cmr2014

They all have awful beliefs, and are pretty awful people, Anna is just especially vocal about it: "Look at me! Look at how meek and submissive I am! Look at how many children I can produce!" all with that smug, pinched smile on her face. We would all probably dislike the others as much -- if not more -- if they had been around when the show was airing. I would feel bad for her if she wasn't so unpleasant -- she absolutely followed all the rules and now she has nothing. She can't get any kind of a job or go to school, and she's got a swarm of little kids at home anyway. She has no friends outside of her immediate family. She doesn't have the emotional or financial resources to divorce Josh and start again. Seeing Jed! take Josh's place as the favorite son, and watching Katie crank out more babies has to hurt.

I agree, and I don't know that I believe that Jinger believes that "people who don't have children are selfish." I think that she would be happy with zero, one or two -- maybe. I'm sure she has children herself because she's heard that mantra about "selfish women" approx 1 million times. I don't think she's really capable of thinking for herself that way -- and that's 100% intentional. Gothard's "teaching materials" and methods were designed to prevent critical thinking and Jinger is a graduate. Jeremy chose her for that reason -- she's not especially dumb, but she doesn't have any interest in examining her existing beliefs. I'm sure that Jinger's docility is a plus to MacArthur and is helping Jeremy within the organization.

It's not just a feeling -- they're not. They mentioned a bathing schedule early on in the show and it was once or twice a week per child. They made a mention of frequent hand washing, but I doubt that. We saw them running around -- filthy -- all the time, and no one stopped to wash their hands. This also came up when Jill and Jessa got married -- and is probably true for the rest of them -- I think that it's one of the (many) issues that the new spouses encounter after they're married.

That's kind of my point. I completely agree that it was a low dig to imply Jana was abused if Jana didn't ask her to phrase it that way. That's our worldview, though, because it's informed by modern thought, books, magazines, television, etc. Jill's is formed 100% by "Wisdom Booklets." I think that it's entirely possible that Jill was making a snarky comment about Jana and -- IMO -- implying that Jana is "used goods" in Gothard-land, or even just jealousy because Jana was "his type" and she wasn't. It could also be that Jill, after a short time in therapy, was thinking that it's important to shine a light on the culture and the damage it caused -- which she knows directly from Jana. In that case, it would be well-intentioned, but wildly inappropriate. It could also be something completely different that never even crossed my mind because I didn't grow up in a cult with 18 siblings. I think that Jill is emerging from the cult, but it was her entire upbringing, and I would think there will be a lot of intermingling of worldviews in her mind for a long time. It wouldn't surprise me if Jana's feelings didn't cross her mind (certainly on-brand for a Duggar).

I think it's impossible to know for sure from our vantage point. I don't think any of us was raised in a hh like the Duggars. I also think that most of the older kids don't particularly like each other. They were pitted against each other, isolated from the outside world and largly isolated from siblings of the opposite sex, and forced to keep a smile plasterd across their faces 24/7. I do think that Jessa and Jinger had some sort of relationship, because Jessa is a loudmouth bully and Jinger is "weak." But she seems to be making her own life now, and Jessa can't bully her -- or it may be that Jessa is happy bullying Ben and her kids and has no need for Jinger anymore. Anyway, it wouldn't surprise me if the statement was meant as a dig at Jana, but it may not be for the reasons that seem obvious to us, but over issues in their long-standing relationship.

I agree that they always look happy. He was always dorky, but he just seemed like a complete non-entity. I think they're really happy together and they don't appear to be in the breeding derby which is great for the whole family. I think that moving out, and getting some autonomy and having someone that he could actually talk to really opened up a whole new world for him. It's just night and day.

It's been noted on this board many times that no sane person should buy a house (car, etc.) from a Duggar. They're not exactly known for their work eithic, or their expertise (on anything).

I agree. Jessa was always sour and unhappy, and she was always going to look for a weak man, and once she got him, she relised that she despises his weakness. I also just think that she's deeply unhappy within herself, and Ben is just some jerk who happens to be around a lot, but her unhappiness comes from within, and I don't think she has to ability to deal with it (I don't think self-reflection is her strong suit). I'm guessing that she doesn't like being a brood-mare/help-meet, and struggles with "what I want" vs "what I've always believed." I think that a lot of this stuff is performative -- staying near the TTH, having so many kids, even the half-assed housekeeping (look at me! I'm so busy being a Christian mom to all these kids and I just can'f find time for cleaning -- LOL)). If she repeats these steps often enough, it will become true! Ben is, IMO, as concerend about image surface realitites as Jeremy. He desperately wanted something -- he was what, 17? He managed to win the pretty girl from TV, and was sure this was the inevitable next step to his rise to television pastor of a mega-church. And now, because he couldn't take a few months to actually ge to know the girl, and her family, he has a lifetime of regret to look forward to. I think he would happily run back to Jessa any day if she'd open up and let him. She knows that, too, and despises him all the more for it.

If she is engaged, I'll be pleased that one of them was finally able to get married without a big announcement and a televised wedding.

On top of that, her dress is figure-hugging and sleeveless!!!

I'm confused by what's going on here. The notice said that the issue was people being unkind and disrespectful of each other, but locking down the threads and changing the names suggest that the issue is people being unkind and disrespectful to the Duggars. Can anyone clarify this for me?

Yeah, and he "hid candy in the shower." Why does this tiny kid have access to candy to hide in the shower? Why was he running around unsupervised so that he could "accidentally" pee on the floor and Amy would slip on it later? She seems to thing (like Jessa) that all these examples of her terrible parenting are just normal -- kids, right? -- moments, when they're so awful. At least she only has one . . .

I think that they're the "cutest" of the kids because their smiles reach their eyes.

It's nice that this crew of unemployed assholes can take some "time off" for a trip to the beach.

The whole "Derick was fired" narrative was based on the idea that TLC does anything to protect their "talent." There is simply no indication that they do that at all -- just the opposite. The entirety of the TLC line up is what would have been called a "freak show" in days gone by. Some of them may get a more sympathetic edit than others, but TLC is no friend to anyone. Jazz was 100% being used by TLC and, as they've shown in the past, they never cared that she's was child.