S31.E09: 90's Night

[White Dog]

Charli hasn’t made a secret of her dancing at all to the contrary her bio shows she’s a dancer first.  Cool. She’s upfront about her training. Her learning ballroom and Latin and not cheating the steps or the movement is just a lovely thing to watch. 

I remember not long ago how Heather Morris another highly trained dancer said “she cannot do ballroom dancing” and “it was so hard” after she was eliminated when she had been working as a dancer for famous singer dancers like Beyonce. Sure ballroom is tough for contemporary/jazz/hip hop dancers but to stress that “she could not do it” was just highly annoying.  https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.usmagazine.com/entertainment/news/heather-morris-talks-shocking-dwts-elimination-w493249/amp/

4 minutes ago, White Dog said:

/already posted

Edited November 13, 2022 by White Dog

[White Dog]

10 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

Wait, what?! I mean, the show has never been truly on the up and up but that is ridiculous lol.

Did you think the same when Corbin Blue was cast? His claim to fame is his dancing. He is the winner of broadways highest awards for outstanding dancing more than once.

Edited November 13, 2022 by White Dog

[FilmTVGeek80]

10 hours ago, LadyMustang65 said:

I could be wrong, but my feeling is more that it's the absolute ringeryness of this ringer.  It's one thing to have been a cheerleader or a back-up dancer whose choreography is limited in scope generally.  It's quite another to have studied at an elite dance studio almost your entire life and competed very successfully for more than a decade.  I think for many that's just a bridge too far.  She is for all intents and purposes a professional dancer.  She gets paid to dance, including have danced with Derek on one of his tv specials.  JoJo was too well trained for many, and Charli takes that even further. There are ringers and then there are RINGERS!  Some of her champions here have made that point themselves by talking about how difficult the choreography is she's being given and how she's doing things no other contestant could ever have done.  Well, yeah.  She's a professional dancer.  This should not surprise anyone. 

💯💯💯💯

I’ll admit I’ve been a fan of some of the dancers who would have possibly been considered ringers (like Alfonso) but the more I learn about Charli’s experience, the worse her case gets.

9 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

Wait, what?! I mean, the show has never been truly on the up and up but that is ridiculous lol.

I just learned about that here and it makes some of Derek’s “OMG look at how amazing you are” reactions even more eye roll-worthy. You know how skilled she is otherwise you wouldn’t have picked her to dance with you.

[White Dog]

Of course Derek is aware of Charlis ability and he’s rightfully impressed because not all contemporary dancers transition to ballroom.
 

Moreover, Derek was aware of Zendayas ability and actually danced with her on a Disney special before she competed. That knowledge of Zendayas strengths and weaknesses may have given him a choreographing advantage. But nobody commented on that during season 16.

Edited November 13, 2022 by White Dog

[FilmTVGeek80]

24 minutes ago, White Dog said:

Did you think the same when Corbin Blue was cast? His claim to fame is his dancing. 

The problem for many, including myself, with Charli is not that she’s hiding having a dance background. For once, the show is mostly being upfront about it, but the level of her training basically makes her a professional BALLROOM dancer. So, yes, she is a big old ringer and one of the biggest on this show. It’s not a shock that people are reacting accordingly.

As for Corbin, I do remember not really rooting for him during his season, but I can’t remember if it’s because I thought he was a ringer.  I’m not familiar with his background. Like Charli, did he study dance his entire life - specifically ballroom specialties? Was he picked to dance on a tv special with an Emmy-winning Champion ballroom dancer? Being a Disney kid with SOME dance training isn’t the same as the experience Charli has.

Edited November 13, 2022 by FilmTVGeek80

[White Dog]

2 minutes ago, White Dog said:

Charli  didn’t have training in Ballroom Dancing. Doing the iconic Mambo from Dirty Dancing isn’t doing Ballroom, Mambo is not part of the ballroom syllabus it’s a social dance and it’s knowing how to leverage your body to do lifts which is contemporary/ballet.   Zendaya did a more Ballroom style of dance with Derek on the Disney special before she competed. Did you hate Zendaya too?  Corbin was not trained in ballroom but he’s a massive Broadway Jazz and Contemporary dancer. 

Edited November 13, 2022 by White Dog

[FilmTVGeek80]

11 minutes ago, White Dog said:

Of course Derek is aware of Charlis ability and he’s rightfully impressed because not all contemporary dancers transition to ballroom.
 

Moreover, Derek was aware of Zendayas ability and actually danced with her on a Disney special before she competed. That knowledge of Zendayas strengths and weaknesses may have given him a choreographing advantage. But nobody commented on that during season 16.

I think his, and the other judges’, reactions to her - knowing they know her training - is over the top. 🤷🏾‍♀️ Derek, a ballroom dancer, did not pick Charli to dance with him having some kind of doubt if she didn’t have ballroom skills.

Zendaya is not a good example to pick because, for me, I never liked her during her season anyway. Plus, Derek was not Zendaya’s partner nor was he a judge during her season.
 

If all Corbin has is Broadway experience, then no, his experience doesn’t compare to Charli’s. I’m not sure why you’re arguing so hard about this when you even admit that she calls herself a dancer first. She has had training her whole life and competed in competitions and has even boasted about her extensive experience with styles like Jazz, and yet the judges fawn all over her as if her achievement even compares to the other more amateur level dancers on this show. 

[White Dog]

1 hour ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

Being a Disney kid with SOME dance training isn’t the same as the experience Charli has

 Corbin has won the Chita Rivera Outstanding Dance Broadway Musical award and has been nominated more than once. That is massive for any pro dancer. Saying that a Disney kid like Corbin has SOME dance experience is like saying Disney Kids Britney, Christina and Justin had SOME singing experience. If I'm not mistaken Ricky Ubeda and Ryan Kasprzak were on So You Think You Can Dance. Ricky won his season.  This year Hugh Jackman is a nominee.  Good company.

www.chitariveraawards.com

2017 Outstanding Male Dancer in a Broadway Show
WINNER - Corbin Bleu, Holiday Inn
John Bolton, Anastasia
Max Clayton, Bandstand
Tyler Hanes, Cats
Ryan Kasprzak, Bandstand
Ricky Ubeda, Cats

Edited November 13, 2022 by White Dog

[Melonie77]

25 minutes ago, White Dog said:

Moreover, Derek was aware of Zendayas ability and actually danced with her on a Disney special before she competed. That knowledge of Zendayas strengths and weaknesses may have given him a choreographing advantage. But nobody commented on that during season 16.

Val was Zendaya's pro-partner. Are you proposing that having danced with Zendaya pre-show gave Derek an advantage in competing against her as Kelly Pickler's pro?

Was anyone even aware of Zendaya's connection to Derek during season 16?

[White Dog]

19 minutes ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

Zendaya is not a good example to pick because, for me, I never liked her during her season anyway. Plus, Derek was not Zendaya’s partner nor was he a judge during her season.

Zendaya danced with Derek before she competed on the show. Charli danced with Derek before she competed on the show. You’re saying a mambo with a lift is ballroom. That’s your proof that Charli is a ballroom pro. Her training isn’t in ballroom but she definitely has a talent for the style.  Technically it’s a social dance with a lift that contemporary dancers do much more often and with ease.

Edited November 13, 2022 by White Dog

[Melonie77]

11 hours ago, LadyMustang65 said:

I could be wrong, but my feeling is more that it's the absolute ringeryness of this ringer.  It's one thing to have been a cheerleader or a back-up dancer whose choreography is limited in scope generally.  It's quite another to have studied at an elite dance studio almost your entire life and competed very successfully for more than a decade.  I think for many that's just a bridge too far.  She is for all intents and purposes a professional dancer.  She gets paid to dance, including have danced with Derek on one of his tv specials.  JoJo was too well trained for many, and Charli takes that even further. There are ringers and then there are RINGERS!  Some of her champions here have made that point themselves by talking about how difficult the choreography is she's being given and how she's doing things no other contestant could ever have done.  Well, yeah.  She's a professional dancer.  This should not surprise anyone.

As for the look, you could be right.  I haven't gone back and re-watched it.  I just remember thinking at the time that if looks could kill, Len would be dead.  Then Mark claiming it was his mistake kind of reinforced my belief she was angry.  

I don't mind ringers as they provide great dancing. However, I don't appreciate ringers who are professionals or who have had some sort of exceptional training. Although I think Charli's dancing is great I only enjoy it to a certain extent due her professional standing. I also thought JoJo was too much of a ringer on the show and only enjoyed her dances for the challenges that having a female partner provided. Another contestant who's ringer standing really stood out to me was Riker Lynch from season 20 who supposedly had ballroom training and is a relative of Derek Hough.

I too noticed an odd reaction from Charli after Len's comment - she argued back something about having been the murderer in the storyline. What I saw was her being somewhat astonished at the concept of being told she made a mistake. I saw it as her having a haughty entitled attitude.
 

[White Dog]

3 minutes ago, Melonie77 said:

However, I don't appreciate ringers who are professionals or who have had some sort of exceptional training

Charli is a tiktoc phenom who wants to become a professional dancer.  I'm not sure what exceptional training is involved here, she rose through the ranks of competitions in her genre of dance, mostly contemporary. 

3 minutes ago, Melonie77 said:

I remember the ringer accusations for Zendaya being about her dance show. I don't remember anything about Derek.

[White Dog]

16 minutes ago, Melonie77 said:

I also thought JoJo was too much of a ringer on the show and only enjoyed her dances for the challenges that having a female partner provided.

I ddn't appreciate how JoJo cheated ballroom and latin for her contemporary style. She should have been pushed to dance ballroom and latin more, because she was capable. 

Edited November 13, 2022 by White Dog

[LadyMustang65]

2 hours ago, White Dog said:

Moreover, Derek was aware of Zendayas ability and actually danced with her on a Disney special before she competed. That knowledge of Zendayas strengths and weaknesses may have given him a choreographing advantage. But nobody commented on that during season 16.

Derek wasn't Zendaya's pro.  Val was.  Just for the record.

[Melonie77]

11 minutes ago, White Dog said:

Charli is a tiktoc phenom who wants to become a professional dancer.  I'm not sure what exceptional training is involved here, she rose through the ranks of competitions in her genre of dance, mostly contemporary. 

Thanks for this video but I still only remember the complaints about Zendaya's ringer status being about Shake it Up her dancing show.

16 minutes ago, White Dog said:

Charli is a tiktoc phenom who wants to become a professional dancer.  I'm not sure what exceptional training is involved here, she rose through the ranks of competitions in her genre of dance, mostly contemporary. 

I don't want to continue debating this point but for many of us Charli's status as a TikTok DANCER, who has been dancing since she was 3 years old, has had extensive training, competed for many years and danced professionally makes her one of the biggest ringers to ever compete on this show.

She spoiled my enjoyment of Gabby's Salsa dance during their relay together. Gabby did a beautiful job but was outscored by what looked like a pair of professional dancers to me.

[peachmangosteen]

Charlie having danced professionally with one of the judges is the step too far for me. I mean, at the end of the day I don't give a shit if she wins and I like her just fine, but the fact that they allowed her to compete makes it abundantly clear the show is not on the up and up. Which honestly I think we all already knew lol. But still, it kind of amazes me they would do something so ridiculous.

Have they talked about her dancing with Derek on the show? If they have, I guess I'll give them credit for transparency.

[anonymiss]

1 hour ago, White Dog said:

 Come on.  Artem and Carrie Ann were in a relationship.  Should we tell Carrie Ann she can't judge either?  

I wouldn't have a problem with this, tbh. She's one of the more self-indulgent talking heads that encourages Tyra to continue her nonsense, interrupting Len et al.

Edited November 13, 2022 by anonymiss

[White Dog]

5 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

Have they talked about her dancing with Derek on the show? If they have, I guess I'll give them credit for transparency.

Charli D’Amelio on ‘DWTS’ support from Landon Barker, Kourtney Kardashian (pagesix.com)

September 10, 2022 

““I was very lucky to be able to work with Derek for three short days and we were able to make something amazing. And I actually got to see him and [his sister] Julianne on their tour when I was, like, 11, so I’ve been a huge fan of him for a very long time,” D’Amelio told us Thursday.

I actually knew [about doing ‘DWTS’] when we did that [special] and I got to tell him. So I don’t know if he pulled any strings but I’m glad that I got that little Derek crash course because I think it will help me with this competition.”

[anonymiss]

Rewatching Charli's professional-level salsa and I have to say the comments about her being unexpressive or like a robot confound me. The dance floor is where she has ALL the charisma, all the expressiveness, much more than some other ringers we've had. She's incredibly passionate and confident with as much showmanship as any pro on the show. It's when she's not dancing she's like a robot on low battery.

Edited November 13, 2022 by anonymiss

[peachmangosteen]

2 hours ago, anonymiss said:

She's incredibly passionate and confident with as much showmanship as any pro on the show. It's when she's not dancing she's like a robot on low battery.

I agree. I actually like her lowkey personality but it is borderline so lowkey that it's like not existent lol. I find her performances to be very fake though, like she's obviously putting on a show rather than seeming like she's actually in it and enjoying it.

Although, I'd say the same for Trevor but I still find his performances more interesting to watch.

Apparently, Disney put out a promo that included all the semi-finalists, plus some already eliminated dancers, but not Shangela. A little shady lol.

[White Dog]

I guess I respond more to low key personalities who dance beautifully. Unfortunately for Charli this show has always been about the personalities and not the dancing. 

[boyznkatz]

Both Charli and Trevor have no personality, but at least Charli can dance. I would take her over him any day.

Edited November 14, 2022 by boyznkatz

[Hanya2]

One part of the favoritism stood out to me. Wayne got to dance to a song he sang on Broadway in Hamilton, Jordin got to dance to one of her own songs, and someone said Mark gets to choose his own music.

Yet when they ask Trevor what he listened to in the 90s, and he says Nirvana and Pearl Jam, and they give him the Barbie song, I guess as a tie-in to the movie that is just now coming out. He gave it his best acting skills, but I don't think he was into it, and it showed.

I'm ok with him leaving next week, and am really, really relieved they booted Vinnie. Several more talented dancers were kicked out before him. He's had his 30 seconds in the sun again.