Season One: Dick Wolf Gives Us Cerebral and Welcome to The LEAN!

[GHScorpiosRule]

Discuss season one episodes here!

While I couldn't get into this at first, this franchise is my second favorite after the mothership. D'Onofrio was just fantastic as Bobby Goren.

I love his partnership with Alex and Jamey Sheridan was GREAT as Deakins--up there with Cragen and Van Buren.

It took awhile to NOT see Vance's Carver as Bud, the murderer from the mothership.

So, shall we start again?

[Xeliou66]

They’ve been showing the start of the show on BBC America - they’ve shown the first 10 episodes

I watched The Good Doctor yesterday - this is an all time favorite of mine, really well done case and investigation, Kelmer was so smug and condescending, he was a memorable villain. This episode had Goren at his finest, he instantly zeroed in on the doctor and saw through his behavior, and it was very compelling watching Goren get the better of the smug bastard. 
And Carver in court is awesome, he was such a stellar lawyer and it’s criminal how underused he was, they should’ve gone into court much more often than they did - Carver was a great prosecutor.

Despite being much more straightforward than many CI plots, I love this episode, so much to like about it. 

[WendyCR72]

42 minutes ago, Xeliou66 said:

They’ve been showing the start of the show on BBC America - they’ve shown the first 10 episodes

I watched The Good Doctor yesterday - this is an all time favorite of mine, really well done case and investigation, Kelmer was so smug and condescending, he was a memorable villain. This episode had Goren at his finest, he instantly zeroed in on the doctor and saw through his behavior, and it was very compelling watching Goren get the better of the smug bastard. 
And Carver in court is awesome, he was such a stellar lawyer and it’s criminal how underused he was, they should’ve gone into court much more often than they did - Carver was a great prosecutor.

Despite being much more straightforward than many CI plots, I love this episode, so much to like about it. 

Peter Kelmer [the correct Peter here, yay for me!] was such arrogant slime. Made me glad when he ended up in prison.

[Xeliou66]

42 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

Peter Kelmer [the correct Peter here, yay for me!] was such arrogant slime. Made me glad when he ended up in prison.

Yeah he really was a rotten smug bastard - he had a lot of nerve to get in the face of his wife’s family after he murdered her, blaming all of her issues on them and ranting that he turned a salesman’s daughter into a surgeon’s wife and got no thanks from anyone. He thought he would get away with murder. He’s one of CI’s most effective villains and it was great to see Goren and Carver nail him.

[peacheslatour]

2 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

Yeah he really was a rotten smug bastard - he had a lot of nerve to get in the face of his wife’s family after he murdered her, blaming all of her issues on them and ranting that he turned a salesman’s daughter into a surgeon’s wife and got no thanks from anyone. He thought he would get away with murder. He’s one of CI’s most effective villains and it was great to see Goren and Carver nail him.

Goren's turn on the witness stand was a thing of beauty.

[Xeliou66]

19 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

Goren's turn on the witness stand was a thing of beauty.

Yes it was, you could see how Kelmer was getting agitated, and Carver’s cross of Kelmer was also awesome. I really wish they had gone into court more, they wasted a really character in Carver.

[MarylandGirl]

On 1/9/2024 at 9:55 PM, Xeliou66 said:

Yes it was, you could see how Kelmer was getting agitated, and Carver’s cross of Kelmer was also awesome. I really wish they had gone into court more, they wasted a really character in Carver.

Agreed, both that it was an amazing cross and that they should have used Carver in the courtroom more.

[Xeliou66]

23 minutes ago, MarylandGirl said:

Agreed, both that it was an amazing cross and that they should have used Carver in the courtroom more.

Yeah, Carver really shined in this one, his cross was great with how he alternated between asking the doctor how he would make the cuts and then asking questions about his marriage, getting him to explode eventually. It’s such a shame this episode and In The Wee Small Hours are the only times we saw Carver at trial, they really wasted him for the most part. I love CI but they should’ve gone into court more, it’s the one thing I would change about the classic era of the show.

[peacheslatour]

23 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

Yeah, Carver really shined in this one, his cross was great with how he alternated between asking the doctor how he would make the cuts and then asking questions about his marriage, getting him to explode eventually. It’s such a shame this episode and In The Wee Small Hours are the only times we saw Carver at trial, they really wasted him for the most part. I love CI but they should’ve gone into court more, it’s the one thing I would change about the classic era of the show.

I agree and I don't get it. Mothership had them in every episode and SVU usually does too but CI just... didn't? Maybe VDO wouldn't have ended up collapsing from exhaustion if they had not insisted he be in every freaking scene.

[Xeliou66]

56 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

I agree and I don't get it. Mothership had them in every episode and SVU usually does too but CI just... didn't? Maybe VDO wouldn't have ended up collapsing from exhaustion if they had not insisted he be in every freaking scene.

Yep, it’s the one flaw of classic CI - they didn’t do any courtroom stuff for the most part. They wanted every ending to be the detectives confronting the perps, it wouldn’t have hurt to mix things up and let some of the cases go to trial and give other characters a chance to shine, I love Goren/Eames but the show would’ve been better with more courtroom scenes, and Carver was a great character as well. I don’t think many people appreciate how important Deakins/Carver were to the show, they were both underused, Carver in particular 

[TakomaSnark]

'Jones' is on and I can't help missing some commentery here.

[Xeliou66]

Season 1 on BBC America today -

Phantom is a good episode, the theme of a con artist sociopath who pretends to be what he’s not has been done plenty of times on the franchise, but it was done well here and it was a compelling case and hunt for the fraudster/murderer, who was even about to kill his own children before he was stopped.

I love the episode Seizure, very strong, twisted and suspenseful plot with the serial killer and the two scummy research doctors - really wild twist with Dr Dwyer being manipulated by both the serial killer and Dr Buckman, Buckman was manipulative scum, he just wanted to make sure his theory wasn’t discredited, so he set up a murder, Dwyer was a psycho and a nut, willing to kill for the sociopathic serial killer Reddick. Great investigation by Goren/Eames and Carver got some nice stuff as well in this one. 

[Shadow Lass]

"Seizure" is the episode where it's introduced that someone in Goren's family is schizophrenic.

I don't know if schizophrenia just fascinated Balcer and the other producers, or there was someone in their family with the condition; it seemed that if someone had mental difficulties on CI, it usually involved schizophrenia, not bipolar disorder or anything else.

[wknt3]

19 hours ago, Shadow Lass said:

I don't know if schizophrenia just fascinated Balcer and the other producers, or there was someone in their family with the condition; it seemed that if someone had mental difficulties on CI, it usually involved schizophrenia, not bipolar disorder or anything else.

SVU pretty much has bipolar disorder locked up within the franchise...

[Shadow Lass]

Been watching Season 1 on Peacock yesterday and today. "Enemy Within" is on now. That was one crazy old guy.

[Xeliou66]

18 minutes ago, Shadow Lass said:

Been watching Season 1 on Peacock yesterday and today. "Enemy Within" is on now. That was one crazy old guy.

Enemy Within had some memorable characters but the plot was so convoluted and contrived that it was one of season 1’s weaker episodes, and season 1 didn’t have many weak episodes. The actor who played the old rich guy who died in the fire played several other roles on the Mothership. 

[Shadow Lass]

Well, we get a Howard Hughes type vic, two selfish family members, plus a commentary about the shitty way rich people treat their help.

[peacheslatour]

1 hour ago, Shadow Lass said:

Well, we get a Howard Hughes type vic, two selfish family members, plus a commentary about the shitty way rich people treat their help.

And an oddly social climbing heath care aide.

[Shadow Lass]

4 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

And an oddly social climbing heath care aide.

I don't know if Zainer was social climbing as much as he was obsessed by getting his kids into a good school (shades of "Kissinger" later on). People do weird things to get their kids into a better school. The lady across the street from us lied about where she lived and then when she got found out, the whole family moved so her kids would go to a better rated school.

[Shadow Lass]

Watching the end of "Smothered" and chuckling through the scene where Roger Jameson and Goren are having their "eye duel" (it's when he's talking about having scars on his genitals from torture). Just the posturing they do with their eyes and little flicks of expression.

[peacheslatour]

36 minutes ago, Shadow Lass said:

Watching the end of "Smothered" and chuckling through the scene where Roger Jameson and Goren are having their "eye duel" (it's when he's talking about having scars on his genitals from torture). Just the posturing they do with their eyes and little flicks of expression.

VDO is a terrific "eye actor".

[Xeliou66]

I watched The Good Doctor again last night on Charge, this is one of my favorites, and every time I watch it I think about how I wish Carver had gotten more screen time - he was awesome in court in this one. He could’ve been just as beloved as any L&O lawyer had he gotten more screentime. It’s a travesty he barely got to go in court. Carver’s cross of the smug Kelmer was awesome, he threw him off balance by asking about the dissections in between asking about his marriage and then got him to explode. Goren was at his best as well in this one. It’s a classic CI episode.

I watched some of The Third Horseman a bit later, I love the manhunt for the sniper in this one and how they figured out who was his next target. Eames was great and very passionate in this one. But it’s the one time Carver kind of annoyed me - he seemed to have personal anti abortion views and it seemed like he was letting it cloud his judgment. 

[peacheslatour]

5 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

I watched The Good Doctor again last night on Charge, this is one of my favorites, and every time I watch it I think about how I wish Carver had gotten more screen time - he was awesome in court in this one. He could’ve been just as beloved as any L&O lawyer had he gotten more screentime. It’s a travesty he barely got to go in court. Carver’s cross of the smug Kelmer was awesome, he threw him off balance by asking about the dissections in between asking about his marriage and then got him to explode. Goren was at his best as well in this one. It’s a classic CI episode.

I watched some of The Third Horseman a bit later, I love the manhunt for the sniper in this one and how they figured out who was his next target. Eames was great and very passionate in this one. But it’s the one time Carver kind of annoyed me - he seemed to have personal anti abortion views and it seemed like he was letting it cloud his judgment. 

All The L&O's seemed to need several characters like that. It bugged me too.

[Xeliou66]

23 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

All The L&O's seemed to need several characters like that. It bugged me too.

What do you mean specifically? Are you talking about Carver’s comments in The Third Horseman?