Lorelai and Christopher

[moonb]

Well, the good news is, if Gigi finds herself a Logan, he might go to Christopher about proposing, because he's the *better* of Gigi's two parents. :) I doubt we'd see her in the revival, but part of me would hope she's being an extremely difficult teenager to him. 

 

Imo, Christopher is pretty aware of his parenting flaws - he expressed regret to Rory in season 5 after Straub died, but then promptly disappeared again - but he isn't willing or able to change that pattern. He's caught up in his own self-image with regard to Lorelai and Rory, that Lorelai is Superwoman Mom whereas he's that guy who can't cut it, but the two of them always let him back in without serious consequences (except for permanently losing Lorelai as a romantic possibility in the end). It's one thing if Lorelai and Rory think of him as "vacation dad," but having your daughter's x-box owning, kicked-out-of-prep-school boyfriend not take you seriously as a parent might be a more uncomfortable mirror. 

[Smad]

Imo, Christopher is pretty aware of his parenting flaws - he expressed regret to Rory in season 5 after Straub died, but then promptly disappeared again - but he isn't willing or able to change that pattern.

But see that's the thing for me I have trouble making sense of. If Chris is so aware of his short-comings or failures as a parent to Rory why would he even mention being disappointed not being asked permission. If he knows he wasn't enough of a parent to Rory then it's a logical conclusion that no one would ever ask his permission. Christopher's main complaint with Rory was always how much he missed. Which made sense because he was one of the least self-aware people on the show due to him being all about himself. Hence him being disappointed not being asked permission. It's just something else he missed.

[moonb]

Finally, something Christopher and Emily have in common - a lack of self-awareness and not thinking of unintended consequences of their actions.

 

Chris is a big gesture, little follow-through kind of guy, and while I think he was sincere in offering to pay for Yale, no strings attached, perhaps he thought that being a little more present in Rory's life for the previous two seasons before Logan's proposal would give him and Rory a healed relationship, and he'd be considered more of a real dad. 

[hippielamb]

With respect, I'm not so sure about that. After pretty much ditching his wife and elder daughter during Richard's medical emergency, Christopher seemed somewhat surprised that Logan hadn't bothered to ask his permission to propose to Rory. Logan was at the hospital - he knew who Rory's real parent was.

Oh, I agree. I meant he recognizes his shortcomings in regards to Gigi. He pretty much admitted to Lorelai that it's unfair to Gigi that he was her only parent. Rory had Lorelai but Gigi only has him, and he knows she needs more. That's why I don't fault him for having nannies or his mother help him with raising her.

That graduation party scene and the Yale weekend episode showed Christopher how much he had missed and he couldn't ignore it. It is interesting that Lorelai sort of comforts him both times. I am sure Rory told Logan that she was raised primarily by her mom. I think Chris is better at being a friend to Rory, a sort of fun uncle rather than a parent. I do like seeing that portrayed on tv because I think it's realistic for an absentee parent to have more of a friend type relationship with their adult child than a parental one.

[dustylil]

but Gigi only has him, and he knows she needs more. That's why I don't fault him for having nannies or his mother help him with raising her

 

I don't fault him in the least for having nannies and Francine to help him either. Although he could also encourage and facilitate Gigi to have a stronger relationship with her half-sister. I may be misremembering, but is there any reason why Sherry can't also be more involved with the child? Could she not visit with Gigi on a regular basis - on Christopher's nickel if need be?

Edited April 24, 2016 by dustylil

[hippielamb]

I don't fault him in the least for having nannies and Francine to help him either. Although he could also encourage and facilitate Gigi to have a stronger relationship with her half-sister. I may be misremembering, but is there any reason why Sherry can't also be more involved with the child? Could she not visit with Gigi on a regular basis - on Christopher's nickel if need be?

Besides selfishness? No. It is telling that in the episode where Sherry has her baby shower, she says she wants a ballerina and that Chris is the baby person. Wait, what? (I kind of wanted Lorelai to laugh out loud at her clueless statement.) The weird thing is that is how it played out.

I had a hard time with the Gigi in Paris with Sherry plot. She hadn't seen Gigi in two years and was essentially a stranger to the little girl. I know the nanny was there but it just sounds so messed up. I do wonder what role Sherry would have in her daughter's life, living in France.

[dustylil]

It is telling that in the episode where Sherry has her baby shower, she says she wants a ballerina and that Chris is the baby person. Wait, what? (I kind of wanted Lorelai to laugh out loud at her clueless statement.)

 

When Sherry would babble on in Season 2 about what an involved father Christopher was to Rory, I used to holler at the television set, ask to see his cancelled child support cheques :)

She hadn't seen Gigi in two years and was essentially a stranger to the little girl. I know the nanny was there but it just sounds so messed up. I do wonder what role Sherry would have in her daughter's life, living in France

 

Even I was dumbfounded that he was all set to send - rather than take -  the little girl to Paris. As to Sherry's role - given that technology like Skype  was functioning at that time  and there were  funds for frequent visits (Sherry to the US as well as Gigi to France), there would be no reason for mother and daughter not to develop a bond. Of  course, it would take all the adults involved to think of only what was best for Gigi. That would likely be the greatest problem.

[txhorns79]

Could she not visit with Gigi on a regular basis - on Christopher's nickel if need be?

 

I can't imagine under what scenario that would be appropriate.  The onus isn't on Christopher to pay for Sherry to come and visit her daughter, just because he happens to have the money to do so.  As far as I know, there was nothing forcing Sherry to live in France, and if she wanted to regularly see Gigi, the burden is on her to move back, not on her ex to facilitate her travel between the oceans.   

Edited April 25, 2016 by txhorns79

[moonb]

Did Christopher have a business or hold down a job by season 6-7? I can't remember if once he inherited his grandfather's money, he was still balancing work and raising Gigi, or if he'd retired, so to speak, to enjoy his lifestyle. 

 

Besides selfishness? No. It is telling that in the episode where Sherry has her baby shower, she says she wants a ballerina and that Chris is the baby person. Wait, what? (I kind of wanted Lorelai to laugh out loud at her clueless statement.) The weird thing is that is how it played out.

 

Sherry as a character never made much sense to me.  I assume Madchen Amick was no longer available for the role after season 3, but she's one type of person in It Should Have Been Lorelai, and then she became this career woman who was mocked by the show  - she couldn't stop working during labor, she talked about treating her child like a doll, and then moved to Paris for her career.  But when she first appears, she's the overly-enthusiastic dad's girlfriend who wants to be Rory's other best friend. If what Rory says is true, she had wanted a child enough to briefly consider single motherhood before meeting Christopher. Lorelai had a couple other good foils, and it's in-character for Chris that their relationship didn't work out, but it's still too bad that he didn't have a serious girlfriend/wife who could have pointed out the oddness of Lorelai's open door policy with Rory. What girlfriend or wife would be comfortable with her significant other crashing on Lorelai's couch in order to visit Rory?

[dustylil]

but it's still too bad that he didn't have a serious girlfriend/wife who could have pointed out the oddness of Lorelai's open door policy with Rory. What girlfriend or wife would be comfortable with her significant other crashing on Lorelai's couch in order to visit Rory?

 

Personally, I didn't find  Lorelai's open door policy all that odd. I have known situations among both family and friends where the non-custodial parent visits and stays with the custodial parent and child. Sometimes it is the only practical solution. Not everybody has relatives nearby to bunk with or can afford a hotel or motel.  

Sometimes in the best interest of the child, one does things that might be seen as odd or unconventional. Neither Christopher nor Sherry would win any prizes for parenting. But if it would be beneficial for Gigi, why shouldn't he take the high road and make it is easy as possible for her to maintain a relationship with her mother? It is Gigi's best interests that are paramount.

[txhorns79]

What girlfriend or wife would be comfortable with her significant other crashing on Lorelai's couch in order to visit Rory?

 

It probably would depend on the relationship between Christopher and Sherry.  If Sherry trusted Christopher, then there's no reason for her to oppose that kind of arrangement. 

Edited April 26, 2016 by txhorns79

[hippielamb]

On 4/25/2016 at 4:56 PM, txhorns79 said:

I can't imagine under what scenario that would be appropriate.  The onus isn't on Christopher to pay for Sherry to come and visit her daughter, just because he happens to have the money to do so.  As far as I know, there was nothing forcing Sherry to live in France, and if she wanted to regularly see Gigi, the burden is on her to move back, not on her ex to facilitate her travel between the oceans.   

Chris could pay for Gigi to go see Sherry just to give himself a break. He was pretty eager to send her off to Paris, I got the impression he was ready for a break and wanted some alone time with Lorelai.

On 4/26/2016 at 9:00 PM, moonb said:

Did Christopher have a business or hold down a job by season 6-7? I can't remember if once he inherited his grandfather's money, he was still balancing work and raising Gigi, or if he'd retired, so to speak, to enjoy his lifestyle. 

 

Sherry as a character never made much sense to me.  I assume Madchen Amick was no longer available for the role after season 3, but she's one type of person in It Should Have Been Lorelai, and then she became this career woman who was mocked by the show  - she couldn't stop working during labor, she talked about treating her child like a doll, and then moved to Paris for her career.  But when she first appears, she's the overly-enthusiastic dad's girlfriend who wants to be Rory's other best friend. If what Rory says is true, she had wanted a child enough to briefly consider single motherhood before meeting Christopher. Lorelai had a couple other good foils, and it's in-character for Chris that their relationship didn't work out, but it's still too bad that he didn't have a serious girlfriend/wife who could have pointed out the oddness of Lorelai's open door policy with Rory. What girlfriend or wife would be comfortable with her significant other crashing on Lorelai's couch in order to visit Rory?

In seasons 6 & 7, there are references to Chris still working. He talks about his job to the woman that Emily was trying to set him up with. Then later when he and Lorelai are arguing in front of the wedding planner, he says he has to go to work. 

Maybe I am being overly cynical but I interpreted Sherry's interest in bonding with Rory as a way to seal her relationship with Chris. It could just be her pushy personality but I thought it was strange.

I have been thinking about this as I am rewatching season 2. Sherry was either the most trusting girlfriend ever or completely clueless. Chris spends the weekend with the GG's. Then he's buying his babymama an expensive pearl necklace. Then he goes to her best friends wedding with her. Lol what? Meanwhile during this time he's becoming distant with Sherry. Something was up.

[dustylil]

4 hours ago, hippielamb said:

Sherry was either the most trusting girlfriend ever or completely clueless. Chris spends the weekend with the GG's. Then he's buying his babymama an expensive pearl necklace. Then he goes to her best friends wedding with her. Lol what? Meanwhile during this time he's becoming distant with Sherry. Something was up

I think at that point the relationship with Sherry was pretty much over. Things had been problematic between them for a time, she was away on a business trip and he apparently was looking for a new place to live. The only reason they reconciled was due to her pregnancy.

Edited April 29, 2016 by dustylil

[navelgazer]

IIRC, after she talked it over with Rory, Lorelai was perfectly willing to give Rory's old room to Gigi.  She even started moving the desk out by herself, which was fun to watch how much she was struggling. 

Once it was all over and Lorelai told him that he was the man she wanted to want, I was relieved.  Now they've tried to be together as adults.  It's like she said in the diner at the end of Sherri's visit to Stars Hollow -- that he was always this possibility and she always had him in the back of her mind and he got mad at her and told her if she had any other revelations to share with him she should leave a note.  

L/C didn't work because he was not the right man for Lorelai.  He was insecure and immature.  Lorelai needed Luke's steadiness to counter her flightiness.  She loved Luke's rants, would tell him often to share them, "Go Luke, rant Luke" in the limo after the party in New York.  Like Rory said when she told Christopher to "leave Mom alone," you leave and Mom's crying.  "He's there and she's happy." 

I think David Rosenthal did a pretty good job with the crap decisions that ASP left him with.  I don't detest S7 the way I used to. 

Edited March 29, 2018 by navelgazer

[Oldernowiser]

Okay, I’m always the last one to discover anything, but I just started watching GG while I'm on the treadmill and I know this thread dates back to last century, but I just have to say that I despised Christopher the moment I saw him and it did NOT get better from there.

That is all.

[peacheslatour]

17 hours ago, Oldernowiser said:

Okay, I’m always the last one to discover anything, but I just started watching GG while I'm on the treadmill and I know this thread dates back to last century, but I just have to say that I despised Christopher the moment I saw him and it did NOT get better from there.

That is all.

Yep, from the moment he rode up on his motorcycle I was like "Oh, I do NOT like this creep."

[andromeda331]

18 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

Yep, from the moment he rode up on his motorcycle I was like "Oh, I do NOT like this creep."

It started there for me too. He only got worse from that moment.

[SJC]

I'm resurrecting an old thread here, lol. 
Just wanted to say how dreadful Chris is & how utterly, utterly amazed I am that anyone--thankfully only a few !--can defend this useless man-child.
And this notion that Lorelai kept Chrissy darlin' from Rory is laughable. Did she install a douche-repelling force field around her house ? Or perhaps a moat with alligators in it ? 🤣😂
So he wasn't ready to be a parent at 16 ? Neither was Lorelai !
And how about when he was 21? 25 ? 30 ? 35 ? Etc., etc.
Now I know there are much, much worse parents out there....however that does not excuse him one iota.

Okay...rant over. 😄

[andromeda331]

On 7/22/2022 at 9:36 PM, SJC said:

I'm resurrecting an old thread here, lol. 
Just wanted to say how dreadful Chris is & how utterly, utterly amazed I am that anyone--thankfully only a few !--can defend this useless man-child.
And this notion that Lorelai kept Chrissy darlin' from Rory is laughable. Did she install a douche-repelling force field around her house ? Or perhaps a moat with alligators in it ? 🤣😂
So he wasn't ready to be a parent at 16 ? Neither was Lorelai !
And how about when he was 21? 25 ? 30 ? 35 ? Etc., etc.
Now I know there are much, much worse parents out there....however that does not excuse him one iota.

Okay...rant over. 😄

Yes! He had Rory's entire life to get ready to be a parent to her and he never did. Because he never wanted too. Christopher only cares about Rory when she can get him something he wants Lorelai or Sherry. That's it. The thing that really infuriates me is how Richard and Emily treat him like some God when he did nothing to take care and raise the granddaughter they love and they know it. Because 16 year old Lorelai didn't want to marry him, they let him off the hook for everything. It's the one thing I hate the most about Lorelai. I am a big fan of Lorelai but out of all of her traits her constantly letting him off the hook is what ticks me off the most. I really wish she had stayed like she was in Christopher Returns suspicious from beginning to end and keeps reminding Rory that he's leaving. But she never is like that again. She lets everything he did in the past and series go. Rory does too. He'll say he feels bad about missing out but I don't believe him. He never really tries to make it up to Rory. He had plenty of time but never does. In season seven when talking to Lorelai about having another kid. Chris is all for it because Rory turned out all right. Yep, no regrets. Rory does have a couple moments with in the show she expresses anger or something about Christopher. First of course is Haunted Leg, when Christopher's shocked that Rory is actually pissed at him. He can't understand why. He promised they were going to be a family, something that Rory wanted and he knew that only to break the promise and run back to be a dad to some other baby. The one thing he never did for her. That had to hurt and she had every right to be pissed. But of course the show doesn't do anything about it. It gets drop with Rory suddenly telling Lorelai in the one with Sherry's Baby Shower that she was in touch with Christopher. That would have been great to see Christopher make up with Rory but we never saw it so it didn't happen. The second time was talking to Marty at Yale about her dad. Of course nothing comes from it. I wanted him to work on being there for Rory but it never happen. Instead everyone acts like he's this great guy. I love Luke calling Christopher out at the renewal because it's the only time we ever got. I wanted so badly for Rory to call him out on that. He deserved it and Rory deserved to be the one calling him out. I love Luke punching Christopher, because again he deserved it for so many things and it's the only one we got. Rory and Lorelai both deserved to punch him.

Edited July 25, 2022 by andromeda331