katha

I think it's more problematic on the male side, but I don't know how to address it. I understand why the pros are coming back every season, it's steady income and exposure. There's also always a risk that you get passed by other dancers if you decide to sit out one season. And, unpopular opinion on my side: I totally get why Derek, Mark, Val and Tony have been on for so long. And why they would be hard to replace. They each bring something very specific when it comes to skill set, performance and "type". The show is also in its 21st season. Let's face it, they can't really attract great celebs anymore. So they're probably mostly happy that the pros are recognizable as well, even though that might have detrimental aspects.

Karina, Sharna, Peta, Witney and Allison on the female side. Val, Derek, Mark and Artem on the male side. Apparently there will be more pros revealed later. Probably still finishing contract negotiations with celebs. I get that they might have felt that news were starting to leak in earnest (mostly Karina?) and they needed to make an announcement about the stuff that's already decided. But wouldn't a press release have been enough? That GMA bit was underwhelming.

The way he doesn't deal with Elle is also very telling. He knows she has PTSD, he recognizes the symptoms. Yet he says nothing and lets her be used as a decoy though it's clear she's not ready. Morgan and Hotch are also uneasy...but they don't understand. They don't recognize the signs like Gideon does. And then he does nothing again in the aftermath and lets Hotch handle all of that as well. That Elle lashed out at Hotch was also very strong writing IMO. Who else? Gideon? I figure she was in the same boat as Morgan where Gideon was concerned: Yeah, they knew he's brilliant, but they also saw that he's not dependable, that he's erratic and detached. OTOH, you had her going for advice to Hotch, being comfortable around him. It was made clear that she liked him, respected him, trusted him and even somewhat admired him. It made sense that in the throes of PTSD she would feel more betrayed by Hotch, since she was much closer to him. The implication being that she didn't expect any better from Gideon anyway. Of course blaming Hotch was an irrational reaction, but that was the point of her exit storyline. It also set up her last scenes and why they were with Hotch: They were so sad because it's clear that they cared for each other a great deal, but that the events had fostered a rift there and both regretted that but didn't see a way to make things right again.

I think Gideon genuinely cared about Reid. The problem is...at the time we meet him he's already rather damaged by the job, and he was probably rather self-involved and stuck in his own head before that as well. So he often can't bring himself to fully engage anymore, to take responsibility for his actions. IMO one clear tonal shift in season two, right at the beginning, is the scene where Gideon talks himself into denial and out of any kind of engagement with the fact that Elle was shot and that him taking a risk with the press conference played a part in that. He's talking and talking and all that time Hotch has this horrified expression on his face. Then goes to clean the blood from Elle's wall. I think at that point Hotch realized he'd have to be the clear leader in the team, Gideon wasn't capable of that anymore. I think Gideon's downward spiral and Gideon leaving had at least as much to do with Hotch becoming the grimmer, harder character he is now as the divorce. And that transformation starts in season two, he takes on an air of sternness and authority that wasn't there in season one. He's a softer character in season one. But one last instance where I do think Gideon goes out of his way to help is "Ashes and Dust". You see his guilt because he knows that he burdens Hotch with the way he often can't engage with things anymore and you see him running around all episode trying to help Hotch because he takes it hard and totally overidentifies with Evan Abby. It's very moving IMO and the episode has great performances by Patinkin and Gibson.

It always comes down to totally inconsistent writing. Agree that JJ showed zero signs of being affected by trauma beforehand so how could Hotch or anyone else pick up on it (since the writers originally thought she was totally fine, then changed their minds)? Then in the episode itself everyone needed to be unobservant for the contrived plot to work. I actually think this sort of thing is the greatest disservice they do to Hotch as a character, being collateral damage in others' storylines. One of the team members does something randomly stupid and over the top, but Hotch conveniently doesn't interfere because he's either uncharacteristically oblivious or he's just not around to witness it. When they write specifically for Hotch more often than not it's at least decent, sometimes even really good. Which I guess is as much as you can expect from TPTB in their current state... The crappy writing with him usually comes in when the writers need to accomodate some nonsense plot for another character.

I'm in the middle of rewatching that whole absurdity again. And yeah, from a plot perspective it's such a clown car. I just got to the part where Prentiss and her old colleagues are being the worst superspies in the history of the universe. They dress in this all-black gear that stands out from the rest of the crowd, they meet super obviously, for any watcher it would be immediately evident that they're talking to each other on those phones, then they throw away those phones into the trash in plain sight where they can be retrieved. They might as well have tattooed "Hey Doyle! Here we are!" onto their foreheads. It was seemingly all about how cool it looked for tptb, no thought went into plausibility or characterization with that stuff.

The Reid and JJ fight was such a lost opportunity. Since that storyline was one endless plothole anyway...I can perhaps buy that Hotch and JJ thought it had to be handled that way. It's not like anything else about it made sense, adding that it had to be kept a big secret from everyone didn't seem more absurd than the rest of it. But then they played online games? Prentiss and JJ where totally nonchalant about the repercussions of their actions in the second episode? What? And the Reid and JJ fight is way too melodramatic in its staging...but aspects of it ring true enough. Reid being passive aggressive to get back at her. She wants to stop that and have him be okay with her again and pushes at him at inappropriate moments on the job until it blows up into an ugly scene. Then she wants to believe it's just about his ego as a profiler because that minimizes her responsibility and she won't have to feel so guilty (which she already does anyway). Then he hits her way below the belt by saying him going back on drugs would have been her fault. They both play dirty and it's not a nice sight. But instead of slowly repairing the friendship or some sort of talk where they clear the air the "resolution" is pasta party and everything is magically okay? Again...what? I actually thought how it played out with Hotch and Morgan was way better done. It was shortly addressed by Hotch at the beginning of the season. Then it flared up again with Strauss' alcoholism and ended with Morgan knowing about the rehab but having to keep it a secret. Kind of sneaky by Hotch, I gotta say. It showed that they both had a point and disagreed in the matter, but without any soap opera stand-offs and pasta parties.

So in my re-watch I'm now almost finished with season five. And I thought what they did with him in the first half was rather interesting. So in good CM tradition they promptly abandoned it LOL. And gave us Ellie with the horrible wig instead. Not necessarily him being Unit Chief. But dealing with the question: What career aspirations does Morgan have? I get that Garcia was forced into the job because of her hacking activities. That Rossi came back because of "old cases coming back to haunt him" but also because he felt that to some degree he selfishly exploited the lurid details of serial killing and didn't take the victims into consideration. Reid is a bit murkier, but at least I understand that he's not in the business of the politics and representative functions that would come with a promotion. Prentiss got herself a new job with power (after they had IMO totally wrecked the character with that Super!Spy! nonsense...but that's a rant for another day LOL). With JJ it's never quite explained, but she changed jobs and became a profiler. So at least there was some movement. They also made quite clear that Hotch doesn't want to rise any further because he wants to be a profiler. Going any higher would mean full-time bureaucracy and politics (IMO they also dropped hints that the possibility for promotion is there, no matter Strauss' blubbering on the matter). Which leaves Morgan. I like that in season five his love for Hotch (I don't think the word is too strong...you can love people even without particularly liking them) manifests itself in fearing that he'll end up like Gideon. Yet for all his questioning he's ultimately totally loyal when it becomes clear that Hotch is being threatened by FBI politics. Also like the neat little touch that Rossi for all his "older uncle advice" doesn't have the clear perspective Hotch and Morgan bring to the situation. Hotch knows that Morgan would never exploit the Foyet situation for his own gain and stage a coup for the Unit Chief position, no matter Rossi's ominous pronouncements. And Morgan knows that Hotch will come back after Haley's death before Rossi does. I don't know, I just think it's nice that Rossi for all his advice giving and good intentions in the situation is wrong about it. Because sometimes even the smartest, most experienced people are wrong about things. And I like that Morgan is good as leader, but that he's tense and strained with the new responsibilities. That he doesn't like the politics, that he's stressed about having to think about everything, that the paperwork makes him crazy, that his agents running off to do their own thing (heh! to Hotch and that nice little bit of payback there!) freaks him out. And so I can perhaps kinda, sorta piece together why he doesn't gun for career advancement outside the BAU, particularly since he's more or less the second-in-command after Hotch now, presumably officially as well. But I have to do all the speculation here. Instead of pursuing that avenue further...we got Pod!Morgan! in much of season six who acted like the writers had never met the character before (that was one saving grace of the stupid Wannabe!Alias! arc: Morgan became recognizably himself again for the most part). Sigh.

I think the DWTS producers are at least partly responsible for this mess. They create this narrative that the pros do it all themselves. When it's clear that they don't. They can't, it's a massive amount of work and stress, not everyone has the same strengths, not everyone's a specialist at every dance style. OTOH, I agree that accusing people of things without proof doesn't lead anywhere either. Particularly since it usually ends with "I'll believe the worst of the pro I don't like and the best of the pro I'm a fan of". Louis and Tony for all their good qualities aren't exactly without self-interest here either with their insinuations (Louis is self-evident, Tony came out with that stuff in the fifth season when brand new young pros became his competition...). I can believe that Witney didn't know how the Emmy ballot worked. And she's been quick to give him credit. But the DWTS producers with their decade of experience in Emmy submissions? They must have known that without contract, without crediting Alan officially it would be difficult to get him recognized. So I'm really side-eyeing the producers here. It appears he's also been helping out Sharna? I just wish DWTS was more upfront about that stuff. I don't blame the pros at all. They're at the mercy of the show, if they speak out of turn they might not be brought back. So I understand that they toe the line. But it's also obvious that choreography can be a collaborative effort and DWTS doesn't always want to admit to it because it doesn't suit their interests. When I watched the livestream for Noah's freestyle for example it was clear to me that Paul and Mark were pitching in ideas, it wasn't only Sharna. And there's nothing wrong with that. Same with Moore helping out. Or pros doing run-throughs with other dancers, looking for a second opinion, etc. As long as they don't take credit for things they didn't do, that seems fine with me. ETA: truthaboutluv, yeah, absolutely. But I guess for me it comes down to power differences. Perhaps he didn't feel he was in a position to make those demands. Because IMO it's pretty clear that DWTS as a show, at least when they don't do a storyline in the package about a pro having a creative crisis or something, don't want to really highlight if there's outside help.

So...I rewatched "The Crossing" from season three, written by Messer and Fisher. It's not the greatest episode ever, but parts of it are quite interesting. What struck me about it is this: It's ostensibly a "JJ heavy" episode and she is the focus much of the time. She's championing taking the stalker case, she talks about how much pressure her job brings with it, she gets (overly) personally invested, they clumsily establish that she's pregnant. But...IMO much of that is heavy-handed and not particularly good writing for the character. I actually think Prentiss and Morgan are better drawn in that plotline, even though they aren't as prominently featured. And the B-plot with Hotch and Rossi assessing the case of the psychologically abused wife who killed her husband is for me much stronger. It has good characterization for both Hotch and Rossi. And the case because it's so quiet and sad is very effective. I guess I just find it curious what happened there: They obviously set out to establish certain things about JJ and make her the center of attention in that episode. Yet the other parts, where perhaps they weren't trying so hard to reach a certain end goal, stand up as stronger. I wonder if that sometimes happens with the writing for JJ in general now? To be fair, Messer isn't always so heavy-handed and she's often written very well for JJ and perhaps circumstances during that time were forcing her hand a bit. Still: Because they (writers, producers, network?) maybe want to drive home certain points about the character (tough action hero! super profiler! best mom!) they overplay their hand and come up with a lot of OTT and forced scenarios for her. Which then is detrimental for the character, no matter how much screen time she gets. It's screen time that is sometimes not that well used to establish believable and coherent things about her. Though they have been better about it this last season.

I think Sadie's samba, contemporary and foxtrot were amazing...as pieces of choreography, not as production numbers. But again...I don't want to criticize Sadie, she did the best she could to perform it, still: The foxtrot suffered from Sadie making that mistake at the end, her contemporary will always be judged against the SYTYCD people and then her dancing can't keep up even though it was good in the DWTS context. The samba was her strongest performance, but even there you see the choreography much more clearly when you watch Mark, how the duck movements and distortions are integrated with traditional samba elements. Willow was a stronger dancer, but also someone who understandably can't keep up with the SYTYCD crowd. And again, I think AT, contemporary and foxtrot in particular stand up as pieces of choreography, not only as production numbers. The AT apart from the abstract paint theme was more traditional, but both contemporary and foxtrot told stories through movement and performance. Yes, they were integrated with production, but IMO they didn't overwhelm. And those are for me the candidates for Emmy submissions. I doubt he handed in the paso with Sadie, no matter how much he might like concept or how he defended it in public, he IMO also clearly adjusted what Sadie could and couldn't handle after that one...so he totally saw that she was overwhelmed by it. But again, it's not only Mark. Most pros have that disadvantage. My unpopular opinion is that Val did better choreography with Janel than with Rumer, even though Rumer was the better dancer. But he had the same problem: Great choreo looked weaker because Janel had limitations as a dancer. Same with Bethany and Derek. That paso was killer. Her execution IMO wasn't, though she gave it her all. Same with the contemporary. Already talked about Sharna. If you don't have a ringer, it won't look as good. The format as a whole puts all the pros at a disadvantage compared to the SYTYCD crowd.

I'm disappointed that Mark didn't get a nom, I thought his work with both Sadie and Willow was stellar. But it was always a long-shot. Same for Sharna, unfortunately. The SYTYCD crowd always has the major advantage of presenting the choreography with very good dancers who know what they are doing. When you have limited partners like Sadie, Willow and Noah...the choreography will not look as good, it won't be seen as clearly. I know Derek got a nom with Amy, but he probably has more clout and more of a lobby behind him with the Emmys. Congrats to all the nominees! (-:

JJ, Morgan are probably the ones used to target a younger demo. You know, make them "cool", action heroes etc. OTOH there were articles with "sources" saying that CBS etc. see JM and TG as vital for the survival of the show during contract negs a few years ago. And I can believe that. They do probably have trackers about audience response that goes beyond social media. And the faithful CM audience that skews older and makes up a large part of viewership is likely anchored to the show mostly through those two. So they have to cater to that audience to some degree. And IMO they do that, there might be dissatisfaction about it not being enough or how screen time is used (sub-par writing is more of a problem for Rossi than Hotch IMO), but both Rossi and Hotch get a decent amount of screen time and attention each season. The statistics thread about screen time on this forum also shows that. The problem for Reid as a character might be...pure speculation here: I tend to agree that TPTB probably think they're doing great with Reid and often social media response will reinforce that. As long as he's "cute and adorable" it might get approval from vocal parts of his fanbase, no matter how ridiculous the writing. As a character he also comes with certain traps: He has certain loud, obvious characteristics. Also nuances, complexities and so on, but as a writer it's perhaps easier to just play into stereotypes with him and turn him into caricature.

Since I'm already here, might as well add other UOs. (-; I didn't mind Hotch and Beth either, it was vaguely plausible and while some of it was cheesy the actors did a decent job selling it. And it showed Hotch living life and putting himself together after trauma and grief which rang true for the character as I read him. Was it stellar execution? Nah, but since that's true for every aspect of the show now... Hotch is my fave character (as you might have guessed LOL) and I agree that the writing for him has suffered as the writing for all the characters has suffered. But IMO compared to about all the others, he's doing all right. TG seems to have a good grasp about what makes him tick, which keeps it coherent. And when the writers don't know what to do with him, they fall back on "looks stern in the background, does boss-like things", which is boring and lazy but for me doesn't do half as much damage as for example some of the things they've done to Morgan, JJ or Reid where they're in the forefront of episodes doing ridiculous OTT stuff that is totally incompatible with what we've learned about them before. And when they do write for him and he's center stage it's usually pretty good and consistent. I mean, sure it was better in the earlier seasons when there were more layers and the team dynamic in general was superior. But I just figure I can't complain too much, compared to what's been done to some of the others. Some of it is probably also natural decline that sets in when a show is on for so long. I've seen it happen on other shows as well. I love Morgan. Always have, always will. And I find some of the clunkers they've written for him absolutely disgusting. Large parts of season 6 was basically a pod person masquerading as Derek Morgan IMO, terrible. And what I wish they brought back more is his role as skeptic. I remember how annoying I found him constantly questioning Gideon's fitness in the early seasons. What do you know? His fears turned out to be warranted. It was a small thing, it didn't take up much screen time, but it was a nice piece of continuity and characterization. I wish TPTB still knew how to do subtle things like that. JJ, the media liason, was one of my favourites. She played a vital role and had a skillset that none of the others possessed. I liked that she was remote and rather cool beneath her politeness, not all female characters need to be warm and nurturing. Am not so fond of JJ, Power Ranger. (-; But I think she still offers good and interesting contributions to the show, which makes the instances where they get it wrong with her that much more aggravating. In the early seasons, writing for him was for the most part really good and MGG did a great job with him, but IMO he did veer into Gary Stu territory at times. This has now shifted to JJ to some degree, who gets the Mary Sue treatment occasionally.

I thought Haley and Hotch's marriage and divorce was one of the better storylines on this show. It all made perfect sense. That they knew each other since high school and had fallen in love with "unfinished" versions of themselves, then perhaps started to grow in different directions as adults, but kinda, sorta tried to ignore that because they loved each other. But love doesn't solve everything, particularly when two partners want two totally incompatible things from life. I didn't think there were any villains at all or "sides" to take. But then another UO, I guess. I've never ever seen Hotch as some sort of tortured martyr. He also wasn't somehow treated "badly" in their marriage by Haley that we saw. They had conflicts that got worse and worse as their relationship started to disintegrate, and they both contributed. Yes, Haley made the verbal demands, but Hotch barely ever gave in to any of them. He de-escalated the argument and mollified her, then he didn't cut back on his work anyway. Rinse. Repeat. I think the episode when Haley leaves is some of the strongest writing ever done on this show. Also very well acted by TG and MM. It shows why that marriage was doomed, why it couldn't be saved. It has Haley's "it's what you do" and Hotch's "It's who I am". Hotch feels that being a profiler is a fundamental part of his identity (and from what we've seen on the show, I tend to agree with him), Haley doesn't understand that or doesn't want to understand that, because she doesn't like what his job as a profiler brings into their relationship. By denying that reality, by telling herself for a long time that "it's just for now, he'll change jobs, all will be better" she was able to stay in the marriage even though she was unhappy. Because she loved him and didn't want to give up on that love. But in that episode reality finally hits for her and she leaves. What those scenes also very smartly do is show what would have happened had Hotch taken that White Collar job. The marriage would have been dunzo anyway, just a bit later. Because the prospect of having to take that White Collar job, of Haley not understanding how strongly he feels about being a profiler...that's the first time we see Hotch really lash out at Haley in an argument. He's aiming to wound her with his words and obviously does. And I just think the White Collar job would have meant tables turned: Haley gets what she wants, but Hotch is unhappy and grows progressively more resentful of Haley. The end result is the same: Divorce. Just a bit later.

Leto and Redmayne would have been my examples for (white) men getting away with IMO pretty obnoxious campaigning as well. Arguably they were "worse" than Hathaway, yet the press didn't start writing about how terrible they are and that everyone hates them. Hathaway has to watch her every public step to this day and do "damage control". Cumberbatch is an interesting case. He campaigned pretty hard at the beginning as all participants in Weinstein productions have to do, then after the Golden Globes as it became clear that it was between Redmayne and Keaton it suddenly stopped. My guess is he and his team knew that he's overexposed and that he'll be doing more PR for his 3 million other projects in the near future, why not take a step back now? After the GGs perhaps they managed to convince Weinstein to allow them to scale it back since he wasn't winning anything anyway?

I think you have to differentiate at what stage people are in their careers, though. DDL for example does have a reputation for being crazy, he even makes jokes about it, and when he was younger also for pretentiousness, but he's toned that down IMO and relaxed about his "craft" in interviews. Loads of people (in the press as well as in various comedy skits) have been making fun of him and his extreme Method for decades. But it's not the prevailing narrative at this point in his career. In the 90ies, though, when he was about Hathaway's age and hadn't yet retired from the Hollywood scene? Yeah, the press was going in on him pretty hard. Then he totally withdrew from that scene and still is only participating now when he's promoting a movie. So he removed himself from the celebritiy aspect somewhat, he wasn't vying for "hottest leading man" anymore (if he ever did, I don't think that's where his interests are), I'm sure he's getting paid very well, but he could be making more if he was a "regular movie star", he aged out of being interesting for the gossip press, he added arguably iconic performances in Gangs of New York, There Will Be Blood and Lincoln and stopped taking himself so damn seriously in interviews. He's just in a very different phase in his career than Hathaway, so for me you can't compare it in such a straightforward way. And I'm sure plenty of people in the industry don't want to work with him because of his extremism. But at this point if you're hiring DDL, you know what he's like and should be prepared to accomodate him IMO. It's not some big secret, he's been working like this for over thirty years and it's well publicized. He also seems relatively low-key and agreeable when he's out of character. I suspect if he threw in Russel Crowe antics on top of the Method acting, people wouldn't be so willing to give him a break. Pettyfer is another discussion. There it's not about talent or anything, but about rumoured bad behaviour on set. Which is something that I suspect can kill your career pretty fast if you're not making people tons of money yet and aren't seen as an exceptional talent (which Pettyfer isn't). Which is something where I think someone like Bale has a reputation for being hard-working and disciplined, though "intense". And he was Batman when that tape of him ranting was leaked, and he apologized relatively quickly and took responsibility for it. Then he added an Oscar to his resume. People are still laughing about it, though. So it's not like it just went away and hasn't affected people's perception of him at all. He was just at a point in his career where he could survive it. Same for Hathaway. She's getting work, she's just very careful about how she's dealing with the press now. Though I do think that sexism absolutely played a part in the way events unfolded in 2013. Hathaway was supremely annoying and awkward during the awards campaign IMO, and it was on full display because she kept on winning everything. But the way major press outlets started writing about "everybody hating Anne", yeah they contributed to the narrative. It became this massive thing. I remember that I found Ben Affleck in that year about as cringeworthy in his campaigning, yet that wasn't part of the discussion. So I agree that women get scrutinized more in that context. And I didn't think Hathaway's Oscar campaign was the worst ever, I thought plenty of other people have done OTT embarassing Oscar campaigns. Yet we were told by parts of the media that hers was somehow especially horrible.

Yeah, for the long-time male pros, some get a very specific type again and again. Though Emma is already kinda typecast and Peta had a run there of getting "hunks" a few seasons ago. It's more pronounced with the men, though. Val usually gets the attractive actress types, usually very capable, and often they're encouraged to go the "sexy" route in their dances. Though you had Danica and Liz there in the middle, IMO rather similar to each other, with dance experience and good dancers, but overthinkers. I remember somewhat questioning at the time why they would give Val with his intensity people with such a personality structure, since he's just bound to reinforce their nervous tendencies (not that he didn't try to adapt and help them out, but IMO that doesn't come naturally to him). But they fit his "type", so the producers just went with it anyway. With Mark and Tony it's also interesting how strangely specific it gets. Tony has the older ladies and one kind of "difficult": Celebs who are believed to be "divas", loud, demanding. Mark has the youngsters, the conservative women and another kind of "difficult": Celebs who show themselves to be potentially "fragile" or unsure about themselves and how to approach the show. And I guess to some degree I can't fault them too much for the typecasting, though it gets annoying. When you have people who have a proven skillset, why not go with what you know and you're assured that it won't end with a disaster. Because they might like the headlines and controversies, but I'm not sure they're really interested in the horror that was Hope and Maks for example where it's just negativity and ugliness.

About different "types": I thought at the time and still think that Lea with Mark would have been interesting. Her and Artem for me weren't an ideal pairing, she was sort of overthinking, too much in her own head all the time and Artem didn't seem to know how to break her out of that and sometimes even seemed to reinforce that. I don't blame either of them for this, sometimes things just don't click. And Artem was great with Patti, a totally different personality. Mark did great with Candace and her stage fright, I also thought Katherine Jenkins for all her talent and abilities was someone who could have been a nervous wreck with the wrong partner. She was still in her head too much at times, but it didn't become a massive issue. He's good with nervous partners like that. Selfishly, I want Mark with someone who has some potential so he can choreograph interesting things on them and isn't stuck forever on the bare basics. But even a limited partner like Candace eventually started putting out enjoyable performances (adjusted for her of course: Contemporaries, samba, jazz were nice...the AT was gorgeous and one of the highlights of season 18 for me). So I just don't want him with totally hopeless cases like Bristol, I think every fan of a pro thinks like that. And yeah, at this point I would appreciate it if the partner wasn't conservative and/or super young. Been there, done that. Why not someone like Lea? Or someone his own age? And not of the "dancing for Jesus" type. They can be beginners, he gets them more often than not anyway. And getting ringers is always tied to all that hassle and resentment, not worth it. As long as they're somewhat capable and willing to put in the work, I'm fine. I'm sure the producers have just waited with bated breath for my input on all this. (-:

I think "older" is not the only criteria for a partner being challenging. Mark has had his share of very tough assignments, I would argue. Kim Kardashian. Bristol Palin. Twice. IMO that's up there with Kate Gosselin as perhaps one of the worst celeb partners ever. Yet the work he did with her in season 11 was astonishing for me. She was untalented, unmotivated, whiny, had no work ethic and was probably forced by her mother into it. He was patient with her to a point that...I really don't know how he did it. And her dancing was somehow not the catastrophe it could have been, it wasn't good by any means, but somewhat bearable. Candace was not an easy partner at all, yet he made it work despite her limitations and nerves. Sadie came with massive family interference and limited talent, he made it work. Willow had talent, but she was also 14, which brought a lot of restrictions with it. Yet he made it work. I would say after Katherine Jenkins, he never had a super capable celeb in the Nastia Liukin, Zendaya, Rumer vein. He's not leading man material for the producers. He's "mad scientist guy". He's "babysitter guy". Val and Derek are the leading men on this show and so they get the contenders for the most part.

The Sia dance was also choreographed by Tessandra Chavez, per Kristyn Burtt. So perhaps Chavez was inspired by Derek's staging for Nastia's dance? (-; And agree that the content wasn't similar at all.

Congrats to Rumer and Val! (-: I thought it was a great partnership and they worked very hard for this! Over the season, I also thought Rumer was probably the best when you take dancing and performance skills together, so good for her! (-: As for that other stuff: It's not really a "competition", it's never been a competition. And when you make the argument that the fix was in for one couple, then isn't there also an implicit argument that couples/pros that won in earlier seasons you might have preferred were also being favoured? I personally do think the show is heavily manipulated and storyboarded. It's about what TPTB think will make the most headlines, give them the most ratings, keep ABC the most happy. Just like all reality TV. So fans of various pros can point to instances where their fave was railroaded and they will probably be right, since at that point in time it suited the producers and their narrative. While others will point out that this or that pro was favoured here or there, which will also probably be true since it suited another storyline. It's scripted BS, but I watch it anyway for the cheese and the dancing. More fool me. (-;

Another example of this is Charlie White, as I already mentioned. When you look solely at his scores, they look mostly appropriate. But somewhere around mid-season (probably when it became clear that he didn't have the votes...and he perhaps wasn't as cooperative with production as they wanted him to be) the judges started going in on him a bit, getting nitpicky. They basically skewered him for his paso doble, you don't see that looking only at his scores. He also had short, uninteresting packages. Just like Nastia with her blah packages and the one hit piece. And you can't tell me that "nothing interesting happened that week", the show is highly storyboarded and scripted, the producers just didn't want to give them a more favourable edit.

This being "Val's season" was one of the storylines they set up this season, so it's not surprising they take that up again. I do think that's the most preferred outcome for production and has been from the start. Like Fons winning last season. Basically everyone knew he had this after the first week. I think season 18 wasn't as clear cut, they would have been fine with Amy as well. Once it became clear Charlie didn't have the votes, they threw him under the bus (I do believe it happened this way around). And they were fine with the M/M juggernaut as well.

Eh, underwhelmed by all the freestyles. I guess Noah's was the "best" in the sense that it capitalized on all the things he is able to do and used it to tell his story and show him off to his advantage. Rumer's was a nice AT, but didn't wow me. Riker's didn't really work for me either, though I do commend Allison for going out of her comfort zone and doing something that she thought would play to his strengths, even though it didn't necessarily play to hers. I'd be okay with anyone winning it at this point. Rumer was perhaps the best of the ones still around, I've had issues with Val's choreo to some degree throughout the season, but that's not her fault and she did great. Riker IMO was similarly hampered somewhat by Allison and her limited ability to teach him ballroom and latin technique. Great performer, though. Noah did what he could, and since they did IMO score him appropriately in the finals here...if he takes it on votes, I'd be okay with that.