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I've hid a bunch of posts in here - on both sides of the argument, for the record - and now I'm asking everyone to move on. If you think someone has stepped over the line of civility, report it. Don't reply. If you find yourself having the same argument with the same person, let it go. If you have a problem with mod actions, PM one of us. We have the little shields next to our names. Anyone is fine - if it's not our forum, we'll direct you to the right person. But do not argue with our actions on the boards. And finally, no one has to justify their voting decisions.

Logan didn't sound "bitter" to me; he sounded wistful/resigned because he realized it was truly the end of their relationship, and maybe even their friendship. I thought the goal was to get Rory to forget her worries, and while it worked for a time, in the light of day real life was intruding again. That's how I interpreted their lines, but obviously MMV. As for the LDB not really caring about Rory, because they didn't speak out against her affair with Logan, Rory's own mother didn't have much reaction, so I don't see why her friends would be expected to.

It seemed to me that Rory kept up with the LDB and considered them her friends. She recognized them immediately, was excited to see them, knew and asked about Colin's recent surgery, and went with them without a qualm. I agree with those who got the impression this was a "one-off" done to cheer Rory up. Logan, at least, has a high-pressure job on another continent.

Those were, supposedly, the final four words, but the situation may have been totally different. I mean, imagine a final scene between Rory and her mom, but it's at Rory's wedding. She dumped Logan a couple episodes into S7 because long-distance just wasn't working, and reconnected with Jess. Over a year later, she's back from the campaign trail, writing her book, and living with Jess in Philly, where his business has started making money. (Is that the right city? I can't remember.) Her mom's getting ready to walk her down the aisle, and a beaming Rory whispers, "Mom?" My story is bad fanfic and NOT what I would want - total Rogan shipper here - but it definitely wouldn't be a repeat of history. What we GOT with 32-year-old Rory is much closer. My long (rambling) point is that having a baby is part of the story, not the entire story. ASP is apparently set on Rory repeating her mother's life, but it didn't have to be that way, no matter Rory's age.

Especially considering that everyone - Logan, Mitchell, the Condé Nast people - were eye-rolling the moment her name was mentioned. She clearly had a reputation as not being very reliable, which Rory acknowledged. (And honestly, I think Rory realized it was a gamble, but thought the potential payoff justified the risk of failure.)

Total agreement on the hotness that it David Sutcliffe! And that the S7 development of Chris's relationship with Rory got thrown under the bus with Logan. But Logan is Christopher, don't ya know? /sarcasm Yeah, if my grandma answered the phone all disoriented, acted completely not like herself, and seemed to be turning her house over to an employee's ever-growing family, I would get in my car and drive there immediately. Not just casually mention to my mom that she should probably check in grandma sometime. If she's in the neighborhood. Maybe.

ITA, @Lady Calypso. When you put art into the world, it stops being "yours". Even more so when you sell that art, which essentially ASP did. I have a lot of sympathy for her original issues with the studio, but when she decided to leave, a side effect of that was giving up control of these characters. And not everyone hated S7. Canon is canon. Maybe my issue is that we never heard how this happened. I could believe this could go as you say, but the last time we saw Logan, he was heading to California, cutting ties with his family, determined to create a new professional destiny for himself. It's hard for me to make that mesh with Revival!Logan without any explanation at all. (And as I said, the biggest disconnect for me was regarding his job and his dad. I can believe his personal life would be a mess.)

I was one who mentioned the possibility of Logan and Odette having an "arrangement" - I think I said I could "fanwank" it. It would probably have been more accurate to say that if they took the story down that path, I could buy it. Because you're right in saying that it was never said or even implied in these episodes that Odette wasn't "all in" on their relationship. (I do think it's a little odd, considering the amount of time it was implied Rory was spending in London that the conflict had never arisen before, if that's the case. But that's just an impression.)

I wondered! At first I thought it was the Dragonfly, because it was so horribly tacky, but then I realized it was tacky in a completely different way! I loved Lorelei's story about Richard, but I always chuckle at the idea that nature brings these huge revelations out in people. Maybe because I live in a rural area, and my view kind of looks like that all the time, and I feel like the rules of fiction say I should have incredible personal clarity as a result. lol

Honestly, I wonder if it would have been, "Rory?" "Yeah?" "I'm pregnant." But if we take ASP at her word, I honestly think she would have had Rory be in a relationship of some kind. Because I don't see "22-year-old Rory repeats her mother's story" as being the kind of happy ending that a series usually requires. I think the kind of ambiguous end we got to the revival is only possible because ASP is reasonably confident that there will be more episodes.

I have the highly unpopular opinion of loving the LDB, so I was thrilled when they showed up. I was watching at a coffee shop - one with wifi! - so I had to try to control my squee. (I love the actors, so that probably colors my opinion, I'll admit.) I know they're idiots, and I would probably hate them in RL, but they're fun idiots. And I felt like "fun" was sorely lacking overall in the revival. I've watched their whole sequence probably a dozen times already. The only thing that bugged me was when Colin "made it rain" in Doose's. I'm assuming they left more than enough money to pay for everything, but I hate that somebody had to pick up all that cash off the floor. Just leave it on the counter. Grr. That said, I kind of wish Logan had been left out of those scenes, and it had just been the three other guys coming to cheer Rory up. Because A) I don't think the person Logan was becoming at the end of S7* would still be hanging out with those guys, and B) I felt like it was an odd match with the rest of the Rory/Logan relationship drama. It somehow made the tango club scenes too heavy, and the Rory/Logan "breakup" scene too light. *I know, I know, I apparently need to pretend that Logan's S7 arc never happened, because clearly ASP isn't going to acknowledge it. :-/

If you go up and hover over the top right corner, icons will show up. If you click the second one from the left, you can pick the subtitles language you want. :-) I didn't mind the Paul joke*, insomuch as I don't see him and Rory having a serious relationship. Yes, they've been "together" for a while, but I guess I have the unpopular opinion that length of a relationship doesn't always equal depth. If Rory has been traveling as much as she says, how much time have they really even spent together? Sometimes people stay in casual monogamous** relationships because they like "having someone". I think it's kind of weak, but I don't think it's uncommon. *I do mind it from the perspective that once again, Rory (and Lorelei) are basically closed off to the idea that anyone besides the two of them have legitimate feelings and needs. **Obviously, this particular relationship isn't monogamous, but I can't think of another term for "non-open".

Because Milo was busy with This Is Us? In all seriousness, the weird guest list at the gazebo completely took me out of that scene. Michel and Lane, instead of Sookie and Jess? (Or April, as annoying as she is?) It was so obviously for actor availability reasons. They should have just had Luke, Lorelei, and Rory.

I absolutely read it that way. Maybe not full-on in love, but definitely I think they were both wanting a real relationship with each other. I think Rory was doing such a great job convincing Logan (and herself) that all she wanted was a Vegas agreement that Logan thought she wouldn't be open to anything more. (And he was probably gunshy after having his earlier proposal rejected.) On the opposite side, I think Rory is so used to the confident Logan who goes after what he wants that she assumed he'd fight for her. Since they seemed to be revisiting so many old themes, I kept expecting an "I can't do casual, I'm a boyfriend-girl" type of declaration from one of them, that would trigger the same kind of "okay, I'll do it" reply from the other. I really enjoyed the revival overall, even though I have nitpicks, but I really HATED what they did to Logan. Not even the cheating so much - since we never saw Odette, I can fanwank that it was a relationship born of convenience and maybe she doesn't care - but it really bothers me that they had Logan back working for his dad again and drinking on the family dime like the end of Season 7 never happened. He was a smart guy, and by all accounts when he was in London before he was a (perhaps surprisingly) hard worker. In my mind, he had gone of to San Francisco and become successful in his own right. Disappointing.

I was irritated about the musical because it took way too much (of our very limited) time away from the characters I love, but... I would totally pay to watch the entire show of Stars Hollow: The Musical starring Sutton Foster and Christian Borle. What a hoot! I bet the two of them had a blast.

All. The. Feels. I'll have to watch again to form cohesive thoughts, but this just made me so, so happy.

I think it's partly due to Rebecca still being alive in the current timeline. It's more dramatic to play these stories with her, because she's there. For example, if Randall found out that Jack knew... it's still dramatic, but it's a different kind of drama. If you want to write a big, ugly, current-day dinner confrontation, it has to be with Rebecca.

I don't claim to be a dance expert, but I know what I like. James was just so entertaining to watch, even though I certainly don't think he was perfect. The way I think about it - if I were given an opportunity to watch the three final couples perform in different locations on the same night, there would be no contest. That said, I like Laurie, too - I watched this show for the first time ever to see her - so I wouldn't say I'm disappointed at the outcome. I do think she had an advantage coming in because of her training, but where do you stop with that kind of reasoning? So no figure skaters or gymnasts... what about musicians? Or actors? The argument could be made that they both come to the show with skills (emoting, performing on stage) that others lack. In the end, I thought all three were deserving finalists, and as a first-time DWTS viewer, they set a really high bar for next season.

ENOUGH. I just had to hide a bunch of posts. The original comment was made, someone responded in civil way, and now I'm asking everyone to let it go. In future, if someone makes a comment that you think crosses the line, report it. If you find yourself arguing the same point back and forth with the same person, change your focus. Weight is a very sensitive topic for some people. There are many people reading our comments who live life at every size. Let's remember that and use some sensitivity.

Who was making fun of his name? I missed it. Gary Stu. I see your point about Jack being too perfect, but I often wonder if we're really seeing objective reality. Or are we viewing events through the eyes of the Pearsons? Since Jack is dead, I can see why they'd remember only the best things about him. (I had the same thought at Randall's daughter's play, when nobody else seemed to see what he - and we - were seeing.)

I sure thought so. But given his exchange with the secretary in the last episode, maybe he had an ugly divorce and his kids chose sides. I found it strange that he would even WANT to wear the hat. He wasn't there! Regarding the Jack/Rebecca/Miguel timeline, Kevin told Olivia that his mom married his "dead dad's best friend". I took from that that Jack was already dead before they got together?

Wow, that scene with Kate and Toby was amazing. You go, Kate! Now, move to New York so you can interact with your brothers. After everything last week, it was nice to see young Kevin and Randall chasing and playing. And adult Randall jumping on Kevin in bed and slapping his ass. lol I'm hoping that it doesn't cause problems between Randall and Beth when he finds out she knew about Rebecca before him. Not that she was hiding it, but people aren't always rational when they're hurting. I don't understand why the show is trying to make Kevin and Olivia happen. I don't mind them dating, but why make it a serious thing? "Adore" her? He barely knows her. Whatever.

Guys, this is a great discussion, but we're getting a little far afield here into "general weight loss" territory. Let's try to bring it back to unpopular opinions about the show, please. :-)

Thanks, @PBGamer89. It's too bad that they don't try to keep it more even. I mean, it just opens the celebs and their partners up to criticism, which isn't really fair if they don't get any say. (I thought the Latin we did see James do was fine, and maybe would have improved further - his other dances did - but we'll never know.) But it's also not entirely fair if everyone doesn't have to perform the same types of dances. :-/

Why is Erin's dress trying to shove her breasts down to her waist? She's gorgeous, but that dress was doing her no favors. I really didn't like her from watching her do her "day job", but seeing her hosting here has given me a vastly different impression of her. How do they pick these "redemption" dances? Seemed like some odd choices, like Calvin's which was the highest scoring dance on the original night. I'm a first-time viewer this season, drawn in because I freaking ADORED Laurie Hernandez during the Olympics, but honestly James stole my allegiance in week one and never let go. Calvin is just delightful, too, so I'd be happy with any of them winning. My thoughts, fully admitting that I know NOTHING about dance, and my comments are just about what I personally like: Calvin is such a beautiful spirit. I don't think his dancing is on par with Laurie or James, but I love watching him. I'd give him an extra point for his smile alone. I'm not sure I think that Lindsey was the best partner for him - I find them a little bland. But their waltz was nice, and I LOVED their freestyle! So much fun. The conveyor belt work reminded me of the choreography from Kinky Boots that I was lucky enough to see on Broadway last year. That was really cool. I was glad that Calvin got a chance to dance without Lindsey, since so much of the time it seems like she's kind of dancing around him, if that makes sense. The toss was great. And how cute is his little boy? Beautiful smile like his dad. I was so tired of Jana's neediness, and I'm happy she's gone. It wasn't a good look for her when she was being so abrupt with the fill-in guy. Both of her performances were kind of boring, but I will say that Jana does make beautiful lines. But she and Gleb just rub me the wrong way. They remind me of that teenage couple who has no friends but each other, and spend all their time hiding under the bleachers, stroking each other's hair and talking about how "no one else understands us" and "it's us against the world!" Shallow note - I really wish they had put her hair up. It was always just flying around looking all stringy. I actually liked Jana's freestyle, but it was just too similar in tone to everything else she's done this season. Angst, angst, and more angst. It's exhausting. Like I said, I came into this assuming Laurie would be my favorite, but her dances just haven't been that interesting to me. I did really like both her dances tonight, though. Her paso was my favorite of hers all season. She has a "punch" to her movements that I think works better for that style than for the more "graceful" dances. I think she's somewhat handicapped, too, by her body type (short and super muscular). I think it makes it harder to make pretty lines. I just could eat her up, though, and Val has managed to not be creepy with her, which is quite a feat. I do wish they wouldn't cast teenagers because I think it's so limiting to the type of dances they can do. Gratuitous slo-mo notwithstanding, her freestyle was really fun. I loved the little moment when everyone else froze and she just went crazy dancing to the "everyone else won't see me dancing" lyric. I love James so much, and I'm neither Canadian nor a racing fan. I'd never heard of the guy before DWTS. But I just love how he inhabits all the characters that Sharna creates, and I think they have a great partnership. Again, I don't claim to be a dance expert, but James's performances are just so watchable. I go back to them again and again. (Admittedly, I'm a musical theater fan, so I gravitate toward those "acting" performances.) That said, I wasn't wowed by their redemption dance. Sharna's skirt was making me crazy before it tripped her up - too long, too heavy, it just made it hard to see her movements. That freestyle, though! Wowza. Normally, I hate, hate, HATE the contemporary-style dances. They just always seem so pretentious, and I think barefoot dancing looks so weird. But that was AMAZING. (And James has "earned" the right to do an angsty dance by doing so many different themes over the season, unlike Jana.) Everything just worked together so well. I agree with some that the voice over was too much, but they didn't need it, IMO. I thought the crash sound effects, along with the lighting and costuming, told the story. There's a little moment where Sharna lifts James that was so cool in the context of the "guardian angel" story. I totally agree with Bruno that it was "visual poetry." I got the feeling the judges wished they could give him 11s. I go to various marching band field show competitions, and James's freestyle reminded me of some of the performances I've seen at those. There will be schools that do these terrific, wonderful performances to fun themes that just make you smile. And then a band comes in and does a huge, high-concept production, and it's so loud and dynamic, with a million moving pieces and great costuming, and they tell like, and entire story of the French Revolution in 15 minutes. And you're not sure if you liked it, or even fully understood it, but you're just blown away. It's art, not entertainment. UCG moment - James has seen his wreck a thousand times? I've seen it a thousand times on this show. lol Question from a new viewer - who decides which celebs do which styles? Because I see this complaint lodged against James a lot - and I get it - but I'm just curious if that's a deliberate decision by Sharna or whomever? It just seems weird that they wouldn't spread it around a little if it's the producers' decision.