ILoveReading

This is almost the exact same thing they said about Dean is s7. How is Michael boring and dull but yet another grief arc, and lesson for Dean is opening up and sharing his feelings not? (Not directed at you Diane, just a rhetorical question).

We never really got to know Michael. He was little more than a one and done character. He was never fully explored. There was never really a chance to develop more of a personality. Plus, AU Michael is supposed to be totally different character so the writers aren't locked into our world Michael's mentality. There is a lot of room to grow an interesting character. Jensen did it with Dean, who was supposed to be a one note comedic sidekick, so I have to doubt he could do it with Michael too if given the opportunity. Im talking about isolated episodes, not overall.

Dabb said almost the exact same thing word for word last season. How they were going to go for smaller more character driven stories. But then suddenly we had Kelly pregnant with Lucifer's spawn. Not exactly small. This season we have an AU universe, Michael, Lucifer, Lucifer's kid, a set up for a spin off, and multiple characters coming back. Not seeing how this any of this is "smaller stories" I do have some complaints about acting and major ones about characterization. I agree. It sounds like we're just repeating the Apocalypse story from s5. Everything sounds like a rehash of a rehash. Do we really need another round of Sam feels like a freak, Dean is sad and depressed, and Lucifer wants to destroy the world. The apocalypse was a personal story the first time around because of Sam and Dean's connection to Michael and Lucifer. A random Michael and Lucifer is going to lack that emotional connection. So connecting Dean to Michael, even if not small in definition, would give the story that personal touch that been missing. Also I find these writers really struggle when they have to do more than one thing at at time, and this season sounds so busy, I feel like nothing is really going to get the attention it needs.

Michael might be a dick, but in the early season, on paper, so was Dean. Jensen took what he was given and elevated it in a way that surprised so many of TPTB. He has this unique ability to soften bad writing, add layers where there probably shouldn't be any, and completely turn the expected outcome on its head. We've heard many BTS stories to this effect. So no matter how Michael was written on paper, I have no doubt that we'd see a much different character then what writers may have envisioned. So for me "Dick angel" isn't an automatic do not want. Honestly, I wouldn't even care if Michael was a full on bad guy, dick angel because I would just like to see Jensen play something that doesn't involve grief or guilt.

Meaty doesn't always equal playing a good guy. Hannible Lectre was a serial killer and I thought Anthony Hopkins had a lot material to work with. With the Mark they had to be careful not to take things to far. But if Jensen was playing an AU Michael they wouldn't have to worry about the character doing something he couldnt' come back from. I've seen glimpses of Jensen playing a bad guy and it was chilling. I would like to see him play a full on psycho. We really wouldn't lose Dean because Michael and Dean would be two separate people. If Dean was being possessed, I can see him saying yes if its part of a plan. It would be no different then Sam saying yes.

I want to see Jensen play Michael because I'd really like to see him get to stretch those acting muscles. Jensen himself has said that he really likes to challenge himself. He said it was why he liked Regarding Dean because he got to flex his range. He's said multiple times he was disappointed about demon Dean being cut short. I could see him being excited about the prospect of playing Michael. As for Dean being possessed. Every major character has been possessed except Dean. Dean wouldn't be Dean for an episode but that's not really a big deal. After the possession we'd still have Dean the same way we had Cas and Sam. Not to mention, Dean as Michael would be something new. So far this season all we've heard about Dean is that he'll put up walls because Cas is dead. This is literally the exact same thing Dean had in s7. I fully expect this "story" to wrap up in episode 3. As for the AU, its an AU. Just because Michael looked like Jensen/Dean he doesn't necessary have to be John and Mary's son. He could look like Dean for no other reason then Dean is supposed to be Michael's true vessel. Not to mention, Jensen would rock it.

I'm guessing this is the storyline that must be coming back that Jared is excited for. A repeat of the apocalypse storyline but this time having Michael focus on him rather than Lucifer.

This was on Creation's web site. For New Jersey con Rich is directing, but I wonder if Rob is in the episode.

Dean is also the only character who gave Adam a second thought.

I was so disappointed in that the writers just ignored it. I can speak for a lot of my fellow Dean fans when I say they were very disappointed too.

Episode 7 next. Season 1- Hook Man Season 2- The Usual Suspects Season 3- Fresh Blood Season 4- It's the Great Pumpkin Sam Winchester Season 5- The Curious Case of Dean Winchester Season 6- Family Matters Season 7- The Mentalists Season 8- A Little Slice of Kevin Season 9- Bad Boys Season 10- Girls Girls Girls Season 11- Plush Season 12- Rock Never Dies Hook Man- Okay episode. Creepy in parts and I like that we find out Dean came up with the salt rounds. I always like seeing Dean's smarts and out of the box thinking. The Usual Suspects- Another one I really liked. If they want to showcase the connection between Sam and Dean this should be how they do it rather than a certain episode that shall remain nameless. Watching this i never had the impression that Sam or Dean had that story rehearsed, but they matched down to the last detail. Jensen was also good in the interrogation scenes. I liked learning some of Sam and Dean's secret codes. I enjoyed Linda Blair and interactions with Dean. Fresh Blood- Okay ep. But I disliked Dean being played for a fool. Bella just betrayed them no way Dean believes her that she just wants to thank them and flat out hands her their location. I really liked Jensen's scenes in the hotel room after he runs after the vampires and tells Sam he just went for a pizza. You can really see that walls Dean has up to help him deal with going to hell and just how reckless he is. Nobody does that hardened "I'm fine" exterior/ I'm a mess inside better than Jensen. He appears cool, calm and collected but then you see the little tells with a look, or a tone, or body language. We need an episode where Dean is curse and cant' speak just so I can watch Jensen's non-verbal acting. It's the Great Pumpkin Sam Winchester- I liked this one. No real stand outs or bad moments. The Curious Case of Dean Winchester- This was not a great ep. I really disliked that we finally get to see Dean play poker and he loses. I get that he had to for the ep to work, but he could have been cursed in some other way. Family Matters- Not much sticks out. But I disliked Gwen calling Dean the reject (or whatever word she used). The Mentalists- Loved this one. Dean's interactions with Melanie were great. Plus, I enjoyed Dean finally getting to deliver his own boo hoo suck it up type lecture. NGL, I found it very satisfying because I found the whole Amy drama blown out of proportion. There was a good case. I liked the guest star. A Little Slice of Kevin- Another one I loved, loved, loved. Give me purgatory Dean any day. I admit was a little worried that they were going to write Dean as having left Cas behind so I was glad that didn't happen. I loved the dynamic between Dean, Cas and Benny. Jensen was so good in this ep when we saw his worry that he was seeing things when he started seeing Cas. The scene between Dean and Cas where Cas tell him what really happened, is still one of my favorite interactions between them. My heart just broke for Dean when he felt so guilty he made up false memories. Cas reassuring him it wasn't his fault was nice to see. . "You can't save everyone my friend, thought you try." I know this is the Dean thread, but I need to through some props Misha's way for how he delivered that line. It was so gentle and sincere. I am so glad they didn't go the 'bossy Dean trying to take away Cas's right to stay in Purgatory" I liked that Cas really appreciated Dean trying to save him. Bad Boys- Another great ep. I liked that we got to see into Dean's past. Plus, Sonny was a great character. Dean's interactions with Timmy were great. Deans' ability to bond with traumatized children in one of my favorite qualities. It showed just how much of "blunt little instrument" Dean really was to John. Dean makes a mistake and John "leaves him to rot." Then only comes for him when he needs him. Poor Dean. Major props to Dylan Everett too. Especially in that last scene where we see Dean trying to decide to go with his family or stay. You could see how torn he was. Another aspect I really liked was Dean that we got to see that can succeed outside of hunting. He was making friends, getting good grades, good at sports. There is nothing I dislike more than the "loser Dean" trope so thanks to Adam Glass for that. Girls Girls Girls- I liked Dean kicking Cole's butt again. Plus, I liked that Dean immediately picked up on the fact that the girl really wasn't into it. Jensen was so good in that end speech. No Dean you are not past saving. Plush- Nothing really sticks out good or bad in this ep. It was kind of 'meh. Since I ship Dean and Donna it was a little disappointing that that we didn't get more interaction between the two. Rock Never Dies- Dean in Leather. That is all.

I think he means Jim Beaver who is taking his place this weekend.

Some are speculating that he's wearing his old tie and coat

They outdid themselves with this one. I can't wait to see Dean's reaction

The whole Dean asks Cas to leave the bunker never made sense to me. Because the very next episode they had Sam and Dean fixing an angel finding machine and Gadreel had no objections to that. It seems to me that a machine lighting up exactly where Sam was standing would be a far bigger clue to Sam that something was going on, then a possibility of angels coming looking for Cas. It's why I sometimes wonder if the writers have any clue what the previous one did.

For me, "it didn't happen on screen, it didn't happen," has to apply to all situations doesn't apply, mainly due to context, timing, and importance. For example we don't see Sam and Dean go to the bathroom every ep, and I don't need to see it to believe that they do. (other than when time travelling, of course). It's not really that important to the story for the writers to specifically state that they do. But with the amulet given the history, and the importance the story placed on it, I feel its important for the writers to have firmly establish that Sam had it all along. From when Dean threw it away and when it surfaced, I feel like too much time has passed and to many important events came and went, the biggest being 5.22, where it would have made a narrative sense for the show to reveal Sam had it. That they didn't makes me believes the writers really thought he had it either. It's true that we don't see Dean scrubbing the bunker with bleach and moping floors, but I've seen enough evidence that Dean likes things neat and tidy. Which is why the scene at the beginning of 12.15 bothered me so much. That happened on screen but I still see it as massively out of character for Dean. As to whether Dean gave Cas money, I guess that would depend on how you see Dean. IMO, given the show history that established that Dean is a caretaker so I think its believable that he gave him some money. I don't think it was a lot, and not enough to go very far because I don't think Sam and Dean have much to give. They live hand to mouth, on hustles and credit card schemes . As we've seen the credit cards don't last that long. Cas had to get from the bunker to a couple of states over somehow. That he had a credit card or cash is the most plausible. While its true, that people can believe that Cas would gamble the money. I don't think its plausible because that's not who Cas's character is. Id find that wildly OOC and it would never cross my mind that he would do that if Dean gave him money. As for sending Cas out, yes it was a wrong, not denying that. But Cas isn't some naive innocent kid. Yes, he was a newly minted human but that doesn't mean that all his previous experience and knowledge is some how lost or worthless. Cas has been observing humans for thousands of years and interacting with humans for several. He's smart and resourceful. Maybe he picked up on how to run credit card scams. Whereas Claire, yes, she might have grown up on the streets but first and formost she is a minor. Plus, she has shown that despite the experience she is still very vunerable, gullable and naive. Also very prone to bad decisions. So, if I had to bet on who would stay alive longer in that situation I'd go with Cas. I personally loved s9. I watch mainly for Jensen's acting, and I felt like there was really something extra in Jensen's performance. It could be used as textbook to demonstrate to an actor/actress how to find what's not on the page. It's hard to watch at times, but binge watching makes it really hit home just how much of downward spiral Dean was in, and how much he isolated himself from his loved ones. Dean went down a very dark path that started in the premier and ended with his death in DYBIM. Watching Jensen and Dean was enjoyable just made me feel so many conflicting emotions. . Give me s9 over s12 any day. S12 is the one I detested.

Regardless of whether it was a blink and you miss it moment the show still established John and Deans' blood type. They aren't compatible. Obviously, I don't think they were trying to say that Dean isn't a Winchester. But it should be a lesson that context and continuity matter, even the small details. But if they did go there, (they won't) it wouldn't bother me because what better way to demonstrate "Family doesn't end with blood." Plus, a who are Dean's parents storyline would be a lot more interesting (to me) than But that's probably a topic for another thread

I'm attempting a s12 rewatch (some eps anyway) and the more I watch the more convinced I become that Dean must be adopted. I'd be okay with that revelation as well.

Thanks to Buck/Lemming There is a very good chance John isn't Dean's father. In Children Shoudn't Play with Dead Things we find out John's blood type is AB negative. In Soul Survivor Sam tells Dean he got his blood type which is O. Odds of a person with an AB blood type having an O child are very slim.

Nothing really new. http://tvline.com/gallery/fall-tv-2017-season-premiere-spoilers/#!35/fall-preview-supernatural-5/ I really hope they aren't cutting recasting Crowley

If he forgot about it in such a short time, than again I question exactly how much it meant to him in the first place. Since it was supposed to be this big meaningful symbol between the brothers, there really is no valid show reason why Sam wouldn't mention it when he thought he was never going to see Dean again. Not that much time passed between 5.16 and 5.22. Sam believed Dean threw it away because he lost he felt Dean lost faith in him. Why would Sam want a reminder of that? Looking Why would Sam need the fake one if he had the real one? Again, if he forgot he had the real one shouldn't the fake one have triggered it, again making me question why he needed the fake one? Shouldn't we have gotten a glimpse of the real one in Sam's box? To much time and to many important things have happened where it would have made sense to bring up the amulet if Sam had it all along. The most glaring being the use of the army man rather then the amulet. That seems to me that the writers didn't really think Sam had it either. So we can agree to disagree on this issue

I guess for me, I must be missing something too because I can't see why Sam would keep it a secret. Dean was so down on everything and everyone at this point, I can see Dean's attitude being "What ever floats your boat Sam, do whatever you want. I don't care." rather than being upset. It's not like Sam ever listened to Dean in the past, why would this be any more upsetting? Plus, I can't see Souless Sam holding on to it either. He wasn't supposed to have any emotional connection to anything. If some girl thought it was cool and asked for it, then I could see Sam giving it to her. Also 5.22 Sam was under the believe that he was never going to see his brother again. That isn't the time for secrecy or hard feelings. If Dean hung the fake one on the mirror instead of just tossing it in the trash it obviously still have some meaning for him. What better time for Sam to mention he had the real one? I can't buy that he would have forgotten about it. For me there is just to many plot holes to believe that Sam had it all this time.

If Sam did that I would think he's trying to paint himself as a victim, that he has to hide it because he doesn't want Dean to make him feel bad. It's still Sam making all his decisions and hiding things from Dean because he thinks Dean will get mad or upset. I agree with @CluelessDrifter in that it makes Dean sound like an ogre and makes Dean the bad guy. *Not saying you were saying this, this is just how I would interpret the Sam's actions if that is what he did.

Does anyone remember when we started getting promo material last year?

Yes it does.