Elementary - General Discussion

[Meredith Quill]

This topic replaces the old Elementary forum which has been vaulted at the location below:

https://forums.primetimer.com/forum/126-elementary-v/

[MisterGlass]

I started rewatching Elementary recently, and was surprised to see a link to an Odker website on a phone in Season 1.  It's interesting to see the company mentioned that far back in the series since it became prominent later.

[Remlab]

I’m rewatching this now, and Joan’s wardrobe is on my mind. I think she looks gorgeous in the earlier seasons with her short skirts and sleeveless tops, but how is she not freezing all the time?! In the season 3 premier when Joan first spots Kitty following her, she is wearing a spaghetti strap dress while everyone else in the ep has long sleeves. I couldn’t stay with the plot because all I could think was “Why doesn’t she have a light sweater?” 
 

I have no idea why I’m fixated on this, because I envy her clothes and would love to wear what she does, but I would so cold! 😀

[Writing Wrongs]

I've been re-watching the show and have just started Season 3.

It's funny how in the pilot and early episodes, Sherlock seemed like he was going to be this rock and roll version with tattoos , cool clothes and hair. By Season 3, he has started dressing like Forrest Gump. Top buttoned shirts, bad haircut, exaggerated tics. I'm not sure why they changed it.

I really started disliking Joan once Mycroft was introduced.

[andromeda331]

18 hours ago, Writing Wrongs said:

I've been re-watching the show and have just started Season 3.

It's funny how in the pilot and early episodes, Sherlock seemed like he was going to be this rock and roll version with tattoos , cool clothes and hair. By Season 3, he has started dressing like Forrest Gump. Top buttoned shirts, bad haircut, exaggerated tics. I'm not sure why they changed it.

I really started disliking Joan once Mycroft was introduced.

Same here. I don't like Joan and Mycroft together. Although my annoyence with Joan started in season two in the episode she kept defending the detective that messed up the Allie Walbash case. Sherlock can be a jerk but that detective deserved it all and more. He was pissed at them looking into the case, dismissed Allie's concerns, defended the actual murderer so much I'm surprised he wasn't involved, told the murderer that Sherlock and Joan were looking into him and gave him their address, and threatened to go above Captain Gregson's head. But Joan keeps defending him throughout the episode because he's a fellow cop and has been doing it longer. Why? 

[Writing Wrongs]

I'm in Season 5 and I really don't care about the whole Shinwell story. I wish they had kept Kitty, she was more interesting to me. Like what was the point of adding Joan's half sister? She is hardly in it. I feel like they keep trying to give Joan more things outside of Holmes, but they just aren't that interesting.

[andromeda331]

9 hours ago, Writing Wrongs said:

I'm in Season 5 and I really don't care about the whole Shinwell story. I wish they had kept Kitty, she was more interesting to me. Like what was the point of adding Joan's half sister? She is hardly in it. I feel like they keep trying to give Joan more things outside of Holmes, but they just aren't that interesting.

I agree with both. I liked the idea Joan helping someone justing getting out of prison starting over. But they didn't stick with that. They suddenly decide to have him go back into the gang to bring them down, then we find out he murdered a friend and then he hits Sherlock. I was already starting not care when he went back into the gang to bring them down, but the murder and attacking Sherlock I was done with him. I don't know Joan still cared about him after that. I really didn't care what happened to him either. I really don't know the point of Shinwell was. I didn't like Kitty at first but she grew on me. I ended up really liking her and was sad when she left. Shinwell never did. I don't know why they gave Joan a sister either. They ended up not doing much with her. She comes back in season six but her role easily could have been filled by anyone. They really had a hard time finding something for Joan to besides being a detective. I'm not sure why.

 

[Athena]

In general, there weren't a lot of semi-regulars which worked on this show. I loved Moriarty and Morland, but felt indifference or didn't really like Mycroft, one of the other Sherlock girlfriends, or most of the other villains. They got great guest stars but the show and the writers had limited ability to really write outside of the core relationships. I also ended up liking Kitty because they really took time to develop the character and it also gave Joan a female friendship on the show.  She had a clearer journey than Shinwell whose storyline was depressing by the end of it.

[Magnumfangirl]

On 3/2/2023 at 5:12 AM, Writing Wrongs said:

It's funny how in the pilot and early episodes, Sherlock seemed like he was going to be this rock and roll version with tattoos , cool clothes and hair. By Season 3, he has started dressing like Forrest Gump. Top buttoned shirts, bad haircut, exaggerated tics. I'm not sure why they changed it.

According to Jonny Lee, Sherlock's changed look was part of his commitment to sobriety.  

[Writing Wrongs]

Finished Season 5. Did not enjoy the SBK storyline at all. It didn't seem like a plot line that needed Sherlock or would really interest him. I hated how Joan kept defending Shinwell even after he beat up Sherlock. And she has the nerve to follow Kitty and break into her house just because she's suspicious. So annoying.

[andromeda331]

9 hours ago, Writing Wrongs said:

Finished Season 5. Did not enjoy the SBK storyline at all. It didn't seem like a plot line that needed Sherlock or would really interest him. I hated how Joan kept defending Shinwell even after he beat up Sherlock. And she has the nerve to follow Kitty and break into her house just because she's suspicious. So annoying.

I didn't either. And I hated Joan defending him after he beat up Sherlock too. It was a terrible storyline.

[mammaM]

On 3/24/2023 at 3:50 PM, Writing Wrongs said:

I'm in Season 5 and I really don't care about the whole Shinwell story. I wish they had kept Kitty, she was more interesting to me. Like what was the point of adding Joan's half sister? She is hardly in it. I feel like they keep trying to give Joan more things outside of Holmes, but they just aren't that interesting.

I remember this from when the show was actually on, the shinwell storyline was dropped because the actor died. That's why it ended so clunky and why you don't really see the character when he was killed, its a stand in.

[Writing Wrongs]

I'm in Season 6 and my dislike of Joan's storylines continues. Her sudden need to adopt seems weird and given their lifestyle a bit irresponsible. I wish they had stayed with Joan having her own apartment and agency. She could still have assisted Sherlock.  And they made a big deal about Sherlock's head condition, but dropped it after a few episodes.

Edited April 8, 2023 by Writing Wrongs

[andromeda331]

On 4/7/2023 at 9:18 AM, Writing Wrongs said:

I'm in Season 6 and my dislike of Joan's storylines continues. Her sudden need to adopt seems weird and given their lifestyle a bit irresponsible. I wish they had stayed with Joan having her own apartment and agency. She could still have assisted Sherlock.  And they made a big deal about Sherlock's head condition, but dropped it after a few episodes.

I agree about the adoption. It's just so out of the blue. Plus Joan spends most the episode acting shocked and upset that her late therpist thought she'd make a good mom. Then suddenly at the end of the episode she's looking into it. They never show how or why Joan got to that point. 

Sherlock's head condition does come up again.

[pancake bacon]

On 3/25/2023 at 1:09 PM, andromeda331 said:

 Shinwell never did. 

 

I agree Shinwell was not very "energetic" in the overall arc of the season, but the part he played toward the very end of arc did pull the rug from under me. 

On 3/26/2023 at 1:12 AM, Magnumfangirl said:

According to Jonny Lee, Sherlock's changed look was part of his commitment to sobriety.  

I loved this thoughtful creativity with the costuming. From fresh off rehab messy, to neat sobriety… there was much discussion on the costume choices of the show, when it was airing originally. Even Sherlock's boots had a background that contributed to character, if I recall correctly. 

On 3/25/2023 at 7:57 PM, Athena said:

In general, there weren't a lot of semi-regulars which worked on this show. 

The semi-regular that worked best of all: CLYDE. 😄 

Mileage may vary with various non-regulars in Elementary, but overall, show runner Rob Dougherty organically refreshed and re-imagined the characters from the Arthur Conan Doyle stories into plausible 2020s characters. Moriarty, Mycroft, Lestrade, the Irregulars as "Everyone"… Plus, original characters that popped up over various episodes that I enjoyed: Mason, the boy genius, coroner Hawes, did I also mention Clyde? 

[Writing Wrongs]

I didn't like how Season 6 ended. I can't believe Gregson covered for his daughter murdering someone (even a scum like Michael) and was ok with Joan going down for it. So Hannah goes free and Sherlock and Joan are exiled.

I do look forward to them in London, though.

[Athena]

On 4/9/2023 at 1:54 PM, pancake bacon said:

The semi-regular that worked best of all: CLYDE. 😄 

Mileage may vary with various non-regulars in Elementary, but overall, show runner Rob Dougherty organically refreshed and re-imagined the characters from the Arthur Conan Doyle stories into plausible 2020s characters. Moriarty, Mycroft, Lestrade, the Irregulars as "Everyone"… Plus, original characters that popped up over various episodes that I enjoyed: Mason, the boy genius, coroner Hawes, did I also mention Clyde? 

I consider Clyde a regular on this show! He lived with the two protagonists after all. 
 

I agree that the show did a good reimagining overall. It was one of the only procedurals that I finished and a show which I followed live. I don’t have a huge urge to rewatch it but I liked and finished it weekly when it aired. There aren’t many shows I can say about that now. 

[andromeda331]

6 hours ago, Writing Wrongs said:

I didn't like how Season 6 ended. I can't believe Gregson covered for his daughter murdering someone (even a scum like Michael) and was ok with Joan going down for it. So Hannah goes free and Sherlock and Joan are exiled.

I do look forward to them in London, though.

I can't believe he did that either. Plus all he would have had to do was tell Sherlock and Joan, they would have understood and found a way for Hannah not to go to jail either. I hate Hannah but they would have done that for Gregson.

6 hours ago, Athena said:

I consider Clyde a regular on this show! He lived with the two protagonists after all. 
 

I agree that the show did a good reimagining overall. It was one of the only procedurals that I finished and a show which I followed live. I don’t have a huge urge to rewatch it but I liked and finished it weekly when it aired. There aren’t many shows I can say about that now. 

I consider Clyde a regular too. I only wish we saw more of him.

[Writing Wrongs]

Finished the series. I'm glad Joan renovated the brownstone, that place always looked nasty to me.

[krankydoodle]

I've been revisiting this show and was poking around Wikipedia to decide which episodes to rewatch when I saw a note about how some of the same people behind Elementary are working on an unrelated series named Watson: "One year after the death of Sherlock Holmes, Dr. John Watson, now head of a clinic specializing in rare disorders, finds himself pitted against his friend's killer, the criminal mastermind Moriarty." It's going to star Morris Chestnut in the title role as "a physician and former consulting detective who now heads the Holmes Clinic, which specializes in rare disorders." I'll probably give it a shot but I'm not very excited about it based on the description.

[andromeda331]

18 hours ago, krankydoodle said:

I've been revisiting this show and was poking around Wikipedia to decide which episodes to rewatch when I saw a note about how some of the same people behind Elementary are working on an unrelated series named Watson: "One year after the death of Sherlock Holmes, Dr. John Watson, now head of a clinic specializing in rare disorders, finds himself pitted against his friend's killer, the criminal mastermind Moriarty." It's going to star Morris Chestnut in the title role as "a physician and former consulting detective who now heads the Holmes Clinic, which specializes in rare disorders." I'll probably give it a shot but I'm not very excited about it based on the description.

Same here.

[MisterGlass]

I feel like that description is trying not to admit that Holmes will appear in the series, either in flashback or because Moriarty did not actually kill him.

I've thought from time to time about direct follow-ups to Elementary, and there is one scenario that would interest me.  If Archie Winter and Arthur Watson grow up and set up a detective agency, occasionally consulting their retired beekeeper godfather, I would give it a shot.  The could also interact with Marcus's mentioned but unnamed child, who would be Officer Bell.