photo fox May 6, 2014 Share May 6, 2014 James Moriarty possesses the greatest criminal mind that the world has ever seen. Sherlock and John knew he wouldn't stay hidden for long, but even they never guessed the sheer scale and audacity of the crime that would propel Moriarty back into the headlines. Sherlock must fight for his reputation, his sanity and his life. But is he all he claims to be? Link to comment
McKinley June 17, 2014 Share June 17, 2014 I'm a latecomer to watching this series, and just saw this ep for the first time in the last week. Google searches show that there was a huge explosion of speculation after this episode aired about how Sherlock did it. But there are two points of the episode that still confuse me, and I haven't seen them discussed much if at all: 1. When Sherlock and Moriarty were on the roof, and had this conversation: Sherlock Holmes: Yes, but I'm not my brother, remember? I am you. Prepared to do anything. Prepared to burn. Prepared to do what ordinary people won't do. You want me to shake hands with you in hell? I shall not disappoint you.Moriarty: Nah. You talk big. Nah. You're ordinary. You're ordinary. You're on the side of the angels.Sherlock Holmes: Oh, I may be on the side of the angels, but don't think for one second that I am one of them.Moriarty: No. You're not. I see. You're not ordinary. No. You're me. You're me. Thank you. Sherlock Holmes. Thank you. Bless you. As long as I'm alive, you can save your friends. You've got a way out. Well good luck with that. {he kills himself} Just before Moriarty changes his mind, he looks intently into Sherlock's face. We don't know what (if anything) he sees because the light flares behind Sherlock, obscuring his face from our view. What causes Moriarty to have this sudden change of mind here? I'm not at all sure what to make of this exchange. 2. Before Sherlock jumps, in his phone conversation with John he tells John that Moriarty was telling the truth - that Sherlock made up Moriarty and all of the other stuff to make himself look exceptional but it was all a lie. (John, of course, does not accept that.) He also tells John to tell everyone else that, as well. Why did he tell these lies to John? In order to comply with Moriarty's conditions to recall the shooters, he only had to jump. He did not have to make a deathbed confession to John. So why do it? So, if anybody happens by this thread, I'd be curious to hear any theories on these points. Link to comment
Peace 47 June 17, 2014 Share June 17, 2014 McKinley, I don't know for sure, but as to the first point, I think it was a theoretical "mind meld" situation: as in, Moriarty looked deep into Sherlock's soul in that moment and was convinced that Sherlock would indeed do anything to beat Moriarty. Whatever limits Mycroft, the police, anyone else would put on themselves, Sherlock would go well beyond that in the name of winning this standoff. And in addition, because the two were so "alike," Sherlock was the only one who could get into Moriarty's head to "trick" the info out of Moriarty. It's not so much that there was any tangible thing that Moriarty saw--more that they were alike enough (even if mirror images of each other) that Moriarty then clearly saw the only way to "win" was to irrevocably remove the possibility of Sherlock getting the assassin call-off info out of him. As to your second question, I remember wondering the same over at TWoP back in the day. I think some would say that in the context of this episode, Sherlock was trying to ease the blow for John: distance himself so that his death would be less personal to John. I think there's the motif in this episode and a couple of others that Sherlock thinks/ worries that John only really appreciates/ likes Sherlock for his dazzling genius, rather than as someone John loves through-and-through. And so if Sherlock removes the "genius" part in his rooftop speech, then he's performing a kindness (in his mind) for John. 4 Link to comment
rereader2 June 17, 2014 Share June 17, 2014 2. Before Sherlock jumps, in his phone conversation with John he tells John that Moriarty was telling the truth - that Sherlock made up Moriarty and all of the other stuff to make himself look exceptional but it was all a lie. (John, of course, does not accept that.) He also tells John to tell everyone else that, as well. Why did he tell these lies to John? In order to comply with Moriarty's conditions to recall the shooters, he only had to jump. He did not have to make a deathbed confession to John. So why do it? As to your second question, I remember wondering the same over at TWoP back in the day. I think some would say that in the context of this episode, Sherlock was trying to ease the blow for John: distance himself so that his death would be less personal to John. I think there's the motif in this episode and a couple of others that Sherlock thinks/ worries that John only really appreciates/ likes Sherlock for his dazzling genius, rather than as someone John loves through-and-through. And so if Sherlock removes the "genius" part in his rooftop speech, then he's performing a kindness (in his mind) for John. Now, I was thinking that the reason Sherlock did this was to give John and anyone he'd tell an acceptable reason for his "suicide". Remember, he was about to go after Moriarty's organization (he may not have foreseen Moriarty killing himself, but he'd have to assume he'd need to take out Moriarty's organization before it was safe to come back). He wouldn't want to give that network a reason to think he was alive, or they'd be after him at the very least, and very possibly go after his three targeted friends, too--especially if John or Lestrade found him! That he thought they'd believe that reads to me as a comment on Sherlock's lack of understanding how much his friends cared about him, himself, as opposed to his genius and results. 1 Link to comment
Peace 47 June 17, 2014 Share June 17, 2014 That's a fair point. I guess that I had sort of looked beyond it because wouldn't a "plausible" reason for his suicide just be, "Moriarty has ruined me. I'm hunted by the police. My reputation is in tatters, and that was always so important to me. I don't know how to go on." I had struggled with Sherlock going the extra mile and saying things that he knew were demonstrably false. Like, saying that he had researched John as a means to explain how Sherlock knew so much about John at their first meeting. This was demonstrably false because Mike had previously confirmed to John (right in front of Sherlock) that he (Mike) had not said a word about John to Sherlock ever before. But you're probably right: pretending to be a fraud might prevent others from working to clear his name and potentially exposing him. It just seems as though the extra layer of lying about his work would have also aroused John's suspicions and led John to ask the same sort of questions. Link to comment
La Tortuga June 18, 2014 Share June 18, 2014 Now, I was thinking that the reason Sherlock did this was to give John and anyone he'd tell an acceptable reason for his "suicide". Remember, he was about to go after Moriarty's organization (he may not have foreseen Moriarty killing himself, but he'd have to assume he'd need to take out Moriarty's organization before it was safe to come back). He wouldn't want to give that network a reason to think he was alive, or they'd be after him at the very least, and very possibly go after his three targeted friends, too--especially if John or Lestrade found him! I think that's a pretty sound theory, except something still bugs me. If Sherlock wanted to be sure that John felt there was an "acceptable" reason for Sherlock's suicide, then "snipers will kill you and Mrs. Hudson and Lestrade if I don't do this" sounds like a pretty acceptable reason to me. Saying that doesn't leave Moriarty's network with a reason to think Sherlock's alive. It seems to me he could have told the truth about why he needed to die, but still faked his own suicide. 1 Link to comment
BradyB66 June 18, 2014 Share June 18, 2014 (edited) Moriarty strikes me as the type of man who would have put a failsafe into his plan. It's not enough for Sherlock to die, he must die a ruined, discredited man or all bets are off and the hits still stand. Thus it was necessary for Sherlock to make his deathbed (or roof) confession. Edited June 18, 2014 by BradyB66 2 Link to comment
rereader2 June 18, 2014 Share June 18, 2014 "snipers will kill you and Mrs. Hudson and Lestrade if I don't do this" sounds like a pretty acceptable reason to me. Saying that doesn't leave Moriarty's network with a reason to think Sherlock's alive. It seems to me he could have told the truth about why he needed to die, but still faked his own suicide. But it would be so cruel to the three of them, to be thinking that Sherlock killed himself for them, and Sherlock does protect his friends, no matter what he says. 3 Link to comment
mledawn June 19, 2014 Share June 19, 2014 But it would be so cruel to the three of them, to be thinking that Sherlock killed himself for them, and Sherlock does protect his friends, no matter what he says. Exactly my thoughts. It's classic Sherlock that he miscalculated the emotions involved in the story he chose to tell anyway. 2 Link to comment
Peace 47 June 20, 2014 Share June 20, 2014 I know that Stephen Moffat has said some things now that season 3 has aired about the "truth" of the rooftop scene, and the following episode obviously colors the interpretation of that scene, as well. But taken for what it is (or what I perceive it to be), it still stands for me as a very moving scene. The acting is incredible. John has this simmering panic during the whole exchange and becomes progressively more agitated as Sherlock becomes progressively more resigned. The tear that drops onto Sherlock's scarf; John insisting that Sherlock could be that clever; Sherlock's surprised little laugh at that very statement. All this was played without guile by Cumberbatch and Freeman, and I just find it very touching. 8 Link to comment
SharonH58 March 26, 2016 Share March 26, 2016 Fantastic episode. I just got season 3 and have been having a marathon. I had forgotten a lot from season 2. Like how much I love the actor that plays Moriarty. He is wonderful! Over the top but believable. I am sorry he shot himself. I agree that Sherlock wanted his friends to believe he was a fake so they wouldn't try to investigate and maybe be hurt by the network. And I also agree he doesn't understand he is their friend, they care about him and are not going to believe he was a fraud. Especially John. I love their friendship and interaction. I think this is the best written and acted show on television. I just wish it was more than episodes per season! 2 Link to comment
Winter Rose July 26, 2016 Share July 26, 2016 I will always lament there being no commentary for this episode, this one was my favorite (with ASiP and TGG not far behind). I guess a commentary would've been too revealing but still, I would've loved a play-by-play from Andrew on portraying Moriarty. I liked the character anyway but this episode really showed there are layers to him (whether that's to his evilness, his intellect, or just him as a person). One of my favorite scenes was the whole sequence of Moriarty stealing the crown jewels. The dancing was really what made it for me and I love that that was just Andrew deciding to dance. 4 Link to comment
Cowgirl July 17, 2017 Share July 17, 2017 (edited) I am new to this series and have now watched up to this episode. The thing that bugs me is, once they had Moriarty in custody, why didn't they also prosecute him for his previous crimes? I'm a deputy prosecutor and we would have tried to get him for the past murders and kidnappings. He exploded an old blind lady, for heaven's sake! I suppose he could have attempted to intimidate the jury the same way, but this still bugged me. Ah well, t.v. I am really loving this series! Edited July 17, 2017 by Cowgirl 7 Link to comment
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