Family Ties: The Good, The Bad And The Ugly

[AgathaC]

10 hours ago, Ancaster said:

Well adjusted children (and adults) have real, tangible friends that they see in person, even if it's only once a year or over some kind of social media that shows an actual person.  And he says he has "friends"?  Isn't that a red flag for you?

It has been, yes. We think it’s odd they don’t hang out, but my understanding is that’s not unheard of these days. He occasionally stays later at school to go to basketball games and he talks to them on the phone.

 

10 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Since the "stick" approach doesn't seem to work with regards to changing habitual behavior or his attitude, are there "carrots" you've tried? 
I don't know why I'm thinking of this, but I'm imagining just you and SS going to a comedy club as a treat after you catch him doing some good deed, like maybe putting a dish in the dishwasher. I've never been to a comedy club, and I don't know if folks are cheered up by them, but he sounds clinically depressed.

We have tried the carrot. And that’s his mom’s preferred method (hence paying for grades). It doesn’t work. His attitude is more that he’s going to do and get whatever he wants regardless.

 

3 hours ago, EtheltoTillie said:

I have resisted weighing in on this situation for a while, but I think this child has very substantial psychiatric issues, depression and possibly personality disorder issues, which are the hardest to treat. I say this with knowledge of families who have had to deal with the same things, so my armchair diagnoses are based on close observations of and lengthy involvement with friends' and relatives' families, and/or clients with disabled children.

I don't know how or if you can navigate this easily with a two-household situation--it's hard enough with one household.  But I don't think these suggestions of behavior modification are of much value here.  More investigation and testing is probably needed.

Oh, it’s something I’ve considered and I agree. I think a PD (or a developing one) is a distinct possibility. I’ve done a lot of research over the years.

My therapist (I see one once a month for maintenance) agrees and says children who are spoiled and indulged as much as SS has been frequently develop dopamine overload. It’s like with addictions. Tolerance builds to the point they just don’t get excited about anything.

Regardless, the result of the way he’s been treated:

Utter lack of accountability or responsibility.

Seeming lack of empathy.

entitlement in the extreme.

Lack of work ethic or endurance. He’s used to instant gratification. If something requires time or effort, he just gives up.

I hate it for him. He really has every possible advantage. But any potential is being totally squandered. And he’s not growing to be the kind of person anyone will want to be around.

Mr A definitely shares some of the blame. He could and should have handled things differently. But any attempt he makes to teach lessons is undermined the second SS goes to his mom’s.

[Ancaster]

8 hours ago, AgathaC said:

 

Mr A definitely shares some of the blame. He could and should have handled things differently. But any attempt he makes to teach lessons is undermined the second SS goes to his mom’s.

There's no reason why routines/expectations/discipline etc have to be the same at both locations.  The kid is obviously not stupid; after all he's learned how to manipulate both parents.  Children/parents/adults/pets actually thrive on order within reason.  Set some ground rules for yourself and communicate them to your partner.

[PRgal]

Met with my son's teachers today.  I decided to meet with the specialists (i.e. art, music, gym, French) in addition to his regular classroom teacher.  They're all saying the same thing.  He works well independently but not necessarily in groups.  He also tends to be stimulated/distracted when sitting with his BFFs.  The Bug Bros are probably going to be split up next year.  I asked about ADHD, but the teachers all say that they really don't flag for testing until Grade 2 since Grade 1 brains are still getting used to a more structured environment.  

[Ancaster]

On 1/27/2025 at 5:08 AM, PRgal said:

This was one of my favourite books growing up.  I’ve read it to my son and asked him if he thought Frances was silly.  He said yes and said he ate lots of different things (yep, just not that much protein.  Still hesitant to give him kid protein drinks since they’re usually loaded with sugar). 

I'm 99% vegetarian and eat a lot of Fage Greek yoghurt; it's packed with protein and tastes great (much better than other brands).

[AgathaC]

14 hours ago, Ancaster said:

There's no reason why routines/expectations/discipline etc have to be the same at both locations.  The kid is obviously not stupid; after all he's learned how to manipulate both parents.  Children/parents/adults/pets actually thrive on order within reason.  Set some ground rules for yourself and communicate them to your partner.

Agreed. And we do have rules in place that Mr A and I both agree on. SS, however, frequently breaks them when it suits him. We’ve yet to find anything that works to get him to actually follow the rules even half the time.

Anyway, I suppose it’s a good thing we at least try. Can’t imagine how horrible he might be if there was no one legitimately trying to provide structure and hold him accountable.

[Ancaster]

1 hour ago, AgathaC said:

Agreed. And we do have rules in place that Mr A and I both agree on. SS, however, frequently breaks them when it suits him. We’ve yet to find anything that works to get him to actually follow the rules even half the time.

Anyway, I suppose it’s a good thing we at least try. Can’t imagine how horrible he might be if there was no one legitimately trying to provide structure and hold him accountable.

This book wasn't new when my kids were little (they're in their 30s now), but I found Children: The Challenge by Rudolph Dreikurs very helpful.  I see a co-author is now listed so I'm guessing it's been updated (I remember finding a couple of ideas outdated even back then).  I remember it as straightforward and no-nonsense, with helpful and practical suggestions.

Good luck; I hope you and your husband can find some solutions so your time with your stepson isn't so fraught and unpleasant.

(One question - do you eat meals together?  Even if his mother lets him have free range of the kitchen/fridge it doesn't mean you have to, and shared meals are A Good Thing.)

Edited February 14 by Ancaster

[AgathaC]

13 minutes ago, Ancaster said:

This book wasn't new when my kids were little (they're in their 30s now), but I found Children: The Challenge by Rudolph Dreikurs very helpful.  I see a co-author is now listed so I'm guessing it's been updated (I remember finding a couple of ideas outdated even back then).  I remember it as straightforward and no-nonsense, with helpful and practical suggestions.

Good luck; I hope you and your husband can find some solutions so your time with your stepson isn't so fraught and unpleasant.

(One question - do you eat meals together?  Even if his mother lets him have free range of the kitchen/fridge it doesn't mean you have to, and shared meals are A Good Thing.)

We do. Always have. And we either watch TV/a movie or play a game after.

No clue how meals work at his mom’s, except they get a lot more takeout as she’s not much of a cook. Mr A and I both enjoy cooking and try to eat healthy, so we don’t eat out nearly as much (which is apparently a gripe of his). It’s not that we never do it — maybe once a week when he’s here or we’ll make burgers or pizza at home. But it’s not a regular thing.

[shapeshifter]

9 hours ago, Ancaster said:

(One question - do you eat meals together?  Even if his mother lets him have free range of the kitchen/fridge it doesn't mean you have to, and shared meals are A Good Thing.)

9 hours ago, AgathaC said:

We do. Always have. And we either watch TV/a movie or play a game after.

That sounds so much better than most households!

Today in the grocery store I was very troubled by a mother yelling really loudly at her 2 young kids who she was pushing in one of those larger baskets for small children: "What is wrong with you? You're going to get a lot of timeout when we get home!" The kids were both crying. It did occur to me that maybe one was teething (2-year molars?) and bit the other one, so perhaps her reaction was understandable. But I was still more afraid this was a case of an overwhelmed mother who was abusive and wondered if this was a "See something; say something" situation. But then I saw her a little while later in another aisle with them talking to them in a more nurturing way. I'm not saying yelling like that at your kids is okay, but she didn't say they were going to be hit; just a timeout. Yet I still wonder if it was a cry for help too. But I didn't say anything. I'm a frail little old lady. But I did want to ask her if she was okay.

 

[Dimity]

3 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

"What is wrong with you? You're going to get a lot of timeout when we get home!" The kids were both crying. It did occur to me that maybe one was teething (2-year molars?) and bit the other one, so perhaps her reaction was understandable.

I'd have to wonder how you do a time out for a 2 yr old. 

[PRgal]

Though the school doesn't feel it's necessary to get my son evaluated for ADHD. I'm beginning to think he should.  We sent him to a one day camp today since schools were closed.  When I went to pick him up, I was told by one of the counsellors that he was a bit distracted while the group was crossing the street and he could have been hit by a car.  Being distracted isn't unusual for him - we see it ourselves at home and we always remind him that there are times to wear the "serious hat" and others where he can be silly and wear the "silly hat."  Needless to say, we were pretty upset.  He seems to shrug it off, which bothers me a bit.  And I'm worried that this is beginning to impact his social life.  The teachers keep on telling me that he's a very bright child and can go far.  He just needs to limit the silliness and to focus.  

[Absolom]

How old is he again?  Six?  Some six year old boys just need a year or two to mature.  It's amazing to watch second graders as they turn from young children to the more able to concentrate and more mature 8 year olds. They shift before your eyes in a week or two sometimes.  Currently there is a six year old boy living next door.  Sometimes he's all put together and other days he's a space cadet.

He may have a bit of ADHD or he could just need a little more time to mature.  Does he have some activities he likes to do where he can concentrate on his own for twenty minutes to half an hour?

[Mindthinkr]

11 hours ago, Dimity said:

I'd have to wonder how you do a time out for a 2 yr old. 

I remember watching a show that said you time out a child the same amount as their age. So a 2 yr old would have a 2 minute time out. Something along the lines of sitting on a step or chair that’s isolated so that they can’t play with toys or interact with other children. 

[PRgal]

15 hours ago, Absolom said:

How old is he again?  Six?  Some six year old boys just need a year or two to mature.  It's amazing to watch second graders as they turn from young children to the more able to concentrate and more mature 8 year olds. They shift before your eyes in a week or two sometimes.  Currently there is a six year old boy living next door.  Sometimes he's all put together and other days he's a space cadet.

He may have a bit of ADHD or he could just need a little more time to mature.  Does he have some activities he likes to do where he can concentrate on his own for twenty minutes to half an hour?

My son?  He's six and in Grade 1.  The teachers say he's doing very well academically, but is easily distracted (though they've all seen improvement since the fall).  Piano lessons have helped a lot!  I asked the teachers if they thought he was bored, but they don't seem to think so.  He works well independently but has trouble when it comes to group work.  

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, PRgal said:

My son?  He's six and in Grade 1.  The teachers say he's doing very well academically, but is easily distracted (though they've all seen improvement since the fall).  Piano lessons have helped a lot!  I asked the teachers if they thought he was bored, but they don't seem to think so.  He works well independently but has trouble when it comes to group work.  

Do regular checkups these days include evaluations for vision and hearing?
Just like I'm sure my oldest daughter couldn't see past the pages of the books she taught herself to read at 4, I'm sure I needed glasses for nearsightedness long before 5th grade.

[PRgal]

25 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

Do regular checkups these days include evaluations for vision and hearing?
Just like I'm sure my oldest daughter couldn't see past the pages of the books she taught herself to read at 4, I'm sure I needed glasses for nearsightedness long before 5th grade.

He has an optometrist and has been wearing glasses for almost three years.  He hasn’t had a hearing test yet but I will speak to his pediatrician about getting one. 

[Absolom]

21 hours ago, PRgal said:

My son?  He's six and in Grade 1.  The teachers say he's doing very well academically, but is easily distracted (though they've all seen improvement since the fall).  Piano lessons have helped a lot!  I asked the teachers if they thought he was bored, but they don't seem to think so.  He works well independently but has trouble when it comes to group work.  

Six year olds who are easily distracted are not shocking.  If he stays in his seat and isn't disrupting others it's a little early to be overly concerned.  If he's getting up and messing with things in the classroom or disturbing other students, then that needs to be addressed.  

[PRgal]

1 hour ago, Absolom said:

Six year olds who are easily distracted are not shocking.  If he stays in his seat and isn't disrupting others it's a little early to be overly concerned.  If he's getting up and messing with things in the classroom or disturbing other students, then that needs to be addressed.  

He was playing rough with several of the boys.  I don't even know who started it, but he seems to do well separated from the boys who tend to play that way.  There was also one kid who was his BFF all last year and part of this year who really DOES have a distraction issue (can't sit as still as other kids in the class).  Having him sit away from said child has helped him!  Piano has too.  And it's beginning to help him use his hands better as well.  For a while, I mostly ignored the fact that he used his hands to eat a lot, but I'm beginning to worry, especially after his art teacher asked me if he is doing any OT.  I was hoping that piano would help him use his fingers/hands a bit better, but I remember being able to hold chords well at his age.  And my hands were (and still are) on the small side.  He has trouble playing triads.  

[isalicat]

On 2/16/2025 at 11:05 AM, PRgal said:

He was playing rough with several of the boys.  I don't even know who started it, but he seems to do well separated from the boys who tend to play that way.  There was also one kid who was his BFF all last year and part of this year who really DOES have a distraction issue (can't sit as still as other kids in the class).  Having him sit away from said child has helped him!  Piano has too.  And it's beginning to help him use his hands better as well.  For a while, I mostly ignored the fact that he used his hands to eat a lot, but I'm beginning to worry, especially after his art teacher asked me if he is doing any OT.  I was hoping that piano would help him use his fingers/hands a bit better, but I remember being able to hold chords well at his age.  And my hands were (and still are) on the small side.  He has trouble playing triads.  

Just a little advice: Don't compare your son to yourself at the same age (he is not a mini-you, or a mini version of your husband or anyone else either). And remember he is a *boy* and they are much more physically active naturally, in my experience raising a son and from what most educators observe, than his classroom setting may accomodate.