S08.E02: Pecking Order

[Chicago Redshirt]

Harvey and Donna get their first taste of how Samantha operates; Alex tries to impress Zane.

[Chicago Redshirt]

The good: Gretchen always makes things a little better. The Louis hallucination of Harvey and Robert dissing him was pretty funny. The episode was at least partially about a case.

The not-so-good: The notion that Samantha is this woman of mystery to the point where they apparently don't even know what school(s) she went to or where she was born is kinda ridiculous. These are objective things that can be figured out. You can call whatever school and see if they have a record of her graduating from there. Birth certificates are matters of public record. She has worked with colleagues who know, presumably, some concrete things about her. 

It wouldn't kill these people to talk to each other, would it? Because things would probably have gone a lot smoother if Samantha and Harvey bounced ideas off of each other, or if Samantha simply told Alex, "The reason I don't have what's-his-face as a client anymore is X." Or even if she can't or doesn't want to go into it in detail, something less cryptic than "Don't do this or you'll be sorry."

The COW doesn't really make sense to me either. How are these investors going to put $50 million in something without some sort of due diligence that the company already had $50 million? How can good guy Max have not realized that they didn't get the first $50 million? Why didn't Our Heroes consider the possibility that both Max and Nick are scum, rather than it having to be one or the other? How does Nick stepping down solve anything? How is it good for the company?

[catrice2]

Just start watching the DVR and I'm already mad. I do not find Louis and sheila  to be cute or interesting.  They're also very creepy.

 why are they pulling Gretchen out out of the closet? I thought she had made her escape ?

[catrice2]

4 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

The good: Gretchen always makes things a little better. The Louis hallucination of Harvey and Robert dissing him was pretty funny. The episode was at least partially about a case.

The not-so-good: The notion that Samantha is this woman of mystery to the point where they apparently don't even know what school(s) she went to or where she was born is kinda ridiculous. These are objective things that can be figured out. You can call whatever school and see if they have a record of her graduating from there. Birth certificates are matters of public record. She has worked with colleagues who know, presumably, some concrete things about her. 

It wouldn't kill these people to talk to each other, would it? Because things would probably have gone a lot smoother if Samantha and Harvey bounced ideas off of each other, or if Samantha simply told Alex, "The reason I don't have what's-his-face as a client anymore is X." Or even if she can't or doesn't want to go into it in detail, something less cryptic than "Don't do this or you'll be sorry."

The COW doesn't really make sense to me either. How are these investors going to put $50 million in something without some sort of due diligence that the company already had $50 million? How can good guy Max have not realized that they didn't get the first $50 million? Why didn't Our Heroes consider the possibility that both Max and Nick are scum, rather than it having to be one or the other? How does Nick stepping down solve anything? How is it good for the company?

You tried to warn me. I kept waiting for the episode to get better and then it didn't. Yes if they talk to each other instead of cursed at and threatened each other then I guess we wouldn't have a show. I'm not quite sure what Katrina's role is supposed to be right now. 

Louis' point needed to be made, but it didn't have to be made the way that they did it. I missed a lot of the episodes with Sheila for whatever reason since I haven't been faithful the last two or three years, but when did she become so awful? I waited all this time for Louis to get a serious romance and I get this? I hate the way they turned Louis into comic relief

[CaptainCranky]

Maybe this show in the future will be watchable but after the first two episodes it's only marginally better than the latter Mike and Rachel days.

1. Thank god I DVR so I was able to FF through all the Louis and Sheila BS. Pitiful attempt at a romantic connection.

2. Sam was better than the first show but still doesn't add a dam thing to the show.

3. Alex. Not sure what I think about him but other than adding token diversity he adds nothing.

4. Are Sam and Alex even junior partners let alone senior partners to be even considered named partners.

I won't claim to be an expert on law firms but I know enough lawyers to know  that partners have equity positions within the firm (they need to put up a lot of money to join as a partner) and only the top rainmakers are considered as named partners.

But since this is TV anything not even close to reality can happen.

I'm giving this show 2 more views and then I'm out if there is not substantial improvement.

[ursula]

NGL, seeing Donna taken down a peg was cathartic.

[Joimiaroxeu]

Ditto comments upthread, I'm kinda over Lewis and Sheila's roleplay. It was cute at first but now it's just tired to me.

Sounds like Samantha put the "shark" in shark. Land shark.

Apparently the word of choice for this episode was "shit" and many of its variations. It wouldn't be so funny if the actors didn't hit the word hard every time they used it. Are we supposed to be impressed or scandalized?

[bros402]

Can Sheila disappear and then she just becomes a regular on Lucifer? I much prefer her there.

[nitrofishblue]

This was an extremely disappointing episode. I wish the Sheila and Louis arc would completely disappear. They suck the life out of the show whenever they are on screen.

[yellowcalla]

On 7/27/2018 at 12:51 PM, CaptainCranky said:

Alex. Not sure what I think about him but other than adding token diversity he adds nothing.

I really like the actor so I'm hoping they find a way to make Alex more interesting. I was disappointed that Zane turned down his offer to play golf since it seemed like a good opportunity to reveal more about Alex to the audience. 

Edited July 29, 2018 by yellowcalla

[bros402]

I like Dule Hill.

I hope he gets something to do here, so I can justify a delay for the filming of Psych: The Movie: The Sequel (Or whatever they call it)

[Chicago Redshirt]

On 7/27/2018 at 5:51 AM, CaptainCranky said:

3. Alex. Not sure what I think about him but other than adding token diversity he adds nothing.

4. Are Sam and Alex even junior partners let alone senior partners to be even considered named partners.

I won't claim to be an expert on law firms but I know enough lawyers to know  that partners have equity positions within the firm (they need to put up a lot of money to join as a partner) and only the top rainmakers are considered as named partners.

I did the web promotion thing featuring Alex interviewing you as if you were a candidate for an associate position. He showed a lot more personality in that short and there was more background on him than I think we've seen in the entirety of his appearances in the real show. 

For instance, I don't remember it every being said that he has a family. Given that Dule Hill has a lot of charisma, I think he could be a good character. So far, though, all he has really been shown as is a goodish attorney who isn't quite in the same tier as Harvey or Mike or most of the other mainstays of the firm.

I think that Samantha and Alex are almost certainly senior partners. Alex was a senior partner where he was before, I believe, and luring him over to the firm involved the promise to make him a named partner. 

That Samantha gets the hulking expense account and that Zane depends on her as his ace suggests to me that she is a senior partner as well.

On 7/29/2018 at 3:55 AM, yellowcalla said:

I really like the actor so I'm hoping they find a way to make Alex more interesting. I was disappointed that Zane turned down his offer to play golf since it seemed like a good opportunity to reveal more about Alex to the audience. 

 

On 7/30/2018 at 1:44 AM, bros402 said:

I like Dule Hill.

I hope he gets something to do here, so I can justify a delay for the filming of Psych: The Movie: The Sequel (Or whatever they call it)

I never got to watch the first movie. :(

Also, I would forgive Suits all its sins if they cast James Roday in pretty much any guest capacity (client, rival lawyer, heck as Shawn Spencer) and allow Dule and James to riff off each other.

[bros402]

11 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

I did the web promotion thing featuring Alex interviewing you as if you were a candidate for an associate position. He showed a lot more personality in that short and there was more background on him than I think we've seen in the entirety of his appearances in the real show. 

For instance, I don't remember it every being said that he has a family. Given that Dule Hill has a lot of charisma, I think he could be a good character. So far, though, all he has really been shown as is a goodish attorney who isn't quite in the same tier as Harvey or Mike or most of the other mainstays of the firm.

I think that Samantha and Alex are almost certainly senior partners. Alex was a senior partner where he was before, I believe, and luring him over to the firm involved the promise to make him a named partner. 

That Samantha gets the hulking expense account and that Zane depends on her as his ace suggests to me that she is a senior partner as well.

 

I never got to watch the first movie. :(

Also, I would forgive Suits all its sins if they cast James Roday in pretty much any guest capacity (client, rival lawyer, heck as Shawn Spencer) and allow Dule and James to riff off each other.

Watch the movie! I think it is on the USA site -http://www.usanetwork.com/psych/videos/psych-the-movie

[statsgirl]

So far Katherine Heigl is a huge negative for me.  Samantha is two dimensional and the kind of bitch I have no interest in, and Heigl isn't a good enough actress to raise the character.

Zane Specter Litt is becoming a toxic workplace.  People spend more time stabbing each other in the back than they do trying to do their actual jobs.  Harvey and Zane leaving Louis out completely is not entertaining (nor is Louis and Sheila's sex life for longer than 30 seconds.)  Samantha undercutting Alex is not entertaining either.

On 7/27/2018 at 3:40 PM, ursula said:

NGL, seeing Donna taken down a peg was cathartic.

How was Donna taken down a peg?  She was doing her job, authorizing Samantha's expense account in line with other lawyers at her level (and also doing due diligence in checking up on her as Samatha was lying) and then Samantha did a runaround and went to Zane who authorized a massive increase without a) telling his partnera Harvey and Louis that he was making new rules for Samantha or b) telling Donna that Samantha is a special case.  That's no way to run a firm.  The in-fighting is going to take more energy than what the do for their clients. Toxic.

Samantha also seems pretty stupid to me.  Has she never heard of Harvey Specter before?  Does she not know that he's one of the partners?  It's not smart to treat him like he's an articling student and run circles behind his back.  It's also not a good idea to antagonize the COO of your new firm either.  I learned very early on that you need to keep the secretarys on your side if you want to get anything done, much less anyone as pivotal as Donna.

It seems like Korsh realized at the end of the episode that Heigl is on the show for the rest of the season and it's not going to help if the audience hates her this much so he brought in Katrina to say that she's good to have on your side in a fight.  I bet, because she's such an illegal fighter she'll kill you if she's against you.

On 7/26/2018 at 4:09 PM, Chicago Redshirt said:

The not-so-good: The notion that Samantha is this woman of mystery to the point where they apparently don't even know what school(s) she went to or where she was born is kinda ridiculous. These are objective things that can be figured out. You can call whatever school and see if they have a record of her graduating from there. Birth certificates are matters of public record. She has worked with colleagues who know, presumably, some concrete things about her. 

It wouldn't kill these people to talk to each other, would it? Because things would probably have gone a lot smoother if Samantha and Harvey bounced ideas off of each other, or if Samantha simply told Alex, "The reason I don't have what's-his-face as a client anymore is X." Or even if she can't or doesn't want to go into it in detail, something less cryptic than "Don't do this or you'll be sorry."

Are we supposed to be scared of Samantha?  Because all I'm getting is that she's stupid enough to cause her own downfall.

What a mess this season is so far.

ETA: GETTING INTO A CANCER TRIAL DOES NOT MEAN  YOU'RE GOING TO GET CURED. Half the people in a trial get the placebo.

I was in a trial, got the experimental drug  and it didn't make any difference to the cancer. Tthe only effect of the experimental drug was to make the side effect of the other chemo worse.

Edited August 7, 2018 by statsgirl

[bros402]

On 8/6/2018 at 6:19 PM, statsgirl said:

So far Katherine Heigl is a huge negative for me.  Samantha is two dimensional and the kind of bitch I have no interest in, and Heigl isn't a good enough actress to raise the character.

Zane Specter Litt is becoming a toxic workplace.  People spend more time stabbing each other in the back than they do trying to do their actual jobs.  Harvey and Zane leaving Louis out completely is not entertaining (nor is Louis and Sheila's sex life for longer than 30 seconds.)  Samantha undercutting Alex is not entertaining either.

How was Donna taken down a peg?  She was doing her job, authorizing Samantha's expense account in line with other lawyers at her level (and also doing due diligence in checking up on her as Samatha was lying) and then Samantha did a runaround and went to Zane who authorized a massive increase without a) telling his partnera Harvey and Louis that he was making new rules for Samantha or b) telling Donna that Samantha is a special case.  That's no way to run a firm.  The in-fighting is going to take more energy than what the do for their clients. Toxic.

Samantha also seems pretty stupid to me.  Has she never heard of Harvey Specter before?  Does she not know that he's one of the partners?  It's not smart to treat him like he's an articling student and run circles behind his back.  It's also not a good idea to antagonize the COO of your new firm either.  I learned very early on that you need to keep the secretarys on your side if you want to get anything done, much less anyone as pivotal as Donna.

It seems like Korsh realized at the end of the episode that Heigl is on the show for the rest of the season and it's not going to help if the audience hates her this much so he brought in Katrina to say that she's good to have on your side in a fight.  I bet, because she's such an illegal fighter she'll kill you if she's against you.

Are we supposed to be scared of Samantha?  Because all I'm getting is that she's stupid enough to cause her own downfall.

What a mess this season is so far.

ETA: GETTING INTO A CANCER TRIAL DOES NOT MEAN  YOU'RE GOING TO GET CURED. Half the people in a trial get the placebo.

I was in a trial, got the experimental drug  and it didn't make any difference to the cancer. Tthe only effect of the experimental drug was to make the side effect of the other chemo worse.

The majority of cancer trials don't give placebos. It usually gives the trial medication at a different dose, or a different drug cocktail

[statsgirl]

19 hours ago, bros402 said:

The majority of cancer trials don't give placebos.

I should have said placebo or control group.  Some phase II trials has standard treatment plus different levels of the experimental drug.  Others like mine have standard treatment plus experimental drug vs standard treatment only..

Quote

Sometimes participants in the control group may be given a look-alike pill or an injection that does not contain any active drug (placebo). This study design is ethical if it is not known if there is benefit or risk from taking the experimental treatment.

However my point was that getting into a cancer trial isn't a cure.  Sometimes it makes the condition worse.

Edited August 9, 2018 by statsgirl

[bros402]

On 8/8/2018 at 9:25 PM, statsgirl said:

I should have said placebo or control group.  Some phase II trials has standard treatment plus different levels of the experimental drug.  Others like mine have standard treatment plus experimental drug vs standard treatment only..

However my point was that getting into a cancer trial isn't a cure.  Sometimes it makes the condition worse.

Oh yeah definitely - it's annoying how shows are like "OMG A CLINICAL TRIAL!" Few hours later: "omg ur cured!!!"

I hop you're doing as okay as possible, given that you have cancer - I also have cancer. Chemo sucks.