S02.E09: Long Ago, Not Far Away

[AnimeMania]

Dusk and Enjoiner Rue learn Demerzel’s origin and true purpose. Tellem’s plans for Gaal take a dark turn. On Terminus, Day confronts Dr. Seldon.

Premiere Date: September 8, 2023         Apple TV+    

[Ottis]

Really into this show now, and again, I assume that means it is cancelled.

The burden of psychohistory ... watching individuals and communities get wiped out, knowing it has to occur, and looking on ahead to what must happen next. Meanwhile, all the tragedy.

I assume all these short-term Empire "wins" are just honing stronger and better enemies? And Demezel was pretty clear that Empire is flawed mentally and physically, so we know "they" are vulnerable.

Loved all the special effects.

 

[marinw]

Whoa! I need to think about this one for a bit. Oh Glawin😥 This one time it’s not a bury your gays thing but rather a Day is the biggest asshat in the galaxy thing, just standing there ordering Bel to give the order that will kill his husband who he thought was already dead twice. Day’s cruelty is stunning.

Edited September 9, 2023 by marinw

[AllyB]

17 hours ago, Ottis said:

Really into this show now, and again, I assume that means it is cancelled.

 

I guess it could potentially be a casualty of the strike but filming of S3 seems to have started back in the spring and is on hiatus since the strike. I don't know why, but the renewal announcements for Foundation come long after work on the season has started. It was the same for season 2, I knew a lot of people on the crew and they had been back at work for ages when S2 was announced as renewed. It seemed like a very odd decision as a lot of the commentary from people watching the first couple of episodes of S1 were that it would never get a second season, when I knew the second season was well under way. It put people off watching for no reason.

[AllyB]

As for the episode, I think it's likely one of two things have happened. One, is that Terminus, while being the beginning of Foundation, was not by this point the main hub of (first) Foundation. Thespin, Anacreon and the other planets (Smyrno, Daribow & Glyptal IV appear on Demerzel's report in S2Ep1 as Foundation allies) that have joined with Foundation, are where the real knowledge and power of Foundation lies. Terminus was the focal point for Empire and was sacrificed to make Day think he has won so they can continue on without Empire's attention. When Constant/Hari told Day that the technology of Foundation made them mathematically assured to win against Empire, he may have been taunting Day, leading him to come to Terminus in person, with Demerzel. That episode was called A Necessary Death, which may have been a reference to the the destruction of Terminus being a necessary sacrifice for Hari's long term plan, which was likely to give the VaultRadiant to Demerzel.

The other possibility is an outlier. But we know Gaal, Salvor and physical Hari are at least several weeks behind. Their defeat of Tellum is concurrent with Terminus/Empire in episode 2 and 3. We don't know what Gaal, Salvor and physical Hari have been doing. But we do know, even knowing she was trapped and going to Vault Hari for help to save Gaal, Salvor wanted to know how Terminus was faring in it's second crisis. Vault Hari calls her, "ever the Warden" and while his refusal to answer if Terminus survives, implies it doesn't. It is that, which inspires her to tell him about Hober Mallow and indicat that she's an outlier who can change the maths. In the time between the events on Ignis and Terminus, Poly and Constant have been able to find and rescue Hober Mallow, bring him back to Foundation, meet Vault Hari, go on their separate missions to Trantor/the Spacers, each get captured, Hober escapes then rescues Constant, have sex, get captured again, sit through events on Terminus and witness it's destruction. That's a lot of time to get things done. So has Salvor used that time to attempt to save Terminus? Could she and Gaal have managed to bring the rest of the Mentallics to their side? Could they, together project an illusion of the destruction of Terminus that would fool Day? Terminus may have been prepared to be sacrificed, but Salvor, the warden, the outlier, changes that?

Edited September 9, 2023 by AllyB

[Ms.Lulu]

This was the best episode yet and I am sad there is just one left this season and with the strike we are unlikely to see them again before 2025.

That said, this episode reminded me of all the goodness in everyone, save Day.

Homer admitting be loves Brother. Dusk learning the truth and wanting to change everything. Salvor and Gael getting back together. And Demerzel, I loved that they can not hurt Empire, but she could could walk away.

Most difficult to watch was Glaewin's death.

And I am counting down to next week!

[marinw]

Roxann Dawson directed the last two episodes. B'elanna Torres on Voyager. The second Star Trek Actor (that I know of) to become a director.

I just saw a You Tube video speculating that Ignus Hari is in fact a robot, which is how he survived being drowned. (Maybe there was a large bag a rice around) So Demerzel is not the last of her kind.

Speaking of Demerzel, the Empire is really into sadistic methods of imprisonment. Yikes. The "Segmenting" reminded me of a particularly graphic episode of Hannibal.

Interesting that Demerzel is called a robot and not an android, which is what we usually call a robot that looks human or humanoid.

Edited September 10, 2023 by marinw

[AllyB]

I hadn't mentioned in my other posts but I loved all the little nods to Star Wars in this episode. The title, Long Ago, Not Far Away. Glawen and his squadron as they go into battle, like Luke and rest of Red Squadron at the battle of Yavin. A lone fighter being able to destroy an enormous space ship by a chain reaction caused by a single shot. And Constant, forced to watch helplessly as her home planet is Alderaaned by her captors.

It does make me assume that Salvor and Gaal will feel a disturbance, as if 'millions of voices suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced.' As we established in A Necessary Death that they feel the suffering of everything around them. I imagine Salvor in particular will feel her home's destruction no matter where in the galaxy she is. Whether they will feel that when it happens or somehow in advance of it, is what I can't guess.

[marinw]

@AllyB are the Star Wars similarities “nods” or “derivative”? Some would argue Star Wars borrowed a lot from the Foundation novels.

Not getting the math of why we are on Cleon 17. They must decant a new one every 30 years, and maybe the first few Cleons didn’t come out right.

Demerzel/Cleon 1 is one of the most messed up and abusive relationships I’ve ever seen. 
 

ETA: I refuse to subscribe to Disney so my knowledge of the Star Wars canon is limited to the feature films and one episode of Andor. Those with a deeper knowledge of SW may be more qualified to comment on the resemblances between SW and this Foundation show.

Edited September 10, 2023 by marinw

[AllyB]

Those listed were all nods to the original Star Wars movie. And they are events specific to this series, they never happened in the Foundation books. These were all little nods to A New Hope. 

[marinw]

The episode title it elf is a “nod”  to Star Wars.

Handsome, noble Glawin was too perfect to live: he knew that he was a liability who was preventing his husband from standing up to Day. So now Bel no longer has Glawin to lose. 😪 How will that change Bel's actions going forward? 

Edited September 10, 2023 by marinw

[TV Anonymous]

On 9/9/2023 at 4:30 PM, marinw said:

Interesting that Demerzel is called a robot and not an android, which is what we usually call a robot that looks human or humanoid.

All Asimov's works refer robots as robots, and never androids.