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Churchhoney

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Everything posted by Churchhoney

  1. I don't watch this. So maybe this is crazy, but I would think it's just like most of the rest of the reality shows.....They would tell you to bring people who disagree with you..... And then they'd carefully tell everyone in your retinue to think of all their objections and all the things that annoy them about wedding dresses and the bride-to-be and the whole situation and harp on those things on camera in the harpiest way possible. In other words, "Okay, friends and family, now remember -- Be on your absolute worst behavior! Ready to do that? Great! Bitchy bitchy bitchy bitchy. We're rolling tape in 5...4....3....2......." These shows want drama. If they started showing too many people who were congenial and reasonable and having a good time, audiences would evaporate in short order, I expect.
  2. Unfortunately, that may well be true.... But Jer's said he's hoping for a New Great Awakening and revival movement -- which he needs if he's going to make a decent salary as a preacher! .... And I'm pretty sure the attitude isn't helping churches gain -- or keep -- adherents....So if he wants to ensure his own preferred future, it'd be better to behave differently, I think! 😁
  3. I didn't say scheduling doesn't work for control. I only said that chaos is something that works and is often used for mean-spirited control.......Obviously hyper-drive scheduling does work. But so does randomness of timing........I have lived this and have seen other people live it, so I know that it's true and I know how it works on people and why, as I explained. .In addition, though, there are many ways other than having no schedule that control freaks use randomness to manipulate. Such as pretending that all their rules are ironclad and then suddenly randomly announcing that, today, people have broken rule x, when they've never mentioned rule x before, ever. I wouldn't in the least put it past Steve Maxwell to pull that kind of trick, for example. Especially on his wife. I'll bet Teri's heard about how she's broken a ton of Steve's rules that she never heard of before she supposedly broke them! That's randomness of another kind and I'd shocked if it were proven that Steve never uses it. On Joy and Austin -- I'm not going by how fundie they look. I don't think we have any real way to know how fundie they look, frankly. Seems to me we have little evidence, period, and that what we do have points in both directions, to some degree. And I depart completely from your assessment that they make fundie look good! I think they make it look horrible. Austin's sexism and Joy's submission to it absolutely sicken me. And while I think their work ethic looks better than those of most of the rest of the Duggar clan, I think Austin's fundie-ish side comes out big time -- and in a very bad way -- when he (probably) evades all regulations and standards in his work. That's fundie as hell to me, and, to me, it makes him a person who's a highly irresponsible to society -- for a religion-related reason......Not a good look or anything that makes fundie-ism look good for society or for its practitioners at all, in my opinion. I was arguing against the prediction that they'll surely get into the mid-double-digit kid area based on one thing -- as I repeatedly said. All I argued was that I think they will find the economic and lifestyle-related changes that come as they approach that very high number to be more than at least one of them -- my bet is Austin -- will want to put up with.....And that that is what I think will likely stop them before they get to the really high numbers.......... I never said that they hadn't yet faced any "realities." I'm well aware that they've had a stillbirth and that that's a difficult reality. But here in the third-and-rising-to-the fourth decade of the 21st century, given their economic and family situations. their earning potential, and so on? I don't think they really have a clue yet how economics, the lifestyle they'll be able to afford as more and more kids come, and just a day-to-day overcrowded living situation will really impact them on a daily basis, especially Austin, who comes from a small family. That kind of discomfort is enough to have made a lot of people change their minds about "we'll have as many children as God gives us." And they inherited this religion from their parents! So, unlike their parents, they can throw all or some of it overboard without feeling like idiots if they find it just too damn inconvenient....That's also something that's allowed a lot of second-generation cult-y people to walk or to bend the rules. And I don't see any evidence that it surely could not happen here.
  4. Exactly. The Duggars aren't at all representative of the large families I've known either. They are representative of quite a few mean-ass control-freak psychological-abuse-type households, though....In this randomness as in some other things.
  5. Good point. Definitely JB's preferred lifestyle. Randomness is also a major tool of the manipulative power-trip kind of control freaks, in my experience. .... When there's no structure or schedule, it's much easier to keep people totally off balance and to gaslight them. When nobody knows what to expect, they're on edge all the time and the person in charge can totally use that to their own advantage. Plus, as JB exhibited, it's a joy to the autocrat in the venue without a schedule to be able to randomly yell into the PA system "Come down here now!" because that always comes as a nervous-making shock and interruption to whatever everybody's doing. And that's a great thrill for those who cherish pushing people around.
  6. He's got sucking-up hustle, I think. .... Pretty much zero working hustle or studying-your-pursuits-whatever-they-be-to-improve-your-skills hustle, though..... I want to think that you need at least some of the working-and-improving hustle, too, even if you're a dedicated and successful suck-up (as he clearly is).....But I must say that his levels of success at the moment are making me wonder..... An instinct to kiss the right asses and a massive drive to do it may be enough for a fair amount of success of some kinds.....Although I do wonder where they'd be financially if Jingle's maiden name weren't bringing in both cash and a good supply of the right asses to kiss. It consoles me to think that, without that, Jer's suck-up hustle might not be getting him very far!
  7. Thanks! And yeesh.....Not surprising, of course. But yeesh anyway.
  8. Yeah, I've heard that, too. The re-education institutions the Gothardites teamed up with some state governments to run were hellish by every account I've ever seen. Gothard and his crew seem to be most devoted to a "godly in-group" vs. "vile untouchables" worldview.
  9. I had reason to follow Hutchinson's doings back when he was in DC. Talked to him a few times. He always struck me as being pretty smart, albeit sometimes led in dumb directions by some of his convictions and his cronies. Also .... I missed the beginning of this whole Caldwell flap, and now they seem to have deleted their stupidity.....Could somebody give me a short recap of what they said? Or, if not, essential oils will do it. 😁
  10. Well, she seems to enjoy drawing......And drawing, even if you're terrible at it -- and she's fairly decent at it -- is a positive activity, almost certainly good for you and your brain and so on, doesn't interfere with other people and their right to make their own decisions....And it's something she'd almost certainly not be doing if she were married to a son of the patriarchy and pumping out God's army, making the guy sandwiches, scrubbing out his skid marks. etc. So, yeah.....
  11. Jer's god cares for people the way Ivan the Terrible cared for peasants?
  12. This. So much this. If the damn TeeVee show hadn't given their family money and fame linked to their damn Gothardism, the tie between them and said Gothardism would be so much weaker. Damn you, TLC.
  13. Hope so.....I think those numbers hold promise for the total decline of Gothard/Quiverfull popularity..... But....you know, famous last words and all that. There's probably a good chance some new loopy guru will leap up with a lot of the same old suggestions, repackaged, and present himself as an "Instagram influencer" or something and get all the Duggarlings onto a new have-a-million-children bandwagon...... 😁 Here's hoping not, however. That suggests to me that Austin's quite susceptible to wavering under economic and lifestyle-threatening pressures (You won't be able to afford hunting trips to the mountain West!) I pin some hopes on this! Because as they approach the double-digit kid threshold, there will be economic and lifestyle pressure.
  14. Apparently it's fairly easy, since the vast majority of Gothard-raised children have left that cult! ... As I understand it, they get a small stream of newbies these days. But the overwhelming majority of those who were in have long since been out.....and many have dropped every Gothard "rule" and preaching they ever heard, it would seem from online testimonies.... And that's even true of some kids in the otherwise diehard families, like the Kellers, who reportedly have had to work like hell to keep their youngest sons from drifting away like some of their older kids have done. And I don't know that the Duggars or the Bateses can fully be counted when it comes to gauging the pull of Gothardism, really. Because in both cases, the fact that their nutso beliefs got them TeeVee fame and some money have clearly played a role in the willingness of the kids to remain part of it all.... I think Austin probably scared himself during his rebel period and returned, embracing the thing wildly for that reason. But that kind of rebound effect isn't necessarily permanent, as far as I can tell. Speaking of Gothardism and its potential influence, I looked up their 990s (online through FY 2017) and they are so an organization in decline.....(throws confetti)....although there are certainly still people paying for their crap.... However, IBLP is spending its seed corn now. As of FY 2017, they still had about $60 million in assets -- down from what was reportedly well over $100 million not too many years earlier -- but they've been spending it down every year, and their actual revenue coming in has shrunk like crazy over the past decade. Their annual spending has significantly outstripped their actual annual revenues every year for a long time now. Annual contributions dropped from over a million in FY 2011-FY 2014 to well under $200,000 by FY 2017....so if support for the organization is anything to go by, they do not have much of a hold on people any more.... They do keep selling stuff, though. (or did in 2017, anyway,...) In FY 2017, they brought in $570,000 in seminar fees; $379,000 in "literature and tapes"; nearly $131,000 in homeschooling horrors; and nearly $1.2 million in "training center fees." For a total of $2.2 million in revenue for the year.....They spent $6.26 million, however. .... So, you know, outgo far outsripping income.... And the revenue is down from $3.8 million in FY 2016......And in FY 2011 through FY 2013, they were bringing in between $5-plus and $6-plus million every year..... Thankfully, "home education" has really dropped off -- It brought in over $700,000 in revenue in FY 2011......Nice to know that they're not selling that stuff any longer. And that the future generations of Duggars, Forsyths, etc., may not be "educated" with it unless their grandparents horded all the books they "taught" their kids with.... https://projects.propublica.org/nonprofits/display_990/366108515/2012_09_EO%2F36-6108515_990_201112
  15. He failed with me, too. But at least he's practicing his sermon writing now. So there's that. 😁
  16. It must have been the Anti-Jill-Rodrigues
  17. Aaaaa. They're all still awfully young. And very very inexperienced. None of them has faced any major economic consequences yet. They probably couldn't even envision at this point what the economic consequences would be like in their situations............. And Austin rebelled once. Yeah, he's done the rebound thing -- come back stronger than ever. But once he did have some different thoughts and feelings in him. They're unlikely to have died altogether. People can change their minds about things. Life circumstances that they never fully anticipated can enlighten them. And while JB keeps supporting with cash Anna's desire to have all those kids (I won't say Josh's desire because we know he thought three kids was enough, long ago....), nobody is going to be able or willing to give much to support to either of these two couples. So economic consequences will start to be fierce after a while.....And that'll be a dose of reality that they may not be willing to soldier through to keep producing hordes, in the end.....For one thing, I don't see either couple able or wiling to do it by grifting, in the style of Jill R or JB. And there aren't any other realistic options for them, financially. Yeah, they're fundie. They're Gothard. But they're not first generation of those things. They aren't converts -- who usually tend to be the truest believers for the long haul.... They inherited it all. It wasn't a choice with any of them, although they currently imagine that it was. .... I think things could look very different to them when reality actually bites. Their baby making fervor hasn't been tested against anything like that yet. I'll be very surprised if one of the two couples, at least, doesn't stop the baby train eventually. Right now they're on automatic pilot, seems to me. Circumstances may wake them out of that trance.
  18. I sort of fear they'll approach those numbers, too. At the same time, though, Austin strikes me as having at least a tiny bit of common sense -- at least enough to have some anxieties about life's realities.... Does he really think he can feed and house that many children? His family of origin is small, and yet I don't get the sense they were living in luxury......And JB and M had a tv show, which he has to know he is not going to have.... I suppose "the Lord will provide" plays a role. But I still wonder whether, ultimately, they're going to be this dumb. Ditto for Joe and Kendra......And I'm hoping they won't be. That at some point they'll have the sense to stop the train.
  19. An attitude, aptitude and approach to life that'll go over so well when/if Jer ends up on the staff of some church somewhere.......
  20. Hey, what is life without a volumizer, huh?
  21. Well, the llcs almost certainly are proliferating in response to last year's tax law, which increased their tax favorability like gangbusters.....I'm sure he's thrilled to have them any time a pot of money comes in. But it was definitely the new law that sparked the creation of so many. And he did get $1.5 million for the house....but I'd bet his actual take from the sale didn't amount to a third of that, if that much, in the final analysis. The house had to cost a bundle to renovate. He held onto it for a few years, so he was paying property taxes all that time -- and maybe mortgage interest, although it's possible he bought it for cash.... He almost certainly had to spend more making it sale-ready than he ever expected. Just the new staging and photography that finally sold it couldn't have come cheap....I'm sure he spent a lot more on the place over time than he ever expected to.... That still leaves a nice chunk of money....but Boob has 30 some people and rising to support.... And a political campaign to pay for! I doubt Jed!'s getting much help from other donors -- If the local GOP thought they could win that seat, I expect they would have run somebody who had a much better chance. So I expect the Duggs are pretty much on their own with it....
  22. Wonder how much transferring of funds and "loaning" and "borrowing" and such among one family's suddenly proliferating horde of llcs that look like they're mostly just ownership vehicles, not businesses, would make the IRS want to come by and perform an audit....
  23. I've sometimes wondered whether he bought that passel of elderly planes mainly so they could paint them up a little bit and then have them sitting around his hangars to make it look like his hangar space is sought after to attract other renters..... I mean, it does seem like "Duggar Aviation" is much more likely to just be another form of real-estate venture rather than anything that has much to do with flying.....I don't seem him letting those boys loose to do much real flying for people JB doesn't actually know.....That would be too risky for the big control freak. They might get the idea that they could fly for other people, independently of Boob, and get paid for it,.....and then fly the coop....
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