Lemuria

Are you saying that Jon’s telling his family—two members of which kept their word not to reveal it and one of whom decided to betray him for her own “irrepressible ambition and desire to rule—who he really is, is the reason Dany burnt KL to the ground? Then she wasn’t very stable to begin with, was she? Not to mention that it’s a pretty misogynistic idea. Dany could have chosen to go with, “They’re not crazy about me right now? Well, I’ll win their affections,” rather than choosing “I’ll force them to love me.” In the end, her choices were her own. But even if Jon had kept silent, do you think, after the destruction of the city, that Sam would have? Or for that matter, Arya and Bran?

A Night’s Watch of one? There is no Night’s Watch anymore. It’s defunct. It’s a former Night’s Watch. It’s most sincerely dead. Which means, there’s also no oath. Jon could just publicly renounce his Targ heritage and refuse the throne and it would have the same effect. I’d say this is too ridiculous to be true but, hey, this is D&D we’re talking about. King Bran and his council—yep, why not turn Westeros into a theocracy. It’s worked so well on Earth. And since Bran doesn’t care about the day-to-day stuff, it’s ripe to have the same corrupting effect. Besides, the ending to the series is totally not bittersweet. It’s hugely tragic.

I know I've asked this before, but this always drives me crazy (well, crazier, anyway 😋). To what end? What would they be watching for? The NK is gone. The WW are gone. The AoTD is kaput. The Wildings are now the Free Folk to the North and can come and go as they please through the Viserion Pass. Why do they need a Night's Watch?

Or what he thinks they need to know and since he doesn't feel most emotions anymore or really care about people, that might not be what the council (assuming there is one) actually need to know.

And threatening to harm her baby, IIRC

I get that you hate Jon Snow, but seriously? He had sworn allegiance to Dany and has repeatedly held to that. He has stated that as far as he is concerned, she is the rightful heir because he doesn't want the throne. Varys didn't just "tell the truth," he was actively working against her (even possibly trying to poison her) and he had also sworn to serve her. Tell me any monarch, especially in the rather brutal world of Planetos, would have tolerated that and not executed the person they all would have considered to be a traitor?

Because (1) he was actively working to dethrone her and put someone else in her place; (2) the conversation with the "little bird" suggested he was also trying to poison her; and (3) he had promised her that if he ever had a problem with her, he would look her in the eye and tell her. He didn't. She promised that if he ever betrayed her, she would burn him to ashes. She did.

Except she didn't do anything in this ep except talk big, and then run around looking scared. Assassination is one thing; battle is something else again.

Pretty much the same way she got past all the NK's generals and a portion of his army in that relatively small Weirwood without anyone noticing her dragging the trampoline she jumped from.

That's why plotonium is so valuable on the open market.

My favorite doctor in one of his best eps. Great choice! Unfortunately, he would have hated this ep!

You may be right but I still have to think that what the producers did with the whole NK storyline – – which is basically to screw it into the ground and make nothing out of it – – has to cut into the audience for the prequel. Why would you want to waste your time on a storyline that you know will turn out to be nothing? It would’ve made a difference for me if they had decided to abandon Westeros and instead take the story to Essos, to where the Long Night really started. The Long Night in Westeros was a reflection of what had broken out an Essos. It would have touched on some things that people had heard about in this series, but also would’ve presented an entirely new scenario. The Great Empire of the Dawn. The Blood Emperor. The Maiden Made of Light. The Lion of Night, who sent his demons to ravage humanity because of the Blood Emperor’s transgressions. And last but not least—drumroll, please—Azor Ahai and Lightbringer, a mysterious figure who came out of nowhere, defeated the evil, and then disappeared back into the mists of history. And who didn’t look a damn thing like Arya.

But the COTF are extinct. The last of them died trying when the NK attacked and killed the3ER (the whole Hodor episode). So, that’s not the reason. If Jon becomes king (increasingly unlikely), I could see his granting the lands beyond the remaining Wall to that Free Folk along with all the remaining castles on the Wall, leaving the gap to act as a pass connecting the True North and the rest of Westeros. ( and if he doesn’t become king but just goes to the far north to live among the Free Folk, I could see his declaring to the rest of Westeros that the far north is now a separate kingdom and I could see his taking over the castles along the wall – – and probably rebuilding something in the pass as sort of a guard tower and a Great Gate, and basically telling the rest of Westeros that they’ll deal with them and trade with them etc. but otherwise, stay out!)

If the latest spoiler that Sansa first joins with Tyrion to replace Dany with Jon is true, then we have to ask, is there anyone Sansa won’t betray to get what she wants? If so, then deep down inside, she really hasn’t changed from season 1. And I still have no clue why some people talk about Jon re-starting the Night Watch. To do what, exactly? Sit on a 700 foot high block of ice and twiddle his thumbs? There’s nothing we need a Night Watch for anymore. The NK, WW and all the wights are gone. The Free Folk aren’t threats (and even if some idiot Northerners continue to think that, Jon doesn’t and certainly wouldn’t do anything to prevent them from moving freely about Westeros).

But then wouldn't she have to start talking very...slowly...with...lots...of...pauses...between...words?

What siege? Wouldn't there have to be a complete castle before an invading army planned a siege? Instead of one where the enemy can just stroll through the missing portion of the wall that a passing Undead Dragon made? You'd think that oh-so-smart Sansa, instead of coming unprepared and saying that she'd have to ask her generals--all of whom were standing in that room--would have argued that with the castle damaged, they needed to leave some sort of a force behind to defend it. But then, I still don't think she cared all that much about the state of health of the soldiers, her real goal was scoring points against Dany.

Sorry, I think that's the only one! (I hate to promise it gets better, in case you still don't like it! 😄😉)

I also posted this in the ep (8.04) thread but thought I'd put it here as well. It's an interesting look at why Jon decided to reveal that he's Targaryen: Jon's Choice to become Aegon

I thought this was an interesting discussion of why Jon decided to reveal who he really is: Jon's Choice to become Aegon Speaking of Arya: I agree her leaving like that was weird, especially as she indicates it will be forever but I also was taken aback in Ep. 8.01, when she and Jon meet for the first time. The first time she said they were family, no problems. But the second time, when she was hugging him again at the end, I can't even exactly tell you why but I felt a threat in it. It really took me aback.

But she was at tha BoTB, wasn’t she? She held back that there was an army coming to help them. If Jon and Davis had known that, they would have tap danced the day away, waiting. I’ve seen comments to the effect that “Oh, but she didn’t really know if they were coming.” Seriously? She rode out to meet them. That definitely sounds as if she knew they were coming. I suspect there was “some late visitor entreating entrance at [her] chamber door.”

Here's my problem with this: I don't believe that Sansa raised the issue because she's the only one thinking of the soldiers. I think she did it for exactly the same reasons she suddenly raised the food issue: To score points against Dany and to cause dissension between Dany and the Northerners. Sansa had enough warning about the huge army and two dragons that were coming to her, and the North's, aid to be able to have started gathering stores to help feed them. If she needed to know what dragons ate, she could have sent a raven. She didn't do any of this. Why? IMO, because she wanted it to be a bone of contention, she wanted to make Dany look bad. Same thing here. If Sansa were truly worried about the soldiers, she would have come to the meeting prepared. I mean, anyone with a single brain cell would have known that the next question after Sansa says the soldiers would need rest, would be "How long?" Why hadn't she discussed this with the "generals" (and who the heck are they anyway and why aren't they in the War Room?) before coming to the meeting? She should have been ready with the answer and with all the details needed to show why that amount of time wasn't unreasonable and was necessary. To me, her failure to come prepared says that either she's too stupid to realize she should have had that information, or she doesn't really care about the soldiers but only the opportunity to make her rival for control of the North look bad. And I don't think Jon is playing lapdog or just bending to Dany's wants. In the scene where Dany is first confronting Jaime and she asks what the Warden of the North thinks, I have no doubt that she was expecting him to agree but he didn't. He presented her with a practical reason why they should keep Jaime around. In this case, I think he saw he saw quite clearly what was happening and what the goals were, especially on Sansa's part, and that if civil war broke out, it could only damage their ability to take on Cersei (and for some reason I don't know about, Sansa seemed to--this is before the lineage reveal--that the North was better off with Cersei on the throne than with Dany. Got me.). I think as an experienced fighter and leader of troops, Jon knew that even if they decided to head south right away, "right away" didn't mean "right away." Dany, the dragons and the Unsullied on ships could head for Dragonstone fairly quickly--but it would still take them a goodly amount of time to get there, since the distance is about 2,500 miles (gotten from Quora). Dany could get a headstart, get to Dragonstone and recoup their. For a land-based army, since the distance between Winterfell and KL on the King's Road is about 1,500 and all on foot. But armies don't march on their feet, they march, as the saying goes, on their stomachs. That means that the army would have to be provisioned before they start out. That's going to take some time. They would also need to ensure cloaks, boots, gear etc for everyone. Again, takes time to gather. Horses (how ever many would be involved) would need to be outfitted and re-shod, grain and the like would need to be taken in wagons (since it's the North in winter). Weapons that were damaged would need to be fixed or replaced. Arrows would have to be made. And so on. So Jon knew that the soldiers would get at least a few weeks of rest while the civilians got the provisions, gear, weaponry, wagons and the like together. (Of course, the show makes it look virtually instantaneously that they're leaving for KL, but you have to read the invisible scene notation, "Time passed." 😊) Instead of permitting WWIII to break out, he poured oil on the waters, knowing that the soldiers would get the rest they needed.

That's not exactly the way it went down. Jon pointed out that they tried to get more and couldn't, including the Blackfish. She says it's not enough men and he points out that it's all the men they have. At that point, she just stands there and says nothing even though she knows there's an army on the way. Jon would never have played it the way he did if he knew there was an army coming; he would have waited. Sansa was responsible ultimately for sending all those men who were fighting her cause to their deaths because, according to ST, she wanted to be the Hero of the Day and sweep in with the Vale army. I agree with Unosez: it's pretty unforgiveable. (Also notice: she got Jon to join her--he was tired of fighting--by playing the Rickon card. "Ramsey has our brother. He's going to hurt our brother" etc and so on. But we see here that she had written Rickon off all the time; she never intended to get Rickon out because it wasn't possible. She just forgot to mention that one itsy, bitsy fact to Jon when she was trying to pump him up to coming to Winterfell.)

But he does now, doesn't he?

Robert Baratheon wanted to rule. He just didn't want to do the grunt work. He was the Louis XIII of Westeros.

He would have told Jon, since it was obvious that Jon really wanted to know (especially if his mother cared for him at all), because by then Jon would have taken the Black and thus was no longer a threat or a candidate for the throne. So the secret could come out. (And it certainly would have changed Jon's relationship with Thorne!)