EarlGreyTea

I thought this when the Duggar clan barged in to hang that sign and leave the cookies. Maybe it's because I'm an only child and used to boundaries, but I would absolutely hate it if a bunch of my in-laws came to my home when I wasn't there. It didn't even look like they were gracious enough to leave a casserole in the freezer (oh, I forgot, it's the Duggars. That they didn't leave a Stouffer's frozen lasagna, more like). As a side note, aren't these people tired of their lives? Someone has a baby, they make a sign. Rinse and repeat. I kept wondering why Jill's martyred ass didn't chime in with her own birth stories, then remembered she and her bigoted husband were kicked off the show and felt better.

I actually think it looks light-years younger than any of Michelle's previous wedding garb, and certainly better than the aluminum foil getup she wore to Jill's wedding. I'm actually rather impressed she tried a nice pattern for once. I think the angle for the photo was completely awful - makes her look like she has no neck. The overall look seems to be vaguely 1970s with those long sleeves, which I do like. However, I think it would have looked better with shorter sleeves considering Michelle's figure. She's busty and short and sometimes clothing on bustier, short women can make them look like a teapot.* *I am one of those people.

I take back my previous assessment of the dress. I really like it, and those sleeves look better when the dress is seen as a whole. I like how it fits her, too - she has a great figure and it looks demure enough for a fundie bride. Perhaps she didn't want it overly form-fitting, and even Meghan Markle, with all the money in the world to get a tailored dress, wore hers a little loose and was critiqued for it. I can't forgive Lauren's hair, though. A lovely swept up style would have done wonders and made the overall look more classic.

I love strawberries and homemade cake as much as the next person, and many times the professionally made ones don't taste as good as they look - but damn. Those cupcakes look terrible! I'm hoping it's a bad photo, and if the person who made them is a "professional," shame on them. Have they never heard of continuity? Having said that, I'd try one. I'm sure they taste good. But in this Instagram day and age, especially with how obsessed these losers are with appearances, this was a huge miss.

Misread this as Jana and Anna made the wedding dress and I thought "makes sense." The top reminds me of Anna's (ugly, IMO) plain wedding dress, particularly the t-shirt shape. The overall effect reminds me of Meghan Markle's wedding dress, but at least she had the tiara to go with it, plus the veil...and the fact that she's Meghan Markle. The bouquet is gorgeous.

Well turn me upside down and paint me blue. JD got himself a girl who is close to his own age with a legit career outside the home? Move over Jinger, JD is now the one worthy of the Free moniker. I’m legitimately impressed. Of course, I was impressed by Derick in the beginning and we all know how that went. I’ll go with cautiously optimistic.

I am usually averse to absolutely anything Marvel-related, but the reviews on this show made me interested enough to watch. I liked that Greg, Tandy's mom's bf, seemed to have had good intentions. It was kind of hinted at earlier but I was glad it was confirmed with her seeing his hopes. Having him married added an interesting shade of gray. Also, he reminded me of Dean Winters, which is never a bad thing. So when he got shot I was legitimately surprised and bummed. I liked Tandy having someone in her corner. Also, what kind of assassin shoots someone with the blinds wide open? The casting director has knocked it of the park with casting of the smaller roles. Greg's death broke my heart and there are no words for how great Billy has been. His role in particular is so vital to understanding Tyrone and his family dynamic, and the actor playing Billy came off as so earnest and youthful, that it was nothing short of devastating seeing him killed in the pilot. Finally we can see some of the chemistry between Tandy and Tyrone that the critics have raved so much about. I actually thought they worked better as friends than romantic partners, but when they approached each other to touch again, I saw real sparks. The shot of them laying next to one another was gorgeous. I love that she is the street-wise one and he is the naive one; it's such a common romantic trope, but you rarely see it with the genders reversed. I love how her remark about their powers being a release "like sex, you know?" hung there awkwardly with so much unsaid from Tyrone. I'm also glad we're finally seeing more of the New Orleans flavor. It's such a unique city and I'm so tired of constantly seeing shows set in New York.

The rest of season two can pack up and go home, because none of them will approach Mama Tammye’s episode. It was as genuinely moving as AJ’s last season. Tammye comforting Bobby after hearing his story was some of the most moving stuff I’ve ever seen on TV. Not a single false note in the episode. I wish all Christians could be like Tammye, because the world would be a better place. I will always love the original Fab 5, but they never moved me like these do.

Brown does great work with his eyes in this episode. In the seconds before Willow's vow, you could see him searching Willow's face and it was crazy - you could see both doubt and certainty in his expression. Then when Willow said "I do," you could see both triumph and a hint of smugness in his eyes. Triumph because he won her over, with Simon's warning in mind, and a bit of smugness that he got the girl in the end over the machinations of his crappy family (no way do I buy that he had no inkling of what was afoot). It's great stuff. Genevieve had less to work with, since her character doesn't have as many layers. You could see uncertainty in her expression throughout the whole episode, right up until she said her vow - then it was like the sun came out and she fulfilled that dream of hers she mentioned at the beginning of the season - her happy ending. The rest of the royal family needs to work on their poker faces, though. A blind man could see their obvious discomfort/anger/apprehension at what is supposedly the wedding of their beloved king. Morons. What I'd give to know what the writers originally had planned for this season, because someone, somewhere along the way, realized they should give Brown something to work with and not to work him into a corner. Good riddance to Mark Schwahn, of course. Finally, I would like to link to Moseley's explanation of the finale. Great stuff in here, the most interesting being that Kathryn's pregnancy was in the works since last season. I recall someone here seeing the chalkboard in the background of her apartment hinting at it, so kudos to that poster. Unfortunately, he also adds: He also adds, to my delight: Love. It. This was exactly what I'd hoped for. Go to the dark side, Willow - Robert's got all the power there.

Crossed my mind that Willow was playing them all the second that tiresome Dominique connection was mentioned. I thought there was a good chance she was playing them all when I heard that, or at least Helena. But the show usually tips its hand early. Willow being in it alone - I don't think so. The show is not good with subtlety. There would have been a hint of it already. Of course, I have been wrong about a LOT that's happened, so who knows. I am re-watching and getting even more annoyed with Eleanor and Jasper. Stealing her letter was wrong, and so was stealing her words, but Eleanor's acting like he murdered Jasper. Burning his photos, really? For chrissakes, she's buddying up with Cyrus! It's utterly ridiculous how Robert is never, ever cut slack from this family. I'm starting to think they all wish he was still dead. It's no wonder he's clinging to Willow as his light. The only ones I buy as loving Robert are Simon and Helena. Helena's motives I can at least buy as being rooted in love. I would like to reiterate how much I loved the pissed off looks on everyone's faces as Willow outfoxed all of them. Whatever Robert said, I'd love to know what it was. p.s. I just remembered Jasper and Eleanor had that security guard, what's his name, write a bunch of their letters for them! The audacity of those assholes!

The guy who climbed into the car with Kathryn is from a few seasons ago. I think he had Helena's lover murdered (which was later retconned if I recall right). He was basically a royal enforcer and possibly had something to do with security or the government, I forget. Anyway, based on that, it sure seems like an attempt to bump Kathryn off by someone. I thought the car was going to explode or something. Jasper and Eleanor have gotten too holier-than-thou for my taste. Eleanor's line about how it was too bad that all these decorations aren't for people in love was bullshit. Apparently the only love story she can buy into is her own, and I can't stress enough how gross it was and how incredibly sketchy her consent was. I enjoyed their pissed off faces when their plan fell on its ass. I was absolutely sure that Robert was going to get shot. I couldn't even fully enjoy them saying their vows because I was sure it was going to happen, because everything in the wedding was going so perfectly. I guess we're going to handwave the plagiarism of Eleanor's letters? I'm totally willing to do that.

Agreed that if this is the end, I can accept it. Willow and Robert married, with him seemingly softening because of her. Kathryn hopefully disappearing forever and Liam ending up with nothing. Cyrus and Violet reuniting. Eleanor and Jasper can go off into the sunset being holier-than-thou forever. And the entire gang falling flat on their faces when their big plan is foiled by Willow. I don't want to find out next season that her marrying him was a part of a bigger plan on her part. If there is more of that next season, no thanks. I really am frustrated that we did not see the Robert/Willow scenes you mentioned. I'm betting the one right before the wedding will be shown next season, but the one at the beginning - yeah. They need to start filling in the damn gaps. That ending sequence was one of the best of the series. Totally tense, hilariously inappropriate song playing, and the vows being said over Kathryn running away/Cyrus seeing Violet. Great stuff.

Wow, WHAT was that? Bombshell after bombshell! One of the best episodes of the series. And Robert and Willow live! It's clear he genuinely cares for her and that's what I wanted from this pairing - Robert's devotion in spite of himself. I loved how Simon, in the fantasy sequence, called her his light and told Robert not to diminish her light with his darkness. Of course, all this means I will not be able to wash my hands of this show. I want to know what is next for Robert and Willow. He isn't as one-note as had feared he would be. Now I NEED another season! They certainly pulled off the mother of all retcons with Robert, though. He was practically a mustache-twirling villain last season, and somewhere along the way they pivoted. I bet the conversation Robert and Willow had right before the wedding will be the crux of everything. It will reveal motivations, it will reveal both of their intentions, it will show whether he truly brings her into the fold as his partner. So I really hope they show us that scene next season. Again in this episode, Brown gave Robert so many layers, and for once the writing seemed to support those layers. There were moments of genuine regret in many of his expressions, and in his scenes with Willow, Brown certainly seemed to suggest real affection for her. I liked that there IS real regret on Robert's part, although every single character on the show thinks the worst of him. If we get a next season perhaps that will be explored. King Simon showing up was finally a chance for Brown to play off a good actor. That scene was riveting and it was rather devastating to see Robert clearly wanting his father's approval. Kathryn pregnant and in danger - guessing that will be the heart of next season's storylines, though I can't bring myself to care. That certainly did look like a legit royal wedding, so kudos to the location scouts, set designers, and costume designers. And Willow's tiara looked legit too. I really cannot say enough about much Max and Genevieve look the part. Both of them looked amazing in their wedding clothes. Genevieve was simply radiant. I have nothing nice to say about any of the other character's clothes, though. One of my favorite things about the show was always the sibling dynamic. It's natural that the twins would stick together, but the death of the relationship between Robert and Eleanor feels like a huge loss to me. I love Eleanor with both her siblings, and her genuine grief over Robert in the beginning of the series was moving and an actual catalyst for her to do some growing up. To see that gone is disappointing in a whole sea of disappointing moments of this show. See you all next season, I hope. The show certainly seems to think it deserves one, based on that rather cliffhanger-y ending. @emjohnson03, @paisley, @catrice2, @Kaiju Ballet, @phoenics, @Rachel RSL, and everyone else who posts here in this subforum, I loved all your posts and hope to see you all next season. Long live King Robert and Queen Willow. P.S. It took me 4 seasons to realize all these episode titles are actually lines from Shakespeare plays.

After I've had some time to digest and read everyone's great posts, I've become even more peeved that I allowed myself to get invested in Robert and Willow when I knew as far back as last season that this show won't let Robert have anything good or, from the looks of it, get out of the show with a single redeeming quality. My one last shred of hope was that if Robert had to become a villain, his feelings for Willow were at least genuine. If I'm right about him plagiarizing Eleanor's love letters, that hope was blown out of the water. I really don't think they will be going for ANY nuance with Robert. It will be full on, mustache-twirling villain with no redeeming qualities and, mark my words, he will probably end up terrorizing poor Willow. Any nuance we saw was on the part of Max Brown, and Max Brown only. The only thing that can salvage this dumpster fire is if Willow is on it with Robert. That would be so entirely badass and a genuine twist. But we know she's most likely not. She's going to be the damsel for everyone else (likely Liam) to rescue. At least I enjoyed it while it all lasted and I really enjoy reading everyone's posts here. You all will be the only reason I come back next season. I love your posts, as always. Agreed that all the other main characters have murky backstories and a list of crimes to rival Robert's. Yet he's the one that's going down? It would be less infuriating if, as I stated above, his feelings for Willow were genuine. Then, between that and Max Brown's acting, he could be redeemed. Anyone who doubts that should look to Jasper for how the show can redeem a character if it really wants to. Jasper DRUGGED Eleanor, yet everyone is pointing the finger at Robert? Naw son. I bet Brown LOVES playing this role, though. He's given the character a lot more layers and it's probably fun to play a tyrant. I'd love some angst if we get a S5. Now that would be worth sticking around for, if the show was truly invested in it. The writers do angst well. I admit to really loving Jasper and Eleanor's angst in the early seasons, especially because they pretty much carried the show. What is the chatter about Willow and Robert on tumblr? Is it positive? What about for Max Brown? It was kind of murky, but apparently Sebastian told Robert offscreen about Eleanor. I'm not completely buying it, as it was kind of hastily explained, we never saw a scene of Robert's reaction to it, and Jasper looked mighty guilty when Eleanor told him about it later. I still think Jasper is the real whistleblower. Sebastian was one of the most decent characters on the show and didn't deserve that unceremonious trip to OffscreenLand. As for Robert, death or jail will be the only thing left for him to do. If he's murdered, I am SO out.

Willow/Robert fans, this was a great episode for them, until the very end; now I can confidently state that the wheels are coming off. And this episode finally answered the question of why we never saw Willow saying yes to Robert's proposal: because we saw it in tonight's episode as he proposed again. I'm pretty sure that at the end of this episode, Willow was quoting Eleanor's love letters to Jasper (the ones that Robert read last season, if you recall), meaning that Robert meant none of it and was saying only what he needed to in order to get Willow back on his side. "I need you to be the kinder side of us." If that doesn't sum up the appeal of Robert and Willow, I don't know what does! Robert was completely right about the queen needing to be apolitical. In the real world British monarchy, that's how it works. But in the universe of the show, I can see how it cuts Willow off at the knees. I loved how he relented and told her to say whatever she wants to the press and to give their gifts away as she wished. Calling it now, Jasper probably blew the whistle on Eleanor's Robin Hood antics. Which will probably set off Breakup No. 1,0001. Where are they going with this Robin Hood storyline? It was cute for an episode and all, but it better be a precursor to some bigger plot to justify this much screen time. What a sad way to end the Sebastian storyline. I hope Helena was wrong. Besides being super attractive, he was a viable love interest for Helena and one of the only characters on this show with no ulterior motives. I really can't buy that Robert is so easily taken in by Liam, and that the latter is such a successful con man. I suppose his plan feeds into Robert's belief that no one is as clever as he is, so Liam having his number in that sense is believable. Cyrus is at least amusing to watch, if we're stuck with this Liam as avenger storyline. Where does Liam get off pairing up with CYRUS, of all people, and still trying to claim the moral high ground? Having said that, the affection between the two is nice to watch. I CAN buy that Helena has Robert's number. Now that is believable, consistent with her character, and more interesting than a sibling pissing match. Mothers usually know what they have in their children, and Robert has always been Helena's favorite. I'm interested to see what Hurley can do if/when Helena is faced with a murderer for a beloved child. I did enjoy the look on Robert's face as he eavesdropped on Cyrus and Liam. He was listening closely, alert as ever, but you could see a shade of hurt on his face. It was a nice touch by Brown, and again, was probably more layers than the character deserves.

I feel like I'm in the minority, but I don't like Mateo/Cheyenne as much as I like them with straight men characters to bounce off (like Amy). IMO, their antics are funnier when played off more normal characters. Mateo/Jonah and Amy/Cheyenne are much funnier pairings to me. But it may be that the Cheyenne character in general doesn't work for me as much as the others do.

That final scene - there is not enough cringe in the entire world. It seems like an even bigger cliffhanger than last season! And to be honest, it seems like yet another jump the shark moment. So they had one last chance to make this pregnancy go the way of the dodo but....apparently not. I had more faith in this show. This show really has come to rely on the strength of the supporting characters to pull it through. That, and it completely nails corporate and retail culture. The main plot about Myrtle and ageism was spot on and I loved how the gang pulled it off. Snarky Kelly is my new favorite Kelly. Hope they keep her around. I really think they missed the ball by not casting her as snarky and jaded from the get-go. Really happy Myrtle was dealt with. It was depressing to think the actress was out of a job when she had such a small role in the first place and didn't appear to be retiring IRL. I hope they do bring her back. And I love Jeff, but that was prime douchebag behavior out of a character who is normally decent and kind. "That's why you never trust a Jeff." He looked great in that suit, though."Is that from our Benedict Arnold collection?" Glenn being nervous and fucking up is really getting old. It's been a plotline in at least two other episodes. This episode was really heavy on Amy and Jonah, which is understandable, but I would have liked to seen more of the supporting characters, especially in the finale. This whole episode felt weird in that so many loose threads were left hanging.

With the departure of the showrunner, Mark Schwahn (good riddance), earlier this year and the fact that I don't think the show is exactly a ratings winner - cancellation has been a possibility every season. Having said that, I think it has done fairly steadily to get 4 seasons, so maybe they'll keep it on for one more season for syndication purposes.

Filming wrapped around September, per Max Brown's Instagram. I remember feeling salty that we didn't get our normal December return date. I loved watching it around the holidays. Speaking of Brown, @emjohnson03 mentioning that Brown loved episodes 9 and 10 must mean he goes full mustache-twirling villain. That's fun for an actor to play, I imagine. He's kind of slumming it on this show, but he's a real character actor and his wife just had another kid, so I imagine this is fun for him. I am not phoenics, but I, too, watched Sleepy Hollow, which I pretend ended after the first season.

Yeah, one-note villains are dull unless they're pure comedic relief, like Cyrus. I love that Robert has layers, but what I'm worried about is that the entire thing with Willow is just part of his plan and that he hasn't caught feelings. I'm not interested in a S5 if that's where they're going with this, which I increasingly fear is what will happen. And even if he HAS caught feelings, Willow is such a decent person that I cannot see her compromising her values to stay with him. Agreed. I can already call what's going to happen: Robert turning full villain, possibly threatening Willow, before tossed into the slammer and/or killed off. Liam being king. End of show. This is why while Robert is entertaining, I love him so much as a character that I don't want him thrown aside for the likes of Liam. I really wish they HAD brought him on sooner, because the show was floundering for a long time before he returned. If there has to be conflict, I'd rather it just be normal brotherly conflict, not murder, for chrissakes. I really think the writers have no idea if they want us to invest in Robert and Willow. On the one hand, they give us sweet scenes of Robert giving her that jewelry box. On the other, they don't show us saying yes to his proposal. They skip some pivotal romantic scenes, then pull back and give us others. It's odd.

Wow, I didn't even consider that Willow may be in cahoots with Liam and Cyrus. I think sleeping with Robert and opening up her private life to the media may be going a bit too far for a long con, but with this show? I wouldn't be surprised. If she has to be in on any plan, I want it to be Robert's, although it would be wildly inconsistent with what we've seen of her character, which is essentially goodhearted. I'm a bit salty I didn't see the Kathryn reveal coming. I watch a ton of horror films, and things like that are Suspense 101. I did see Liam and Cyrus coming, though, which was a bit less obvious. I personally think this episode was the final nail in the coffin for me that there's no going back with Robert. Full-on villain, and with how the promo for next week was, he may end up alone. I was able to lie to myself for the entire season, but it's time to face the music that Liam will win, Robert will end up in jail or dead, and I'm just hoping Willow scrapes out alive.

Willow and Robert fans, be warned: they share exactly one scene together, at the very end. You're welcome. And also the promo for next week doesn't look promising at ALL. I KNEW Cyrus and Liam were in cahoots for a while now, going back several episodes probably. Kathryn too (okay, fine, I wasn't as sure about her as I was about Cyrus). She actually became interesting this episode. Unfortunately, according to the promo, this spells the end of the fun times us Robert fans have had. It's been a pleasure enjoying this show with all of you. As Scar would say, be prepared. The end is nigh. Very much a filler episode, which I feel we've not had in a while. But Robert looked great in that suit and his hair slightly tousled. I love that Eleanor, Helena, and Willow are friendly. This show is very lacking in female friendships since Ophelia left. I like that Eleanor's drug expertise came in handy. She was so tender with Willow. And Genevieve Gaunt got to stretch her comedic wings. The dog fakeout killed me. And it was funny seeing her in shorts and a T-shirt for once. I loved when she said she wouldn't mind not being queen, but not marrying Robert would devastate her. And that what he thought of her meant more to her than anyone else's opinion. If only I felt like their pairing was on more solid ground. The soil loophole of Cyrus' was hysterical. The Robert with the pool game with Jasper: I'm really tired of their constant pissing match. Jasper is such a self-righteous prick for someone who legit drugged and conned his so-called love. The only person I accept as a true rival for Robert is Cyrus, because he so clearly has his number (due to them being two sides of the same coin) and he's hysterical.

Exactly my thoughts. Derick's only true tweet in all this mess was the one where he said "nothing about our family's views have changed." Make absolutely no mistake, they are all as ugly on the inside as he is and always have been, just in a slightly prettier package. And with enough sense to realize their views are highly offensive. Or maybe not sense - just a willingness to hide their true feelings for a buck. Which is consistent with the Duggar doctrine. I'm just glad Derick periodically loses his marbles, so I am reminded to never, ever put Counting On on the DVR. And to make a little donation to the ACLU and/or Planned Parenthood. Because the Lord has laid it on my heart.

Before I watched this episode I swore I'd accept any cockamamie excuse for Amy not being pregnant. I did not get my wish. I won't stop watching the show, but this storyline to me is a fuck-up of epic proportions. Totally unnecessary, makes no sense, feels tacked-on, and doesn't move the characters forward. Amy is now back where she was in season one, and who wants to watch that retread? Is this show hard-up for cash, or is it just a natural fit for endorsements? This season has had Target, Pizza Hut, and whatever that rando car commercial with Dina, Glenn, and Garrett. If it keeps the show on for longer, I'm all for it. Mateo and the 20 dollar bill was super sweet in its own weird way. Carol calling Alex like when she called Adam last season was a fantastic callback! Janet needs more lines. "You are running out of sympathy points, girl." A Dinoglenn production! Holy shit, that was an epic dragging of Amy by Jonah. He nailed the problems I've been having with the Amy character. She DOES act like a martyr, and she IS pretty judgmental without the ability to accept criticism herself. And this is coming from someone who really likes Amy. I was on her side for much of the episode until he finally wanted to talk and she blew him off. He's got her number, all right.

No Sebastian this episode. I don't think it was revealed that Robert put himself on the island, making Liam look the fool. Which - it was TOTALLY telegraphed last season that Robert had put himself there, but that seems to be retconned. The PTSD is gone, which is too bad because it was intriguing last season. Since his return, Robert has taken: 1. Liam's place in the line of succession. Liam's entire raison d'etre since season one was filling Robert's shoes, and it really was an interesting arc, seeing him accept his new role and then - bam. Gone. And Robert wasn't too gracious about it either. 2. Kathryn. Yes, she was Robert's first - another reason for Liam to dislike him. But Liam seemed to see her as his. 3. The support of the people. The #kingliam hashtag was a major plot point last season. Which brings us to: 4. Willow. Liam never gave her the time of day, but I think he secretly liked having her in his back pocket. Her PR smarts singlehandedly made him believe he could be king, and he's lost that, too.