The West Wing Season Six: Lame Duck

[Guest]

I don't believe Leo is resigning! I hope it doesn't actually happen! These peace talks are a mess!

Wait, is he having a heart attack? NO!! Leo!

[Guest]

Um, crying as President said "go spend some time with my outgoing Chief of Staff."

Did he just ask CJ to be the new Chief? Wow. I would have guessed Josh!

[eyebleach]

oh this is gonna be fun :)

[SingleMaltBlonde]

I can never really believe what they do to Leo and his relationship with Jeb.

[Guest]

I really hope Leo's plot turns around because watching him struggle with both his health and what to do with himself is painful. Ugh. I don't like this.

Especially given that I know what befalls John Spencer :(

Santos is going to run and beat Will's guy, isn't he. (Don't answer. It's rhetorical!)

[betsyboo]

oh this is gonna be fun :)

I might have squeed at her enthusiasm. It's like watching a kitten take its first steps....  :-))

[BizBuzz]

Ah yes, it's getting exciting again ... you have to help me ... what episode are you on?  Because one is coming up that if you like CJ as much as you say you do, you will absolutely LOVE.

[Guest]

Ah yes, it's getting exciting again ... you have to help me ... what episode are you on?  Because one is coming up that if you like CJ as much as you say you do, you will absolutely LOVE.

I can't tell you what episode I'm on or you'll realize that I watched 9 episodes yesterday....

 

Fine. I am on episode 8.  The last one I watched was "A Change is Going to Come."

 

Being that CJ is my favorite character, I'm good with her being CoS.  However, it feels like a strange move to me.  Press Secretary to Chief of Staff?  I also have to say that I really like that she is doing fine at the job but by no means doing it perfectly. It would be too unrealistic otherwise.  I love her little visits to Leo. "Liftoff" was a fantastic episode for her too.  

 

But now I'm excited to see what is upcoming!

[A Boston Gal]

deaja, it WAS a strange move, and it was endlessly debated among us at the old place when it happened. So very unlikely in real life, but what can you do? In the end, we all just suspended our disbelief, took a deep breath, and moved on. Or rather, kept watching.... ;)

[Guest]

Okay, and also (this is part season 5 and part season 6), when Leo talked about resigning, Jed said he needed a list of names before he did.  Leo said he would make a list of names. This sounded like he was suggesting someone from the outside. But then in Season 6, it is a matter of "There is only 1 name."  I don't think it makes a lot of sense.  I think arguments could have been made for Josh, Toby, or CJ.  Even maybe bringing Sam back (I know this wasn't a possibility given actors, but it could have been mentioned.).  I think it would have made more sense to have it be more like "Hey, why don't you name CJ interim because she's a good traffic cop to keep Toby and Josh from fighting.  Once I'm stronger, we can decide how to transition it and to whom.  Let's discuss if it should be Josh, Toby, or CJ at that time or if we need to bring in someone new."

 

I swear I'm not anti-CJ, but I just think that would have been a more logical way to handle it.  CJ had very little policy experience that we saw on screen.  Josh and Toby both had a lot more experience in that area.

 

However, they both did have areas with a lot of weakness. Toby could be a bit of a hot-head, and since Bartlet was too at times, they might not have worked out well.  Josh tended to be a very strong hand on any issue where I think the CoS needs to have a more balanced approach.  

 

It just seemed to me that even if CJ was the ultimate choice, she wasn't the only obvious choice.  

[A Boston Gal]

In my heart, I believe the CJ decision did not stem from any logical character or story line considerations, but from the love the showrunners evidently had for Allison Janney. ;)

[BizBuzz]

Liftoff is the episode that I was talking about, I loved every single thing about that episode.

 

I was shocked at the choice, however, in the big scheme of things, I settled in that it was a good idea.  Josh to me is and always has been too much of a hot head.

 

From the example that Leo has set time and time again, one of the CoS's jobs is to talk the President down.  CJ always handled that incredibly well, Josh, well, he was usually why the President would go off on some wild tangent.  HA!

 

Toby?  Well ... we know how the President felt about Toby.  ::giggle::

 

Yeah, someone outside could have been considered, but in the reality of television, TWW worked with long lasting characters, bringing on someone new at that point wasn't an option, especially with the newness of other characters planned for in Season 6 & 7 ... that is just one gals opinion.  

ETA ... or what A Boston Gal said ...

[A Boston Gal]

GMTA, BizBuzz, and all that good stuff. :D

[Melancholy]

I agree with the above. I watched the series as it aired for the first time and I was EXTREMELY dubious about picking CJ to be COS (even though she's my favorite) because I couldn't see it happen IRL. However, I think it worked really well for the story and it fit with how we understand the Bartlet Administration functions. Plus, I think Leo's "one name" OTT firmness came from the timeline. Even in hospital bed just a brush away from death, Leo was a chessmaster.

 

IMO, Leo wanted Josh, in particular, to be available to manage a presidential campaign to ensure a next Democrat president. However, Leo understood that a lot of the top outside Democratic talent would be focused on the next President in Jed's lame duck days. Leo thought that CJ, in particular, could be trusted to still take the work of a lame-duck administration seriously so it's not a lame-duck while at the same time keeping Jed happy and motivated as much as possible as Jed the Lovable Egomaniac watches history replace him and render him increasingly irrelevant. Toby doesn't have that sensitivity (ahem), even if Toby could be the more intimidating, shrewd consigiliere for an administration in its prime. 

 

I would argue there's a tragic element. I'm not sure that a Leo who wasn't in his hospital bed feeling his mortality, who just felt the pain of rejection from Jed because Leo didn't sensitively play his hand advising a president more concerned with his legacy than hearing Leo's advice would have been so firm that CJ could be the only choice. This is a somewhat defeated Leo looking for a custodian more than a visionary or in-fighter. 

Edited December 1, 2015 by Melancholy

[AriAu]

 In the real world, I think the COS would have been someone outside the immediate inner sanctum, but I do think there would have been some constraints, since, as Melancholy said, the best and brightest would have been backing candidates. 'Nuf said for now on that. I think the replacement would have been someone to keep the trains running on time and not someone to move things forward too much and likely would have been a senior statesman that could have handled issues with Congress....but this is not the real world and is TV, which prefers to keep the old beloved characters at the forefront as the series (and the ratings) wound down!

 

I think it would have made more sense to have it be more like "Hey, why don't
you name CJ interim because she's a good traffic cop to keep Toby and Josh from
fighting.

 

Are we sure she hasn't watched more episodes!! Only a few episodes until they do come to blows in Drought Conditions, one of my favorites of that season

Edited December 2, 2015 by AriAu

[Guest]

Not sure I like this season. Leo is sick. Jed is sick. Donna just quit.

And since I'm feeling nitpicky, I find it hard to believe they have a random temp covering for Donna. You would think there would be someone more capable to help the Deputy Chief of Staff? And that Donna would give more notice than a day?

[betsyboo]

Not sure I like this season. Leo is sick. Jed is sick. Donna just quit.

And since I'm feeling nitpicky, I find it hard to believe they have a random temp covering for Donna. You would think there would be someone more capable to help the Deputy Chief of Staff? And that Donna would give more notice than a day?

just so you don't think we're ignoring you, we are holding our tongues until you get to the end of the season!! :) cc: BizBuzz AriAu

[BizBuzz]

The season began shortly after the events that occurred at the end of season 5. President Bartlet, over the strong objections of Leo McGarry, managed to organize a peace summit at Camp David between the Israelis and the Palestinians. After numerous negotiating sessions, a peace agreement was reached, but only if the U.S. was willing to provide peacekeepers. The stress of his job, along with fighting with his best friend over the conditions of the agreement, caused Leo to have a heart attack. He resigned his post as Chief of Staff and recommended C.J. Cregg as his replacement. After some initial stumbles, C.J. proved to be more than up to the job.

 

The remaining staff began to deal with the limitations of a lame duck Presidential administration. While preparing for a summit with China, a diplomatic incident forced C.J. to remove Josh from running point on it. This, combined with Josh's low opinions of the potential Democratic Presidential nominees and Donna leaving her position as his assistant caused him to convince Matt Santos, a relatively inexperienced but very politically savvy Congressman, to make a dark horse run for the Democratic nomination. Santos agreed to take the leap, but only if Josh would accompany him. This caused Josh to leave his post as Deputy Chief of Staff to work full time for Santos.

 

While preparing for and traveling to the China summit, the President began to experience a severe MS episode, which left him almost totally paralyzed. While he managed to successfully complete the summit in a wheelchair, he was left physically impaired for weeks afterward.

 

Following the President's State of the Union address, Leo, returning to the White House in an advisory capacity, worked to convince the rest of the senior staff that there was still a lot that they could do in their final year in office.

 

In the midst of the Democratic Primary campaign, the Matt Santos campaign started out shaky but gradually gained ground as the candidate continued to demonstrate his qualifications. John Hoynes, who had originally been a strong candidate, was brought down by yet another sex scandal. As the Democratic convention approached, no candidate had a lock on the nomination, resulting in a full-out floor fight. After Santos gave a rousing speech on the convention floor, President Bartlet, who had been reluctant to get involved in the nomination fight, did some behind-the-scenes maneuvering to give the nomination to Santos. the 2006 Presidential campaign would be between Matthew Santos and Arnold Vinick.

Summary via West Wing Wiki

 

NSF Thurmont

The Birnam Wood

Third-Day Story

Liftoff

The Hubbert Peak

The Dover Test

A Change is Gonna Come

In the Room

Impact Winter

Faith Based Initiative

Opposition Research

365 Days

King Corn

The Wake Up Call

Freedonia

Drought Conditions

A Good Day

La Palabra

Ninety Miles Away

In God We Trust

Things Fall Apart

2162 Votes

[BizBuzz]

just so you don't think we're ignoring you, we are holding our tongues until you get to the end of the season!! :) cc: BizBuzz AriAu

Oops ... me thinks I might have said too much.

[eyebleach]

Ditto on keeping my mouth shut :)

[AriAu]

:) cc: BizBuzz AriAu

 

Hey, don't blame me...I spoiler tagged info for a show whose last episode ran 9 1/2 years ago!

[Melancholy]

And since I'm feeling nitpicky, I find it hard to believe they have a random temp covering for Donna. You would think there would be someone more capable to help the Deputy Chief of Staff? And that Donna would give more notice than a day?

 

IMO, Donna was very angry at Josh. Unprofessionally so. However, I dunno, it works for me that Donna has a lot emotionally tied up with Josh so she'll go above and beyond for him. However when Josh spurned Donna like repeatedly being dismissive of her requests for a lunch to talk about her future after she was already feeling limited and unfulfilled and humiliated that people like CJ and Angela have taken note of it, suddenly Donna's unprofessional devotion to Josh could turn into an unprofessional tantrum at Josh. It's not great and it really doesn't speak well on Donna's professionalism right when she was demanding to be treated like a professional but I dunno, I typically find Donna that short-sighted and childish. 

 

I get the impression that Josh has many assistants and interns. There's one hilarious moment where he comes out into the bullpen whining about having misplaced his wallet- and someone tosses it at him. Or he comes out whining about ordering a pizza. And that's just personal stuff- forget the army of assistants and aids that he has for his more difficult professional duties. I just think Josh heavily leaned on Donna for EVERYTHING from stalking congresswomen to briefing him for meetings to booking his Thanksgiving tickets home (with an attempt to get Donna to call his mother to explain the delay until Donna put a stop to that). I think Josh still had lots of help- but like a child, he was at sea because the person who sits at DONNA'S desk wasn't Donna. Note that in this ep, he could just order a random person to book his flight to Texas and it's done instantly. IMO, the show indicates that the Deputy Chief of Staff's Office was still well-stocked and functional- it's just that Josh Lyman, 12-Year Old Boy With His Secret Crush felt adrift. 

[AriAu]

it's just that Josh Lyman, 12-Year Old Boy With His Secret Crush felt adrift.

 

Is it too early to start debating whether it was a secret crush or an as yet undiscovered crush...will it reveal too much of what transpires over the next season and a half?

I think that at this point he knows he needs her, but does not yet realize the depth of his feelings.He "wouldn't stop for a beer" and he flew to Gaza, but at this point he is still uncertain of his true feelings for her-romantic, friend, confidant.... I guess in that way he is a 12 year olf!

[Melancholy]

LOL, I used "secret" for short-hand. However, I agree that Josh isn't in touch with his feelings for Donna and what they mean. I think Donna immediately felt a crush from the flashbacks on and absolutely by Amy's "Are you in love with Josh?" at the end of S4, Donna knew that she was in love with Josh. Probably earlier than that. However, I think Josh is very attracted to Donn and loves her so much- but he has no idea what that means and he can't put a name or significance on it. Like, I love Amy and Joey. I really like Josh/Amy and Josh/Joey and I even get the point of Josh/Mandy- but I don't think Josh loved or opened his heart to love any of those women. There's an immature, mercurial aspect to Josh where he evaluates his romances as the accessories to his glamorous, power-broker life. 

 

JOSH: He's a power dater. That's what power daters do. You know how I know?

AMY: 'Cause you're a power dater?

JOSH: That's right.

 

Within that, he can't put his feelings for Donna in perspective. 

[betsyboo]

Hey, don't blame me...I spoiler tagged info for a show whose last episode ran 9 1/2 years ago!

:-)) No blame thrown!

[eyebleach]

Is it too early to start debating whether it was a secret crush or an as yet undiscovered crush...will it reveal too much of what transpires over the next season and a half?

I think that at this point he knows he needs her, but does not yet realize the depth of his feelings.He "wouldn't stop for a beer" and he flew to Gaza, but at this point he is still uncertain of his true feelings for her-romantic, friend, confidant.... I guess in that way he is a 12 year olf!

 

Oh, I think he knew he was in love with her but didn't want to admit it.  It would be too complicated AND Josh is really afraid to love people for fear of them dying (his sister, his father).  He's a man with a couple 'a issues! And yet, he's my fav!

[BizBuzz]

Oh, I think he knew he was in love with her but didn't want to admit it.  It would be too complicated AND Josh is really afraid to love people for fear of them dying (his sister, his father).  He's a man with a couple 'a issues! And yet, he's my fav!

 

A couple?  ::giggle::

 

I think there was chemistry between them from the very first episode.  To me, there was so many times where Josh was way OTT with his "denial" of any feelings.  And Donna was very caring for Josh, even with all his shenanigans.

 

Like when he was wondering out loud to Sam about why would Donna try to push him and Joey together.  Or when he was visibly jealous (at least to me he was) when Donna was involved with Jack Reese.  

 

Think about how Donna took care of him after the shooting.  

 

If I were Donna, I would be pissed too if Josh ignored my constant pleas to meet "professionally" ... there was too much between them for him to just take her for granted, which is what he was doing.  

 

The 12 year old is a good description ... Josh had some smarts, but to me he was a temper tantrum waiting to happen.

[Guest]

I hope this isn't inappropriate, but I am reading TWOP recaps of some of my favorite episodes and I chortled at this.

 

Will says, "On behalf of the Vice-President, and myself, and every man who's ever had a Wonder Woman fantasy, it's a bright day." There has got to be some kind of storyline coming that will explain the crap that comes out of Will's mouth. Like, maybe he has a brain tumor? Or maybe his mother took too much LSD when she was pregnant? Or maybe the real Will was replaced with a duplicate spy from some country that is completely humor-deprived? I'm just asking for something so I can stop questioning my faith in a merciful God. Because there's no way God would create someone who would say the things Will says for no reason.

 

 

I like Will, but sometimes he says things so off the wall.  And I hated the Wonder Woman line because of the whole sexism issue I've discussed before.  

[Guest]

I'm sorry. I can't resist.

 

Santos leaves, calling out to an aide to get Josh a copy of the talking points on the patients' bill of rights. Josh has hearts in his eyes. There should be violins playing in the background. I think that as much as everyone wants Josh and Donna to get together, it's too late -- he has a new love now.

 

[betsyboo]

 

I'm sorry. I can't resist.

 

 

 

 

 

Wait till you meet Bram!!!!  <3

[BizBuzz]

Ok ... I must be an epic fail as a feminist because I don't see the sexism that some people see.

 

In any case ... which episode are you up to now deaja?  ::giggle::

[Guest]

I finished Faith Based Initiative late last night. Or maybe it was the wee hours of the morning.

 

So, general season 6 observation, I called the Santos thing above about him running for president in part because of the fact that he was in the credits.  (Obviously, I still don't know if I'm right that he runs and beats Will's guy, but I am holding fast to that theory.)  Season 6 Episode 1, I hadn't realized I was on a new season but then I was like "Hey, there's a new guy in the credits. New guy? Who are you?"  And then I started to see the writing on the wall. Or to think I did anyway.  For all I know, he could go the way of Mandy. But at one point I was like "They wouldn't add him to the credits if he were really a House member leaving."  And now that we've met his wife, I'm definitely thinking he sticks around. I do realize I am making this very hard to discuss because you all know and I don't know, and I am sorry.  But not sorry enough to shut up. 

 

Speaking of disappearing, did Amy kinda disappear too?  She hasn't been around.  Can't say I miss her.

[eyebleach]

Ok ... I must be an epic fail as a feminist because I don't see the sexism that some people see.

 

In any case ... which episode are you up to now deaja?  ::giggle::

ME TOO!

I often noticed a bit of man-splaining but I ways mostly thought that was to catch people up on how the poltical system works and I thought I was more sensitive to it because I was a poli sci major.  This stuff is my jam.

Edited December 2, 2015 by eyebleach

[Melancholy]

I also thought the sexism charges from TWW were overstated. Like, I agree that bunch of the male characters said obnoxious, sexist things. However, I don't get necessarily that the show ENDORSED that (although maybe with Danny's sexual harassment = TRUE LOVE). Still, I put Will's "Wonder Woman fantasy" in a similar category as Toby's "Send CJ to Ramallah to swat at suicide bombers with her purse" even though it's not as obviously terrible- it's part of a pattern in the whole ep, including Secretary Hutchinson and those guys that Josh met with snarking that he was working for CJ, that CJ shattered the glass ceiling AGAIN but she still has to deal with sexist crap constantly even from supposedly enlightened Democrats working at the highest level of government. 

[SingleMaltBlonde]

I can't tell you what episode I'm on or you'll realize that I watched 9 episodes yesterday....

 

You are in a safe space, no judgement from any of us....

[Guest]

Donna is working for Russell? Oh Donna. You need to work with Josh.

[txhorns79]

Donna is working for Russell? Oh Donna. You need to work with Josh.

 

That I disagree with.  She needed to get as far away from Josh as she could.  Their relationship was seriously unhealthy. 

 

 

I often noticed a bit of man-splaining but I ways mostly thought that was to catch people up on how the poltical system works and I thought I was more sensitive to it because I was a poli sci major.

 

One of the worst instances I could think of off hand was when Ainsley destroyed Sam on Capitol Beat(?) and Josh runs through the office telling everyone to come watch because "Sam's getting beat by a girl," or something very similar.  It's just like, "Really?  The worst part of all this is that a woman is beating Sam in a political debate?"   

[Guest]

Santos isn't in it to win it? My previous statements might sound silly.

Oh, but Ellie just donated to the campaign. So maybe they are in it?

Whatever. If my previous speculation was all ridiculous I'm fine with a good laugh at my expense in a few episodes.

That I disagree with. She needed to get as far away from Josh as she could. Their relationship was seriously unhealthy.

One of the worst instances I could think of off hand was when Ainsley destroyed Sam on Capitol Beat(?) and Josh runs through the office telling everyone to come watch because "Sam's getting beat by a girl," or something very similar. It's just like, "Really? The worst part of all this is that a woman is beating Sam in a political debate?"

I agree that Donna needed to as a character. But my Josh and Donna shipping is new, and I want to see them together.

[betsyboo]

Mouth. Zipped.  

 

BUT. IT'S. SO. HARD.

[Guest]

I wasn't a fan of Annabeth at first. But I'm liking her more and more.

[Melancholy]

One of the worst instances I could think of off hand was when Ainsley destroyed Sam on Capitol Beat(?) and Josh runs through the office telling everyone to come watch because "Sam's getting beat by a girl," or something very similar.  It's just like, "Really?  The worst part of all this is that a woman is beating Sam in a political debate?"   

 

Although according to canon in that very ep, Sam made himself particularly stupid and useless and vulnerable before the debate by instantly stereotyping Ainsley as a blonde, leggy, sexy Republican bimbo. Sexism was Sam's Achilles heel and he looked like such a fucking moron by dismissing Ainsley because she was an attractive woman because she kicked her ass (even though her political position should have been harder to defend). Just because Toby and Josh joined in the sexism parade doesn't mean that the show was endorsing it. This is just the kind of crap that supposedly enlightened, educated Democrat men get up to and they're realistically never punished for that shit until they find themselves underestimating a female opponent or saying something in front of the wrong (i.e. less tolerant or door-matty) woman. 

 

BTW, LOVE Annabeth. Kristen Chenowith is the best.

Edited December 3, 2015 by Melancholy

[BW Manilowe]

Santos isn't in it to win it? My previous statements might sound silly.

Oh, but Ellie just donated to the campaign. So maybe they are in it?

Whatever. If my previous speculation was all ridiculous I'm fine with a good laugh at my expense in a few episodes.

I agree that Donna needed to as a character. But my Josh and Donna shipping is new, and I want to see them together.

A small, but still really important, correction... If I may...

That actually wasn't "Ellie" who donated to the Santos campaign. I'll explain...

Yes, her first name *is* "Elizabeth", & "Ellie" *is* a common nickname for "Elizabeth".

But they don't call Elizabeth "Ellie" for short. The family (& maybe at least some of the staff) calls her "Liz" or "Lizzie", or "Lizzie B", (as I remember) for short (& those nicknames are in various episodes when the character appears, & sometimes when she's just talked about in passing). She's also the eldest, & only "married with children" (daughter, Annie, & son, Gus), Bartlet daughter--Elizabeth Bartlet Westin.

The family & staff don't call Elizabeth "Ellie", because the Bartlets' *middle* daughter was named "Eleanor" & *she* goes by the nickname "Ellie".

She's the blonde daughter, who takes more after Abbey--following in her professional footsteps, etc.--& wanting as little to do with politics/campaigning as possible, except when she really believes in an issue or opposes particularly Jed's/his Administration's viewpoint; & she pretty much believes Jed loves her sisters much more than he loves her & she can never do anything right in his eyes.

And giving 2 sister characters first names (Elizabeth & Eleanor) which share a common nickname (Ellie) is the 1 thing, I think, that Sorkin may have done that drove me, if not others who watched the show, the most crazy about the show.

And then, the youngest Bartlet daughter is Zoey (Zoey Patricia Bartlet). But you know her well already.

[eyebleach]

Some of you folks make me feel so much more normal in my obsessive detail catching.  You are my people!
 

[Guest]

Okay, I am reading another recap and I have to ask.

 

Did I miss Josh and Santos either one being gay?  Or is the recapper just making an awful lot of "they are gay lover" jokes for nothing?  I mean, Santos is married with kids which I know doesn't mean everything, but I don't remember any scene where it was pretty clear that they were just a cover.  And I always assumed Josh is straight because of Joey and Amy and (hopefully!) Donna. At first I thought the recapper was just being dramatic, but I'm reading one where she says they had sex under a Christmas tree and I really don't think I would have not noticed that.

[betsyboo]

Okay, I am reading another recap and I have to ask.

 

Did I miss Josh and Santos either one being gay?  Or is the recapper just making an awful lot of "they are gay lover" jokes for nothing?  I mean, Santos is married with kids which I know doesn't mean everything, but I don't remember any scene where it was pretty clear that they were just a cover.  And I always assumed Josh is straight because of Joey and Amy and (hopefully!) Donna. At first I thought the recapper was just being dramatic, but I'm reading one where she says they had sex under a Christmas tree and I really don't think I would have not noticed that.

oh it was the recapper. If you had been reading them all along, you'd understand his tone and snark. Because Josh "picked his guy" the joke was always that Josh was in love with him.  All of the love story is silly made up crazy.

[AriAu]

At first I thought the recapper was just being dramatic, but I'm reading one where she says they had sex under a Christmas tree and I really don't think I would have not noticed that.

 

My secretary just came in to ask why I was laughing so hard-to quote TWOP..."You owe me a new keyboard"

Edited December 3, 2015 by AriAu

[txhorns79]

If you had been reading them all along, you'd understand his tone and snark. Because Josh "picked his guy" the joke was always that Josh was in love with him.  All of the love story is silly made up crazy.

 

In fairness, there were a lot of times when the acting and dialogue made it seem like Josh was talking about and/or to a love interest rather than a possible Presidential candidate.  It wasn't totally the recapper.  

[Guest]

My secretary just came in to ask why I was laughing so hard-to quote TWOP..."You owe me a new keyboard"

You have to admit - it would make sense that Santos made the credits if he was Josh's not-so-secret lover.

[Eyes High]

My complaints with the sexism in TWW dropped off notably after Aaron Sorkin left the show. Judging from what I've seen of his other material, I don't think that's a coincidence. I think this is clearest with Donna. Anyone who claims that The West Wing under Sorkin was sexism-free need look no further than her.

 

Donna only started pursuing her career seriously and bridling at perpetually being consigned to the role of Josh's Girl Friday after Sorkin left. That conversation in Season 5 where CJ bluntly points out that Donna is turning down fruitful career development opportunities and shooting herself in the foot out of love for him never would have happened under Sorkin. The closest we got in the Sorkin years was Amy asking Donna if she was in love with Josh, but at no point was Donna's career stagnation explicitly linked to her love for Josh, and pointed out to be something negative that was stifling her career growth. 

 

Under Sorkin, Donna was Josh's humble, devoted sidekick, who was in love with Josh but never realized that it got in the way of her personal and professional growth (or realized it and ignored it), who made vague noises about wanting to do more that neither of them followed through on. The relationship wasn't presented as something dysfunctional or harmful to Donna. After Sorkin, within 1.5 seasons, Donna not only realized that Josh was holding her back but Donna finally broke free of Josh (and it was pretty awesome), left her job and launched herself on her own career path. That's not a coincidence.

 

Now, the complaint with Donna is that she took on positions after the White House for which she was vastly underqualified, not even being a college graduate. However, given that the alternative under Sorkin appeared to have been Donna happily remaining forever as Josh's adoring helpmeet subordinate (whose role in part was to ask him dumb questions for the benefit of the viewing public that he would answer in the most condescending manner possible) as the Natural Order of Things, I can live with that. 

Edited December 3, 2015 by Eyes High

[Deputy Deputy CoS]

My complaints with the sexism in TWW dropped off notably after Aaron Sorkin left the show. Judging from what I've seen of his other material, I don't think that's a coincidence. I think this is clearest with Donna. Anyone who claims that The West Wing under Sorkin was sexism-free need look no further than her.

 

Donna only started pursuing her career seriously and bridling at perpetually being consigned to the role of Josh's Girl Friday after Sorkin left. That conversation in Season 5 where CJ bluntly points out that Donna is turning down fruitful career development opportunities and shooting herself in the foot out of love for him never would have happened under Sorkin. The closest we got in the Sorkin years was Amy asking Donna if she was in love with Josh, but at no point was Donna's career stagnation explicitly linked to her love for Josh, and pointed out to be something negative that was stifling her career growth. 

 

Under Sorkin, Donna was Josh's humble, devoted sidekick, who was in love with Josh but never realized that it got in the way of her personal and professional growth (or realized it and ignored it), who made vague noises about wanting to do more that neither of them followed through on. The relationship wasn't presented as something dysfunctional or harmful to Donna. After Sorkin, within 1.5 seasons, Donna not only realized that Josh was holding her back but Donna finally broke free of Josh (and it was pretty awesome), left her job and launched herself on her own career path. That's not a coincidence.

 

I don't know if Sorkin intended for Donna to be devoted to Josh forever or if sexism played a role in their dynamic,  but I want to just remind people that Donna's first and foremost devotion was to Jed. Her relationship with Josh and his with her overshadows all the relationships they had with other's so it not surprising that the president is not a factor when there is debate about how long Donna stayed with Josh at the White House. Bartlett was the reason why she packed her belongings and moved across the country to join a campaign that was lagging behind. See my profile, how captivated she was watching Jed's State of the Union speech. Don't make me search tumblr for a gif of Donna looking at him when he was on the phone with her former English teacher. Donna loved and respected Jed Bartlett the most.

 

Josh alone didn't benefit from her years with him as his assistant, Donna herself did too. She was correct when she pointed out to CJ that "It is the White House". She had the title as an assistant but her role was beyond that. She worked on so many issues, in a capacity that an assistant wouldn't, like working with Angela Black on the budget before the awesome Shutdown,  the Benign Prerogative and meeting with some farmers in California. I could mention more but it was implied that she wasn't your typical assistant. She remained Josh's assistant and Josh selfishly kept her close all those years because the arrangement suited them. What she needed was recognition in the form of a formal  promotion and formal job enlargement. It made sense that she would want it more after her brush with death and take action then. It made more sense that she would quit on the spot. She is criticized for being unprofessional but I assume she's notified HR ahead of time and was waiting to speak with Josh. 

 

I might have been frustrated with her seemingly stagnant career growth if I watched live, but having binge watched, I can say that up till season 6, her character arc is one of the best arcs on the show.