Cardie November 12, 2015 Share November 12, 2015 Unless I miss my bet, the grandmother who told Erika to bury birds and make a wish, was Virgil's mother. Virgil, who'd first heard about the birds long before Erika was born, knew that right now, Erika needed to try belief, to see past what's "pretend." My strong feeling has been that he's John's father, but you could be right. In a small town like Jarden with an even smaller African American populations, it's likely that the old folk magic superstitions would be well known to most from that community. 1 Link to comment https://forums.primetimer.com/topic/34185-s02e06-lens/page/2/#findComment-1700550
Pallas November 12, 2015 Share November 12, 2015 Very good point! I'd also speculated earlier that Virgil was John's father -- but his being Erika's, instead, made his offer of a bird a little less eerie, yet a little more pointed, too. Then again, father-and-son angst and the redemption-by-mutual-forgiveness arc are such staples of both Lindelof and contemporary cable drama...and John's trauma is obviously visceral. Most of all I love your idea that the buried bird is a myth well-known within, but only within, Jarden's African-American culture. 1 Link to comment https://forums.primetimer.com/topic/34185-s02e06-lens/page/2/#findComment-1701764
Juliegirlj November 12, 2015 Share November 12, 2015 I loved that the title of the episode had more than one meaning. Nora was afraid she was somehow a Lens, and had caused the departure of not only her husband and kids, but the girls in Jarden. Nora and Erika are a lens for each other- each seeing things in the other that bring up tumultuous feelings, that was the reason for the rock throwing on both their behalf. I don't know if I've ever watched a character with such a perfect union of character development and spot on perfection of casting and acting as with Carrie Coon/Nora. When Kevin first said he was seeing someone I flinched, but Nora, who of course would know Kevin better than that, didn't jump to that conclusion! Loved when Virgil told Erika that he IS her family- if only we could know the backstory on that situation!! 4 Link to comment https://forums.primetimer.com/topic/34185-s02e06-lens/page/2/#findComment-1703030
Milburn Stone November 12, 2015 Share November 12, 2015 (edited) My strong feeling has been that he's John's father, but you could be right. In a small town like Jarden with an even smaller African American populations, it's likely that the old folk magic superstitions would be well known to most from that community. Not disagreeing with the overall thrust of your post, but my impression is that the African American population of Jarden isn't that small. One of the things I've loved most about this season is that, for TV, the cast is remarkably integrated and that the black people in the show are not limited by either importance or number to being tokens. (In fact, from what we've been shown, I've wondered if maybe the population of Jarden is majority black.) In terms not just of how integrated the cast is but how integrated the town of Jarden is, I wish all cities were like Jarden. Edited November 12, 2015 by Milburn Stone 2 Link to comment https://forums.primetimer.com/topic/34185-s02e06-lens/page/2/#findComment-1703087
Cardie November 12, 2015 Share November 12, 2015 My meaning was not so much that blacks were a tiny subset of Jardenians but with a population less than the 9600 and change total, Jarden's black residents probably were no more than one degree of separation from all the others and such longstanding folk traditions would be well known. 1 Link to comment https://forums.primetimer.com/topic/34185-s02e06-lens/page/2/#findComment-1703460
meep.meep November 12, 2015 Share November 12, 2015 So, before the earthquake and the disappearance, if Erika buried a bird, it stayed alive. But now, they die. So, something has changed. Loved Nora hanging up as soon as the woman on the phone started talking about demons. Also loved the mad scientist at the beginning having a furious argument about how everything correlates. That's the problem with not having a viable theory about the disappearance - any variable can be correlated to some degree. But that's junk science. I didn't think they needed to lay out the goat and wedding dress people, that seemed clear after Matt trying to reproduce the conditions under which Mary "came alive." But Erika was magnificent in her indignation. 5 Link to comment https://forums.primetimer.com/topic/34185-s02e06-lens/page/2/#findComment-1704180
Tara Ariano November 12, 2015 Share November 12, 2015 In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode! It's Time To Ask The Hard Questions On The LeftoversIs The Leftovers truly good television? Or does it just resemble it? Link to comment https://forums.primetimer.com/topic/34185-s02e06-lens/page/2/#findComment-1704246
shapeshifter November 12, 2015 Share November 12, 2015 I loved that the title of the episode had more than one meaning. Nora was afraid she was somehow a Lens, and had caused the departure of not only her husband and kids, but the girls in Jarden. Nora and Erika are a lens for each other Also, windows are like lenses. 3 Link to comment https://forums.primetimer.com/topic/34185-s02e06-lens/page/2/#findComment-1704314
Snakelite November 13, 2015 Share November 13, 2015 I am so glad I perservered with this show. It keeps getting better every week. They made it a point to show through Kevin's reaction that Nora's donation was more than they could afford. I felt that a large donation was, in her mind, necessary to affirm her desire that the search was not futile and that the girls were still within reach. I think they used the same paypal process to mirror her transaction with Holy Wayne. She really didn't believe he could help her but she wanted it to be true. She also gave him a large sum of money and it was questionably effective. I was surprised when Kevin claimed to have first seen Patti after Lily came to them. I remember at least one scene from the first season where she came to him when he was locked up, well before they found Lily. That leads me to believe that the writers are bending history somewhat to make Lily integral to what is happening to Kevin and that she will be a key to the present storyline. I am also guessing Tom is on his way to Miracle with Laurie to come soon after. 1 Link to comment https://forums.primetimer.com/topic/34185-s02e06-lens/page/2/#findComment-1706461
pandora spocks November 14, 2015 Share November 14, 2015 Few "shock" moments that are meant to scare me actually do, but the second rock through the window was one of them. I thought a pissed-off Patti threw the rock in retaliation for Kevin's confession to Nora. Link to comment https://forums.primetimer.com/topic/34185-s02e06-lens/page/2/#findComment-1711741
Pallas December 7, 2015 Share December 7, 2015 Just re-watched in advance of the finale, and it was suddenly clear why Nora left, and took Lily with her. In his confession at the end of the episode, Kevin says that he began seeing Patti "when we found Lily; when you and I began to live together." Despite herself, Nora believes that she is the lens that amplified Kevin's neurosis into madness. 2 Link to comment https://forums.primetimer.com/topic/34185-s02e06-lens/page/2/#findComment-1779837
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