Snow White (1937 & 2025)

[Wiendish Fitch]

Well, Snow White, the latest Disney live action remake, is certainly inspiring... opinions. Since you can't discuss the remake without discussing the original, why don't we talk about one, the other, or both, here? As always, let's be civilized... "fair", as it were!

Oh, come on, you knew that was coming. Moving along with unmarked spoilers...

I'll keep my comments on the 2025 version to a minimum because I didn't see it (sorry, I personally hate the Disney live action remakes), but Mr. Fitch did. Let me just say that everything he told me confirmed my suspicions of how awful it looked. He also snarked about how Snow White's superpower in the climax is essentially knowing everyone's names. While I agree it's good to know people's names (I'm fairly hit or miss myself), niceness all by itself no longer impresses me. I am reminded of a great line from Anna Kendrick's memoir Scrappy Little Nobody about we tend to excessively overrate "niceness" in women:

“A person who smiles a lot and remembers everyone’s birthday can turn out to be undercover crazy, a compulsive thief, and boring to boot." 

Now, regarding Rachel Zegler's comments regarding the original and Snow White's relationship with the prince, I'm not going to dogpile. The poor girl has been given enough grief at this point, she's entitled to her opinions, and you know who else is?

I am.

So here is my unsolicited, long-winded personal take on Snow White and the prince's relationship.

I personally have never had an issue with it. Nope, never. Not even during my decades long "I hate Snow White!" phase. In fact, several years ago, I read a wonderful theory online about their relationship that was one of the most refreshingly intelligent takes on it I've ever encountered. Watching the movie, I don't get the feeling that they literally just met right then and there. He doesn't come across as "stalking" her. He's casually riding his horse, but there's a slight sense of purpose there, and he climbs over the wall, making his presence known. He's not lurking in a tree or in a bush. Snow White is slightly startled when he joins her singing (no one here has ever joined in when someone was singing a song you knew?) and runs away because she hates for him to see her in her rags. Watch her as he's serenading her... she is thrilled that he's there, but it's combined with a familiarity with what he's doing. (you can tell he's done this before). 

For crying out loud, when she later sings the song "Someday My Prince Will Come" , she's literally telling the dwarves how much she loves the prince and how she can't wait to marry him. Note her voice and body language, she's gazing heavenward, lost in a daydream about her future with him, and she barely even notices the dwarves. 

Now, here comes the "problematic" part: the kiss. Remember, it was the cure to the Sleeping Death potion. Only the Queen knew about it (and she's dead now). The prince has been searching far and wide for Snow White, which doesn't seem like a thing you would do for someone you just met (unless it's Millennium Actress), and he's surprised and saddened to see her dead. He plants a light, quick, good-bye kiss on her lips.

That's it. Nothing else, nothing gross or illicit, he thinks she's dead*. But then the spell is broken, Snow White awakens, and I defy anyone to see her reaction to seeing the prince and tell me she isn't utterly, absolutely, unreservedly over the moon with joy to see him. Hell, she holds out her arms to him immediately, a la Norma Shearer in A Free Soul ("C'mon, put 'em around me!"). 

So no, I see no stalking, assaulting, or anything truly wrong or objectionable. And even if you think I'm dead wrong and say the movie is promoting marrying someone you just met... it's a fairy tale. It's a parent's job to teach their kids not to do stupid things!

 

*Now, one of our heroes in Dead Poet's Society does indeed kiss a girl he knows to be passed out, and I have barely heard a peep about that.

Edited March 29 by Wiendish Fitch

[Spartan Girl]

48 minutes ago, Wiendish Fitch said:

it's a fairy tale. It's a parent's job to teach their kids not to do stupid things!

 

That quote applies to all movies in general, even comedies that are problematic.

Look, the old Snow White isn’t one of my personal favorites, and we’ve all made snarky comments about Disney at some point in our lives but ITA that the kiss wasn’t problematic or creepy because, yeah, it was just to be a goodbye kiss, nothing more. 

I do have a soft spot for Snow and Grumpy’s friendship and how he warms up to her.

I haven’t seen the new movie yet, and I might out of sure morbid curiosity, but let it be enough to say that I’m sick of both Rachel and Gal getting dogpiled for this and that. 

[Makai]

Interesting topic. I am somewhere in the middle on the topic. I agree with a lot of the underlying criticism but I feel that much of it is unfairly projected on to the characters. The attitudes towards women in the real world in which the movie is being made is problematic and it feels like that gets projected onto the blank slate that is the Prince. 

The actual romance in the story is sweet, if underdeveloped. Calling it stalking or assault feels like a really a massive reach. 

11 hours ago, Wiendish Fitch said:

He also snarked about how Snow White's superpower in the climax is essentially knowing everyone's names. While I agree it's good to know people's names (I'm fairly hit or miss myself), niceness all by itself no longer impresses me. I am reminded of a great line from Anna Kendrick's memoir Scrappy Little Nobody about we tend to excessively overrate "niceness" in women:

“A person who smiles a lot and remembers everyone’s birthday can turn out to be undercover crazy, a compulsive thief, and boring to boot." 

Ughh. This is what really annoys me about how Snow White has been adapted and probably why I never related to the character as a kid. Far too much emphasis on her being pure of heart using a very narrow scale. 

I will probably watch the new movie eventually although it’s going to be hard for me to get past the horrible costumes and CGI. I read a comment from someone who saw it that Snow White’s awful haircut was deliberate and a result of abuse by the Evil Queen. So I am somewhat intrigued about how that aspect is fleshed out. 

Edited March 30 by Makai

[Wiendish Fitch]

On a more positive note, I have to give it up for Lucille LaVerne as the Evil Queen in the original. It remains one of the most chilling, memorable voiceover performances ever... and it was her last film (she died in 1945)! LaVerne hailed from Tennessee, but was very adept at British accents. Two years before Snow White, she played the Vengeance in MGM's A Tale of Two Cities*, and film historian Rudy Behlmer pointed out how similar her voice was there to the Old Peddler guise.

Oh, yes, she voiced both the Queen and the Old Peddler! How did she manage to sound so convincing? Simple... she just took out her dentures!**

 

* I enthusiastically recommend that one. It's excellent, and it has my beloved  Ronald Colman as Sidney Carton.

**I read somewhere that Robert Helpmann, who played the Child Catcher in Chitty Chitty Bang Bang, pulled the same trick in order to look and sound creepier.

Edited March 30 by Wiendish Fitch

[Bookworm 1979]

If you ever want to watch a good live action adaptation of Snow White, go to YouTube and look up Snow white at Radio City Music Hall 1980. You can't find it on video anymore, sadly. When I was a kid I watched this all the time. 

[Spartan Girl]

8 minutes ago, Bookworm 1979 said:

If you ever want to watch a good live action adaptation of Snow White, go to YouTube and look up Snow white at Radio City Music Hall 1980. You can't find it on video anymore, sadly. When I was a kid I watched this all the time. 

I looked that up on YouTube last night. It’s a good show for kids, but the Disneyland dwarf costumes…yeah, no. The newer show that was at Disneyland/Disney World in the 2000s at least made them look better. 

[Sarah 103]

18 hours ago, Makai said:

The actual romance in the story is sweet, if underdeveloped.

This is why a live action remake had potential. A live action version with better developed leads could have worked well. They barely have personalities. I understand why the 1937 movie is important from a historical standpoint. It proved that feature length animated films could be successful. It has an important place in Disney/cinematic history. That being said, the idea of a live action version of this makes infinitely more sense than photo-realistic CGI lions.  

I will not see the new version in theaters but I probably will watch it on Disney+ because I'm intrigued by the idea of the male lead being a charming rogue instead of a prince. 

 

 

[shipmate]

Saw this last weekend – went in with no expectations and was pleasantly surprised. Rachel Ziegler is so freakin talented!

[GHScorpiosRule]

Refuse to watch this live version. Just as I refused to watch the live version of Aladdin-for reasons I stated in that movie’s thread.

I LOVE the 1937 version. The Evil Queen was just so …EVIL and so beautiful which made her all the more dangerous. I actually think she’s more beautiful than Snow! And the actress who voiced her (The Queen) was ABSOLUTELY-AMAAAAZING!

The one Prince who was the most useless because we never saw him more than twice was in Cinderella. Prince Phillip from Sleeping Beauty was the most fleshed out Prince and had a POV.

But I digress. I agree with @Wiendish Fitch on ALL her points in her original post!

I’m also sick and tired and WEARY of all these “Honest Trailers” and picking apart of my classic movies-be they animation or live-refusing to accept when they were made. Yes, it would be nice if humanity had always been enlightened, but that’s not the case, so deal with it!

Now I’ll get off my soapbox, and rewatch the original. Okay, maybe not now, as I have to be up early in the morning. But I’m watching it TOMORROW!!!

[voiceover]

On 3/30/2025 at 8:05 AM, Wiendish Fitch said:

I enthusiastically recommend [Tale of Two Cities].  It's excellent, and it has my beloved  Ronald Colman as Sidney Carton.

Because it simply cannot be said often enough!!  One of the best character intros in the history of cinema (he’s hungover), and later on, a drunk scene for the ages (“You are smug, Mr Darnay…”).

And Lucille is a child’s worst nightmare in both.

[One4Sorrow2TooBad]

"It was the best of times ,it was the worst of times"  great opening line! Ronald Colman was an awesome actor back in the day.  He was in a lot of movies.

[Wiendish Fitch]

Like a lot of people, I'm not 100% wild about Adriana Caselotti (Snow White)'s voice. Don't get me wrong: her technique is second to none (not surprising, her dad was a vocal coach), but I find her voice by itself a wee bit too cold and high-pitched. I don't hate it anymore, it's personally more of an attitude of "it is what it is". 

The maddening thing is, Caselotti's voice improved dramatically as she matured, as the below clip demonstrates. Try not to cry with dumb joy at these two Disney legends duetting their hearts out.

 

Edited April 1 by Wiendish Fitch

[Spartan Girl]

That was a pretty cool duet. I’m impressed that Adriana could still sound like Snow White after so long.

But yeah I agree with @Wiendish Fitch at her worst, she kind of sounded like Olive Oyl.

Edited April 1 by Spartan Girl