Churchhoney

If the cows had been keeping a close eye on the neighborhood, as Jim Bob told them to, they should at least have learned by now how to build a shed or something. Stupid lazy cows.

Of course this does appear to be a transcript of a taped interview. And transcripts of taped interviews do tend to sound pretty eight-year-oldish, no matter who's being interviewed, compared to written language. And this is a college publication, so I doubt that much cleaning up in the interest of making him sound smarter was done. So I think we need to let him off the hook a bit about that part. Plus, of course, a transcribed taped interview doesn't tell you anything about when the person was smiling or saying something somewhat tongue in cheek.

Back on the subject of Derick, I'm wondering whether he was not, in fact, working under IMB auspices in Nepal after all, in their Journeyman program. ... I've looked around on their website, and the question of appropriate visas really doesn't come up (suspiciously so, in my opinion). And it seems pretty clear that they would not try to get actual church vocation or other work visas for the people in this program, since they probably have enough trouble getting those for the full-fledged missionaries; Seems to me that a lot of what they do say about this program fits very well with what Derick said he was doing. There are two or three kinds of work he might have been doing, and I think you could do any of them with a study visa -- either obtained because you're attending a Nepal school pretty much full time or because you're attending one of the part-time Nepalese school options, which I read elsewhere is what a lot of people do while they are also doing other things there, such as trekking or working part-time or as a volunteer with an NGO. He might have done either one or some combination of these, I think, from his descriptions of his activities. This first one seems to pretty much amount to "socializing with Nepali students": "University Ministry As a part of the university team, you will seek to use all the resources that God has put at your disposal to engage your campus with the gospel in such a way as to result in transformed lives that will lead to a transformed society." The next one would fit with his accountancy degree and also would fit the way he describes his Nepal work on his LinkedIn: "Support Roles Eighty percent of your time will utilize your giftedness and expertise to do financial and logistical tasks that free the rest of the Strategy missionary force to evangelize/disciple/train with 100 percent of their time. Support Role missionaries will spend at least 20 percent of their time Evangelizing/Disciplining/Training new believers to see a multitude from every language, tribe, people and nation have opportunity to know and worship our Lord Jesus Christ. All field personnel, whether they spend the majority of their time in support related service or evangelism and church planting ministries, are important, are needed, and are missionaries" This one looks pretty purely social in nature, and also might fit what Derick described: "Discipler/Trainer You will initiate a strategy of sharing the Gospel with those who have never heard, using a variety of methodologies appropriate for the specific people group, i.e. Chronological Bible Storying. Your primary task is to find people who are open and receptive to the Gospel, and stay with them, leading them to place their faith in Christ. You will teach them from the very beginning to share Jesus with their family and friends, guiding them in how to share and how to pray for others." Furthermore, I think that IMB basically acknowledges that in at least some countries they flat out bring in these Journeyman people on the downlow, because the countries are reluctant to allow it but IMB views their conversion activities as an absolutely essential part of their Christian calling. It's called "Creative Access." And it might well account for why Derick does not mention his Nepal employer or give many details of his work on his LInkedIn. ... That might well be the IMB-suggested behavior for a Journeyman who's been in certain countries under the "creative access" approach, I expect. And from what I've read elsewhere about Nepali visas, lots of groups do have workers in the country without work visas: In other words, IMB brings in Journeyman under all kinds of guises when they're really there to act as missionaries: "Creative Access Creative Access helps you enter a culture that is closed to outsiders’ attempts to directly bring the Gospel to its people or is legally hesitant to allow an outsider to take up residence. Creative Access helps you get your foot in the door. Examples would be ESL training, sports, community development, business opportunities, etc." http://www.imbstudents.org/programs/jman/Go_Journeyman.aspx#.VhaSsiuW4o1 All of this makes me pretty sure Derick was in Nepal working under IMB auspices, but that he was basically one of their stealth workers. To be non-stealth, he would need to enter the full-fledged missionary track. But he would need additional college coursework to do that. And, once he hooked up with Jill, he certainly found that she'd need a ton more academic work, too. So whether or not he and Jill would have been found acceptable to IMB on other grounds, they both had quite a road ahead of them to get the academic qualifications. I don't think he was actively lying about his Nepal work. I think IMB instructed him to keep it quiet. As you would do if you were using "creative access." That just shows how extremely seriously the Baptists take their conversion mission, I think.

Plus ... you can't just leave cows. Somebody very knowledgeable, extremely responsible and willing to do hard work has to be there for most of every single day to keep things going. .... And that leaves out the vast majority of the Duggars. Jana and JD are probably responsible enough to do it, but first they would have to learn all about it -- and they don't have time because they're already doing everything else.

No no! It's yet another magnificent paradox of Duggar Christianity! God's ways are unknowable. And yet Ben -- king of the unknowing -- can totes explain them to you! We call it Hypostupid!

Lovely! I was wondering whether the Seewalds might be Old Earth Creationists rather than Young Earthers. (although I know that Ben's a Young Earther since joining the Duggs, but I thought that might be their influence...) I find here, though, that Vision Forum -- which is the main cult I've heard mentioned as a Seewald influence?? -- was a Young Earther establishment as well, apparently. Here's Wartburg Watch on the subject, at any rate -- http://thewartburgwatch.com/2010/10/18/birds-of-a-feather-flock-together-in-the-young-earth-crowd/ "In 2009 Ken Ham was among the keynote speakers at the “Sufficiency of Scripture” conference held by the National Center for Family Integrated Churches (NCFIC). Others speaking at the conference were: Doug Phillips, Voddie Baucham, Joe Morecraft, Kevin Swanson, Paul Washer, and Scott Brown. Some of the workshop speakers were: Geoffrey Botkin (whose daughters wrote So Much More (see our post), William Einwechter (whose writings are sometimes featured on the Vision Forum website), and Andy Davis, who serves as Senior Pastor of First Baptist Church in Durham, NC and is a council member of the Gospel Coalition. It’s important to note that Scott Brown heads up NCFIC and is a close friend of Doug Phillips."

Seriously. The things that can go wrong with cows (and the milk, if you're doing the milk) are legion. So many health things to keep an eye on and preventive things to do. Running a dairy or beef farm is not for the casual hobbyist. I wonder how long they watched a farmer before they decided to do this? 25 minutes?

And it's creeping closer and closer to Jessa's due date. If Jill is going to be involved in that in any way -- and it's hard to believe that she's not, even if only for teevee purposes -- they'll need to hustle to get back to CA and that back to AR in time for that.

In the words of Nelson, Ha Ha.

Yeah, it was just some kind of legal CYA boilerplate, not anything they actually did.

I fear for them. And by "them" of course I mean the cows.

Good post. I don't think you'd be attracted to this very prescriptive, intrusive, paint-by-numbers form of religion unless you were a pretty fearful person in some way. And if you're fearful enough, then the answer is just to shield yourself from everything, I think. I think we actually may see evidence of that kind of thing when we look at all the big religions of the world -- they all seem to break down into various sects, many of which vary a lot in how restrictive and prescriptive they are. And I'd bet that when people actually opt for one or the other they do it on the basis of the needs of their individual personalities. (doesn't hold for those born into one branch of other, of course)

So you think "Ben Ham" should be the successor to the (clearly aging) Ken Ham? .... Don't encourage him!

I don't think the 200 percent thing goes with the Trinity. I think it's the "hypostatic"!!! thing, which as I understand it refers to Christ being fully God and fully man. The paradox there is that he's one single unified being, yet he's also 100 percent human and 100 percent divine -- 200 percent. But still only one being. The Trinity is a similar paradox but not the same -- and I don't think they use the word "hypostatic" for it. In that, God is one, but is also all three beings of the Trinity -- a 100 percent in that case is made up of 100 percent Father, 100 percent Christ, 100 percent Holy Spirit -- 300 percent. But really the whole percentage stuff is just pure nonsense and not really part of theologists' explanations -- just written so Bin can show us that he knows how to write percentages! "Hypostatic" sounds to me like what happens when you turn on a lamp in January and the spark is so big that the other people in the room yell, What the heck was that?. ... Or what happens at one of those kiddie-science museums when you touch the Van de Graaf generator.

Seems like she was kind of holding her nose at first, but the more she thought about having her own house the more he appealed to her, no matter what the color of his beard. Escape into a place with your own bathroom beat out looks snobbery, apparently.

So apparently the Seewalds were okay with fossil hunting and a paleontology ambition -- i.e., they apparently didn't think those were planted by God to lead us astray? ... That sounds like tolerating curiosity about evolution, to me. .... huh. I wonder what he thinks of the Teamsters Union? :-)

Oh, I kind of like that idea. Maybe he and Bin could start a joint website -- Ben and Bin. And they could share a bit of wisdom with us each day. It might end up more popular than The Onion.

I think he just likes typing "hypostatic union." Also -- Is it me or does this not sound much like a "devotional"? ETA: I wonder whether he heard that people were throwing shade on his fitness for seminary studies. And, I mean, he knows about "hypostatic union." So I take it all back. He totally is.....There ya go, Bin.

Regarding Josh, I'd say that we're not sure about anything. Some people feel sure about some things. But there's certainly no consensus on anything. And I get the feeling that even most individuals' views shift fairly often. We think that he's in a center that "treats" addictions through prayer and... um... staying off the streets temporarily or something. But that's about it.

Luckily for those possible suitors, though, by now they've probably had enough access to media to realize that, if they bought in, not only would they end up with possibly the world's worst parents-in-law but also would end up on the hook for future support of at least some of the parents-in-law's umpty-ump uneducated, nonworking children. Sometimes media is not your friend, Jim Bob!

I don't think he has either the balls or the brains to go rogue. I think he's basically just a weak little fearful incompetent boy -- just as JB always wanted him to be. But stupid JB didn't reckon with what happens when grown men you've molded into weak little fearful incompetent boys get the very understandable desire to be big men. And then screw up mightily in big-man-similar ways while remaining weak little fearful incompetent boys. I don't know that anybody on earth would have a good answer for what the hell you do then.

Exactly. When you unwittingly fall in with a gifted con man like JB, then all bets are off about how you'll respond. It's like being unexpectedly thrown into mile-deep water wearing a tuxedo. You're confused as hell and just trying to keep your head above water. Jim Bob has thoroughly thoroughly conned his kids, so we know he's good at it. I think he's one of those people who doesn't have much of a brain, but who puts 100 percent of that brain to work trying to manipulate others. I had those in my family, and he seems quite familiar to me. Looks like an idiot in most of the ways in which we normally judge intelligence, but he can manipulate you into the most incredible things and tie your reason in knots in seconds. Also utterly ruthless.... And he never stops doing it.

My guess is that as a young kid he might have dreamed of being either a missionary or a cop (or, being a young kid, dreamed of being both: The Adventures of Missionary Agent! -- it could be a tv show). And then after his dad died the law-enforcement idea might have strengthened for a while as he thought about him and what he might do in his life to kind of memorialize him, make him proud. And then maybe he either applied to the FBI and didn't make it, or started thinking about the job in more detail and realized that maybe Pistol Pete's gun was about his speed, when it came to being a tough guy. (That might be some of what he was sorting through in the famous "missing year' between college and Nepal.) And then when the agent dream died, the old missionary dream resurfaced. Of course, that's a tough road, too -- especially when you've already graduated from college but don't have any of the coursework you'll need to actually work under the mission board's auspices -- and might have disheartened him a bit. And maybe he was a bit of a leghumper, so he reached out to the Duggars -- with their hearts for mission and all -- thinking that maybe they could help him along somehow (after all, they live close by to where he and his family lived). And Jim Bob smelled a person who'd let JB and M push him around, pushed a daughter or two out there for inspection. (Maybe JB even dangled in front of Derick the idea that he was hooked up with some "missionaries" who might be able to help him get on track.) And, voila, Derick became a Duggar. And -- as I explained ad nauseam elsewhere -- I don't think Derick is a particularly strong or confident person. So, once he was subsumed into the Duggars, he really got subsumed into the Duggars. That's my non-fan-but-nevertheless-obsessive fictionalization of events, anyway. Speaks of how difficult it actually is to be an idealist -- and then try to live in keeping with your ideals, I expect.

Totally agree. ... I'm also not sure what's wrong with sounding idealistic. I still do, I think. And I actually believe it's one of my better qualities. Even at my advanced age!

Me neither.