then that all went away when the rabbit head did. I always love myself some Donna, though. She's strong without being abrasive or arrogant, and bonus, she genuinely laughs at Dean's jokes.

I completely disagree with everything you said.

I generally find that season 11 improves on rewatch. It was mostly focused all the way through and the story was pretty simple. I like that Dean got a cosmic win just by being himself and talking it out with God's sister, no shiny powers required. That nicely wrapped up the MoC arc, beginning with this ominous dark force that appeared only evil and destructive, then ending with that dark force finding peace herself. But while I liked the general outcome of the story, the execution could (as always) have been better. Dean and Amara's weird irresistible bond was never fully explained, and we got multiple possible answers that never solidifed. Is it because he was the first of God's creation she saw? Is it because his "light" drew her in? Is it because he bore the MoC? Is it because he was just a proxy for her brother? She obviously favored him, but how and for what reason? I don't agree, however, that most of S11's standalones were godawful. I found them, in general, better than S10 and S12. Into the Mystic and Safe House are ones I find especially enjoyable. Red Meat and Just my Imagination may be the only ones that annoyed the shit out of me.