Spoilers, Speculation & All Things Media!

[GeorgieNY]

Wow. Just read the comments on the FB post. People are PISSED! They ARE up to something like 214,000 likes though.

[WendyCR72]

Wow. Just read the comments on the FB post. People are PISSED! They ARE up to something like 214,000 likes though.

Maybe, but they are liking despite themselves, so ABC knows its audience.

[halaciHU]

Regarding the promised "new mythology" and my reservation about it: In the season premiere of Person of Interest they made a very subtle yet very meaningful nod to the memory of a character who was written off more than half a season ago. It wasn't necessary by the story of the episode - but it was completely human if I see the characters as real ones. That missing somebody (or any human emotion) must not be COTW related in a thoughtful storytelling.

 

So I don't believe that they can do anything good with the new mythology because they can't do anything even with the old one. It's a question of conceptional approach, and I don't think that any new mystery would change it.

[verdana]

They've really painted themselves into a corner now. Do they give fans the clip for effort and teach people their rules don't matter or just keep from releasing it altogether and further alienate a very unhappy fanbase?

I don't like being held to ransom or made to sit up and beg for a bone on a slightly longer sneak peek that if it's anything like the cheese fest of that second one I don't want to watch any way.

 

They should have released the fully extended sneak peek as normal instead of trying this stunt which has backfired and simply pissed people off.

 

Forever sounds like they've just ripped off Castle right down to using even the same well known lines and are hoping for the best but given ABC's awful record with new shows may be it will survive.

 

I expect the premiere of Castle to get decent but not stunning ratings, after four long months people are going to tune in as normal to see what's happened to Castle, the disappointing finale won't make any difference to that, it's after this I'll be interested in watching what happens.  

Edited September 24, 2014 by verdana

[halaciHU]

I'm sure they will reach the 300K for the evening - if no other way they will hack FB. Maybe I'm negative, but IMHO all channels must have had thousands of spam accounts on FB and twitter, they are needed if they want to show big numbers.

 

Forever: yes, clearly a copycat of Castle, but nevertheless it had a fresher air with being new. Not thrilled about it, but at this moment should I need to pick one, I would pick Forever, because they have the chance to pleasantly surprise me, something I gave up on Castle long ago.

 

I will be very much surprised if the premiere suffers from the finale in the numbers. If anything, then the second episode, because the new, TNT based audience is looking for the fun, not the convoluted drama. As much as the show profits from being a string of singular, non-connected episodes, it could harm it if suddenly they expect the audience to be interested in references to long gone events.

 

But even if it happens I think the numbers will go back to normal (which in this year will probably mean slightly below 2.0, with a 1.4-1.5 season minimum). Bones fans were on the warpath after S5, if I recall correctly, spreading the same threats about quitting as the Castle fandom did. Yet the premiere numbers of S6 were almost identical of the S5 finale.

[verdana]

VinceW. Marlowe says a lot of things during interviews that never end up happening or he uses certain stock words which are meaningless in the general scheme of things and this could be just another instance of that, the guy is nothing if not predictable. Then again this whole new mythology business could turn into a mess but we are going to wait and see on that one as I doubt any of us will be finding any real answers that quickly.
 
As for deliberately sabotaging Castle this confuses me as surely he needs Castle to perform to get Derrick Storm off the ground. In my view, he's simply hapless at promoting anything in a way that makes fans feel good about the show. He's never been great at it saying things that annoy and frustrate (which goes along with his suggestion that fans secretly enjoy being frustrated) rather then engender anything positive and exciting which is the usual goal and nothing has changed given the interviews over the hiatus. Amann seems to be cut from the same cloth which is no shock since he's been the one promoted by Marlowe to take over day to day responsibilities. Marlowe trusts DA to speak and act like he would, so far Amann is doing a bang up job. 
 
As for the wedding and viewers switching off, they've already been told a wedding will happen before the end of the year so you are looking at November at the very latest and that's soon enough to stave off any boredom or restlessness from the general audience. Those ordinary viewers out there are the important ones not the on line fan base which TPTB seem to treat with suspicion and contempt most of the time like some kind of wild animal that needs locking up. If they had dragged the wedding out for another full season with no hint it was every going to happen then yeah I think pretty much everyone would have got pissed off by that point. 

Edited September 24, 2014 by verdana

[Elysium1973]

So I'm watching the Forever pilot and noticed it was directed by this guy I worked with 100 years ago. He's a really pompous douche so that kind of clouded my whole view of it. There are a lot of similarities to Castle to be sure. Interesting/meddling parental figure? Check. Sassy/damaged brunette NYPD detective? Check. Giant loft apartment? Check. Attractive male lead? Check. One degree seperation from Bones? Check. (Does the actor who plays Fisher ever do anything different?). How many times is this guy going to have to be reborn? If this show stays on the air I'd advise him to not get chunky.

[verdana]

That is exactly what the story was & the story sucked with a great hissing sound. The thing that boggles the mind is that all of these professionals looked at the script & said "This is great. Let's make it the season finale."

No one comes out of that with any credit, not the writers or network execs who must have given it the nod as they do to all scripts, that doesn't say much for them. I felt sorry for the cast though having to act through that dreck and sell it. 

 

Wasn't it the network who didn't want Rick to say ILY when Beckett got shot but Marlowe persuaded them? I may have got that wrong but I seem to recall there was some big debate at the time between them as to whether the ILY finally needed to be said.  If it was Marlowe's call to finally go with it then thank God he did. I couldn't have faced them dragging it out any longer something had to give. There have been some occasions when I wonder if it's ABC that need a kick up the backside not the writers. 

Edited September 24, 2014 by verdana

[halaciHU]

they've already been told a wedding will happen before the end of the year

 

that's the usual Castle season building method. They promise in September that they will do something meaningful in the middle of the year, and fans are calming themselves in the next months that no matter how boring or meaningless the show is, there will be something great. Than it happens or not, but then comes the "finale must be great" mantra, and then rinse, dry, repeat the next season. Does anybody remember the "SO's story will be solved in the first half of the season" line from S3? I have no doubt that they will do the wedding now, even though Marlowe would probably like to honestly and organically postpone it till the end of time - that was just a too big mistake not to make amends.

Wasn't it the network who didn't want Rick to say ILY when Beckett got shot but Marlowe persuaded them?

 

It was Marlowe, they shot two different versions and he wanted (at least he said he wanted) this one. he has no imagination, but I think he has the sense to recognize when he reaches the end of the rope. 

Edited September 24, 2014 by halaciHU

[madmaverick]

http://www.ew.com/ew/gallery/0,,20302134_20854860,00.html#30220455

Castle
''Romantic, mysterious, seductive. Castle, the new fragrance by Calvin Klein.'' C+

 

Lol at EW's description of the Castle poster (I would not object to seeing some actual romance and seduction on Castle).  Calvin Klein indeed, heh.  Though I recall seeing rather more skin in CK ads. ;)  

 

Seems to me the networks can't even really compete with the cable shows even when it comes to most of their poster art.  Or even many of the fan artists for that matter.

[halaciHU]

Seems to me the networks can't even really compete with the cable shows even when it comes to most of their poster art.

 

they can't compete even the network shows, eg. The Blacklist's fake magazine covers are great. I also like the SHIELD poster - it can be seen too direct, but I like the graphical incorporation of the persons into the badge and the way Ward's direction expresses his situation. What I loved the most was the blurb under the OUaT apple poster: "I hope ABC keeps making apple posters, it's like a marketing department version of Hodor."

[tljgator]

Forever = (Castle + Elementary) / Supernatural trope that the lead can't die

 

Honestly, I had trouble getting past all the "Sherlocking" in the first few minutes (and throughout) to notice all the Castle-like qualities.  The ring on the necklace really stood out, though, as he Sherlocked that it meant she had a dead husband. *rme* It was one of the most derivative shows I've seen in a long time. Or, thinking in terms of fashion, what TLo call "Frankendresses" -- mish-mashes of a bunch of parts that worked in another context, but when stitched together are lacking.  It's a Frankenshow.

 

I did enjoy the Castle commentary in last night's Mindy episode, though.  Both Mindy Kaling & Rhea Pearlman really sold it.

Edited September 24, 2014 by tljgator

[halaciHU]

To me Forever (after the second episode) is like a compact car from a lesser brand of huge car trust. All the parts are used in other cars, readily available from the shells of the storehouse, just a little facelift on the design, a little different dashboard, that's all. Nothing special, just ample. But it can be reliable, comfortable, easy to maintain, in other words a car which is good for using. 

[oberon55]

 

It was Marlowe, they shot two different versions and he wanted (at least he said he wanted) this one. he has no imagination, but I think he has the sense to recognize when he reaches the end of the rope.

 

Then they immediately crawfished their way out of it by having Beckett lie about hearing him. With their usual skill they took what should have been a great moment and turned it into a season of secrets & lies. As a rule they are terrible at the big payoffs. After that miserable excuse of a proposal I foolishly thought maybe they will make up for it with a decent heartfelt wedding. Instead we got long lost husbands, burning cars & muddy wedding dresses. Pretty much par for the course.

Edited September 24, 2014 by oberon55

[verdana]

http://www.ew.com/ew/gallery/0,,20302134_20854860,00.html#30220455

Lol at EW's description of the Castle poster (I would not object to seeing some actual romance and seduction on Castle).  Calvin Klein indeed, heh. Though I recall seeing rather more skin in CK ads. ;)  

 

They got the mysterious bit right at least, in that it's a mystery to me how the hell they've managed to dampen down so much sexual tension, lustful teasing and longing between Castle and Beckett to the point now where I'd need a microscope to locate it. 

[verdana]

But even if it happens I think the numbers will go back to normal (which in this year will probably mean slightly below 2.0, with a 1.4-1.5 season minimum). Bones fans were on the warpath after S5, if I recall correctly, spreading the same threats about quitting as the Castle fandom did. Yet the premiere numbers of S6 were almost identical of the S5 finale.

I've seen a few doom laden suggestions out there about how Castle will do when it returns but honestly I don't see any big ratings slide on the horizon. I'm certainly no expert but my guess is that Castle will go the way of most ageing shows, the demo will slowly bleed and I expect it do drop a little more this season from the S6 average but not seriously. The time for it to matter is when a Castle clone comes along which looks a better bet to the network, then I suspect Castle will get quickly dumped. ABC must be looking very hard right now to find that replacement with Castle about to go into S7 with the two main leads ready to renegotiate terms. 

 

Andrew Rofles: “Me and CASTLE star Stana Katic on the set….” (x)

Edited September 24, 2014 by verdana

[verdana]

Stana Katic from the show Castle paid a special visit to Josh today. She was amzaing....spending a lot of genuine time with Josh talking about Legos, listening to music, and chatting. He asked her to sign his yearbook so she left him with a very nice positive message. — with Michael Steger. X

 

Nice to see her taking some time out in what must be a busy filming schedule to make this kid's day.  

[halaciHU]

The time for it to matter is when a Castle clone comes along which looks a better bet to the network, then I suspect Castle will get quickly dumped. ABC must be looking very hard right now to find that replacement with Castle about to go into S7 with the two main leads ready to renegotiate terms. 

 

That should have been Forever, but seems it will have a hard time just to survive, not to beat Castle. the two 1.7 ratings are far from solid, but it is interesting that yesterday they managed to appeal more viewers than the lead-in MAoS. Even if it doesn't beat Castle, if it manages to bring at least a 1.5 in the Tuesday 10 pm slot (which has been a Death Valley for ABC for a long time) they will have a second season and who knows what happens. Castle got a charity second chance at the end of S1, and look where it is now.

[halaciHU]

Nice to see her taking some time out in what must be a busy filming schedule to make this kid's day.  

 

From the date it looks like it's from 2011, but great to see her in private.

[verdana]

he has no imagination, but I think he has the sense to recognize when he reaches the end of the rope. 

Oh yeah I think he does too, pity by then I'm often climbing the walls in frustration. The wedding of Castle and Beckett is Marlowe's last ace to play and he knows it which is why he must be somewhat annoyed that he's reached the end of the rope on this one a little quicker than he envisaged. Can't say I'm sorry about that. 

 

oberon. Have to agree with you about the pay offs, the only one that did work for me was Always and even then the warm glow of heady satisfaction was eventually nullified by the events that followed later. I'm left wondering now if Marlowe has missed his big chance with that botched Hamptons wedding with friends and family which did look like it could have been promising (minus the Rogan bullshit obviously). 

Edited September 24, 2014 by verdana

[madmaverick]

Ha, did they not get their 300,000 likes from fb? ;)  Or were they taken aback by the fan comments to their request?

ETA: So they are up to 250,000 likes already.  I am not a fan of it, but I guess one should never underestimate the voting craziness of fandom. ;)  

 

Sneak peek (didn't we see this already?) from TV Line:

http://tvline.com/2014/09/24/castle-season-7-premiere-video-ricks-car-crushed/

 

- Am I the only one wondering why they didn't try to stop the car being crushed or check to see if Castle was in it immediately instead of running after the bad guy?

- Yes, the wind blown locks look nice but I'm thinking Stana's hair really needs to be tied back during these scenes.  Not for the first time you can see her trying to angle the hair out of her face and it's distracting for the audience. (It was really obvious at the end of Veritas when she went to hug Castle in a super emotional moment, but had to get the hair out of the way first!)

- Maybe it's because we're just seeing clips, but as much as I've loved Robert Duncan's score especially for Always, I think they should hold back on the score a bit.  It was overkill during the burning car aftermath sneak peek and a bit too much here for the action sequence.  Sometimes silence adds to the tension.

Edited September 24, 2014 by madmaverick

[halaciHU]

Sneak peek (didn't we see this already?) from TV Line:

http://tvline.com/2014/09/24/castle-season-7-premiere-video-ricks-car-crushed/

 

- Am I the only one wondering why they didn't try to stop the car being crushed or check to see if Castle was in it immediately instead of running after the bad guy?

- Yes, the wind blown locks look nice but I'm thinking Stana's hair really needs to be tied back during these scenes.  Not for the first time you can see her trying to angle the hair out of her face and it's distracting for the audience. (It was really obvious at the end of Veritas when she went to hug Castle in a super emotional moment, but had to get the hair out of the way first!)

- Maybe it's because we're just seeing clips, but as much as I've loved Robert Duncan's score especially for Always, I think they should hold back on the score a bit.  It was overkill during the burning car aftermath sneak peek and a bit too much here for the action sequence.  Sometimes silence adds to the tension.

 

Yes, this was the accidentally posted then revoked SP from around ten days ago.

 

- Cheking the car first: meeting of great minds :) That was my first reaction that somebody switch off that goddamned machine and check the trunk! You know just in case if the so much beloved fiance hasn't died yet... Sometime in the summer Matt Mittovich answered to somebody who criticised the cliffhanger, that for Kate it is a cliffhanger, because she doesn't know that they are in a TV show and Castle mustn't die. Watching this SP it looks like somebody told her the shocking truth, that's why she started to play hide and seek instead of trying to save him.

 

- Hair: true. Starts to be embarrassing, even though it's shorter now.

 

- Music: sorry, I'm not such a great fan of Duncan's work. In some places it is great, but to me the first seasons episodes, where there were selected soundtracks also, those worked better.

Oh yes and hev have another side of the super-duper-model-guitar player-car racer-skateboarder-scrabble master detective: Kate "Linebacker" Beckett.

Plus somehow the ring now doesn't obstruct her police work. It's nice to see it on her hand, it had been even nicer if they had spared the BS about not wearing it and saying that oops, sorry.

Edited September 24, 2014 by halaciHU

[verdana]

halaci. Thanks, I should have noticed. I hadn't seen it before though and presumed it was a recent.

 

Castle got a charity second chance at the end of S1, and look where it is now.

 

It's "the little train that could" as someone linked to the show once said which I always felt was kind of appropriate.  

[WendyCR72]

To me Forever (after the second episode) is like a compact car from a lesser brand of huge car trust. All the parts are used in other cars, readily available from the shells of the storehouse, just a little facelift on the design, a little different dashboard, that's all. Nothing special, just ample. But it can be reliable, comfortable, easy to maintain, in other words a car which is good for using. 

 

But aren't most broadcast shows these days like that? I mean, Castle has/had elements of Bones which was before it (author [and scientist] helping law enforcement officer of the opposite sex solve crimes, with ensuing WTWT/sexual tension, and in the case of Bones, the female ALSO had her mother murdered when she was a teenager and searched for mom's killer and the male was a single father) which, before those, were Moonlighting, Remington Steele, and Scarecrow & Mrs. King, which all followed Hart To Hart.

 

In other words, originality isn't a necessity. So if Forever steals parts of Castle, it's no more than what others have stolen. But if it can grow or even maintain water, it still may have a shot as comfort TV. And there's nothing wrong with comfort TV.

[verdana]

Good to know it's not just me that thought I'd already seen it once. 

 

I agree about the music just too much (again).

 

Yeah the ring is back and although I'm very glad to see it I do wish they hadn't tried to explain its absence away last season with an excuse that didn't hold water then and certainly doesn't now given she's wearing it on the job.

 

- Am I the only one wondering why they didn't try to stop the car being crushed or check to see if Castle was in it immediately instead of running after the bad guy?

 

 

No me too, the guy drops the controls so the car stops being crushed but then surely you go and check the bloody car first! Not ignore that and go off chasing after the guy, meanwhile the love of your life could be lying critically injured in the car somewhere. If I thought someone was in that car (let alone my husband to be) due to GPS tracking I would be either checking it myself and getting Espo and/or Ryan to chase after the guy to try and catch him. In fact for a second I thought that was exactly what they were going to do but they lost me after that when they all ran after him and ignored the car, I can't get into this scene any more than I could the first one at the car crash site it's overblown manipulative drama which doesn't do much for me unfortunately. 

 

Oh yes and hev have another side of the super-duper-model-guitar player-car racer-skateboarder-scrabble master detective: Kate "Linebacker" Beckett.

 

Badass crazy Beckett sells and the writers know it. I sense we will see a lot more of her like this in the premiere. It will help to wash away the memory of sappy Beckett who doesn't remember she got married once and allowed her dopey douche of an ex lover to get her breaking into a car risking her badge with barely a murmur. 

 

ETA. Oh and I believe that sneak peek should have been posted in the media thread but too late now, another sneak peek has just come out and I've put it over there. 

Edited September 24, 2014 by verdana

[S55]

 

But aren't most broadcast shows these days like that? I mean, Castle has/had elements of Bones which was before it (author [and scientist] helping law enforcement officer of the opposite sex solve crimes, with ensuing WTWT/sexual tension, and in the case of Bones, the female ALSO had her mother murdered when she was a teenager and searched for mom's killer and the male was a single father) which, before those, were Moonlighting, Remington Steele, and Scarecrow & Mrs. King, which all followed Hart To Hart.

 

In other words, originality isn't a necessity. So if Forever steals parts of Castle, it's no more than what others have stolen. But if it can grow or even maintain water, it still may have a shot as comfort TV. And there's nothing wrong with comfort TV.

 

Agreed. There's very little true originality on TV right now. Look at how many US shows are adapted from a non-US version (and have been for years) along with shows that are close in concept to existing shows. Personally, I can't look at the Mysteries of Laura show and not chuckle imagining it as what could potentially happen to Castle somehow should Beckett become a mom on it (which, because that show looks awful to me (and maybe just me), is NOT a compliment, lol). IMO, most TV originality is on cable (with some exceptions) because that medium tends to take more risks than network for various reasons and circumstances. Network is typically more comfort TV and cable is edgier. Not an absolute by any means, but my observations. 

[verdana]

Mega Buzz: Castle's Mystery, a Homeland Feud and the Bones Conspiracy at TV Guide

 

Any last-minute spoilers before the Castle premiere? — Michelle
Although it's not built as a two-parter like last year's season-opener, don't expect to get all the answers about who caused Castle's car accident or why by the end of the premiere. But do be prepared for the answers that are immediately available to make every character — even Beckett — seriously evaluate how much they really know (or believe in) Castle. The only silver lining: Those immediate answers don't necessarily paint the full picture. But will the damage already be done?

 

This is a rehash of that article a few days ago which was obviously trying to stir up concerns amongst the fans about what problems could lie ahead for Caskett in the future due to his disappearance.   Nothing new here, they must be getting desperate going over existing spoilers again and presenting them as fresh information. 

[verdana]

Sneak Peek Three is out here.

 

Obviously happens before the car wrecking scene.

[VinceW]

verdana….As for the wedding and viewers switching off, they've already been told a wedding will happen before the end of the year so you are looking at November at the very latest and that's soon enough to stave off any boredom or restlessness from the general audience. Those ordinary viewers out there are the important ones not the on line fan base which TPTB seem to treat with suspicion and contempt most of the time like some kind of wild animal that needs locking up.

Sabotage might be a harsh word, but any long wedding delay could drop viewership numbers to rerun levels after episodes 1-3. In many cases, an ordinary viewer just checks out instead of trying to find reasons to continue watching. They don’t join an online forum, follow them on twitter, or read interviews, etc. A “before the end of the year” wedding could mean anything in Marlowe’s world.

[whack-a-mole]

Sabotage might be a harsh word, but any long wedding delay could drop viewership numbers to rerun levels after episodes 1-3. In many cases, an ordinary viewer just checks out instead of trying to find reasons to continue watching. They don’t join an online forum, follow them on twitter, or read interviews, etc. A “before the end of the year” wedding could mean anything in Marlowe’s world.

They're still on about the damn wedding? Just buy some flowers off a street vendor and go to city hall already.

[halaciHU]

But aren't most broadcast shows these days like that? I mean, Castle has/had elements of Bones which was before it (author [and scientist] helping law enforcement officer of the opposite sex solve crimes, with ensuing WTWT/sexual tension, and in the case of Bones, the female ALSO had her mother murdered when she was a teenager and searched for mom's killer and the male was a single father) which, before those, were Moonlighting, Remington Steele, and Scarecrow & Mrs. King, which all followed Hart To Hart.

 

In other words, originality isn't a necessity. So if Forever steals parts of Castle, it's no more than what others have stolen. But if it can grow or even maintain water, it still may have a shot as comfort TV. And there's nothing wrong with comfort TV.

 

Just to make it clear: I wrote my analogy as a kudos, that Forever did the best what they could do and made a perfectly functional show. I hope it will prevail, because beside being good for the goal, I have no bad experience yet about their inability of improvement, so I can hope that they can be even better.

 

On the other hand I'm sure that if Forever were aired on another channel, ABC would have already sued them for plagiarism. There's one thing when the core concept is similar (or even the same) as a previous show. Forever is not similar in general, it is paractically the same on the details level, even with the same dialogue situations. In certain scenes the differences were on the level of a fake "adidos" trainer: enough to avoid a lawsuit but similar enough to be mixed with the original.

 

How about this: The male lead is in the box the first time, because his special knowledge about the means of killing made him the primary suspect of a murder. he is smug and assertive. The sexy detective (tall, willowy brunette, wears the ring of an unexpectedly deceased close relative on a chain around her neck) brings him to book for some embarrassing findings in his life, but instead of him being embarrased, he instantly turns the accuses into a sexual innuendo, embarrassing her. Sounds familiar? 

 

While I admit that being completely, ingeniously original is next to impossible - mainly on network TV where people are dying for the proven formulas -, there is a distinctive line between being a creative with a wide pool of idea sources and being a copycat. 

 

(BTW: the funny thing is, that if you and halwiederman were right and adding originality to the basic concepts would have had no importance, then Castle should be cancelled immediately and be replaced by Forever, because it's the same, so it should bring the same results as Castle for a supposedly much lower sum.)

Forever didn't tank horribly last night. I'm interested to see what happens next week. I still don't think it's the Castle replacement. I think Castle has one more season in it beyond 7 and that's it. So the replacement will probably be something else. 

 

That it can not be (because it failed) doesn't mean that it wasn't intended to be.

[Cyranetta]

 

halwideman: But that's not necessarily a bad thing. I have a lot of respect for a good television formula.

 

In a way, formula television is kind of like wine or beer. When it's well-crafted, it goes down smoothly, just the kind of drink with which to relax. Not every drink needs to be an exotic cocktail invention.

[halaciHU]

p.s. why do people keep calling me HalWIEDERMAN???

 

There is no "E" or "R"

 

Haven't you guys seen America's Sweet Hearts?

 

Honestly sorry, my bad! Mostly working with Germans, probably that's why.

[Elysium1973]

When I think about the "regular" viewers I immediately think of my parents. They're in the typical Castle demo (over 65), have been watching from the beginning, and like it for the cases and the chemistry/romance of Caskett. I wouldn't peg them as shippers...but maybe I would. They were both very disappointed with finale. They didn't understand why they couldn't get their nice summer send off of a "lovely wedding in Nantucket" ( that's a direct quote from my mom). She might not have known where the hell they were but she knew she was frustrated. And then she has me to do deal with - which obviously doesn't make it any better. Now, with the scheduling on Monday night they have three shows they watch at the same time: Blacklist, NCIS: LA, and Castle. Right now LA is going to be watched on demand, but they're not sure how long their patience will hold. .

My point is that a lot of people don't want their "easy" shows like Castle or Bones or even that Forever show to be all angsty and melodramatic. It should be dessert (someone on this board said that once and it's a great description) or comfort TV. Leave the drama to shows that can handle it, like Good Wife or Blacklist. Don't try to be something you're not. Know your audience. It's not a whisper but a roar of discontent. Writing to frustrate your fan base is idiotic - especially when you're talking about someone like Marlowe. He isn't Dick Wolf. He's not Chris Lloyd or Steve Levitan. Somewhere along the way he started to believe his own press and stopped being a chubby bearded guy married to a pretty average looking gal. They're aspiring to be something they're not and that's my problem. I liked what that average looking couple put out, in the beginning. It was their story, kinda. Then Caskett got together and no one knew what to do. Writing happy is hard. But that's what this show is, or has mostly been. Throwing contrived drama/obstacles/secrets has always been a fucking disaster, yet AWM can't seem to learn from his mistakes. And for me throwing together some slapdash wedding isn't going to be that satisfying. I'm sorry, it isn't. Getting married in the precinct is lame. Or at the loft. Maybe I'm just spoiled by the Bon..., I mean the show we dare not speak of, wedding. Cyndi Lauper singing At Last? Bringing back all the important players, including the bride's father? Beautiful venue, heartfelt vows, and a true sense of occasion? These are all important, to me at least, and I got really emotional watching it because I love those characters. It's the same with Castle. I don't always love everything about them (doofus Castle is the worst) but I love them, as a couple. I wanted to see them have that moment and I'm not sure if it'll ever be quite right. And it depresses me because it just didn't have to be that way. It's another contrived obstacle and at this point, the blush is off the rose.

Edited September 24, 2014 by Elysium1973

[S55]

I guess no one has seen that ultra cheesey yet hilarious movie!

 

I've seen it...once. Which is why I didn't get the reference, lol. 

[madmaverick]

Nathan is live tweeting the premiere.  I sense that he'll be in for more of the fiery reaction (heh) that he got while live tweeting FBFW.

 

Nathan Fillion @NathanFillion  ·  4m
Castle fans- I’m going to live tweet the premiere of Castle. I’ll try for east coast, but I may work late, so… maybe west coast.

 

Nathan participated in a live stage reading of a blacklist script, playing a cult deprogrammer also named Rick.  Have we had any cults on Castle? I sense a theme...

 

http://gointothestory.blcklst.com/2014/09/black-list-live-returns-with-the-seekers-of-perpetual-love.html

 

I did enjoy the Castle commentary in last night's Mindy episode, though.  Both Mindy Kaling & Rhea Pearlman really sold it.

 

I did too.  Though i guess if Castle is being perceived as anything, it's an 'old lady' show.  The demo's always skewed older, but that doesn't really seem reflected in much of online fandom, which seems to skew much younger, into teenager territory actually, judging from some maturity levels. ;)

 

I checked out The Mindy Project after seeing that charming clip with the Castle reference.  I'd checked out the pilot when it first aired because I do think Mindy Kaling is a talented writer, but the comedy and the tone weren't quite strong enough to hook me.  Fast forward to the end of last season and I read some critical praise for the way that show resolved its WT/WT in true romantic fashion.  So I checked out how they did it and loved it.  Show had definitely improved.  Mindy's an unabashed lover of romantic comedies (as is the character she plays) and that definitely comes through in her writing of the romance and the comedy on the show.

 

 I was curious to see how that show would fare with the writing of a couple in a relationship after the WT/WT had been resolved as that is often tricky territory, and after watching the first 2 episodes of their new season, I come away impressed.  Those 2 episodes are worth a look for people who enjoy good romantic comedy, and for Castle viewers even for comparison's sake, just to see how much we missed out on seeing with Castle/Beckett, how it could have been done more satisfyingly, and to enjoy it somewhat with another cute couple. ;)   All the lost potential for romance, comedy, heart, relationship growth.  Not to mention abundant sexy times.  The writers there actually realise what a honeymoon period means (it's more the tone than anything graphic), and know how to balance it out with interesting, relevant and realistic relationship growing pains and adjustment from friendship to romantic relationship.  Ep. 2 with the Castle reference dealt with meeting the mother in law, and I got to say that brunch meeting was far more entertaining than the pure awkwardness in our dinner with parents on Castle.

 

The romance/romantic comedy is still the bread and butter of Castle in my opinion.  Caskett is the reason I watch.  Sometimes I feel they are in danger of forgetting that when they somehow sucker punch out a lot of the fun, the joy, the romance in the relationship with the way they write them.  

Edited September 24, 2014 by madmaverick

[S55]

So, Nathan's going to livetweet the premiere. Interesting. Wonder who else will join the livetweet party with him & Penny now. 

 

ETA: Jinx madmaverick! ;) 

Edited September 24, 2014 by S55

[KaveDweller]

Nathan participated in a live stage reading of a blacklist script, playing a cult deprogrammer also named Rick.  Have we had any cults on Castle? I sense a theme...

 

You know, I don't think we have seen a cult.  They should though, it would be better than some of the repetitive ones we've gotten.

[Elysium1973]

We now have two great posters whose names start with hal which is my problem! I shall call halwideman hal and halaciHU hala. God, that's still really confusing. Oh well.

Interesting comments above. I thought the second episode of Forever was much more watchable than the first. This is probably because this guy I worked with didn't direct the second episode. When not-Detective Beckett was talking to her captain in the suspiciously similar police station I was very, very worried she was going to call her "sir". Thank god that didn't happen. Judd Hirsch and Susan Sullivan should do their own show.

I quite like looking at Ioan Gruffudd, so that's a plus. And who doesn't love any non American accent? I often wonder if the UK fans like or dislike American accents. Some are grating (Boston drives me nuts) some are lyrical (deep South), but I really prefer English/Irish/Australian accents. Scottish can get a little garbled to me if it's too thick. Sorry, random aside. I'm ready for Downton to come back so I can pretend that Dame Maggie is my best friend.

Nathan live tweeting the premiere? Oh boy. That should make it interesting. Twitter will probably break.

Edited September 24, 2014 by Elysium1973

[verdana]

ABC's 'Castle' returns: 5 things to know about the season 7 premiere by Julie Boudwin at Nola.com. 

[verdana]

Castle Season 7 Premiere - "Driven" Advance Review, Runaway Groom? at Your Entertainment Corner

 

It's rather spoilery, which I know sounds dumb to say in a spoiler thread but it gives up a few more bits of information that I can't remember from previous reviews, or may be by this stage I'm getting in a muddle with all the information floating around. 

Edited September 24, 2014 by verdana

[turnitwayup]

Have we had any cults on Castle? I sense a theme...

Wasn't the victim in the Swan Song ep left/escape a cult?

Judd Hirsch and Susan Sullivan should do their own show.

I would watch that. Instead of a Derrick Storm show, give Martha a comedy spin off revolving around her social life and acting studio. Judd can play her love interest if Forever doesn't last past the season.

[WendyCR72]

Beautiful venue, heartfelt vows

 

Yes! Regarding that "other show", it was a treat that the vows not only included a letter from season 2 (and one of its best episodes, ever!) and remembered the "I could be a duck!" quip from Brennan in the pilot.

 

I was damned impressed.

 

I can only hope when Castle has its turn with a wedding, that it can be even half as great and remember its history...

[verdana]

Episode 7.07 Title revealed at Spoiler TV

 

"Once Upon A Time in the West"

 

I hope Marlowe is not trying to suggest with this title any comparison between his output and that of the work of the great Sergio Leone.  Although they could have Castle do something to pay a brief homage to the movie (without shooting a child obviously), I'll take Nathan in a full cowboy outfit please writers, lots of dust swirling around, a suitable score from Robert Duncan (no Always theme tinkling away here thank you) a grand solo entrance holding a gun and a horse somewhere in the mix...okay may be I'm getting a little carried away.

Edited September 25, 2014 by verdana

[verdana]

Based on the information kindly provided by Nadine and S55 (apologies I think I've been calling you SSS in the past!) and the latest spoiler I am going to up-date the episode list:

 

#Castle #Writers #Directors #S7
Ep1~>Amann/Bowman
Ep2~>AWM/Riley
Ep3~>Creaseys/Woods
Ep4~>Hanning/Bowman
Ep5~>Adler/Roe
Ep6~>Terri/Holahan
Ep7~>TPW/Riley 

 

#Castle #Titles
Ep1~> Driven
Ep2~> Montreal
Ep3~> Clear and Present Danger
Ep4~> Child's Play
Ep5~> Meme Is Murder
Ep6~> Time Of Our Lives
Ep7~> Once Upon A Time in the West 

Edited September 25, 2014 by verdana

[S55]

Episode 7.07 Title revealed at Spoiler TV

 

"Once Upon A Time in the West"

 

I hope Marlowe is not trying to suggest with this title any comparison between his output and that of the work of the great Sergio Leone.  Although they could have Castle do something to pay a brief homage to the movie (without shooting a child obviously), I'll take Nathan in a full cowboy outfit please writers, lots of dust swirling around, a suitable score from Robert Duncan (no Always theme tinkling away here thank you) a grand solo entrance holding a gun and a horse somewhere in the mix...okay may be I'm getting a little carried away.

 

I just realized the title of 7.07 also is a lyric from that Will Smith "Wild Wild West" song. Ha! What a blast from the past. 

 

verdana, I've got this great potential image of Nathan in my head now. Thanks for that. ;) 

[KaveDweller]

Wasn't the victim in the Swan Song ep left/escape a cult?

 

There was a cult mentioned in the episode, yeah.  I don't remember if they were behind the death or not though.  But I don't really count that because of the weird documentary-style thing.  We didn't really get to see Castle theorizing or making comments. I don't think we saw them meet a lot of people in the cult either.  I think the show could have a lot of fun with that. if they tried.

 

But Swan Song is one episode I never re-watched so I could be misremembering.

[Elysium1973]

Episode 7.07 Title revealed at Spoiler TV

 

"Once Upon A Time in the West"

 

I hope Marlowe is not trying to suggest with this title any comparison between his output and that of the work of the great Sergio Leone.  Although they could have Castle do something to pay a brief homage to the movie (without shooting a child obviously), I'll take Nathan in a full cowboy outfit please writers, lots of dust swirling around, a suitable score from Robert Duncan (no Always theme tinkling away here thank you) a grand solo entrance holding a gun and a horse somewhere in the mix...okay may be I'm getting a little carried away.

I have dim hopes about Castle doing a western episode, though that could have something to do with being from Texas and being surrounded by "cowboy" scenarios 24/7. If anyone can pull it off it's TPW. I have to admit it would be endlessly amusing to see Caskett get married on a dude ranch. You know Fillion would be all about dressing as a (space) cowboy with Luke as the maestro of fashion debacles. It could be HH bad or...it could be That 70's Show. Oh vey.

Did anyone else get a little queasy at the mention of Castle being photographed with another woman? It's a well they go to entirely too often for my taste. Busty reporters, ninjas, strippers, talk of all Castle's prior conquests, it really grates. I don't want to think about him with other women. It grosses me out and it's totally disrespectful to the character of Beckett. Not helping matters is Fillion's obvious relish in all women other than Kate. Can't they find anything else to generate drama other than distrust?

[verdana]

I know it hasn't aired yet but I'm not understanding why people (reviewers who have seen it) are annoyed with Ryan and Esposito. They follow evidence. It's who they are. Unfortunately there is going to be evidence that makes it look like Castle was involved in his own disappearance. Someone has to be the devils advocate. They both aren't Beckett. Her job is to believe in him. You need to have characters that give you an uncomfortable point of view.

Espo and Ryan have to do their jobs as cops which is investigate whatever evidence is placed in front of them and draw conclusions from that I quite agree. However, this is not some stranger they are investigating but a man they've worked alongside for six years, risked their lives with and he's about to get married to a woman they admire and whose judgement they presumably trust. So I can understand on a purely emotional level why some reviewers may have been somewhat irritated by any turn of events which has the boys (or Beckett) seriously doubting Castle even if they are doing their jobs. I guess it depends at what level they start to doubt, if it looks obviously like some kind of set up and they've immediately condemned the guy then yeah I'd be annoyed by that. 

 

Of course in the real world they wouldn't be allowed to touch this case with a ten foot barge pole good job TV doesn't care about such trifling matters. 

[verdana]

I have dim hopes about Castle doing a western episode, though that could have something to do with being from Texas and being surrounded by "cowboy" scenarios 24/7. If anyone can pull it off it's TPW. I have to admit it would be endlessly amusing to see Caskett get married on a dude ranch. You know Fillion would be all about dressing as a (space) cowboy with Luke as the maestro of fashion debacles. It could be HH bad or...it could be That 70's Show. Oh vey.

I'd rather not see them married in a western themed wedding thanks there's so much that could go wrong there even with TPW writing it but given the title they had better give me the goods elsewhere. I want Nathan in a well fitted (Luke!) cowboy outfit, Stana too. I'm already pondering on the kind of cute western style shirt she could wear (but I guess that's for the fashion thread) and remember the hats. I want lots of horses and cows since they're at a ranch, a tense stand off between Caskett and the murderer and not forgetting a bar room brawl straight out of Dodge City - however since ABC are seemingly on a tight budget where Castle is concerned they'll probably downsize it to a rather loud argument at the bar.

Edited September 25, 2014 by verdana