S19.E12: Sharon Osbourne; Rosa Brooks; Ian Bremmer

[Pike Ludwell]

I disagree that Bill is an angry or bitter or unhappy person because he is criticizing what in his opinion are specific out-of-touch-with-reality directions culture is taking. A person can be very happy, but still extremely critical of particular things. Many have pointed out his age as if that has something to do with his views. I disagree. I believe he would have reacted the same to the same stimuli decades ago. Many of his guests who espouse his views have been very young. I disagree that it is "crankiness".

Edited April 19, 2021 by Pike Ludwell

[RealHousewife]

9 hours ago, BrownBear2012 said:

His "love" life has not been very traditional from what I've read. He's been known to frequent swinger clubs and was a frequent guest at the Playboy Mansion...nothing wrong with that at all if that is what you're into. He had one live in situation that I know of that was years ago...I forgot her name but she was a video regular in rap videos...her specialty was BJ's. That ended badly and when he broke up with her she sued him. Maybe that soured him on having deeper relationships, I don't know. He did get called out by Rose McGowan for a "Me Too" moment she had with him when she was a guest on his show "Politically Incorrect"...google it. Whether his personal life has turned him into curmudgeony old fart is a possiblity...maybe the lockdown has gotten to him...he did lose a ton of stand up gigs and that had to piss him off. But plenty of Americans have lost their jobs and businesses and don't have the same assets he does...he has plenty of $$$ to keep him comfortable for the rest of his life and has it a lot better than a majority of other Americans. Whatever the reasons are for his anger and bitterness it maybe time for reflection on his part and let go of petty beefs that occured years ago ( i.e. Berkeley) and show some compassion and kindness for a change...angry humor is funny and some people do it really well like Lewis Black...but Bill just spews and spits out stuff that seems to come from a very dark place in his soul.

No, he's never been traditional and has maintained he's never wanted a traditional life. I remember he would say of course Hugh Hefner is happy! He's said he likes having all his time to himself and being able to do whatever he wants with it. I remember the woman you mentioned as well, Karrine Steffans aka super head. Yes, I'm also familiar with Rose McGowan and mentioned it in this thread. If Bill's grumpy the last year hasn't been very fun for him, I get that to a degree. You can be rich, have a good gig going, and you can still miss going out and living your life per usual. I just don't like how it's affected his show. We'll see how he is as life gets back to normal. 

8 hours ago, Starchild said:

Generally speaking there appears to be a serious lack of nuance that has crept into the show (and Bill, presumably). I noticed it at a couple of points.

• The discussion with Osbourne skipped over a lot of the depth of what happened with the Oprah interview and Piers Morgan, as well as what some of her past colleagues alleged, and was boiled down to a couple of rants that underscored the point he was trying to make about cancel culture. They looked like a couple of mean girls at the popular table in the cafeteria after teachers called them out on their behaviour.
• The angry declaration that yes, of course, white people are allowed to talk about black issues. That's not untrue, but props to Ian for trying to push back on the obvious problems with the points being made, specifically that blacks who resist arrest are a lot more likely to be violently taken down than whites who resist. I almost expected Bill to say something like, "then they should definitely know better."

The whole thing about how he rages against "wokeness" and cancel culture in general makes me uncomfortable. There is a vast landscape between "I should be able to say whatever I want with impunity" and "that person who said the n-word in high school 20 years ago when talking about rap music should be tarred and feathered, fired from their job, and forever cast out from polite society."

Sneering at the term "wokeness" implies that people are too sensitive and just need to grow up, when a lot of people out there have been, and are being, badly hurt by a lot of other people, in a lot of different ways, at a lot of different levels (individually and systemically). The term "cancel culture" suggests some monolithic movement devouring humanity without just cause. But both of these are much more complex than that, as issues concerning human beings typically are.

Yes there have been some extreme examples that went too far, but people should be ready to accept the consequences for their words and actions, especially in the present. If the moral arc of the universe is bending towards justice, it should be expected that people who habitually demonstrate a lack of respect to their fellows will see those fellows wash their hands and turn their backs. If corporations recognize that trend (for they rarely lead and usually follow in matters of social justice), they will also respond in kind. To me, that is not some unjustified cancel culture. That is justifiable social (and corporate) responsibility.

By all means, push back against the overreactions (and the underreactions for that matter), but don't paint over the entire nuanced picture with a splash of whitewash or a stripe of tar. 

Respect is key to a civilized society.

Boom. Woke is like feminism to me in the sense I use it by its definition and won't allow the most extreme people in the movement to hijack it and give in to misuse. Being woke just means you're aware of racism and injustice. It doesn't mean you're hateful in your own way and want to go around canceling everyone for everything. 

Edited April 20, 2021 by RealHousewife

[iMonrey]

Quote

Here's what I don't get. Who didn't know that obesity was a risk factor for covid complications? Bill talked like this was some suppressed secret, and if only people knew about it, they would (in Bill's mind) have found the motivation they'd been lacking to lose weight. But who are these supposed fat people who didn't know? This was about as well known a risk factor as age and race. Fat people knew about it! They were shamed about it. It didn't suddenly make them get skinny.

And it's not as if people don't already know being overweight is unhealthy. I'm not sure why Bill keeps bringing this up. It's like he thinks obesity just isn't addressed in this country  . . . or something. ?

Quote

I'm not a cancel culture person and don't need to listen to someone I agree with 100%, or else I would have stopped listening to Bill long ago.  I know he came on to Rose McGowan in a crude manner. 

In fairness to Bill, Rose McGowan is loonier than a toon. I'd have to take whatever she says with a grain of salt.

[izabella]

3 hours ago, iMonrey said:

And it's not as if people don't already know being overweight is unhealthy. I'm not sure why Bill keeps bringing this up. It's like he thinks obesity just isn't addressed in this country  . . . or something. ?

He thinks fat people aren't shamed enough, and aren't blamed enough.  He seems to think the only reason they are fat is they don't have the kind of discipline he has, and thus, should be shamed all the time everywhere for it instead of being accepted as human beings.  And he wants "everyone," including the media, to constantly be talking about fat being the cause of all ills.  If he has some other point, I certainly haven't grasped it.