Santa Barbara - General Discussion

[Bali]

Okay, I've been giving this a lot of thought. Here are a few things that I would have done differently:

Done anything Louise Sorel asked for to keep her.  But kept her divorced. Probably brought in a powerful foe for CC and Lionel and had him after Augusta.

 

Kept Warren. Kept Brick. Not killed Joe right after the wedding. Had more Joe vs. Kelly's lifestyle conflict. Had Laken be the one to run off to Europe and meet the Hartley brothers. 

 

Kept Caroline because Caroline v Augusta would have been great. 

 

Find a different way for Gina to blackmail CC and still have CC and Sophia fight for ways to be together. Maybe have it be something Ted is accused of.

 

Contine the Sophia and Augusta friendship. Have Augusta venting about how Lionel and Caroline are a thing now and get to hear Augusta complain, "I would try to trick him, but dammit she's just too nice. I don't know what to do." Sophia, "Go after him. He's always loved you." And then Sophia would have had a friend to smack her head (probably literally- but playfully) when she was all worried about CC and Pamela. "Oh, CC will always choose you Darling, don't be an idiot." Never bring TJ onto the show at all.

 

Killed Joe to send Kelly off to film Princess Bride- hook her up with Jeffrey to bring on Pammie Darling.  

 

Perhaps even a weird Pamela/Augusta/ Sophia/CC/Lionel/ new guy arc where they're all fighting, forming untrustworthy alliances, and trying to be the ultimate business leader. Continue that for a loooonnng time with various ones winning and losing at different points. And get all the kids involved throughout

[Bali]

12 hours ago, cleo said:

I'm watching the eps when the original Pamela showed up. There's so much that doesn't make sense.

Alex acts like he raised Elena alone. So did Pamela give her away or what? She expresses no grief over Elena being dead but carries around a picture of Mason and Jeffrey.

Also I only saw Marj Dusay in the later yrs. It's just a bit jarring trying to connect that history with this. Like this Pamela talks about the letters she sent CC and Mason. Then I remember Sophia talking about how hateful the letters were, like that Pamela was unbalanced.

Two biased perspectives to be sure.

Anyway bc I've never seen any of the original Pamela stories, I'm hoping some of it will be good.

I've never seen those episodes either. I've never understood a lot of that storyline. It breaks up CC and Sophia and after all they go through, that never made sense to me. But they did serious shifting of backstory for a lot of that anyway.  Still thinks the show NEEDS Augusta 

[cleo]

1 hour ago, Bali said:

Kept Warren. Kept Brick. Not killed Joe right after the wedding. Had more Joe vs. Kelly's lifestyle conflict. Had Laken be the one to run off to Europe and meet the Hartley brothers. 

Keeping original recipe Warren and Brick would have been good. Especially Brick, he was criminally underused. I think the idea with Kelly and Laken is good. 

Re Pamela- I actually never even saw much of Marj Dusay, I only ever saw her in that fabulous dinner episode from 1991? 1992? I'm predisposed to prefer her Pamela. 

As for the rest- once Elena is dead the storyline with Cruz in jail is really boring (to me). But stuff with Mason and Julia gets better at least. 

I'm at Oct 1987. Slow march to 1988, which I have never seen. I'm kind of expecting a trainwreck tbh. 

 

Edited June 26, 2021 by cleo

[Bali]

16 hours ago, cleo said:

I'm watching the eps when the original Pamela showed up. There's so much that doesn't make sense.

Alex acts like he raised Elena alone. So did Pamela give her away or what? She expresses no grief over Elena being dead but carries around a picture of Mason and Jeffrey.

Also I only saw Marj Dusay in the later yrs. It's just a bit jarring trying to connect that history with this. Like this Pamela talks about the letters she sent CC and Mason. Then I remember Sophia talking about how hateful the letters were, like that Pamela was unbalanced.

Two biased perspectives to be sure.

Anyway bc I've never seen any of the original Pamela stories, I'm hoping some of it will be good.

I've never seen those episodes either. I've never understood a lot of that storyline. It breaks up CC and Sophia and after all they go through, that never made sense to me. But they did serious shifting of backstory for a lot of that anyway.  Still thinks the show NEEDS Augusta 

[Bali]

I have been reading a lot of interviews. Apparently, Lane Davies and Judith McConnell wanted to do a storyline where Sophia and Mason hook up. Boy, I'm glad the show didn't go there. But with other characters on a different show, LD and JM might have been awesome.

[cleo]

That would have been awwwwful. 

[WendyCR72]

12 hours ago, Bali said:

I have been reading a lot of interviews. Apparently, Lane Davies and Judith McConnell wanted to do a storyline where Sophia and Mason hook up. Boy, I'm glad the show didn't go there. But with other characters on a different show, LD and JM might have been awesome.

Eeeewwww. Especially since the show established that Sophia came into Mason's life when he was still a boy. Thank goodness the writers didn't heed that suggestion!

[cleo]

Ok so I just realized Shirley Fields only played Pamela for a few eps before Dusay. I'm glad bc I am just not feeling SF at all. 

[Bali]

On 6/30/2021 at 3:27 PM, cleo said:

That would have been awwwwful. 

And disturbing on SO MANY levels!!

I went backwards to watch some of the stuff I skipped. I'm at Mason working out of the restaurant/bar. Augusta says, "You're not funny, Mason." He replies, "Augusta, out of all of the mean things you've ever said to me, that hurt the most." 

[Bali]

On 6/30/2021 at 3:27 PM, cleo said:

 

 

[Bali]

My husband came home in the middle of an episode. When he fell asleep, I returned to the episode. The episode in question is the one where Ted and Jackie have been arrested and are at the police station. One of the prostitutes is there. Hubby woke up in time to say, Well she's not wearing a bra and it's cold in there. Ted tells Mason the girls can't come back to the apartment. Hubby asks if he's gay. I said, No, he's 18. Hubby says, 18 and doesn't want a hooker with perky ones at his apartment? He is gay. And I didn't even go into CC and Gina's wedding. 

[cleo]

Ted was a boy scout and very naive. There were some funny scenes with Mason and Ginger and the prostitutes though.

[Bali]

4 hours ago, cleo said:

Ted was a boy scout and very naive. There were some funny scenes with Mason and Ginger and the prostitutes though.

I am cracking up over Mason and the prostitutes. But there's no way I'm going to try to explain that to hubby. Lol

[Bali]

I finally got to see the tunnel explosion. And the opening of The Orient Express. And the beginning of the Unholy Mason/Gina affair. Some notes: poor Mason wants romance and love. Rotflmao at Eden telling Cruz people don't want to eat where assissins die. I simply adore Breeze! And I missed her when the show stopped mentioning her. Beautiful dog! I finally saw Eden's proposal. Whew. Be still mah heart! Kelly really is such a lot of trouble. And I really love that bright blue color they wear so often. Kinda wish they made clothes that color now.

And one more thought: JULIA!!!!

[cleo]

I thought it was cool they had Eden propose. 

I think at one point Mason was blackmailing Gina for sex, just gross. 

 

[Bali]

10 hours ago, cleo said:

I thought it was cool they had Eden propose. 

I think at one point Mason was blackmailing Gina for sex, just gross. 

 

He was blackmailing her yes. But he wanted romance in it, even then. Why can I not hate him? Lol

[Bali]

I'm getting to the really fun juicy stuff now. Ted has been arrested. Mary is getting drunk. Mason is being Mason. Gina just lost the baby. Sophia knows Channing was gay. And Augusta is talking to the priest. 

I also had to rewatch Augusta's fan dance twice. Louise Sorel turned on the music with the heel of her shoe rather effortlessly  I would have never ever been so graceful. Lionels impotence story was heartbreaking and hilarious at the same time. Not every actor/actress could have pulled that off. 

I love Mason inviting Mary to eat and telling her that he's always nice once a month during the full moon. Lol.  Mason, you've been so brow beaten even you don't see your worth. 

The one thing I don't fully understand is why Mason would defend Sophia. Can he not decide if he hates her? He seems to hate her, but doesn't seem to. Ya know?

[cleo]

I always thought of Mason and Sophia as frenemies, esp from Mason's perspective. I don't think he hates her any more than he really hates his father.

I'm typically anti- mother ( bc my own mother was terrible lol), but I always thought Sophia did genuinely care about Mason and try her best. I think Mason knew that at times and so he never fully hated her. He did, however, resent her a lot and blame her a lot, which is understandable. It's very much a child's view though.

Edited July 16, 2021 by cleo

[Bali]

I know Sophia isn't your favorite. But thank you for giving her credit. I too believe she cared about Mason. 

I do find any scene with Augusta and Sophia riveting. 

[cleo]

Yeah there are lots.of good things about Sophia. That's one of the things the show did well- characters like Sophia and Mason are complex. They are good and bad, just like people. And JM was great. 

@Bali are you bouncing around or going roughly in order? 

ETA in my own viewing I was afraid I had my hopes up too high about the Pamela story but the ep where Sophia finds out Pamela is  back is fantastic. 818. It was voted best ep of the yr by the Soap Opera Digest.

Sophia called her something like a demented character out of Emily Dickinson lol. 

Just a fantastic episode all around.

 

Edited July 18, 2021 by cleo

[Bali]

@cleo, I'm going roughly in order. Every once in a while, I need to bounce to some of the happy episodes. 

I'm at Mason telling CC that Channing isn't his. Just Awesome stuff!

 

Edited July 19, 2021 by Bali
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[cleo]

Yeah that was a good ep.

[Bali]

Gina just trumped everyone by hiding the papers that CC signed. This stuff is great.

[Bali]

Dylan Hartley and Kirk the Jerk are torture! Ugh, I'll never make it without the FF button.

[cleo]

I never liked Kelly's early storylines after Joe and Peter. Really skipped most of her stuff until CG was in the role. Although Jeffrey grew on me.

I liked the Kirk storyline although it went on too long. I also wish the Guiding Light guy could have done the role from the beginning. By liked I mean I thought it was well written, especially in the beginning. Man Cruz was a jerk though about Eden's father.

So in my own watch I am at two different points-  the tail end of 1987 and I think fall 1989 and you can almost draw lines there with the Dobsons leaving and the show just going off a cliff and then getting better when they returned. 

But with 1989- everything with Ethan Asher and Laura is awful, I tried to watch it but it makes no sense and I can't stand the actress.

The actor playing Michael is good, it's a shame he didn't get very good storylines.

 

Edited July 23, 2021 by cleo

[Bali]

I actually like Nick. I think he's a very sweet guy and hated that Kelly hurt him. Never liked Dylan. I liked Jeffrey. 

Cruz really is being a jerk! But he has a hard line on euthanasia just because everyone is waiting for TPTB to get their asses in gear and hire Jed Allan already!

[Bali]

Are there full videos after episode 1300?

[Hiyo]

I liked Jeffry too, and wish they kept him around longer. It would have been nice to see Mason develop more of a relationship with his only non-Capwell sibling.

Though him being involved with Kelly was just weird from everyone's point of view:

Mason: My sister is in a relationship with my brother!

Jeffry: I'm in a relationship with my brother's sister!

Kelly: I'm in a relationship with my brother's brother!

Ah, soaps...you needed a score card to keep track of how CC, Sophia, Lionel, and Pam's children were all related to one another.

[cleo]

@Hiyo I thought Kelly and Jeffrey was weird in the beginning too, but I kind of got over it.

Nick was ok but didn't he sleepmwith Kelly in the ghost town when she didn't remember anything? I don't know something about it was yucky to me but I don't remember anymore.

@Bali I think the later years 1989, 90, 91 are on YT only in bits and pieces. I haven't looked in a while. I have all the eps but I bought them from someone. If you want more info pm me.

I also don't mind sharing the odd ep myself with someone. But I don't upload to YT myself generally for a variety of reasons.

[Bali]

2 hours ago, Hiyo said:

I liked Jeffry too, and wish they kept him around longer. It would have been nice to see Mason develop more of a relationship with his only non-Capwell sibling.

Though him being involved with Kelly was just weird from everyone's point of view:

Mason: My sister is in a relationship with my brother!

Jeffry: I'm in a relationship with my brother's sister!

Kelly: I'm in a relationship with my brother's brother!

Ah, soaps...you needed a score card to keep track of how CC, Sophia, Lionel, and Pam's children were all related to one another.

Yeah, I'm one of those weirdos who draws a hard line about not having affairs with: people who have been invloved with parents, siblings, grandparents, and the half-siblings on the other side of their family.

I know soaps like to keep it in the family, but that sets of my creepometer. Big red blaring sirens!!

As for Nick and Kelly, he tried to not make love with her. She kept at him and he gave in. But I think that she wanted to anyway. How much can a guy take? Lol 

Eden is fighting Gina. And just dumped paint all over her. Honestly, I so enjoy when bad things happen to Gina. There might be something wrong with me. I look forward to Mason turning on her too.

[cleo]

I do suppose on a soap opera scale the Nick thing was minor!

[Hiyo]

Quote

I thought Kelly and Jeffrey was weird in the beginning too, but I kind of got over it.

Oh I liked them as a couple too, it's just better to not to think about them sharing a sibling lol

[Bali]

19 hours ago, cleo said:

I do suppose on a soap opera scale the Nick thing was minor!

So very minor!! I mean vs. I shot my son. I got killed by a C, or I switched babies...

[Bali]

 I  was reading through the YouTube comments from when he takes over the role and people say he's so much more evil than Bateman. I see CC differently. I see that when he came out of that coma, Lionel was leaching all over Sophia who wasn't fighting it very hard. Gina was bragging about the stuff she's pulled. And CC was a man betrayed and hurt to the depths of his soul. That's not a comfortable emotion, so he turned to rage and fury. And Jed Allan was perfect.

[cleo]

Wow yeah. I thought Charles Bateman's CC was much harder and colder than Jed Allen's. Mind you I think some of that was limited acting ability.

I thought with Jed Allen CC could be both a bastard but also I could still see some warmth and heart in him. 

[Bali]

11 hours ago, cleo said:

Wow yeah. I thought Charles Bateman's CC was much harder and colder than Jed Allen's. Mind you I think some of that was limited acting ability.

I thought with Jed Allen CC could be both a bastard but also I could still see some warmth and heart in him. 

Jed has more depth. That's a personal bias, but that has always been my impression. 

[Bali]

Brick just found out that Minx switched the babies. So much wasted potential. Richard Eden is so phenomenal in these scenes. It's a shame that later writers and PTB decided he was only capable of angry. He could do so much more.

[cleo]

Well I can't stand Pamela. I don't know if we're supposed to hate her, but I 100% do. I totally agree with CC and Sophia, I think she's psycho. I don't think she gives a shit about Mason. I think she is just using her children.

Based on she lies outright to Mason, to his face, and lied in court.

Also don't like Shirley Fields.

ETA I also hate the whole storyline of Cruz being on trial and in jail. Lots of ff-ing. Thankfully I am also balancing it out by watching the beginning of Robert Barr. I love Robert.

 

Edited August 3, 2021 by cleo

[Bali]

And she breaks up too many favorite couples. Sigh. I'm not looking forward to that breakup, or the arrival of TJ. BLECH

[cleo]

Yeah TJ is around but so far I've been fastforwarding his scenes. Although I have to say that is quite the 80s mullet.

[Bali]

I know. I don't have to tell you my opinion about Sophia and CC breakup

[Bali]

And for a minute, can we please talk about Lionel. He kept that painting of Sophia. He kept her pearls. And he can't figure out why Augusta is jealous of her? What a flipping moron! Not to mention the way he pants after Sophia every time she tries to see CC. 

[cleo]

Lionel was a hound dog for sure! Don't forget he went after Eden early on. There was a great ep where she and Augusta got into it and Augusta slapped her.

[Bali]

I know! I loved that scene. 

[Steph J]

I'm in the mid-600 episodes, where the show is dealing with the aftermath of Hayley's rape and Ted is being such an ass, trying to talk her out of going to counselling so that it can be dealt with "privately." It feels like a real missed opportunity that the show didn't tie Ted and C.C.'s aversion to the idea of therapy to the family's experience with Marcello, since that would have given them an actual reason to be mistrustful of the profession.

[cleo]

Not one of my favourite stories. 

[Bali]

On 8/10/2021 at 1:29 AM, Steph J said:

I'm in the mid-600 episodes, where the show is dealing with the aftermath of Hayley's rape and Ted is being such an ass, trying to talk her out of going to counselling so that it can be dealt with "privately." It feels like a real missed opportunity that the show didn't tie Ted and C.C.'s aversion to the idea of therapy to the family's experience with Marcello, since that would have given them an actual reason to be mistrustful of the profession.

I have always thought that too. As Sophia is yelling about how much therapy helped her, CC could have yelled back that Marcello basically kidnapped her and stole her from her children and him. And that therapy didn't help Kelly either. 

[cleo]

I'm watching the Robert and Eden storyline. Really having a hard time not binging it, bc I loved that storyline. I thought Robert and Eden were hot- although honestly Marcy Walker had great chemistry with almost everyone. (So sad about Roscoe Born).

But you can see the Dobsons wanted a do over with the Lisa storyline- like you have Eden not remembering things, and stealing things with this guy (Robert). Very similar with what came later with Lisa and Andre. Except Andre- meh. They really needed to get a more attractive, charismatic actor. I loathed Andre and honestly Eden/Lisa would have hooked up with someone better. 

I felt the same about Kirk- that was a well written storyline, but they really needed a more attractive, charismatic actor imo. 

Cruz is a real jerk in the R/E storyline and I'm amazed Eden didn't throw Victoria in his face. Because I would have. 

It is also amazing- this storyline is so great and so well done and the rest of the soap is just garbage at this time. Just terribly boring or awful characters- Lujack (Scott? The doctor?). He's Lujack to me lol. Ethan and his awful wife. Cruz's brother is a little interesting but goes nowhere. Greg is still hanging around for some reason. 

Michael is a character with potential but they stick him in terrible storylines at this time. 

 

Edited August 15, 2021 by cleo

[Hiyo]

What year was all of the above happening?

[cleo]

Robert came in the summer of 1989. The rest of 1989 is pure garbage imo. The initial story with him and Eden extended into 1990. 

The Lisa storyline was several months later when it started I think late fall 1990? It ended spring 1991.