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PODCAST S02.E22 Go Pirates!: Veronica Mars Graduates With (Dubious) Honors

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Thank you guys for this podcast.  I am very sorry that we will not be moving on to college together next week, as I was expecting to. Veronica Mars still remains one of my favourite things on TV, although it seems like I enjoyed Season 2 more than you did.  I thought the overarching mystery was pretty well constructed with indications and clues spread throughout the season, even arguably making Cassidy a more prominent character towards the end of Season 1. 

Here are some reactions in no particular order to things you had a problem with.  I think there is no doubt that Cassidy put the rat on the bus for the only and most obvious reason: to give "the rich kids" an excuse to not catch the bus home because of the stench. In his police interview, he said it was Dick's idea to hire a car but I think we can assume that Cassidy was an accomplished manipulator and planted the idea.  I think this is also proof that the plan was to do the bus on the way back.

Cassidy was in anonymous communication with Woody and had commenced his blackmail plan.  I have always believed that Woody knew something was going to happen with the bus, (hence telling Gia not to travel back on it) even if he didn't know the details.  I got from the audio file that Veronica found that Peter and Marco, although they were planning "the outing of all outings", were still collecting evidence so it wouldn't just be the two of them making the accusations.  I think they went on that field trip to make Woody uncomfortable but weren't ready to confront him.  It's not a stretch to believe that Cassidy was stringing them along.

Cassidy's blackmail plan was brilliant.  I think it's certain that he blackmailed Woody into ensuring that incorporation would fail, so Woody faked that whole scandal with the drugged-campaign-worker-scene knowing Keith would not lie down and take the blame.  The timing of it, on the eve of the vote, was crucial to incorporation failing causing Cassidy's carefully purchased properties (bought for bargain basement prices outside the incorporation area) immediately to jump back up in value.

One of your criticisms was how could Veronica have been so sure it was Cassidy?  Firstly, she has a history of making leaps to assigning guilt and not always being right.  In this case, I don't have a single doubt that it was the chlamydia thing, based on the dolly zoom when she is looking at the photo followed by the smash cut to the bathroom where she has clearly just vomited.  Don't forget that there was still a mystery for her as to how she got chlamydia; she knew she hadn't got it from Duncan so that must have been a niggling question.  She was clearly uncomfortable when she read that Woody had been treated for it.  The realisation that she had been raped by Cassidy explains how incredibly upset she was before she had even confronted him.  I'm sorry that you think that undercuts A Trip to the Dentist.  I think it adds to it.  She had spent most of Season 1 believing she had been raped that night and she was right.

As for Logan and Veronica getting together, I didn't need to see anything more than I saw.  That was an intense night for both of them anyway but then add to it that Veronica thought her father had died in the explosion.  The Pieta scene with Logan holding her, the mirror of the scene at the beginning of Season 2 where she was holding him, covers a lot of emotional territory.

Regarding Mollymook, let me give you the benefit of local knowledge.  It's a beach-side town about 3 hours south of Sydney, and about 30 minutes south of a place where I spend of lot of weekend and holiday time.  I'm please to see that little Lilly was rugged up because early June on the south coast can be cold.  There may be days where it's warm enough in the middle of the day to take a sweater off but I have never swum later than April.  Duncan looks a little underdressed to me.  Another thing that I have always wondered.  If Duncan could so easily have organised CW to make that hit, can we assume that he is in contact with his father?  Thoughts?

Was one of your criticisms that Cassidy was too evil and too much of a mastermind?  I think he was a Class A sociopath.  The victim of bullying at home and sexual assault as a child, he was presenting himself as one thing while hiding a cold and vindictive nature.  The first indicator was the ease with which he burned his father and manipulated Veronica to do it for him.  Until he oh so casually pointed it out, Veronica had not noticed that Kendall and the county assessor were swapping gym bags. 

I suppose you could say that I have had to make a lot of assumptions with all of this, but that is one of the things I have always loved about this show.  It has always assumed that its audience can work stuff out for itself.  Maybe too much with this series? I don't think so, but it's just my opinion. 

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I’m SO sad that the podcast is on hiatus that I registered to comment and I HATE registering!

In any case, thank you for the insightful commentary- I have enjoyed my rewatch so much and looked forward to listening and the visual aids every week.

All the best!

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I too will be sorry to see the podcast go on hiatus.  I've so enjoyed my structured re-watch and looked forward to hearing Sarah and John's commentary each Friday.

I liked some things more as well..I can remember being compelled by the Alternaprom scene and it felt true to teen romance.  I can agree that the tone between Logan and Veronia this season at times seemed off, but I still bought their getting back together..Altertnaprom showed each of their true feelings regardless of timing and circumstance, and the traumatic scenes of the finale (as well as the trial) showed them clinging together when everything else was stripped away.

The Keith/Kendall scene at the end and Veronica waiting at the airport did fall flat with me.

I think having Beaver/Woody as dual villains worked as well.  I do agree that the urgency around the bus crash case wasn't there, and it really seemed to me upon this rewatch that the episode order was off.  

Anyway, Bon Voyage, Go Pirates!

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I am also sad that this podcast is ending, I was looking forward to hearing your snark on Piz. 

I think I liked some things more that the podcasters as well. I liked the scene at the end with Logan and Veronica, him holding her, then how he just silently snuck out of the apartment and let her have time with her dad. But I do agree about the Jackie reveal. I remember the first time I watched the series, I thought it came out of nowhere and that surely I had missed something along the way. After several other viewings of this series, I realize that I didn't miss anything. The show just did a poor job of writing all of that. 

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hi guys! Thanks so much for the kind words. We definitely hope to get back to Season 3: The Piz-ness as soon as we can -- although it seems go90 pulled VM from its rotation of shows, so maybe it's for the best that we're also taking a break. (Is it still airing on POP at all?)

 

We for sure have less patience for certain things in the show than "civilian" viewers, probably because of how we have to approach it analysis-wise, but it's still such a great show to think about and unpack. We'll miss doing that with you guys...but feel free to keep it going in here and we'll chime in on things!

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I'm sorry to hear that the podcast is going on hiatus. I always look forward to starting my Monday work day with an episode. I enjoyed the re-watch a lot more with the color commentary, I've always struggled when I try to re-watch seasons 2 & 3, season 1 was such a perfect complete story and the other 2 just don't live up to it. 

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I really love this podcast.  You guys do such a great job of breaking it all down.  I'm going to miss it while you are on hiatus.  

I agree that the test that Veronica sends to Mac is infuriating.  I really hate how the whole Mac/Beaver things plays out but I'm so glad he didn't kill her.

Veronica couldn't just call 911 she couldn't say anything it would have taken them forever to figure out that someone needed help and where they were. I get why she sends a text to Logan she knows he's close and she knows how he feels so of course he would come.  

I guess I don't find the Logan and Veronica getting back together weird.  They're into each other, I don't thinks it's complicated.  It's likely not a good idea but I get that they have strong feelings.  

I hate the Keith leaving her at the airport cliffhanger, it doesn't make any sense and is really contrived.

Edited by Clare
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14 hours ago, Sarah D. Bunting said:

hi guys! Thanks so much for the kind words. We definitely hope to get back to Season 3: The Piz-ness as soon as we can -- although it seems go90 pulled VM from its rotation of shows, so maybe it's for the best that we're also taking a break. (Is it still airing on POP at all?)

 

We for sure have less patience for certain things in the show than "civilian" viewers, probably because of how we have to approach it analysis-wise, but it's still such a great show to think about and unpack. We'll miss doing that with you guys...but feel free to keep it going in here and we'll chime in on things!

Thanks!

i didn’t know about go90 yesterday..bummer, I’ll have to pull out my DVD’s!

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I'm a few episodes behind the podcast and go90 pulling the show is pretty annoying. I have all three seasons of the show on DVD, but no longer have a DVD player. Lol. So I'm not sure if I'll breakdown and buy them or just listen to the last few podcast eps without the benefit of having seen the episodes recently. 

Thanks y'all for doing this! I have so much love for this show and it was a pleasure hearing your analysis (and jokes) every week. Pasta fazool 4eva!

Edited by veronicamers
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So sad that you guys are going on hiatus, and I really hope you come back at some point to do season 3 (and the movie *fingers crossed*)

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Arresting Weevil - sure, Lamb is a dick, but Weevil is a suspected murderer (an accusation of which he, if not directly guilty of, is certainly partially responsible for). I never had a problem with Lamb, for once, actually doing his job. If he gets to be a dick at the same time, I guess that's just a bonus for him

Love V's moment at graduation (which reminded me of Buffy, too), particularly with (no longer Vice) Principal Clemmons.

Harry Hamlin really nailed the creepy vibe throughout.

I assumed the baby was Jackie's who was being brought up by Granny, the kid just referred to her a "mom" because she'd been the one bringing her up (he may even have been told it WAS his mother). Though it is a completely unnecessary retcon.

Awww, shout out to me (initial post is here, if you're curious)! Glad the things that puzzled me puzzled other people too. The trouble is, when you make a villain an Evil Genius who has a plan for everything, then having things just have to break for him is unsatisfactory. I agree with Imamarshmallow that he wanted the revelations about Woody to come out on the eve of the vote, but allowing Peter & Marco to confront Woody risked his whole revelation coming out prematurely. Yes, it's possible he had a contingency plan for that happening, but if you're prepared to blow up a bus full of people to enact your Evil Scheme, wouldn't you kill the two people who could torpedo your scheme first? And if he wants to hurt Woody, wouldn't he want to kill Gia too rather than warn her off? Since Krysten Ritter was only in this one Season, it's not as if he couldn't have killed her too (or at least attempted to) as part of his revenge.

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It was always my understanding that Beaver blew the bus to get rid of those who wanted to out Woody because Beaver didn’t want that info out. He wasn’t trying to hurt Woody at that time. Incorporation wasn’t even discussed at that point yet. He was trying to protect himself. I assume Woody didn’t want Gia on the bus once he saw which students (abuse victims) were on the bus. 

Once Beaver started buying properties, he realized incorporation would screw his plans. I think Beaver got Lucky riled up to start sending out the videos and emails to kill incorporation. 

Veronica said was going through the old baseball rosters to figure out the missing speaker from the audio tape. She’d ruled out all but one which is why she went to the burger place to get his name when she realized that Beaver was on the team too. 

Veronica forwarded the text she recieved about meeting on the roof to Logan since she could do it quickly and she knew he was in the building and could get there fast. 

I agree the text ‘Beaver is a killer’ is the worst part of the season. 

Jackie was an unnecessary twist. I think she was always going to go back to NY. She was never going to Paris. That was just a lie to cover her prior lies. She just left earlier than planned after her improving relationship with her dad was shut down after his release. 

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