The Bullpen

[Danielg342]

Question - would it have been different if it had been Garcia?

 

Interesting...never thought about this until now. Assuming that the writing was clear that the Morgan/Garcia banter was purely playful (because the writing isn't clear), I would think that Savannah (and Sam, who, as I understand, is still Garcia's boyfriend) probably wouldn't be comfortable with it at first, but may just "get used to it" once she understands it's just something between friends. Savannah seems to understand that Garcia is just Morgan's friend, so I could see her accepting the banter on some kind of level. Of course, I also think Morgan, out of respect for Savannah, would tone down his own rhetoric and not be as flirty with Garcia as he used to be...that stuff, after all, flies if he's single, but not when he isn't.

 

As for Garcia...well, the show went four seasons with Lynch being her boyfriend, and I guess I could fanwank Lynch not wanting to bother the "dynamic" Garcia has with Morgan, if only because Lynch might be slightly intimidated by Morgan (even though I know Morgan's not the "bully" type, Lynch likely has been bullied by people like Morgan before, and Lynch had been apprehensive towards Morgan a few times on the show).

 

Sam...that's a wild card. Haven't seen enough of him other than to know that he's a dithering fool. In fact, I wonder why Garcia stays with this guy...as Garcia herself said in "Burn", Sam wasn't good enough for her to confide in her feelings about Greg Baylor, and you'd think that'd be something you would confide in with your boyfriend. So I can't make a case one way or another if Sam would be OK with the bantering.

 

Garcia herself...well, I can see her rather enjoying the banter and likely wouldn't put up with a boyfriend that would tell her to "cut it out". Rather, I think Garcia would want a guy who'd be just as playful as she is. Someone she can play tricks with and plays tricks with her. Someone who likes to go on "adventures" just because they can. Someone who would get her twisted sense of humour and interests (because I think Garcia is twisted and would definitely be "out there" with her interests). Someone who keeps her on her toes...heck, someone with a spine.

 

Bottom line...Garcia needs better taste in men. :-p

[Cobalt Stargazer]

If I were Savannah I definitely wouldn't feel threatened by Morgan's relationship with Garcia (and this has nothing to do with physical appearance), but I would be annoyed. Similar to how I am annoyed with their relationship as a viewer. It's clear there's no sexual tension between the tw of them and it's all innocent (yet bothersome) fun. I have no problem with how they were in earlier seasons, but now they just lay it on so thick. It's similar to how the writers feel the need to write unsubs who outdo past unsubs and who are more deranged and sadistic. 

 

Just to clarify some stuff -

 

I did mostly mean that the Morgan/Garcia "bantering" has gotten bothersome because they lay it on so thick. In the early seasons, it was bearable, and every now and then outsiders would react to it, like in Aftermath when he was on the phone with her and said, "You are a goddess, woman" and when he hangs up all the people in the waiting room were staring at him. He fumbles a little, then says, "Uh, it was a work call." It was a moment, and then he went back to being serious and doing the job. Like Garcia herself, it was the spice that livened up their otherwise mostly grim every day lives, but they also knew when to cut it out and be professional. Over time, what was once kind of cute has become unbearable both because its so overdone and because there's no point to it. The closest thing to sexytimes they've had is when he stepped out of her bathroom all wet and wrapped in a towel, and given how she reacted to that situation, I can only imagine how spun out she'd have gotten if he had ever asked her out on a date.

 

As for Savannah, it doesn't really have anything to do with whether or not Derek is attracted to Penelope, because after all this time I don't believe he is. It has to do with her being the girlfriend now. Its mostly a party foul kind of thing, like getting too drunk at someone else's house. He doesn't have to want to actually do anything with Garcia for it to be a bit disrespectful towards his SO.

 

Also, I'm not so much of a hypocrite that I think shipping in canon doesn't or can't work. God knows I've written stories that feel like canon at this point because I prefer that to the show sometimes. But at the same time, I'm glad CM has avoided it. Morgan and Garcia are bad enough, and they're not dating. How bad would it be if they were?

[Danielg342]

Also, I'm not so much of a hypocrite that I think shipping in canon doesn't or can't work. God knows I've written stories that feel like canon at this point because I prefer that to the show sometimes.

 

Well, if the show were to ever go there...why not Morgan/Reid? No one in the history of television would ever think of something like that- so it'd be a refreshing change of pace- and it would help put a little bit of irony into the "I hope it was a 'she'" line Morgan delivered way back in S5.

[zannej]

Well, if the show were to ever go there...why not Morgan/Reid? No one in the history of television would ever think of something like that- so it'd be a refreshing change of pace- and it would help put a little bit of irony into the "I hope it was a 'she'" line Morgan delivered way back in S5.

:-P

 

I could never see Morgan and Reid together. I don't even see them having enough in common to be friends much less in a relationship with one another. Morgan does not treat Reid with the appropriate respect that would be needed. Plus they show zero interest on one another physically or otherwise.

 

I really can't see Reid being a match for anyone on the team, given how they treat him-- and Hotch is his supervisor so that would be completely out.

[Danielg342]

Grumpy Cat will not phase me. :-p

 

(Apparently he's very playful...anyway...back to the topic...)

 

I will say that I'm with Cobalt Stargazer in that I'd rather keep the relationships on the team platonic. Not just for realism but also because CM is supposed to be about the cases and the characters at work- not their personal lives. Plus, the characters pairing up would make for cheap drama and, at worst, would drive the team apart. So, no, just no.

 

Having said that...if anyone were paired, Morgan and Reid seem to be the only choice I might be intrigued by, just for the simple point that Hollywood tends to avoid homosexual male relationships at seemingly all costs. So it would be nice to subvert that for a change.

 

Plus, I would disagree that Morgan and Reid wouldn't at least be friends. I think Shemar Moore and Matthew Gray Gubler have impeccable chemistry together, and in S1-S4, the writers seemed to actually feed into that and made Morgan a "big brother" to Reid. Lately- and unfortunately- the writing seems to have gotten away from that, but early indicators showed that it could have been possible.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

Well, if the show were to ever go there...why not Morgan/Reid?

 

zaneej beat me to it, but maybe because I'd prefer for Spencer to end up with someone who isn't a condescending ass towards him eighty percent of the time? If nothing else, I remember Amplification when Reid said he was about to strip so the HazMat people could scrub him down, and Morgan couldn't get out of there fast enough. Given the circumstances, that was appropriate, but it doesn't speak to any secret desire Derek may have had to see Reid's body.

[Danielg342]

(I have no idea why I posted four times...the "Quick Reply" button seems to have failed me...

 

Mods, I'm so so sorry...)

 

zaneej beat me to it, but maybe because I'd prefer for Spencer to end up with someone who isn't a condescending ass towards him eighty percent of the time? If nothing else, I remember Amplification when Reid said he was about to strip so the HazMat people could scrub him down, and Morgan couldn't get out of there fast enough. Given the circumstances, that was appropriate, but it doesn't speak to any secret desire Derek may have had to see Reid's body.

 

I believe Reid was the one who told Morgan to go, not the other way around. Morgan said he wasn't going to go anywhere without Reid and was going to wait for him to get cleaned up before Reid said, "they're going to take off all of my clothes and spray me. Do you really want to see that?" Then Morgan agreed and went to the hospital.

 

I would agree that Morgan now isn't a good fit...but then again, the writing for every character sucks nowadays, including Reid. The S1-S4 Morgan/Reid...that was a different story. That was a real friendship.

[zannej]

Grumpy Cat is a "she". Her name is Tardar Sauce. <3 Grumpy cat and watched the movie 3 times. LOL.

 

Its one thing to have a working relationship and care about one another-- its another thing to have a romantic relationship with them. I think they get annoyed with one another with all the time they spend together at work. I can't see them wanting to live together or be around each other constantly. They just have different interests. Even if I felt that Morgan respected Reid as an adult and such, I think there just isn't enough common ground. 

 

I really am glad that they haven't tried to pair any team members up. I think if they did that, even with Reid on the show, it might be too much for me and I'd have to stop watching.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

I would agree that Morgan now isn't a good fit...but then again, the writing for every character sucks nowadays, including Reid. The S1-S4 Morgan/Reid...that was a different story. That was a real friendship.

 

Now this I do agree with. When Morgan dials back the condescension, etc, he's a good friend to Reid, and to Garcia for that matter. But when he's coming off like a dudebro, then I just want someone to slap packing tape over his mouth so he'll shut the hell up.

 

Admittedly, I am enough of a hypocrite to accept it if they somehow got Glaudini to come back as a mostly-but-not-quite-completely-reformed Elle, then explore the past dynamic between her and Reid. Maybe its just because she wasn't around long enough to start acting like a jerk towards him, but even now I always notice that although she was just about to snap, she never behaved hurtfully towards him. 'Course, her coming back is in my pie in the sky world, and given what MESSer seems to think of how appealing Reid is, these writers would just screw it up, so maybe its better that it doesn't happen.

Edited May 17, 2015 by Cobalt Stargazer

[Danielg342]

I had no idea there was a movie about Grumpy Cat...my how far she's gone.

 

(Regardless, she doesn't have anything on Stubbs, the Mayor of Talkeetna, Alaska, or Bosco, the dog who was actually elected Mayor of Sunol, California)

 

As for Elle...I think I'd just like to see her come back at some point, in any capacity, really. For all the flack that female characters get on this show, Elle was the only one who seemed closest to actually having a set characterization and flaws, instead of being randomly written all over the place like Prentiss, turned into a Mary Sue like JJ or not being given much to work with like Blake or Callahan.

[MCatry]

Well, if the show were to ever go there...why not Morgan/Reid? No one in the history of television would ever think of something like that- so it'd be a refreshing change of pace- and it would help put a little bit of irony into the "I hope it was a 'she'" line Morgan delivered way back in S5.

 

That "I hope it was a 'she'" line was a weird thing to say at that very moment, and it was dropped and received as if it would have been the most normal thing to say.

WEIRD. With capital letters.

And unfortunately, dropped forever.

[normasm]

I'm glad it was dropped. Morgan was implying Reid was either by himself (horrors!) or gay (even more horrors! in Morgan's book), neither of which should be fodder for discussion in a work meeting, and wouldn't be any of his frakkin' business in a private context, unless Reid were confiding in him. Any which way you look at it, the comment was rude and inappropriate.

[MCatry]

I'm glad it was dropped. Morgan was implying Reid was either by himself (horrors!) or gay (even more horrors! in Morgan's book), neither of which should be fodder for discussion in a work meeting, and wouldn't be any of his frakkin' business in a private context, unless Reid were confiding in him. Any which way you look at it, the comment was rude and inappropriate.

I agree with you. Maybe I didn't express myself correctly.

I am sorry they wrote that line.

And I am sorry there was no follow up.

No one told Morgan his comment was out of place. No one.

In that sense, I am sorry they dropped that line.

[Bookish Jen]

The irony about JJ is that it seems like Erica Messer is so afraid we won't like her that she refuses to give her a negative trait. In doing so, she ensures that she isn't likeable.

I agree with this so much. By making JJ the Mary Sue of CM, Erica has ensured so many of us no longer regard JJ in a positive manner. It's okay for Erica's golden girl to have flaws; in fact, we welcome them. After all, most of us don't mind our favorite CM characters being flawed and a bit messed up. If Reid was Mr. Perfect, I'd be Miss Puking.

Edited May 20, 2015 by Bookish Jen

[Bookish Jen]

Well, if the show were to ever go there...why not Morgan/Reid? No one in the history of television would ever think of something like that- so it'd be a refreshing change of pace- and it would help put a little bit of irony into the "I hope it was a 'she'" line Morgan delivered way back in S5.

Ugh, I loathed that line; I found it to be contemptible and downright bigoted, and so unlike Morgan, who always came across pretty open minded.

 

That being said, I don't ship Morgan and Reid, now Hotch and Reid...::goes off to a dreamy place::

[Cobalt Stargazer]

Its one thing to have a working relationship and care about one another-- its another thing to have a romantic relationship with them. I think they get annoyed with one another with all the time they spend together at work. I can't see them wanting to live together or be around each other constantly. They just have different interests. Even if I felt that Morgan respected Reid as an adult and such, I think there just isn't enough common ground. 

 

In 'Profiler, Profiled, actually, it was Morgan himself who was practically begging Hotch to back off and stay out of his personal business, that the team more or less lived together as it was and he had been trying to keep some things private. Given the situation, that they were trying their damnedest to help him, I can only imagine his discomfort with the level of emotional intimacy a romantic relationship with any of his co-workers would have called for. I get that he was ashamed of what Carl Buford had done to him, but he was facing murder charges.

 

And then there's Emily and the Doyle business, and....well....ya'll know what happened there.

[Russet29]

Its one thing to have a working relationship and care about one another-- its another thing to have a romantic relationship with them. I think they get annoyed with one another with all the time they spend together at work. I can't see them wanting to live together or be around each other constantly. They just have different interests. Even if I felt that Morgan respected Reid as an adult and such, I think there just isn't enough common ground. 

This is why I want to see more conflict within the team. I understand they're a "family," but families fight. It's unrealistic for a group of people, some with vastly different personalities, to only ever get along and respect each other under any and all circumstances. I go on a family vacation for a week and by day 4 I want to throttle someone. The fact that they spend so much time together because of work also makes me think they wouldn't want to spend much time together outside of work. They all have lives outside of the BAU and I imagine that's what they would want to focus on when not on a case.

[MCatry]

I go on a family vacation for a week and by day 4 I want to throttle someone.

Good for you!

It only takes a couple of hours for me, when we gather together every Sunday. I love rain, snow, storms and alikes just because in those opportunities we cancel the family meeting since we can't leave all the kids outside to play.

Conflicts, and their resolutions, are interesting,

Bland, Disneyana family stuff, is just plain boring.

[Droogie]

This is why I want to see more conflict within the team. I understand they're a "family," but families fight. It's unrealistic for a group of people, some with vastly different personalities, to only ever get along and respect each other under any and all circumstances. I go on a family vacation for a week and by day 4 I want to throttle someone. The fact that they spend so much time together because of work also makes me think they wouldn't want to spend much time together outside of work. They all have lives outside of the BAU and I imagine that's what they would want to focus on when not on a case.

I do agree, but at the same time, I don't see them having much time to devote to relationships outside work. Their jobs are unique, their hours are unpredictable, and I imagine it would be hard to find people to whom they would relate well. I have always been of the mind that an inter-team dalliance or two would have made some sense -- or at least, that the friendships are very deep and they want to be with each other outside of the job.

I work long hours and am with the same people day in and day out, yet besides my husband and children (I don't have much extended family), my colleagues are my best friends -- we get each other in ways other people don't. And several of them met and fell in love and got married and still work together.

I think it's different with families -- we didn't choose our families. We don't get to necessarily choose our colleagues, either -- true -- but lots of times we form close bonds with them. Just my two cents.

Edited May 18, 2015 by Droogie

[MCatry]

I do agree, but at the same time, I don't see them having much time to devote to relationships outside work. Their jobs are unique, their hours are unpredictable, and I imagine it would be hard to find people to whom they would relate well. I have always been of the mind that an inter-team dalliance or two would have made some sense -- or at least, that the friendships are very deep and they want to be with each other outside of the job.

I remember that in earlier seasons Mirren and Bernero stated that according to their research on the real BAU the majority of members were male, everyone but one member were either divorced or never married and they did travel a lot, but not as much as it is portrayed on tv (and certainly not in their own jet). It makes sense that spending so much time together will generate friction, but also love, even if sometimes is the hard type of love. Of course under the new administration of the show that type of strangled relationships were buried under the premise of 'look-how-perfect-our-family-is', and a number of love interests for everyone, as if that would be the only type of meaningful relationship you may develop away from work. And of course most of them work just peachy, except for Hotch who was dumped by Beth, and Maeve who ended up with a bullet in her skull.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

It makes sense that spending so much time together will generate friction, but also love, even if sometimes is the hard type of love. Of course under the new administration of the show that type of strangled relationships were buried under the premise of 'look-how-perfect-our-family-is', and a number of love interests for everyone, as if that would be the only type of meaningful relationship you may develop away from work. And of course most of them work just peachy, except for Hotch who was dumped by Beth, and Maeve who ended up with a bullet in her skull.

 

Re this - in law enforcement in general, not just at the federal/state level but local cops as well, there's a fairly high rate of divorce and alcoholism among its members, among other problems like depression and burnout. I would imagine that having to wade through the worst of what humanity is capable of doing to one another can put a strain on anyone's mental and emotional well-being, everything from abusive parents to out and out serial killers. There's a reason its a trope that so many TV cops have strained marriages. Its an annoying trope a lot of the time, but its also true to life.

 

What doesn't happen that often is that the spouses/children/girlfriends of law enforcement officers get targeted by serial murderers, and if they do the LEO in question likely won't remain on active duty for long. In real life, George Foyet would probably not have gone to all the trouble to track Haley down and kill her, even if it was just to devastate Hotch. The exception to this is the drug cartels and the Mafia, which employ hitmen and such who would kill somebody for a carton of cigarettes. Fictional mobsters like Tony Soprano, and real ones like Sammy Gravano, seldom do their own killing once they're the boss, they hire it done so as to not get their own hands dirty.

 

Had Haley survived the Reaper, I think Hotch really would have spent the rest of his life apologizing and making it up to her for her and Jack being in danger. Jessica was the one who said that it wasn't as if they'd fallen out of love, it was just his work that got in the way. If she had lived, they probably would have been able to work something out and get back together. I don't know if Reid would have been able to have an actual relationship with poor doomed Maeve. On paper, and in retrospect, she seems perfect for him, but part of the tragedy of her death was that he never got the chance to find out if the reality would have lived up to his imagination. Would the real girl have been able to compete with the voice over the phone? He - and the rest of us - will never know, and it makes me curse the writers all over again for dealing him such a crushing blow, then failing to deal with it in any meaningful way.

Edited May 18, 2015 by Cobalt Stargazer

[zannej]

Jim Clemente said it was particularly hard to have a relationship because he always knew when the other person was lying to him. So, I think he felt that being a profiler made relationships even harder in that respect.

 

I know that it is not uncommon for law enforcement agents to have affairs with co-workers, but I am very glad that they never went there on this show (at least not with the core team).

 

As for the "I hope it was a she" comment, I never took that to mean that Morgan was implying Reid was gay. I took it to mean that Morgan was hoping that Reid was actually getting some action as a reason to be late instead of alternatives (such as doing drugs). I think he only used "she" because Rossi previously said "I hope she was worth it". My take was that Morgan's intent was "I hope you had a good reason for being late". It was one of those lines that could be misconstrued-- and that is something true to life. People sometimes say things with one intent but other people think it means something else. I've had people take things I said the wrong way before. Is there anyone here who hasn't said something with one intent and then had someone come back and accuse them of meaning something entirely different?

 

and I just had brain freeze

[Danielg342]

That may be true, zannej, but Morgan did look into Reid's butt when making the comment. So the implication seems clear to me.

[MCatry]

That may be true, zannej, but Morgan did look into Reid's butt when making the comment. So the implication seems clear to me.

I didn't realise he did that!

[Saje]

I'm confused, why would looking at Reid's butt mean anything? I don't see one thing leading to the other at all, and I look at a LOT of butts. ;) 

 

I agree with zannej in that it was just a throwaway remark, meant more along the lines of "being with a woman would be more acceptable that other things you've done before that used to make you late - like take drugs."

[smoker]

I remember an earlier episode, it was a probably a few seasons ago, when Morgan snapped on Garcia and told Hotch that she really needed to up her professionalism game. It pissed me off so much when Hotch's response was: "She always gets the job done." Did it ever cross anyone's mind that in every case they are working against the clock and Garcia's unnecessary rants just waste time?  What would happen if they showed up 10 seconds too late to save a victim because Garcia spent those seconds with a ridiculous greeting or sign off? I'd actually enjoy seeing that.

Yes, it was s06e01, I do remember too

and I do agree with you, Morgan and Garcia's interactions are out of control, but  the bad thing about Morgan's attitude  was he was acting like some spoiled brat in that episode. He doesn't care about Garcia's comments while he is in the mood.

I miss when Hotch cut her off from time to time.

Edited May 20, 2015 by smoker

[smoker]

Had Haley survived the Reaper, I think Hotch really would have spent the rest of his life apologizing and making it up to her for her and Jack being in danger. Jessica was the one who said that it wasn't as if they'd fallen out of love, it was just his work that got in the way. If she had lived, they probably would have been able to work something out and get back together.

my thoughts about this matter:

Haley and Hotch may be hooked up again for a while, but they would ended appart again because they are not in the same page anymore, the second you marry a lawyer who wants to have a brilliant career so he can spend the rest of his life and his leisure time worshipping you and suddenly, he arrives home and he tells you he wants to be an agent of the law (and that becomes who he is) well... not many people got over that.

It's like Winona and Raylan, she keeps feeding him she has grown up and she can live with his job, 3 times they tried and fail because of her, to be fair we don't know about the last one but I am putting it on her too xP

I read/listened a line once (a show, a book, someone's comment), sorry I can't remember where

"love doesn't change the nature of a man"

I extent that to any Human Being, so you got used to it or you got out of that life

sorry for the rambling, I am really Hotch obsessed

Edited May 20, 2015 by smoker

[Danielg342]

I'm confused, why would looking at Reid's butt mean anything? I don't see one thing leading to the other at all, and I look at a LOT of butts. ;) 

 

Reid was asked if "she was worth it", which could mean he had sex with her. So Morgan says his line and checks Reid's butt...because sex between males involves the butt (and that's about as much as I feel I can explain without going beyond the bounds of the board, I hope).

[Cobalt Stargazer]

my thoughts about this matter:

Haley and Hotch may be hooked up again for a while, but they would ended appart again because they are not in the same page anymore, the second you marry a lawyer who wants to have a brilliant career so he can spend the rest of his life and his leisure time worshipping you and suddenly, he arrives home and he tells you he wants to be an agent of the law (and that becomes who he is) well... not many people got over that.

 

Let me clarify -

 

When Haley realized that she and Jack were alone with Foyet, I think she got a major look into why Aaron's work mattered so much and why he put so much into it. Had he gotten back to the house in time to save her life, she probably would have backed off of her hardcore stance against his career path. Before she left him, when he told her that he was going to join Strauss and the team in the field, she said that she didn't want to think about the women who were being killed, that she more or less wanted him to keep his word about no longer being an active field agent. It was an unfair expectation, but had Morgan not called him from a crime scene and said that Strauss had succeeded in pissing off the lead detective in record time, he would not have decided to pack his go-bag so he could both work the case and pull the BAU's fat out of the fire. They were both emotional, and they had a fight about it, but when Haley [i[became[/i] one of the women Hotch was working to protect, I think she finally realized why his work was so important to him, that he was trying to keep people safe. Had she lived through the ordeal, they probably would have been able to sit down and have a more reasonable conversation about things.

 

The real reason that Haley was killed off is the same reason that Elle left, because the actress either decided to leave or got fired. But without considering the out-of-show reasons, I think that Aaron could have put his family back together.

[ForeverAlone]

I think the only reason Haley was killed off was because the writers wanted maximum emotional punch to end this arc, and merely arresting Foyet wouldn't have been enough. So to do that, they had to make some story contortions, such as Haley being completely unaware of what Foyet looked like. I think they were just determined to kill someone (like they were determined to kill Maeve), and Haley was the best bet. It's not like they were going to kill off any of the main cast. 

[Saje]

Reid was asked if "she was worth it", which could mean he had sex with her. So Morgan says his line and checks Reid's butt...because sex between males involves the butt (and that's about as much as I feel I can explain without going beyond the bounds of the board, I hope).

 

As someone who is quite familiar with sex between males, I think that is a real reach, Daniel, sorry.

[Droogie]

I'm confused, why would looking at Reid's butt mean anything? I don't see one thing leading to the other at all, and I look at a LOT of butts. ;) 

 

I agree with zannej in that it was just a throwaway remark, meant more along the lines of "being with a woman would be more acceptable that other things you've done before that used to make you late - like take drugs."

I agree, too, that it ultimately meant nothing, just Morgan being "funny," and trying to get a rise out of Reid. I don't think it was a comment on Reid's possible addiction, because I don't think he would've said that with a smile on his face.

[Danielg342]

As someone who is quite familiar with sex between males, I think that is a real reach, Daniel, sorry.

I'm not quite sure, honestly, what else could be implied by Morgan looking at Reid's butt and saying “I hope it was a she” other than to make sure his butt wasn't “penetrated” (since a girl wouldn't likely penetrate his butt).

[thewhiteowl]

Let's leave the debate of "sex between males" and how it may or may not be accomplished, alone.  It's off topic, never happened on the show. Thanks.

[smoker]

Had she lived through the ordeal, they probably would have been able to sit down and have a more reasonable conversation about things.

 

I think that Aaron could have put his family back together.

 

It's amazing how different we see things. And I can't disagree with you, I think they'd have tried again but... not going to repeat myself, not trying to make you change your mind or anything, just different point of view. I want to say Meredith Monroe did a good job, I did like her most of the time (her last speech, it was too manipulative) and I think her acting made Haley more sympathetic after she became "the bad guy" in season 3, she was shown as a good wife and as a bitchy wife but how that change happened was let in the writing room. I hate when Megan Kane told Hotch she didn't understand how his wife let him, the one time I've been on Haley' side.

And I do agree with ForeverAlone 

I think the only reason Haley was killed off was because the writers wanted maximum emotional punch to end this arc, and merely arresting Foyet wouldn't have been enough. So to do that, they had to make some story contortions, such as Haley being completely unaware of what Foyet looked like. I think they were just determined to kill someone (like they were determined to kill Maeve), and Haley was the best bet. It's not like they were going to kill off any of the main cast. 

and not only with Haley's death but their divorce too (as I've said before). Writers needed to show a broken marriage and who else was available??

there are holes in their divorce and there are holes in 100 and there are holes in Hotch turning his office in some sanctuary after he took off Haley's photos when they divorce and they were appart for two long years. Hotch was angry after their divorce, everything was done on her way.Moreover, Haley was desperate for some attention, are you telling me she didn't hook up with anyone? that's pretty unrealistic (writers, I am looking at you).

Edited May 21, 2015 by smoker

[JMO]

I just thought this was interesting----the actor who played the kid who plays chess with Reid in 'The Uncanny Valley' (whose name, I just learned, is Eric, and not Gary---but he will be for me, forever, Gary)  is Matthew Moy, now on '2 Broke Girls'.  What I found interesting is that he is only four years younger than MGG.  Even as young as Matthew Gray Gubler can sometimes look, I'd always thought there was a much bigger age difference between the two. 

 

I know.  Slow news night.

[MCatry]

I just saw the CM season ten DVD cover.

Just make me miss the earlier seasons even more.

http://www.tvshowsondvd.com/news/Criminal-Minds-Season-10/21150#ixzz3btlvGWtp

[ForeverAlone]

Yeah I know. Poor little Reid is so tiny at the bottom.

Season one had an outsized Gideon dwarfing everyone else (not surprisingly), but it got more egalitarian in later seasons. Now for the past year or two, there has been a more visually obvious pecking order, and I see where Reid fits into that (at the bottom). For a character who was so important and such a driving force in early seasons, and to now see him diminished so much, pisses me off.

Edited June 3, 2015 by ForeverAlone

[Russet29]

Eh, it looks like all the others (minus season 1). I'm not about to overanalyze it and really, I just can't bring myself to care about a DVD cover.

[missmycat]

I guess I can take comfort in the fact that the Mary Sue is shoved in the back . Instead of being upfront and practically even with Hotch like she was for the cover of last season's DVD release.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

I was about to say that exact thing. At least Hotch is out in front while JJ is off to the side.

[missmycat]

I was about to say that exact thing. At least Hotch is out in front while JJ is off to the side.

Plus I sort of see MGG and KV out in front like that as a nod to their popularity. However had they been the same size as the rest, no doubt both would have overshadowed the 2 leads JM and TG.Something which CBS certainly wasn't about to allow. Yes they may have allowed JJ to dominate the show as though she were the lead character, but with some things even CBS is going to draw the line. Anyways  I actually think it is a nice change from the past where both MGG and KV were dead last behind everyone else.

[Guesswht]

They put JJ behind the others, i don't see what the problem is.

Kate takes away more space on the cover than JJ, she's as big as Garcia+Reid together. Yeah, i know - something is wrong with my eyes and JJ is standing in front of everyone.

All i see on the cover is Hotch, Rossi and Kate, they shoved JJ, Garcia and Reid in the background and Morgan (&JJ) has a weird (bad) place.

 

This time it's obviously not JJ's fault that Reid is in the background, 'someone' has no place on the cover but she put herself there anyway.

I really wish that season 10 never happened but it's obviously happened, because they just released the S10 DVD, oh well :( I wish they'd just re-film the whole season (The Forever People, Nelson's Sparrow and Mr Scratch were good episodes though).

[Old Dog]

Yeah I know. Poor little Reid is so tiny at the bottom.

Season one had an outsized Gideon dwarfing everyone else (not surprisingly), but it got more egalitarian in later seasons. Now for the past year or two, there has been a more visually obvious pecking order, and I see where Reid fits into that (at the bottom). For a character who was so important and such a driving force in early seasons, and to now see him diminished so much, pisses me off.

I agree. My immediate impression of the cover was that it looks like TG, JM, SM and AJC are the main stars and JLH, KV and MGG are just supporting cast. I know it doesn't really matter much in the scheme of things but it certainly reflects where the focus has been put in Season 10. Some people say that because MGG is at the front it makes a difference but to me the size of the pictures is the key to it.  I know MGG probably doesn't care a jot but as a ten year Reid fan it does make me angry and sad as without doubt MGG and TG are the most popular cast members and for me AJC will always be supporting cast. Yes it's only the dvd cover but it does carry a message.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

I know MGG probably doesn't care a jot but as a ten year Reid fan it does make me angry and sad as without doubt MGG and TG are the most popular cast members and for me AJC will always be supporting cast. Yes it's only the dvd cover but it does carry a message.

 

Although I take solace in the fact that TG is front and center, it does grate that MGG has so little prominence. You're probably right that he doesn't care, but it makes me wonder who designs the covers.

[MCatry]

I agree. My immediate impression of the cover was that it looks like TG, JM, SM and AJC are the main stars and JLH, KV and MGG are just supporting cast. I know it doesn't really matter much in the scheme of things but it certainly reflects where the focus has been put in Season 10.

We may like it or not, KV AND MGG are nowadays supporting cast. That's what their screen figures and relative impact in the episodes reflected for this season.

Visual language is not random, nor careless. Not at this level of production. And the meaning of this cover is pretty clear.

[Droogie]

Yep, if I knew nothing of the show, looking at that cover, I would think the ones on the top were the stars and the little ones at the bottom were supporting cast. Not cool, CBS.

Edited June 3, 2015 by Droogie

[Saje]

At least we get a front and center shot of Reid's... gun. :P

[ForeverAlone]

Yeah, my eyes are immediately drawn to the people on top, because they are bigger. It's only by looking closer that I saw Reid. And I don't think that was an accident, and most of the middle season covers had the characters closer in size to each other.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

In happier news, at least for me, ION is circling back to the pilot tomorrow morning at ten a.m. EST, so for anyone who wants to watch it, check your schedules.