wayne67
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Posts posted by wayne67
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Iris/Barry/Joe are a whole different issue since they've had a total of 2 minutes of group interaction and just 1-2 brief scenes each with Barry over the past 4 episodes. Whether their family dynamic has changed or not is impossible to say, as that story is just not being told. Whereas Star Labs have had 4 episodes dedicated to their dynamics, and yet little to no progress in any one direction.
It feels like everything is happening in some sort of weird nonsensical vacuum of repetition and Wells is the Flash Mob's Cult leader that they have blind unwavering faith and devotion in ...
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Hi, new to the forum, just have to ask, since if I rode in a guy's arms at whatever speed Barry can travel, at the end of a ride to escape that kind of explosion, my hair would not look like that, unless Barry has a force field or something that protects those things he carries in his arms from the sheer force of the atmosphere passing over them. Ain't no [bleeping] way. Can somebody reasonably explain the pattern-perfect large curls?
I can't watch anymore until I understand this, especially if it's just wardrobe's failure to communicate the staging anachronism...
Everybody has perfect hair on TV! (Except vagrant!Firestorm) It's definitely a legit nitpick, though.
I assumed that Barry just developed Speed Force offscreen and nobody commented on it hence how he was able to transport everyone around (minus Felicity) without burning their clothes/skin from the insane speeds that he now travels at.
Unless they're forgetting that his clothes used to burst into flame when he didn't wear his speed suit as they seem to ignore that at random since introducing that phenomenon.
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I just had a random thought with the episode with Captain Cold and Heat guy it would have made much more sense for Cisco to upgrade Barry's suit with the shields he gave to the police which would give Cisco greater significance in the Flash gang. The extra weight of the suit would give Barry a legitimate reason to not smack the guns out of their hands during the confrontation because he'd be heavier than normal and would build up the sense that Barry is working towards greater speed with weight training.
The writing feels clunky and disjointed for Barry, he's supposed to be smart but he acts stupid which would make sense if they were going with him being reckless and arrogant but it seems like we're supposed to swallow that he's SUPER IMMATURE 26 year old with a good heart.
Is Barry ever going to try and figure out who Reverse Flash is so he can free his father or is he just going to erase his entire timeline with no forethought? Martin Stein made a point of saying that Barry would have to achieve a speed to punch through the space time continuum but Barry doesn't seem to care about the time space continuum or erasing himself or erasing the good he's done since then as Flash.
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Good point. There have been some missed opportunities to develop something interesting and complex with the STAR Labs crew. I thought sure Caitlyn would be more upset about Wells turning on the PC after being warned about it's danger. After all, she lost the love of her life to the blast, but nothing came of it. She was angry for 5 seconds, then it was back to business as usual. Though it came out of nowhere, Barry called Wells out about releasing Tony knowing that he would be killed by Blackout, but then quickly backed off after Wells claimed he felt guilt over the PC disaster and was able to recite the names of all the individuals who he knew were killed by the blast. I'd also think that someone on the crew would start to become suspicious of so many of Wells' former acquaintances either hating him or gunning for him but no one blinks an eye over this. It would certainly make Joe's (and perhaps even Iris') investigations more interesting if Barry was starting to have some reservations about Wells due to some of the questionable things he's seen about the man, instead he continues to insist that Wells is completely trustworthy.
Also, how interesting would it have been if there had been some disagreements about which meta humans go into the PC prison and which are worthy of rehabilitation. I think we can all agree that there have at least been a couple of them that weren't evil, but just a little misguided and could actually be of good use with some positive reinforcements. But again, nothing. Everyone ushers the metahumans they capture to the PC prison with no qualms about it, sometimes even with a smile on their faces.
Like you, though we see Team Flash working together, I don't feel a deep connection between them like Team Arrow. Trust was there from pretty much jump and they almost never have disagreements. Pre-packaged boy band was a great analogy for Team Flash.
Thank you for eloquently explaining my issues as of late with the Star Labs Gang. Everything they do has little impact on their relationships or interactions with each other. It's like watching an action adventure sitcom with technobabble BS to explain the nonsense. It's hard to invest in these characters when their interactions seem so inconsistent and incoherent and is often ignored by the next episode as if it never happened or their actions have little meaning to their day to day lives.
For instance I'm told Barry loves Iris, I don't know when this supposedly happened or why he's been holding onto it forever but he gets around to confessing it and it seems to have little impact on any of their relationships. There should be some awkwardness and disruption within the family unit when Iris tells her father but it doesn't have any long lasting impact on anything possibly because Iris doesn't trust Joe to keep it to himself or for other reasons but it all stays below the surface. I guess they could be going for some sort of subtlety but judging by the Metahuman prison and the lack of awareness of any of the supposedly moral characters about it's ongoing nature I feel a complete disconnect. I want to like this show but all the relationships feel fairly shallow and superficial.
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So the general thought the best way to grab Ronnie was to shoot up a coffee shop? And yet he let the STAR Labs van go without riddling it with bullets.
I'm still trying to figure out why they tranq'ed the waiter instead of just waiting for Ronnie and Caitlin to leave the restaurant/coffee shop and bag them outside in a discreet tranq and bag situation. Then again why a General would only have 5 soldiers escorting him about seems odd too. I'm still left wondering if running super fast will be the solution to every Flash fail.
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Eh. I'll take adorkable, still-learning, upbeat Barry and leave the weighty burdens to the sister show.
But learning implies character growth. All that seems to be happening is that he's speed training to run faster. He seldom seems to be mildly inconvenienced by the burden of being a super hero and responsible for the safety of the humans in the city.
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The difference between Buffy and Barry is vast.
Buffy is fast, strong and all that. But at the end of the day, she's only human and one person.
Barry is superhumanly fast with superhuman reflexes. Eventually so ridiculously fast that he can move at light speed or near-light speed and that he can go back in time. If the writers took his powers to their logical conclusion, there really would not be someone he could not beat if he spent a half-second thinking about how to defeat them. Captain Cold, Heat Wave and all those people with various weapons? He should be able to strip them of their weapons in a blink of an eye. Or punch them five hundred times in a second. Or grab protective gear and then beat them up.
In basically a worst-case scenario, he should almost always be able to effect a retreat and plan a second attack.
I'm aware that Barry is overpowered compared to Buffy. My point was he could plan something, even if the plan involves a 3 second glance at the Army base layout before he goes off to rescue someone. He could still get hit with an energy weapon or unmanned by a trip wire but his lack of any planning at all before an enemy encounter takes me out of the show as I just think he doesn't take it all that seriously so why should I. YMMV
I'd just like Barry to face some actual consequences for his actions, or deal with problems that super speed can't solve like a police inquiry into his actions at the CSI lab or getting investigated by his friend because he keeps lying to her, or dealing with his anonymity being broached for the 3rd time? by a super villain of the week. Or take some more care with his secret identity, on the Iris thread quarks made the point that 13 people know of Barry's secret identity and we're only up to episode 14. I'd just like some indication, no matter how small that there is some impact on this city with all the metahuman mayhem other than Iris's blog becoming popular enough to get her a job at the local newspaper.
There's a wealth of tension to be mined for Barry as a character but I'm not feeling any of it as he doesn't seem all that burdened by the weight of responsibility of being a hero.
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I don't mind if Barry wins, I just want Barry to stop bumbling into situations and super speeding out of them when they fail. There's very little actual tension because I know that no matter how stupid he is, he'll either be left for dead and recover (Tony) or someone else will do the heavy lifting of thinking for him (Pied Piper).
Firefly had some great moments where the 'heroes' would make a plan and it'll all go sideways due to unforeseen circumstances and they'd have to try and talk/shoot/outwit their way out of the situations they got themselves into. I feel like Barry doesn't have to think to succeed and that grates on me considering his earlier characterisation as a little goofy but really smart.
I guess I'm tired of the dumb hero motif.
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No. One of the problems with him being a thinking superhero is that there would never be any drama because he'd always win. He almost has to be dumb for there to be any tension.
Lol he's going to win anyway as he's the main character but is it so hard to make him win in a less contrived way ?
I knew Buffy was going to win every fight too but they often did scenes where the characters did research together and bonded a little with wry humor.
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Based on the latest episode, does anyone think Barry will ever learn to think before rushing into a battle with an enemy ?
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If Eiling really was killed then that's a waste of a good character and actor. Him knowing about Barry and Wells is a problem but Grodd could always do some mind control to shut him up. Having a high ranking puppet in the military is a useful thing.
I'm pretty sure if an actual General was missing from an army base for more than ten minutes than it would escalate the situation rather than remove the threat the army/Government poses. I'm sure all those men will report his absence and check the footage from their security cams/drones/military satellite. They might even connect Wells cooperation as suspicious considering his character or use their credentials to seize everything at Star Labs which is so poorly secured that Martin Stein walked right into the room they were in without anyone noticing except Ronnie. *sigh*
Maximum security prisons shouldn't be easily accessed off the street. Must stop thinking, it'll only aggravate me. *sigh*
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I think it's a case of people not wanting to believe that Wells is evil. Let's be honest Wells was his idol and now he's Barry's father figure. Is it easy to pinpoint him as a villain with all the things you pointed out? Yes, but when you look at it from Barry's perspective it's easy to see why he'd label Wells as a someone who means well even if his execution is questionable.
To be fair, Joe is doing the same thing and one could even argue the prison was partially Joe's idea.
I'm more interested in the general's thinking. "Let me create a weapon that requires my opponent to be stupid enough to trash talk me as opposed to just knocking me out."
Lol how many father figures does Barry need ? He's got a bio dad, Joe as his foster dad and Wells as his science dad? I'd accept Barry thinking Wells actions were well meaning but ill executed if A) the man wasn't supposed to be a genius B) His actions were questioned for more than 3 seconds before he's given a free pass by Barry because Wells strokes his ego.
Joe does question Wells actions, hence all the investigating. Apparently noone cares about the constitution in regards to that prison. I blame the Patriot Act.
Perhaps the General hijacked a military satellite and noticed Barry's tendency to quip first and punch later. There's probably at least 2 scenes of Pied Piper causing scenes in public spaces that would gather some notice from the military and Barry didn't do the sensible thing and speed behind the guy's back and knock him unconscious and strip him of his weapons without conversation. Then there's Captain Cold and Heat guy and their long winded battle when Flash could have run up to a roof and thrown some rocks at super speed at the two humans with SuperScience weapons.
The General probably used recon and battle strategy which is something Barry desperately needs before I'll accept him as a competent hero.
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I don't know. If you look at it from Barry's point of view, star labs has been teaching him to control his powers and it's given him a purpose in life. For Iris the lab has saved Barry's life. IMO, it makes sense that they don't want to believe that Wells is evil.
Except Barry has personal first hand experience that Wells was told by Pied Piper that the particle accelerator was dangerous and ignored it to continue on heedless of the dangers of experimentation. Pied Piper was then cut out by Wells for dissenting. Then there's the metahuman prison that has no oversight, the use of Tony as a decoy, the dead bodies that are just disposed of without Barry being concerned at all. '
As Mason? said Barry's life wouldn't have been in danger if Wells and co weren't being haphazard with matter. Regardless of intent, cleaning up the mess doesn't negate the impact of your actions just because you might be sorry. Supposedly 17 people died as a direct result of the explosion and countless others have suffered and or died in the resulting chaos of metahumans on the loose. Barry also knows that Wells is covering up the metahumans existence and doesn't ask why.
Wells should have a big neon sign saying 'DUBIOUS' over his head. Barry works with cops and the justice system he shouldn't be so naive about people's dark sides especially when Wells sacrifices a dude to delay an enemy's attack. I'll give him a free pass for not noticing the disappearance of major players since very little has any lasting impact in this city. A 15 year old murder is more important than a nuclear explosion in the 'badlands' outside the city to Joe.
It boggles the mind.
Also there is no way that the General developed a weapon to be used against The Flash without advising superiors of his name and power. Do you think Barry and Firestorm assaulting the army personnel would be considered treason ?
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Did it bother anyone else the amount of time that Barry spent super speeding back and forth without his super suit with or without passengers? Or that the special gizmo Ronnie was wearing disappeared when they separated the second time ?
Barry keeps aggravating me. He keeps rushing into situations without thinking and the solutions are often "RUN FASTER" like with Mist guy or Tony/Girder. It's becoming stale.
Barry and Iris are way too trusting of Wells/Star Labs considering their respective backgrounds/life experiences. Total disconnect.
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This was definitely an improvement on the Iris reporting sub plot though I do wonder about her assertion that the burning man worked at Star Labs, I'd imagine it would be fairly easy to prove as there should be some staff inventory she could look up in 3 seconds since Star Labs was supposedly a high profile facility.
I don't think Iris was particularly nosy, her interrogation came across as fairly tepid to me.
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You know what I feel like has been happening lately, on several shows that I watch, including? This exact conversation...
Writers/Show-runners/Powers That Be: I love this show I created, but I especially love this one character. I think they're the very best character ever, and I`m going to write them into as many scenes as possible, so that everyone can love them as much as I do!
Fans/Critics/The World At Large: Ummmm, we don't like that character as much as you do. We actually like some of these other, better, more interesting characters. Can we see them more?
Powers That Be: What? You don't all LOVE my favorite character! Well, I`ll show you! I`ll write even MORE scenes for them! And I`ll decrease screen time for all those other "better" and "more interesting" characters, so you'll forget all about them, and love my Favorite Character Ever!
The World At Large: Well, we now hate that character, and now we hate you. Please put the camera back on the characters that actually work .
Powers That Be: *puts fingers in ears* lalalalalal cant hear you! lalalalala
Unless the Network pulls their fingers out of their ears... I swear I could copy and paste this onto at least five different boards.
ITA. It's always painful as a viewer when TPTB try and force you into liking a character. It seldom ever works and the audience backlash gets massive. I'm reminded of Lana Lang and her ever growing list of skills that made no sense.
Unfortunately the converse happens to well liked and useful members of the crew, they get sidelined for the stupidest reasons to further plot or to service a weak/disliked character and their defined characteristics and skills are often overlooked eg Jenny when Hawley showed up, she seemed to forget that she had artifact knowledge and half a decade of artifact retrieval under her belt.
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I enjoyed the episode even if it was littered with plot holes and contrivance.
That said. I'm confused about Henry being suddenly mortal and turning into weird ash and floating away. What did Crane shoot him with exactly? He said something about greek fire weapons.
I was actually rooting for Katrina and Henry to succeed and activate all the witches in Sleepy Hollow/ The State. It would have given season 3 more of a scope where they would recruit good people into a Good coven and depower the bad ones that they could find (with some spell or potion) and it could be a race with The Big Bad of that season to get enough to stop/cause the apocalypse. I assumed it was going to be like the Buffy Slayer activation, people weren't necessarily going to be good or bad because of the power but use it based on their personality leading to all sorts of random conflict as random civilians were engulfed in the apocalyptic battle.
Of course I was confused about the importance of that particular bell to activate the spell but whatever. Macguffin of the day I suppose.
Instead we're going with more time travel hijinks. *sigh* I might just write my own fanfiction during the hiatus depending on how the finale pans out.
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I'd say mostly because I like CP, but also because I liked how Iris was being portrayed pre mid-season finale and because I like what she could be.
I actually love all the characters though honestly. Even if the writing for all of them is kinda shit!
I did like her before Barry's confession derailed her characterisation even further. I liked her best when she was engaged in some lighthearted matchmaking for Barry and Felicity because she wanted to make him happy.
The writing hasn't been great for many of the characters. Cisco creating a super weapon to neutralise/kill Barry/The Flash and losing it without telling anyone at Star Labs ruined that character for me. Caitlin's confusing reactions to Ronnie ruined her for me. Joe hiding the death threat targeting Iris ruined Joe for me. Barry blithely gloating over the imprisonment of Peekaboo ruined him for me. I'm really running out of characters to like. I'm just biding my time until Grood now.
I keep hoping that the writing will improve and smooth out some of the missteps like give Iris's reporting job some weight and show her doing some actual reporting.
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This! I mean Iris is my favorite character, I'm definitely an Iris fan, but that isn't gonna stop me from criticizing what she does. Or, more specifically, criticizing how she is written, because it's awful at this point and there is really no denying that, even if you love her.
I'm curious why is Iris your favorite character ?
Personally none of the characters have clicked for me. I liked Captain Cold for a few seconds before he degenerated into a stock standard "genius super villain" with stupid convoluted plans.
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I'm going to have to disagree partially and say I don't think it matters who we are invested in, I think sabotaging a relationship consciously when you are in one yourself would always look bad. What saves it for iris is that I don't think she did it consciously.
Fair enough. I'm just saying that we give more leeway to characters we like and understand than people we don't (typically). I mean I don't like Barry at the moment but I can still sort of understand where he's coming from. I don't even know what Iris is thinking half the time about her life so it's hard to relate.
I'm also starting to wonder - for the rest of you - do you consider a character's PoV to only be connected to what they "say" rather than what they "do?" I mean, I guess hearing what they say is the only way to try to confirm what we think we are seeing - but it isn't just that, right?
Otherwise that would be a lot of telling and not showing.
A lot of us are going by Iris's actions and inactions. For instance her moving in with Eddie and meeting his parents imply a certain level of relationship growth. We don't necessarily need to see it to assume that it has some meaning for Iris.
After all we get a lot of actions and dialogue with Barry but his inner thoughts are mostly referenced at the beginning and end of the episodes. Iris got a moment during that blog where presumably her inner thoughts were revealed about metahumans.
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and her silently weighing up her options over which man to choose does not endear me to the character.
Well, but the opposite idea of this didn't seem to endear you to her either... so?I'm confused. What's the opposite idea? Loudly not weighing up her options ? Did I miss something.
On that other topic you mentioned
- I'd like to get some reasoning for why Iris wanted to be a police officer
- What happened to Iris's mother
- Some moments with Iris and Eddie as a couple
- Iris actually doing some reporting with or without Mason, stuff like going out in the field, trying to track down metahumans or metacriminals. I'd even settle for some indication that she's looking for Peekaboo's bf.
- A 'family meal' between Iris, Eddie, Barry and Joe so we can see them all interact as a 'family'.
- A flashback to when and why Barry and Iris originally became friends.
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I don't think that's fair. A lot of people do this when they aren't sure about something. Sometimes it's best to do nothing, when doing something could cause so much harm. SevenStars and cynic already mentioned this - but Iris has a lot to think about - it's understandable if she's not sure which way to go, and keeping the status quo might feel like the easiest path to take... If she chooses to try with Barry, she'd hurt Eddie. And then if it didn't work out, family dinners would be a mess. Given that, I can see how she might just keep to the status quo.
Especially if she's unsure of herself, her feelings and possibly Barry's feelings at this point.
It really was only about a few weeks for Iris in terms of time - if that. That's not a lot of time to make a decision like that.
I don't understand the judgements on Iris as a person from this.
The problem becomes that Iris by choosing to keep the status quo has made a choice. She has decided to continue her relationship with Eddie, moving in with him meeting with his parents while contemplating her feelings for another man (maybe). That's considered unfair on Eddie and on Barry because Eddie thinks their relationship is moving on smoothly and Barry considers Iris to have effectively dismissed his feelings to continue on with her current relationship which is her right but it doesn't mean Barry should continue to be stuck in some kind of holding pattern indefinitely until she makes her choice.
Undermining Barry's relationship consciously or subconsciously while she herself is in a relationship comes across as fickled and unfair to the audience who has spent more time with Barry than Iris. People want to take his side because he's the main character and she is a character that makes little sense for a whole bunch of reasons.
It's unfair to expect that Iris is free to continue on her relationship with Eddie while Barry is supposed to wait on the sidelines to prove how deep his feelings for her were.
He moved on to someone who is actually interested in him which apparently is a first for him. It's a step in the right direction for him despite his emotional baggage and his secret alter ego nonsense.
Iris is in a relationship that she chose to pursue and since the female choosing between two men has always irritated me as a tv trope because I'm left yelling at the tv various refrains of "pick one", "pick both", "have a threesome and keep the best one" usually I end up settling for "MAKE A DECISION ALREADY I'M BORED". I admit to some personal bias, I've seen this trope play out so many times it's just tiresome.
At least in this case she's not picking between brothers or best friends just her former foster brother and her father's cop partner. I hate love triangles.
That said I don't dislike the character as much as I dislike Barry but that's an entirely different issue. I just want her to have some agency and her silently weighing up her options over which man to choose does not endear me to the character.
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I'm kind of over the relationship merrygoround with all these characters. I wish they had just stuck with Lavon and AB and had Zoe and Wade have a semi healthy relationship without the added burden of an accidental pregnancy thrown in at the last minute.
Best relationship is always Tom Long and Wanda. Hilarious and cute with their own issues that they usually resolve.
The whole moving out plot line was super contrived and I was annoyed that Zade basically dumped a country singer onto Lavon and abandoned him to cater to her every whim alone.
At the moment I'm only watching because of Tom Long and Lavon's excellent no no no NO's, most of the other characters aggravate me to varying degrees and at various times.
I marathoned the entire show in less than a week. Probably wasn't healthy.
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I disagree that they're trying to make another felicity. Caitlin's problem is that she's not written consistently. One minute she's the dark serious member desperately trying to get Barry and Cisco on board and the next minute she's playing along with their shenanigans. There has to be a happy medium
ITA Caitlin went from grieving Ronnie to searching him out desperately to being kind of blase about him returning from his presumed death. She's another character I don't get but at the very least her role in the Flash Gang dilutes her overall importance so I don't spend much time having to think about it, unlike Iris.
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S06.E08: A Wedding
in Glee [V]
· Edited by wayne67
I laughed at the ridiculousness in between groaning in pain at the stupidity and the Klaine propping.
If a ship is good you don't have the sell the audience that hard on it. (Samchel and Klaine)
The best thing about the episode for me was hearing Artie and Mercedes having a duet.
The weddings meant little to me as I think Britney comes across as having severe mental issues and Klaine has so many issues that they never address or resolve to endear them to me. I don't care that either are married. Meh.