Derek Morgan: He's Got Good Abs

[Droogie]

I agree, Normasm -- lots of sensory overload in nursing. But I am pretty touchy with my family and friends. And if I ever met MGG, I might have to hug him. The trick would be getting me to let go. I'd hug you, too!

[normasm]

Hugs are the best! They're the main weapon in my arsenal for world peace!!!

 

*I'd hug you too*

Edited April 24, 2015 by normasm

[Danielg342]

Hugs are the best! They're the main weapon in my arsenal for world peace!!!

*I'd hug you too*

I'm the same way- very much a huggy guy. To quote The Most Interesting Man In The World, I'm a lover, not a fighter- but I'm a fighter too, so don't get any ideas. :-p Edited April 24, 2015 by Danielg342

[Bookish Jen]

I think its likely that the cast and crew probably wished Shemar a happy birthday through private messages or calls.

Here's the video btw

 

It was also Jason Bernero's birthday.

Thank you so much for sharing this. The affection the cast shows towards each other is so touching. The CM cast truly seem to love and care about each other. And yes, I adore the sweet and very genuine friendship between Shemar and Matthew. I love it when men feel comfortable within themselves to show the loving, vulnerable and warm aspects of their personalities and character.

 

And one of my FB friends, Susan, a woman I know through writing-related circles, will love this. We have bonded through our mutual love of CM. She's a huge Shemar fan, so I just had to post this to her FB page. And she can definitely use a good dose of Shemar considering she's having a health issue with her hand.

Edited April 24, 2015 by Bookish Jen

[Cobalt Stargazer]

As for Morgan, I don't think he intended to get Carl murdered. His intention was to do something for the greater good by putting the info out there that he'd been the victim of sexual abuse and he was trying to encourage other victims to come forward. It's something that has actually helped some victims in the past to find the courage to open up. He was visibly upset when he heard that Buford was murdered.

 

I have to defend Derek here, my general ambivalence towards him aside.

 

IMO, its a fair stretch to say he "got Carl murdered". Yes, he spoke out on television about his abuse after Rodney's arrest, revealing the whole truth after a long silence that ultimately resulted in Carl's death, but the most I'd consider him guilty of is not wholly thinking it through. If anything, he was trying to clear up the press' misconception that being abused had turned Rodney into a killer rather than something internal, particularly after Gordinsky had just said that it had. Had Rodney's own son not been molested by his swim coach, had he dealt with his trauma from what Carl did to him, there'd have been no triggering event. Derek dealt with his issues and made something out of himself instead of letting it wreck his life, even if he hid it from his co-workers at first out of shame.

 

What always gets me about Restoration is Carl's false piety over his jailhouse conversion to Islam, as if that makes him clean instead of just a monster wrapping himself in righteousness. If its true that God don't like ugly, then maybe Allah doesn't either, and its Derek who says that Carl joined a group that hadn't figured him out yet. I'm not religious, although I was raised Baptist and then drifted away from it when I got older, but it always grates my cheese when hypocrites of whatever stripe hide behind their so-called faith to cover up what they really are. The worst kind of hypocrites are murderers and molesters who have their come to Jesus moment after they've made wreckage out of other people's lives.

 

Ultimately, if Derek is responsible for Carl Buford's death, then perhaps Aaron really was responsible for George Foyet killing those people on the bus. Hotch knew that Foyet was crazy and dangerous and determined to make himself heard, so shouldn't he have been able to predict that he would lash out in one way or another? Because that's what's being asked of Morgan here, to somehow know that his words would put Carl's life in jeopardy, and I don't see how that would be remotely possible. YMMV.

[Danielg342]

Ultimately, if Derek is responsible for Carl Buford's death, then perhaps Aaron really was responsible for George Foyet killing those people on the bus. Hotch knew that Foyet was crazy and dangerous and determined to make himself heard, so shouldn't he have been able to predict that he would lash out in one way or another? Because that's what's being asked of Morgan here, to somehow know that his words would put Carl's life in jeopardy, and I don't see how that would be remotely possible. YMMV.

I had a lot of problems with “Restoration”- chief among them how Stan Gordinski turned into a blubbering suck-up- but Morgan's words with Buford was not one of them.

I think, fully, that Morgan knew what he was doing, and that by having the press conference, he knew entirely that Buford was going to experience some major pain. Earlier in the episode, when Buford was playing coy with Morgan, Morgan warned Buford about “what happens to child molesters in prison.” Buford then decided to open up, but not fully, so Morgan decided to teach him a lesson by telling the public that his molester was Buford.

This may be unsettling, but I'm okay with that. Buford was still every bit as slimey in “Restoration” as he was in “Profiler, Profiled”, and still seemed determined to ruin Morgan's case just like he had six years prior. Like the true molester that he was, Buford still wanted to exhibit control and he did, so Morgan had to turn the tables. Yeah, he did so in an extreme way, but the way I see it, Morgan had no other options- the only card he had left with Buford was revealing his real past.

Furthermore, I would argue that Morgan is definitely the kind of guy who'd adhere to frontier justice if given the chance. He was always the kind of guy who'd shoot first and ask questions later- I think of the early years where he tackled and fought with impunity and how he emptied that clip into Billy Flynn and how he went rogue to hunt for Ian Doyle. Plus, I can imagine that having his molester alive had to have weighed on him. Sure, I doubt he'd want death on anyone, but this is his molester he's talking about, so if he had the opportunity to dispatch him, Morgan would. It of course helped that Buford goaded him into it.

[thewhiteowl]

I didn't mind the Closer or Morgan or whoever lying to obtain a confession because that is real. Police in this country will say anything to get a suspect to talk. If you don't know this, I hope you never get arrested in the US.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

I had a lot of problems with “Restoration”- chief among them how Stan Gordinski turned into a blubbering suck-up-

 

I don't think Gordinski did anything like blubber. If it had been up to him, Derek would have ended up where Carl did, so at the very least he owed him a sincere apology. He did get it wrong, and it would have been kind of ridiculous if he hadn't at least tried to make it right.

[Danielg342]

I don't think Gordinski did anything like blubber. If it had been up to him, Derek would have ended up where Carl did, so at the very least he owed him a sincere apology. He did get it wrong, and it would have been kind of ridiculous if he hadn't at least tried to make it right.

I agree the apology was warranted- it just bugged me how it was delivered (he sounded like he was grovelling) and it bugged me that Gordinski had no other role in the episode except to apologize to Morgan.

[zannej]

I think that Gordinski just felt extremely guilty because he gave Morgan such a hard time and thought the worst of him only to find out that he was a victim. So, not only had he failed to protect Morgan from abuse, he made things worse for him. 

 

One thing I was bothered by was how Morgan seemed to think he was the ONLY victim at first when he now knows the statistics and that abusers like that sometimes have hundreds of victims.

 

thewhiteowl, for me, it depends on what the cops are lying about-- and the FBI is held to a higher standard. There are certain things they are not allowed to lie about. They are not allowed to say that they have a DNA match or fingerprint match. They also are not allowed to tell people they have immunity and that things can't be used against them in court because people need to be aware of their rights. Furthermore, once a person asks for a lawyer, they are not allowed to continue questioning them. They are also not allowed to make threats if the person doesn't confess. That said, they *can* carefully phrase things to trick people. One of their biggest scams is to coerce people into taking a polygraph-- which is basically used as a tool to intimidate people into confessing and to also get them to give up their 5th amendment right to remain silent. Anyway, FBI can say things like "What if I told you" to set up a hypothetical situation. That's why its important to pay attention to what questions are being asked and to ask if you are free to go and if you are not, request a lawyer. 

 

So, has anyone heard any word on contract negotiations for Shemar thus far?

[normasm]

I think that Gordinski just felt extremely guilty because he gave Morgan such a hard time and thought the worst of him only to find out that he was a victim. So, not only had he failed to protect Morgan from abuse, he made things worse for him. 

 

One thing I was bothered by was how Morgan seemed to think he was the ONLY victim at first when he now knows the statistics and that abusers like that sometimes have hundreds of victims.

 

 

You see Gordinski become queasy when Reid is going over the victims list. He says he knew most of those kids and just thought they were trouble makers. I think his unease and subsequent apology to Morgan were 100% believable from a decent man who found out how totally wrong he was, and how a lot of people were hurt who didn't need to be because he supported a serial molester/rapist.

 

And, yeah, I am a bit bothered by the fact that Morgan just got his tail out of there and thought he was the only one, when, if he had been more mature, he should have gone after Buford the moment he became a cop, knowing there were at least several more victims, and future victims.

[Danielg342]

No news on his contract, but he does have a new girlfriend, soccer player Shawna Gordon- old enough to be his daughter:

http://mobile.news.com.au/sport/sports-life/former-western-sydney-player-shawna-gordon-is-dating-criminal-minds-actor-shemar-moore/story-fno61i58-1227187723377

[ForeverAlone]

Shemar has been dating Shawna for about a year now. 

[Russet29]

I'm hesitant to criticize anyone for dating someone younger. As long as the younger party is a legal adult, I'm indifferent. It's their lives and they're old enough to make these kinds of decisions for themselves.

 

This does remind me of an exchange I somehow stumbled across on the black hole of the internet that is Twitter. I guess MGG is dating a 20 year old and some of his "fans" were tearing him a new one for only dating "significantly younger brunettes." Someone actually created a collage of his exes to prove it. As if that wasn't creepy enough these supposed fans claimed they were doing this for his sake because they want the best for him. And they were tagging him throughout all of this so he could see it.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

You see Gordinski become queasy when Reid is going over the victims list. He says he knew most of those kids and just thought they were trouble makers. I think his unease and subsequent apology to Morgan were 100% believable from a decent man who found out how totally wrong he was, and how a lot of people were hurt who didn't need to be because he supported a serial molester/rapist.

 

Kind of off-topic, but related. One of the things I really grew to dislike about SVU's Elliot Stabler was that once he made up his mind, it was set in stone, and one of his fellow detectives even makes the observation that he was quick to assume and slow to apologize when he suspects that the cop's partner was involved in a bad shoot. That he was a hard-charging bulldog, which made for a good cop but a lousy human being., and that while he eventually did admit that he was wrong he was still going to be the same jackass the next day that he'd been before.

 

It was IMO to Gordinski's credit that he admitted he'd been wrong. He'd assumed that Derek was a pedophile at best and a murderer at worst, and had he been able to make his circumstantial evidence into a case that stuck, it would have been an injustice. If he "blubbered" when he apologized, then maybe a little blubbering was called for. I don't always like Derek. I think he can be smug and condescending and a bit of an ass. But he absolutely had a right to that apology, in whatever form it arrived in.

[Bookish Jen]

I agree, Normasm -- lots of sensory overload in nursing. But I am pretty touchy with my family and friends. And if I ever met MGG, I might have to hug him. The trick would be getting me to let go. I'd hug you, too!

You mean, if MGG ever got to meet you.

 

And hey, do I get a hug, too?

[Droogie]

You mean, if MGG ever got to meet you.

 

And hey, do I get a hug, too?

Oh, heck yeah.

I'm hesitant to criticize anyone for dating someone younger. As long as the younger party is a legal adult, I'm indifferent. It's their lives and they're old enough to make these kinds of decisions for themselves.

 

This does remind me of an exchange I somehow stumbled across on the black hole of the internet that is Twitter. I guess MGG is dating a 20 year old and some of his "fans" were tearing him a new one for only dating "significantly younger brunettes." Someone actually created a collage of his exes to prove it. As if that wasn't creepy enough these supposed fans claimed they were doing this for his sake because they want the best for him. And they were tagging him throughout all of this so he could see it.

What is wrong with people? Leave the man alone, for crying out loud. Wonder how old these so-called fans are, anyway?

[normasm]

Hugs for all you cool people!

[Russet29]

Oh, heck yeah.

What is wrong with people? Leave the man alone, for crying out loud. Wonder how old these so-called fans are, anyway?

Fortunately there were a few level headed people who tried to intervene, but you can't reason with crazy. I'm pretty sure everyone involved on both sides of this absurd debate were teenagers. I guess it's heartening to see some young people act like adults? That's my silver lining way of thinking.

[normasm]

Oh, heck yeah.

What is wrong with people? Leave the man alone, for crying out loud. Wonder how old these so-called fans are, anyway?

Oh, Good Lord. Who are these people?

 

I do know at least some of these folks are in their 30s-40s, etc. Not that youth can be used as an excuse anyway, you either respect people's privacy or you don't. I think their behavior is disgusting. I've seen Shemar with his girlfriend on Ellen, and she seemed really nice, but even if she didn't it would be none of my damn business...

[Danielg342]

I'm hesitant to criticize anyone for dating someone younger. As long as the younger party is a legal adult, I'm indifferent. It's their lives and they're old enough to make these kinds of decisions for themselves.

I wasn't trying to be critical myself- I just find stuff like that to be a bit odd. Of course, they're both adults so it's their choice and if they're happy then all the better...I just wouldn't do something like that myself unless I know the younger one is mature beyond her years. Truth is, there's a vast gulf of differences (in general) at 45 and 24, not just in maturity level but other things like life experiences and expectations.

Of course, given that Shemar Moore has never married or had a live-in relationship, I could understand that he probably relates more to someone who is in their twenties than women his own age, many of whom either are or have been married. Still, I'd think he'd be more interested in settling down at his age than Shawna Gordon might be at 24...then again, Moore just might not be the “settling down” type at all, or Gordon might be more interested in settling down than I give her credit for.

Who knows...as long as they're happy.

Perhaps the Gordon relationship is a reflection of the decision to pair Morgan with someone, since Morgan was a bachelor as long as Moore has, and now that it has changed, Morgan has too.

I do think, for the show, it might be interesting to explore a “May-September” relationship like Moore's and Gordon's, because I could see it leading to tensions that could make great fodder for a case...and truth is, for all the “familial” stuff Erica Messer likes to do, this is one aspect she has yet to explore.

[Droogie]

I'm not gonna lie, and I absolutely do not mean to offend, but I don't get it. I mean, I do get it, but I really don't (confusing enough yet?).

I think that kind of age difference when a woman is 30 and the man is 45 or 50 is not that big of a deal. But when the woman is 20 or 25 and the man is 35 or 45, then it just seems to me that someone is over-compensating, for a lost youth or a fear of growing older... well, I don't know exactly what, but intellectually I don't understand. What could they have in common? What is the attraction? (Wait, don't answer that.)

Maybe as a woman, I don't understand the appeal on the part of the man. I just turned 50 (hard to even type it, frankly) My best girlfriends are 28, 29 and 32, so I get hanging with people younger. But when these girlfriends of mine were 20 and I was 42, I don't know that we would've had much in common with one another. Maybe it's different between a man and a woman pursuing a romantic relationship, but the difference in maturity levels would have to be blatant.

My own grandparents had a 16-year age difference. My grandpa was somewhat of a "player" at age 32 when he met my grandma, who was 16 at the time. He said he met her and all bets were off. Her parents shipped her several states away to live with an older brother to try and separate them, but my grandpa would not be deterred. I guess it was quite the scandal at the time. I never thought of them as anything other than a love story. But seeing these celebrities consistently hooking up with women almost half their age is kind of tiring.

I guess I want these people I sort of admire to be different, and when I find out they're typical, it's a little disconcerting,

Edited May 24, 2015 by Droogie

[Danielg342]

I'm not gonna lie, and I absolutely do not mean to offend, but I don't get it. I mean, I do get it, but I really don't (confusing enough yet?).

I think that kind of age difference when a woman is 30 and the man is 45 or 50 is not that big of a deal. But when the woman is 20 or 25 and the man is 35 or 45, then it just seems to me that someone is over-compensating, for a lost youth or a fear of growing older... well, I don't know exactly what, but intellectually I don't understand. What could they have in common? What is the attraction? (Wait, don't answer that.)

Maybe as a woman, I don't understand the appeal on the part of the man. I just turned 50 (hard to even type it, frankly) My best girlfriends are 28, 29 and 32, so I get hanging with people younger. But when these girlfriends of mine were 20 and I was 42, I don't know that we would've had much in common with one another. Maybe it's different between a man and a woman pursuing a romantic relationship, but the difference in maturity levels would have to be blatant.

My own grandparents had a 16-year age difference. My grandpa was somewhat of a "player" at age 32 when he met my grandma, who was 16 at the time. He said he met her and all bets were off. Her parents shipped her several states away to live with an older brother to try and separate them, but my grandpa would not be deterred. I guess it was quite the scandal at the time. I never thought of them as anything other than a love story. But seeing these celebrities consistently hooking up with women almost half their age is kind of tiring.

I guess I want these people I sort of admire to be different, and when I find out they're typical, it's a little disconcerting,

About nine years ago, I remember bumping into a guy who was, at best, mid-twenties who was dating a woman who was at least 50. He did tell me their relationship gets a lot of looks, and it was jarring to me too because he was dating a woman who looked old enough to be his mother.

So it can happen the other way around. Of course, this was in a small town (well, as “small” a town of 10,000 can be) that's blue-collar, conservative and where everyone is bitter all the time, so I guess the strange isn't so unexpected.

(It's also why I left said town for the city...yeah the city has weirdos but at least they're happy weirdos)

I also find myself, at 33 and still single, skewing towards women who are still in their twenties. Now, probably a bit of this has to do with the fact that most women my age are unavailable, but I also think I have more of a “mid-twenties” mindset than a mindset of people my age. I'm kind of just putting my life together right now- I only moved out of my parents' house at 28, and only started to finally support myself financially at 29 (it's a bit of a long story, but it's also why a guy with a History degree winds up becoming a janitor...not that I'm really complaining, mind you).

So, maybe it's just me, but I find I relate more to people who are still in that “figuring things out” stage than people who have “figured it out” (like someone who is 33 is more likely to be), and that leads me to people who are younger. Not that much younger- I sure won't go for an 18-year-old, because I find too many of them idealistic and narcissistic- but I'm not sure I'd go for someone my “age” yet, since I'm not sure I'm there yet.

Which leads to Shemar. We can only speculate, but I wonder if he feels more like he's 25 than 45- he's that much more fit than a lot of people who actually are 25, and since he's got an interest in fitness it led him to Shawna Gordon, who, as a professional athlete, values fitness as much as he does. Since 25 tends to be the time soccer players' careers “take off”- they're no longer “prospects” by the time they're 23, really- perhaps Gordon is as determined to make something of herself just like Moore seems to be, since “The Bounce Back” appears to be Moore's chance to grow his own acting career. Likely, since Moore hasn't been married and only really started to get big into movies he's not “45” like the rest of Hollywood is- he's just a bloomer, like Gordon is.

[Droogie]

I'm sure Shemar does feel 25. I can tell you without hesitation that i feel 25. It's a cold bucket of water when I realize I'm not -- or when I pass a mirror and have the fleeting thought: Who is that? And I think I look pretty good, for my age.

I think our perspectives are bound to be different, since I'm a woman. Women my age can feel invisible -- society doesn't like old age, especially on a woman. You mentioned your friend getting "looks" because he is with a woman 20+ years his senior, but if their gender roles were reversed, few people would bat an eyelash. A friend of mine who is 27 is marrying a 50-year-old man next Saturday. Everyone gushes about how romantic and sweet they are. And they are. But I think also that he is just terrified of growing older -- every person he dated before my friend was at least 20 years younger.

I'm not trolling for men, thank goodness, but one of my good friends is my age and single. And she is beautiful, truly. She would love to be in a relationship, but men her age want a 30 year old, and most of the attention she receives is from men in their 60s and 70s. Not what she is after. These men have no self-awareness about their own advanced age. It may have been thrilling when she was 30 -- not so much now; it's just icky.

Good for Shemar, though, if that's what he wants. And good for MGG, too, since word is he is dating a girl barely out of her teens. There is nothing at all wrong with it, and I don't want to make it sound as though I think there is. It is none of my business, truly, and in the grand scheme, I really don't care all that much. But I kind of think it goes beyond having a "type" and veers into having a complex.

Edited May 24, 2015 by Droogie

[ForeverAlone]

Personally, even though I understand that their lives are their own and it's legal, I will never endorse this sort of behavior. It makes them look like creepy old guys preying on younger women for their own purposes. Many people do bat their eyes at older man/younger women dynamics and many men in Hollywood who practice that get ripped to shreds in certain circles and almost become jokes as they get older. He's viewed as a creepy old guy or an old fool and she's viewed as a gold digger (the same if the genders are reversed in my experience). 

 

While I would not harass Shemar or Matthew for their choices,  I do give them plenty of side eye. Particularly Matthew who should be beyond that (because I really couldn't care less what Shemar does with his life), and there are other issues beyond age that make his latest possible love interest extra creepy, in my opinion. 

[Droogie]

Personally, even though I understand that their lives are their own and it's legal, I will never endorse this sort of behavior. It makes them look like creepy old guys preying on younger women for their own purposes. Many people do bat their eyes at older man/younger women dynamics and many men in Hollywood who practice that get ripped to shreds in certain circles and almost become jokes as they get older. He's viewed as a creepy old guy or an old fool and she's viewed as a gold digger (the same if the genders are reversed in my experience). 

 

While I would not harass Shemar or Matthew for their choices,  I do give them plenty of side eye. Particularly Matthew who should be beyond that (because I really couldn't care less what Shemar does with his life), and there are other issues beyond age that make his latest possible love interest extra creepy, in my opinion.

That's what kinda bums me out. And I don't know why I think MGG should be "beyond" that, but I suppose I do. His persona is so affable and likable, and to me, this sort of thing flies in the face of it. Things he has said publicly about what he values in a woman don't jibe.

Shemar, OTOH, doesn't surprise me. The vibe I get from him leads me to have exactly this sort of expectation.

I am undoubtedly guilty of putting people on some sort of pedestal when I've come to like and admire them, so it is a letdown when they turn out to be something "less" than I thought. Live and learn. :-)

...which brings me to recall something sort-of along these lines I heard from a comedienne a few years ago: She said when she sees an older man driving a red Corvette, she wants to shout over to him, "Hey! So sorry about your penis!" Apologies if that is out of line, but ever since, I've thought the same thing.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

...which brings me to recall something sort-of along these lines I heard from a comedienne a few years ago: She said when she sees an older man driving a red Corvette, she wants to shout over to him, "Hey! So sorry about your penis!" Apologies if that is out of line, but ever since, I've thought the same thing.

 

I'm gonna try to keep this relevant to the topic, so here goes.

 

Before I purchased the box set of Prime Suspect, which remains the best seventy dollars I ever spent, I read several reviews of it online, both because I'd never seen it before and because box sets are expensive. And damned if one of the reviewers didn't slag off on Helen Mirren taking her clothes off, specifically saying that a woman in her fifties getting naked was something they had no wish to see.

 

I admit to being extremely biased because I think La Mirren is a goddess, and she'll be 70 on her next birthday. But if we apply the standard of that unknown reviewer to Shemar, that someone in their mid-forties is no longer attractive enough to display their body, no matter if they're a gym rat or not, then isn't that just as unacceptable? I'm only a few months older than Shemar, and while I don't personally find him (or Derek, for that matter) all that attractive, I think he's definitely fit enough that a younger woman would see the appeal. As you say, I get it that it bothers some people, but it bothering some people is kind of a weird concept to me, so maybe I don't really get it all that much.

[Droogie]

I'm kind of laughing to myself right now because I had this whole treatise on what I've been trying to say typed out and then I just realized how very stupid I sound. Ultimately, I guess this is one of those things that's as old as time and unlikely to ever change. It isn't immoral or illegal and to each his own; we like what we like.

[Old Dog]

Age differences in relationships have never bothered me - unless they are purely a "trophy" relationship. The fact is some people, of either sex, are born young and stay young all their lives - like Matthew- so I can see why he gravitates towards younger women. The opposite side of the coin is that some are born old and stay that way - I know, I married one of those! If Matthew and Shemar can find a happy relationship then age shouldn't matter at all.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

I was hoping that I didn't come off as too ridiculous myself, Droogie. :-)

[MCatry]

Age differences in relationships have never bothered me - unless they are purely a "trophy" relationship. The fact is some people, of either sex, are born young and stay young all their lives - like Matthew- so I can see why he gravitates towards younger women. The opposite side of the coin is that some are born old and stay that way - I know, I married one of those! If Matthew and Shemar can find a happy relationship then age shouldn't matter at all.

I am 'one of those'!!!

I never liked playing, not even in kindergarten (and I still don't like it), and I found my classmates a bunch of annoying kids. Only in my second year at the University I got to meet people like me, and I was finally able to joke, chat and have fun at the same level.

I think that's the trick: to find people that actually gets you, that are at your same level of maturity, despite what your ID may say.

Nevertheless, there is a thing called the PeterPan syndrome which is entirely different. It becomes an issue when you refuse to grow up and advance in your life, weather people may want to acknowledge it or not. And old Peter Pans are, indeed, kinda creepy.

[Saje]

Matthew seems to me to be somewhat of a dichotomy.

 

He'll act like a big dorky kid, yet he's a well-respected director.

 

He's committed to this tv show for 11 years in a row (a work ethic that immature people just cannot maintain), yet he can't hold an enduring relationship with a woman.

 

He bends over backwards for his fans and his charity appearances (a very adult sensibility - putting others first), then he'll crawl inside a dog cage to play with his nephew and dress up in a turtle suit to sing a Disney song.

 

He deliberately will have horrible hair, make incredibly ugly selfie faces, then turn around and look stunningly flawless in magazine shoots.

 

He'll make silly appearances on children's shows, then show up as a serious and adept leading man in an indie film like The Beauty Inside. 

 

I don't think his proclivities are anyone's business to judge, as long as he's not harming anyone and all parties involved are adults. My friend who loves him beyond belief (and agrees that we have no right to judge him), still thinks it's "squicky" that the older he gets, the younger his female interests seem to. I really don't care, he fascinates me. Too bad he isn't gay :/. Imagine how stiff, uptight CBS would love that. 

[Old Dog]

Matthew seems to me to be somewhat of a dichotomy.

 

He'll act like a big dorky kid, yet he's a well-respected director.

 

He's committed to this tv show for 11 years in a row (a work ethic that immature people just cannot maintain), yet he can't hold an enduring relationship with a woman.

 

He bends over backwards for his fans and his charity appearances (a very adult sensibility - putting others first), then he'll crawl inside a dog cage to play with his nephew and dress up in a turtle suit to sing a Disney song.

 

He deliberately will have horrible hair, make incredibly ugly selfie faces, then turn around and look stunningly flawless in magazine shoots.

 

He'll make silly appearances on children's shows, then show up as a serious and adept leading man in an indie film like The Beauty Inside. 

 

I don't think his proclivities are anyone's business to judge, as long as he's not harming anyone and all parties involved are adults. My friend who loves him beyond belief (and agrees that we have no right to judge him), still thinks it's "squicky" that the older he gets, the younger his female interests seem to. I really don't care, he fascinates me. Too bad he isn't gay :/. Imagine how stiff, uptight CBS would love that. 

It's this dichotomy that makes him so fascinating. Yet I think he has a young soul - always enthusiastic, curious, appreciative - and I doubt he will ever change. Shemar on the other hand seems more as if he is trying hard to hang onto his youth = Matthew won't have to try at all as he will still be young when he is 90.

[zannej]

I think Shemar knows his body won't last forever-- as I've said before, so he probably tries to make the most of it. When he was in Japan he held up a magazine and looked at the girl on the cover and said "She's too young for me" and handed it to MGG who also said "She's too young for me, too".

 

If you look at other actors in Hollywood, men can get leading roles well in to their 50s, but women are often considered old maids in their 30s. It's a culture of its own and it encourages unhealthy double standards. One of the things that seems to happen often is that the older men date younger women. So long as they are not underage and not being abused, it doesn't bother me-- even if sometimes I might think "well, that's odd".

[Droogie]

I think Shemar knows his body won't last forever-- as I've said before, so he probably tries to make the most of it. When he was in Japan he held up a magazine and looked at the girl on the cover and said "She's too young for me" and handed it to MGG who also said "She's too young for me, too".

If you look at other actors in Hollywood, men can get leading roles well in to their 50s, but women are often considered old maids in their 30s. It's a culture of its own and it encourages unhealthy double standards. One of the things that seems to happen often is that the older men date younger women. So long as they are not underage and not being abused, it doesn't bother me-- even if sometimes I might think "well, that's odd".

That's what bugs me -- I tried to articulate that but I guess I wasn't able to do so. A man is still considered viable and attractive until -- when? I don't seem to know of a cutoff point. But once a woman is in her 30s, she's invisible -- to Hollywood, to men, to everyone, kind of. People throw shade far less at an older man with a much younger woman than they do when the situation is reversed. When someone of whom you think highly shows that he is prey to that thinking, it's a bummer. Maybe it's because I'm a little sensitive about being considered "old." When the young guy at the supermarket checkout calls me, "Ma'am," I bristle. Who're you calling "ma'am"? I just got out of a mosh pit.

That being said, I don't condemn it. Everyone has a "type;" even I do. Nothing should really surprise me at this point.

Edited June 1, 2015 by Droogie

[zannej]

Droogie, I also think there is a partial link to actual biology involved. Men are able to continue procreating at much older ages than women. Once women go through menapause they can no longer give birth. Also, the older a woman gets, the less likely it will be that she will have healthy children. After mid 30s, the chances of complications, birth defects, etc increase. Meanwhile, men can still produce offspring even in their 80s. I believe the oldest one is a man who claimed to sire a child at the age of 96. Mind you, the older men get, the more likely they will produce offspring with birth defects, but they are often still able to conceive for much longer. Women get to a point where they just can't (unless special measures like invitro are used).

Biologically, the attraction is to someone who is able to procreate and since women are taken out of the game, so to speak, much earlier than men, I can sort of see why women may be deemed less attractive earlier (even if I don't agree with it). Intellectually I know this isn't fair, but life is never fair. Another issue is that there is so much pressure on women to be perfect or look a certain way. Women are expected to wear jewelry, put on makeup, and basically go through more measures to make themselves look a certain way. Men are expected to groom their facial hair, but are not expected to bling themselves up or put on glitter or makeup to make themselvess appealing. It's rather funny because in the rest of the animal kingdom, the males are the ones who have the bright plumage and who are tasked with attracting a mate. Humans seem to have it somewhat backwards.

The reddit article where Joe mentioned that Shemar's mother said she only had one child but she had a pretty child is somewhat telling as well. Looks are something that have always been stressed as important for Shemar. I also wonder if maybe he had been told he wasn't smart or was discouraged from other pursuits by teachers when he was younger.

Edited June 10, 2015 by zannej

[Droogie]

Zannej, I most definitely agree that biology is involved. Everything that signals "reproductive capability!" in a female dims by her mid-30s. It's disheartening, to put it mildly, when you begin to see that you aren't considered as relevant or attractive when that happens. It doesn't matter that you still are those things (I could make a list half a mile long of mature women who've still "got it," but it never fails that someone says, "Wow, she looks great, for her age.") My best friend recently married a man ten years younger -- she is beautiful but is exhausting and bankrupting herself trying to keep age at bay.

I think those who are disheartened or perturbed when someone like MGG (who reads as an idealized version of a man) repeatedly pursues women so much younger than he is, simply thought he was "above" biology. I think most women seek emotional depth in a partner and intimacy in their relationships; I guess many men let their hormones do their thinking and don't need or require much else. No disrespect to men intended! I am nearly a year older than my husband -- I've never gotten any vibe from him that he'd like to go trolling for new women at the local high school.

[katha]

So in my re-watch I'm now almost finished with season five. And I thought what they did with him in the first half was rather interesting. So in good CM tradition they promptly abandoned it LOL. And gave us Ellie with the horrible wig instead. Not necessarily him being Unit Chief. But dealing with the question: What career aspirations does Morgan have? I get that Garcia was forced into the job because of her hacking activities. That Rossi came back because of "old cases coming back to haunt him" but also because he felt that to some degree he selfishly exploited the lurid details of serial killing and didn't take the victims into consideration. Reid is a bit murkier, but at least I understand that he's not in the business of the politics and representative functions that would come with a promotion. Prentiss got herself a new job with power (after they had IMO totally wrecked the character with that Super!Spy! nonsense...but that's a rant for another day LOL). With JJ it's never quite explained, but she changed jobs and became a profiler. So at least there was some movement. They also made quite clear that Hotch doesn't want to rise any further because he wants to be a profiler. Going any higher would mean full-time bureaucracy and politics (IMO they also dropped hints that the possibility for promotion is there, no matter Strauss' blubbering on the matter).

 

Which leaves Morgan. I like that in season five his love for Hotch (I don't think the word is too strong...you can love people even without particularly liking them) manifests itself in fearing that he'll end up like Gideon. Yet for all his questioning he's ultimately totally loyal when it becomes clear that Hotch is being threatened by FBI politics. Also like the neat little touch that Rossi for all his "older uncle advice" doesn't have the clear perspective Hotch and Morgan bring to the situation. Hotch knows that Morgan would never exploit the Foyet situation for his own gain and stage a coup for the Unit Chief position, no matter Rossi's ominous pronouncements. And Morgan knows that Hotch will come back after Haley's death before Rossi does. I don't know, I just think it's nice that Rossi for all his advice giving and good intentions in the situation is wrong about it. Because sometimes even the smartest, most experienced people are wrong about things.

 

And I like that Morgan is good as leader, but that he's tense and strained with the new responsibilities. That he doesn't like the politics, that he's stressed about having to think about everything, that the paperwork makes him crazy, that his agents running off to do their own thing (heh! to Hotch and that nice little bit of payback there!) freaks him out. And so I can perhaps kinda, sorta piece together why he doesn't gun for career advancement outside the BAU, particularly since he's more or less the second-in-command after Hotch now, presumably officially as well. But I have to do all the speculation here. Instead of pursuing that avenue further...we got Pod!Morgan! in much of season six who acted like the writers had never met the character before (that was one saving grace of the stupid Wannabe!Alias! arc: Morgan became recognizably himself again for the most part). Sigh.

Edited July 29, 2015 by katha

[Droogie]

I'm thinking of how Morgan could be explored, minus Savannah, and I keep thinking I wish they would delve into what happened in Boston, prior to "Extreme Aggressor." I know the Gideon Ship has sailed off into the horizon, but I don't think we ever really found out how it affected Morgan. If there is anything I'd like to see in S11 regarding him, it would be this. It would be interesting to have him revisit that in some fashion.

[ForeverAlone]

But Morgan wasn't in Boston, so he wasn't personally affected by what happened, and it's never been suggested that Morgan was close friends with anyone who was in Boston with Gideon. 

Edited July 31, 2015 by ForeverAlone

[JMO]

 

But Morgan wasn't in Boston, so he wasn't personally affected by what happened, and it's never been suggested that Morgan was close friends with anyone with him.

 

I can't remember what gave me the impression, but I've always understood that Morgan was in Boston.

[Droogie]

Me too, JMO. I thought he was personally involved, and have been kinda surprised it was never really discussed. I mean, I know Gideon had a "major depressive episode," but I never really knew how it affected Morgan.

[ForeverAlone]

I thought, in the pilot, when the one trainee asked Morgan in the bar if he was in Boston with Gideon, he said that he was supposed to be (with the implication that he actually wasn't). 

Edited July 31, 2015 by ForeverAlone

[Droogie]

Maybe I've been reading too much fan fiction. I need to rewatch that episode -- it's been awhile. Even so, if he was supposed to be but wasn't, that would be interesting as well.

[ForeverAlone]

I just quickly rewatched the bar scene in the pilot, and yes Morgan said he was supposed to be in Boston with Gideon. But that would mean that he wasn't for whatever reason.

 

I got the impression that none of the BAU team we saw in the pilot were in Boston with Gideon. Maybe at best Hotch, though I don't think he ever said if he was. 

Edited July 31, 2015 by ForeverAlone

[JMO]

I just quickly rewatched the bar scene in the pilot, and yes Morgan said he was supposed to be in Boston with Gideon. But that would mean that he wasn't for whatever reason.

 

I got the impression that none of the BAU team we saw in the pilot were in Boston with Gideon. Maybe at best Hotch, though I don't think he ever said if he was.

Ah, that does sound familiar now, FA.

[Droogie]

I just quickly rewatched the bar scene in the pilot, and yes Morgan said he was supposed to be in Boston with Gideon. But that would mean that he wasn't for whatever reason.

 

I got the impression that none of the BAU team we saw in the pilot were in Boston with Gideon. Maybe at best Hotch, though I don't think he ever said if he was.

Still, I would like to look into this more. Did Derek feel guilty that he wasn't here? Why, exactly, wasn't he, if in fact he was not? I wonder if any of it figured into the Morgan we know? Gideon and Morgan obviously knew each other -- where was Reid? How did Morgan cope with the aftermath?

[Cobalt Stargazer]

Still, I would like to look into this more. Did Derek feel guilty that he wasn't here? Why, exactly, wasn't he, if in fact he was not? I wonder if any of it figured into the Morgan we know? Gideon and Morgan obviously knew each other -- where was Reid? How did Morgan cope with the aftermath?

 

To my immediate recollection, Derek never says why he wasn't in Boston, only that he was supposed to be. Reid doesn't say if he himself was there or not, but he knew that Gideon was on extended leave, because he tells him, "They want you back" when Jason is looking over the case file. So maybe? Its unclear.

 

IMO, Morgan deflected re the aftermath of Boston. I know that he tends to either minimize things or just shrug them off, and that's why I've always been kind of ambivalent towards him, but as we saw later in Profiler, Profiled, what bothers him the most tends to be what he talks about the least. That's why in Lucky he was so adamant about not talking to the priest, and then Rossi made him do it. "What happened to you that you have so much contempt for a priest you've never even met?"

[Danielg342]

I'll have to rewatch the scene myself, because I thought Morgan was telling his new “acquaintances” that he was supposed to be at work- meaning at the office- not in Boston. I could be wrong.

In any case, I remember in “Won't Get Fooled Again” Morgan was pretty apprehensive about getting too close to Adrian Bale, which is why he stayed behind. So even if he didn't go to Boston, the event affected him in some way- and it would, because I'm sure he would hear what happened and think, “that could have been me.” Perhaps too he had a close personal friend on the trip, or, maybe, his first love- and her death is what turned him into a “player” for so long.

So I'd love to know more about how Boston affected him, regardless of his attendance there- although, knowing this writing team, I'm not sure it'll get handled all that well.

[normasm]

Just a note that the pix of Shemar at the CBS TCA party this past weekend show him sporting a large silver band on his third finger, left hand.