Emily Gilmore...What is with her?

[junienmomo]

The Big Head story was a parenting failure for Emily. However, it didn't really show such bad parenting that I felt Lorelai should have run away from home at 16 and cut her parents off from herself and their grand-daughter. Ditto for how maids stayed up with Lorelai when she had ear aches. However, I don't think those stories exist. At some points in the series, Emily and Richard get into "What did we do in raising you to deserve that?", and Lorelai (rather unusually for her) doesn't meet the question head-on citing some clear cut abuse or misery that necessitated a run-away.

 

We will never have the answer to the chicken and egg question of who was more at fault. I view it as Lorelai demanding independence from an early age, and Emily demanding obedience to her choice of roles for her family. This is a natural conflict between parent and child and in some cases is only catastrophically resolvable; that is, everyone does her own thing. 

Emily had options throughout her life to improve the situation, as did Lorelai, with the caution that Lorelai was a child for a significant portion of the time and therefore less at fault for that period. The fact that the adult Lorelai chose to remain the martyr is all on her. 

 

Your observation about Richard is relevant and important to the mother-daughter relationship. He was detached from family life, wanting the 1950's stereotype of fathering. He also did not include Emily in important financial decisions like retirement, or emotional choices, like Pennilyn Lott. 

He wasn't better to Lorelai. By his own admission, his outburst at the Hayden dinner was not about her, as she commented, but about his own reputation. He did cut her slack when she ran away like an eight year old from the boring accountant, but when it came to Lorelai's relationship with Luke, he was off plotting his own Machiavellian scheme to sanitize the diner guy for a small amount of social acceptance at the club. He even derided Emily for not thinking of these things herself, which makes me wonder if Emily's Christopher manipulation wasn't as much an effort to please Richard as it was to achieve the goal.

 

It's a convoluted mess that wasn't helped by the writers' decisions to not really heal those relationships for a long time.

[ZuluQueenOfDwarves]

So, A Tisket, A Tasket is on, and Emily is advocating Lorelai use coercion and manipulation to keep Rory from Jess, which snaps Lorelai back into discussion mode with Rory and resolves their fight. It sheds a lot of light into Emily's notion of child rearing, and definitely lends some credence to the nurture side of the nature/nurture debate. She practically wants to ground Rory for the crime of spending time with Jess--just being in his company is enough to spook her into locking Rory up and throwing away the key (her words).

Lorelai, as we all know, is not a people pleaser. She has a rebellious streak, and having such a controlling mother grossly exacerbated it, IMHO. And Emily really never owns up to the role she had in driving Lorelai away, which I think was a mixture of depression, and a fierce desire to ensure Rory wasn't stifled the way she was.

I disagree that Lorelai shares an equal role in the dysfunction. She certainly played her part, but Emily was the mother. She set the tone. She taught Lorelai from an early age that her first response would be to control and criticize. She demeans the things Lorelai likes and shows great disapproval for her daughter in private and public.

Compare Mrs. Kim. Lane is not the daughter she envisioned, and there were some definite growing pains while she adjusted to the idea that her daughter is a drummer/amateur musicologist. The series ended with the Kim women having a beautiful, imperfect, healthy adult relationship, while Lorelai and Emily were still in that painful two step-one step that's always defined them. I truly think Lorelai's warning to Mrs. Kim way back in S1 took root, and that inspired her to adjust.

[txhorns79]

The Big Head story was a parenting failure for Emily. However, it didn't really show such bad parenting that I felt Lorelai should have run away from home at 16 and cut her parents off from herself and their grand-daughter.

 

I tend to think of that story as not much of anything.  It was treated like a one off joke, and never mentioned again.  I think Emily and Lorelai's problems stemmed mostly from a lack of understanding.  Emily didn't know how to meet her daughter's needs (and it could be argued that she wasn't all that interested in finding out what they were), while Lorelai wasn't particularly interested in trying to meet her mother half way without acting like she was being put out.       

[moonb]

So, A Tisket, A Tasket is on, and Emily is advocating Lorelai use coercion and manipulation to keep Rory from Jess, which snaps Lorelai back into discussion mode with Rory and resolves their fight. It sheds a lot of light into Emily's notion of child rearing, and definitely lends some credence to the nurture side of the nature/nurture debate. She practically wants to ground Rory for the crime of spending time with Jess--just being in his company is enough to spook her into locking Rory up and throwing away the key (her words).

 

Unfortunately, Emily wasn't much better by the time Rory was 21 and Emily discovered she was sleeping with Logan. We can get a little sense of how Emily and Lorelai's relationship might have gone by watching her try to mold Rory. But I think the big difference where Rory is concerned is that Emily is viewing everything with the hindsight of teen pregnancy, and anxiety over girls and their freedom, sexual and otherwise, must necessarily reflect on Emily.

 

In Dear Emily and Richard, Emily mostly seems exasperated with her teenage daughter's stubbornness, and Lorelai could have seen that as smothering. Based on season 6, I think we're supposed to get the sense that Lorelai's getting pregnant and running away caused Emily to get even more controlling.

 

Compare Mrs. Kim. Lane is not the daughter she envisioned, and there were some definite growing pains while she adjusted to the idea that her daughter is a drummer/amateur musicologist.

 

Emily seemed to be getting there with Lorelai in early seasons, but then she regressed big time, maybe to cause more drama for story purposes.

[bearcatfan]

Just watched Season 2's Sadie, Sadie and I thought the middle of that episode was a good moment from Emily. She clearly wasn't happy at first with Dean being there but quickly put it aside and was very kind to him. She even appeared to be sympathetic when Richard went on his illogical interrogation and rant. It may have been because she realized that Rory was getting upset and not for Dean's sake but it still was there. Season 5 Emily wold have reveled in Dean being uncomfortable no matter how upset it made Rory.

[hippielamb]

I think season three Emily is my favourite Emily. I find her more sympathetic and likable in this season than any other. It feels like she is trying to not be so critical with Lorelai and plays along with some of the jokes.

[cuddlingcrowley]

I agree S3 Emily is great, but late Season 6/Season 7 Emily is my personal favorite. I love her trying to buy Lorelai and Luke that beautiful house and how much thought she put into it. I also really like her reaction when Lorelai broke down over her doomed wedding.

I'm halfway through S7 and Emily is pretty on point when it comes to how she deals with Christopher and Lorelai's relationship, imo. Lorelai even stopps making quips long enough to listen to her mother's advice.

There's also a special place in my heart for how genuinely appreciative Richard and Emily are of the Dragonfly Inn. I don't think Lorelai ever realized what a huge deal it was Emily wanting to throw the tiny debutants Tea there. I don't think you get higher praise than that from Emily Gilmore.

Edited May 28, 2016 by cuddlingcrowley

[dustylil]

55 minutes ago, hippielamb said:

It feels like she is trying to not be so critical with Lorelai and plays along with some of the jokes.

Lorelai is more thoughtful of her mother as well in that season. Even buying her a DVD player as well as a number of DVDs that she would like. Naturally of course this rapprochement would soon collapse rather than be strengthened.

[hippielamb]

17 hours ago, cuddlingcrowley said:

I agree S3 Emily is great, but late Season 6/Season 7 Emily is my personal favorite. I love her trying to buy Lorelai and Luke that beautiful house and how much thought she put into it. I also really like her reaction when Lorelai broke down over her doomed wedding.

I'm halfway through S7 and Emily is pretty on point when it comes to how she deals with Christopher and Lorelai's relationship, imo. Lorelai even stopps making quips long enough to listen to her mother's advice.

There's also a special place in my heart for how genuinely appreciative Richard and Emily are of the Dragonfly Inn. I don't think Lorelai ever realized what a huge deal it was Emily wanting to throw the tiny debutants Tea there. I don't think you get higher praise than that from Emily Gilmore.

Season 3 Emily is when I started liking her, she's not written as completely antagonistic to Lorelai. We see her defend/be protective of her daughter in two separate episodes. This was the season that convinced me despite all their issues, she really does love Lorelai.

I like late season 6/season 7 Emily too. The scene where she touches Lorelai's arm is probably the most affectionate we have seen her with her daughter. Buying a home that Lorelai would love, even though Emily doesn't approve of who her daughter is marrying shows real growth. It's sad that Emily is the only one that Lorelai can open up to about the Luke situation. She can't talk to Sookie because she's all teamluke but Emily will be sympathetic (as much as Emily can be) to her.

I like her advice in season 7 about marriage, and Lorelai actually listens to her! Whatever their relationship, Emily had spent close to 40 years being married to the same man and could give insight to compromising. She does backpedal a bit when she learns about the divorce and later over Rory's possible engagement but that's believable to the Emily character.

16 hours ago, dustylil said:

Lorelai is more thoughtful of her mother as well in that season. Even buying her a DVD player as well as a number of DVDs that she would like. Naturally of course this rapprochement would soon collapse rather than be strengthened.

I love that episode just to see how far they have come. I am looking forward to it in the rewatch. I like the little hints in season three that they are slowly making progress.

[PRgal]

I have always thought that Emily's family, while deeply rooted in that part of the US, may have lost a good deal of their wealth.  They were able to keep up with appearances, perhaps by sending Emily to good schools and joining the "right organizations," but really, they were in debt.  And Emily was embarrassed by that.  And Richard's family might be "not-as-old" money, so he "technically" isn't the ideal type of husband according to HER family, but he and his family had "enough."  Or maybe I've been watching too much Downton Abbey. 

[txhorns79]

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Or maybe I've been watching too much Downton Abbey. 

Hee!  I would love to imagine what the Dowager Countess would say if she made the mistake of having a conversation with Lorelai.  I would have liked to get some sense of Emily's family.  They focused so heavily on Richard's side, and basically gave Emily nothing except a sister who I think was mentioned once. 

[junienmomo]

4 hours ago, txhorns79 said:

Hee!  I would love to imagine what the Dowager Countess would say if she made the mistake of having a conversation with Lorelai.  I would have liked to get some sense of Emily's family.  They focused so heavily on Richard's side, and basically gave Emily nothing except a sister who I think was mentioned once. 

Isn't Gran the Dowager Countess without the noble background? Or the sense of irony. Or politeness. Or the willingness to change her attitude. Or the sense of style. 

Funny how they did focus on Richard's family when everything else inside the Gilmore family was about the female relationships. The depth of the story would have been so enhanced if we knew more about Emily's mother and why Hope and Emily may have been estranged. Richard was, after all, a frequently recurring guest role.

[hippielamb]

On 7/14/2016 at 4:59 PM, PRgal said:

I have always thought that Emily's family, while deeply rooted in that part of the US, may have lost a good deal of their wealth.  They were able to keep up with appearances, perhaps by sending Emily to good schools and joining the "right organizations," but really, they were in debt.  And Emily was embarrassed by that.  And Richard's family might be "not-as-old" money, so he "technically" isn't the ideal type of husband according to HER family, but he and his family had "enough."  Or maybe I've been watching too much Downton Abbey. 

I kind of agree with this. My personal belief (not remotely canon) is that Emily was raised in that world of having proper manners and such but without any real money. Maybe that's why she is so focused on Lorelai and Rory marrying men from a certain social class. She wants the best for her girls, and it also gives her a certain power if her daughter and granddaughter are married to wealthy, society type men.

[txhorns79]

Quote

Richard was, after all, a frequently recurring guest role.

I think that was honestly just how he was billed, but he was actually a regular.  It's like how Heather Locklear was always a "Special Guest Star" on Melrose Place despite appearing in nearly every episode of the show.  I think I had read that those kind of things are all negotiated so an actor can be made to seem more important.      

[junienmomo]

6 hours ago, txhorns79 said:

I think that was honestly just how he was billed, but he was actually a regular.  It's like how Heather Locklear was always a "Special Guest Star" on Melrose Place despite appearing in nearly every episode of the show.  I think I had read that those kind of things are all negotiated so an actor can be made to seem more important.      

Good point. I based my opinion because of the females being the center of the story. While Richard's an equal member of the family, he's not a Gilmore Girl. 

[ghoulina]

On 7/14/2016 at 7:04 PM, txhorns79 said:

I would have liked to get some sense of Emily's family.  They focused so heavily on Richard's side, and basically gave Emily nothing except a sister who I think was mentioned once. 

I think she also had an Aunt Cora, who was not mentally ill, but "athletic".