Season Eight: Scambled Episode Order and Writers' Strikes, Oh My! And Hi, Zack Nichols...

[WendyCR72]

Talk Season 8 and Goren's forever-changing beard and hair length here!

[WendyCR72]

We always say how in the later years that Goren lost his intensity. But "Family Values" is nearing the end and VDO's/Goren's verbal showdown with David Harbour's Paul Devildes is still - to me - one of Goren's best go-rounds with the perps.

Both actors were riveting there.

[Spartan Girl]

6 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

We always say how in the later years that Goren lost his intensity. But "Family Values" is nearing the end and VDO's/Goren's verbal showdown with David Harbour's Paul Devildes is still - to me - one of Goren's best go-rounds with the perps.

Both actors were riveting there.

That was David Harbour?! I had no idea!

[peacheslatour]

12 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

We always say how in the later years that Goren lost his intensity. But "Family Values" is nearing the end and VDO's/Goren's verbal showdown with David Harbour's Paul Devildes is still - to me - one of Goren's best go-rounds with the perps.

Both actors were riveting there.

I always skip that one. Religious whackjobs freak me out.

[Xeliou66]

12 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

We always say how in the later years that Goren lost his intensity. But "Family Values" is nearing the end and VDO's/Goren's verbal showdown with David Harbour's Paul Devildes is still - to me - one of Goren's best go-rounds with the perps.

Both actors were riveting there.

Family Values is my favorite from season 8, and it’s because Goren really brought the intensity in this one and seemed more like the Goren of old instead of the worn down, baggage filled Goren. Devildis was just as creepy as they come and a memorable villain as well. 

[Shadow Lass]

Well, "Faithfully" was supposed to be the season premiere and they showed it fifth...I wonder what they edited from that episode that might have explained who Bobby was sharing dinner with! I made up my own characters and explanation for my fanfic, but it might have been nice to know how canon explained them. (They also introduced an unseen "uncle" for him in season 7.)

[WendyCR72]

13 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

That was David Harbour?! I had no idea!

David Harbour was also the silver thief with the murdering pregnant fiancé/wife in the episode "Silver Lining" in S4, too.

[Xeliou66]

I saw Major Case last night, and this may be the best Nichols episode - it’s a shame Nichols had two dull as dirt partners in Wheeler and Stevens, because he was an interesting enough character, and I loved seeing Nichols work with Eames on the case, it added a lot having a strong partner for Nichols. And the case was really good - Henry Muller was a memorable villain, being a forensics expert and a creepy pervert attracted to teenage girls who murdered the victim when she rejected him. It was a classic case of the detective trying to outsmart an expert villain - and the thing is is Henry might’ve gotten away with the murder had he not tried to frame the drug dealer - if he had just stayed out of it instead of visiting Ross to see what they knew, finding out about the dealer and then trying ti frame him, he might’ve gotten away with it and the case might’ve never been solved. But Henry trying to frame the dealer aroused Nichols suspicion, and he soon figured out Henry did it. I guess Henry thought he was too smart to get caught but his own arrogance is what brought him down. I liked how Nichols trapped him and used Rodgers to help pull off the deception. It’s a great episode, although Ross was a douche as usual in it. Like I say, I think it’s my favorite Nichols episode, and I also like Revolution, where Nichols worked with Eames again. It’s too bad they never found a good partner for Nichols.

Season 8 had its ups and downs and the oddities with the episodes being aired out of order and all, but it has some good episodes.

[Shadow Lass]

18 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

I saw Major Case last night

 

Me, too! I didn't mind Nichols with Wheeler, but God, Stevens...don't get me started on Stevens.

I liked Nichols and Muller trying to outwit each other. The story could have easily been done with Goren.

[Xeliou66]

8 minutes ago, Shadow Lass said:

Me, too! I didn't mind Nichols with Wheeler, but God, Stevens...don't get me started on Stevens.

I liked Nichols and Muller trying to outwit each other. The story could have easily been done with Goren.

Yeah the battle between detective and criminal felt like classic CI - one reason why I like that episode a lot - CI had many great episodes with a nasty criminal mastermind who thought they could get away with anything and it’s always satisfying to see the detective outwit them. In this case Henry might’ve gotten away with it if it wasn’t for his own ego, he thought he would be safe if he framed someone else and that proved to be his undoing. Fascinating plot.

I like Nichols, but he never had a good partner other than the 2 episodes with Eames. Not sure who was more boring - Wheeler or Stevens.

[Shadow Lass]

I watched "Lady's Man" today, because it's a favorite, but also "Faithfully" because I've watched it maybe three times and wanted to see the episode they were supposed to lead off eighth season with again.

And I was totally flabbergasted by something...

I've always complained about "Faithfully" not explaining about Molly and her family, and I only recalled the two scenes: the dinner table scene at the beginning and the photo scene at the end. Today I noticed a scene I swear I had never seen before--which I don't know HOW--and I was baffled. It's just a few seconds: Eames walks up to Goren where he's looking at a photo of Molly on his laptop; he says to her that this is his niece and she's nine years old.

So I'm completely puzzled now. I can understand why the LOCI Wiki says Molly is Donny's sister--it's a logical reasoning, but she can't be. Evelyn Carlson definitely didn't live in Michigan, and why would Frank have been in Michigan? Is Molly Frank's child? Does Bobby have a sister or brother he doesn't know about? If they'd filmed a full season instead of only 16 episodes, might we have gotten an answer to the mystery?

Theories? Comments?

[Xeliou66]

7 minutes ago, Shadow Lass said:

I watched "Lady's Man" today, because it's a favorite, but also "Faithfully" because I've watched it maybe three times and wanted to see the episode they were supposed to lead off eighth season with again.

And I was totally flabbergasted by something...

I've always complained about "Faithfully" not explaining about Molly and her family, and I only recalled the two scenes: the dinner table scene at the beginning and the photo scene at the end. Today I noticed a scene I swear I had never seen before--which I don't know HOW--and I was baffled. It's just a few seconds: Eames walks up to Goren where he's looking at a photo of Molly on his laptop; he says to her that this is his niece and she's nine years old.

So I'm completely puzzled now. I can understand why the LOCI Wiki says Molly is Donny's sister--it's a logical reasoning, but she can't be. Evelyn Carlson definitely didn't live in Michigan, and why would Frank have been in Michigan? Is Molly Frank's child? Does Bobby have a sister or brother he doesn't know about? If they'd filmed a full season instead of only 16 episodes, might we have gotten an answer to the mystery?

Theories? Comments?

That’s always puzzled me, it didn’t make sense that Goren would have a niece, I’m pretty sure that the girl wasn’t Frank’s child, but who her parents were was a complete mystery to me. Did Goren have a half sibling or something, either from his bio father the murderer or the guy he always thought was his dad? It’s a puzzle that was never explained. Very odd.

[Shadow Lass]

Honestly, it just "got" me yesterday for a silly reason...I wouldn't write any Goren/Eames fanfic until I knew all the canon about both, and then I somehow missed that scene...more than once??? Still don't understand! So the family relationship in my fanfic is cousin, not niece. (Although if he is her uncle, why doesn't Molly call him "Uncle Robert" in the letter?) And so that bothers me because I'm anal that way...LOL.

On the other hand I played really fast and loose with the "Nicole Wallace resurrection" episode ("The Catacombes") in JO, too, so I have no room to talk.

There is a long fic where Bobby finds a half sister who's the daughter of Mark Ford Brady, but I can't read it because the author tortures Bobby physically and psychologically through the first fifth of the epic, then he's messed up so bad he ends up in a mental institution after trying to kill himself, and I can't do that stuff...messes with my head. The parts I have read have creeped me out enough.

Now that I think about it, I can work a scenario where Molly is Frank's daughter, and make it logical: say Molly's mom (let's call her Jane Fry) gets that "call" that a lot of people get: they want to leave the country/the Midwest/the Bible Belt, etc. and go to the big city to become a singer, an actor, a dancer, or she's just bored with the "Green Acres" life and wants some excitement. Jane's a little older than most, but does just this, and somehow runs into Frank during one of his "good" periods (we see this in "Endgame," where Frank's nicely dressed because he made good at the horse track). She falls for his good looks, charm, and excuses (just like Evelyn Carlson did--it's not his fault, Bobby doesn't understand him, Mom always liked Bobby best--which of course is a damn lie, Bobby poisons Mom's mind against him, yadda, yadda, yadda) and eventually gets pregnant, only to have Frank relapse into his old ways. She eventually decides neither Frank nor NYC living is for her and goes home. Molly grows up on the farm.

Bobby reconnects with them after Frank's death (maybe Bobby finds a note from Jane in a search of Frank's apartment and a pic of Molly), so we get the scenes in "Faithfully."

[peacheslatour]

I watched Lady's Man last night. Raul Esparza as an ADA who worked with and framed  Eames on an old case. I know a lot of people think he's hot but I never will after seeing that ep. I did love the way Bobby, when he went to cuff him said "Hold still sweetie." and then he handed the cuffs to Eames.

[Xeliou66]

1 hour ago, peacheslatour said:

I watched Lady's Man last night. Raul Esparza as an ADA who worked with and framed  Eames on an old case. I know a lot of people think he's hot but I never will after seeing that ep. I did love the way Bobby, when he went to cuff him said "Hold still sweetie." and then he handed the cuffs to Eames.

That was a good episode, I liked how we got some focus on Eames and the backstory was interesting. The murderer was very creepy, and it’s hard to believe it’s the same actor who played the awesome ADA Barba on SVU. It’s one of season 8’s stronger episodes. 
I think Major Case is my favorite season 8 episode and my favorite of the Nichols episodes, it was on last night as well - Henry the forensics expert was a memorable perp and it was a compelling story with Nichols trying to nail him. It’s funny though how if Henry hadn’t tried to frame the innocent guy who had a perfect alibi, he probably would’ve gotten away with it, Nichols wouldn’t have had reason to be suspicious of Henry if he hadn’t tampered with evidence.