The Rewatch project

[Uncle JUICE]

So, given that I've run out of a lot of things to watch in Covid, and SAul will be coming back shortly, I decided to start a rewatch of this show from season 1, something I'd never done. I have to say, if this show had NO connection to the ABQniverse of Breaking Bad, I stills think it would be one of the ten best shows since the dawn of the golden age of TV. Because Breaking Bad is basically a perfect expression of peak TV, artistically and creatively, and because of the relationship, this show slips into Most Underrated. How it's not a mulitple Emmy winner, particularly through the first two seasons, is insane. 

THe show actually could function on its own with no changes at all, if you start it with the Cinnabon manager and then just cut to the color shots and you have an excellent mystery show. THe character the writers have created out of what was basically comic relief when he first showed up is realy incredible. Where this show really separated itself is in the little choices it makes. Two to highlight: when Chuck tells Kim what Jimmy did to get Mesa Verde, and Kim chooses to go with Jimmy's story, she KNOWS CHuck is right. The show doesn't let her be fooled by Jimmy, which is a very easy decision to make, and that does a lot for her as a character. The other is the episode where she and JImmy strike out on their own and form their private practice, and how subtly it serves as a total blueprint of what their relationship really is. It's phenomenal.

ANyone else rewatching?

[Bannon]

On 3/4/2021 at 7:31 AM, Uncle JUICE said:

So, given that I've run out of a lot of things to watch in Covid, and SAul will be coming back shortly, I decided to start a rewatch of this show from season 1, something I'd never done. I have to say, if this show had NO connection to the ABQniverse of Breaking Bad, I stills think it would be one of the ten best shows since the dawn of the golden age of TV. Because Breaking Bad is basically a perfect expression of peak TV, artistically and creatively, and because of the relationship, this show slips into Most Underrated. How it's not a mulitple Emmy winner, particularly through the first two seasons, is insane. 

THe show actually could function on its own with no changes at all, if you start it with the Cinnabon manager and then just cut to the color shots and you have an excellent mystery show. THe character the writers have created out of what was basically comic relief when he first showed up is realy incredible. Where this show really separated itself is in the little choices it makes. Two to highlight: when Chuck tells Kim what Jimmy did to get Mesa Verde, and Kim chooses to go with Jimmy's story, she KNOWS CHuck is right. The show doesn't let her be fooled by Jimmy, which is a very easy decision to make, and that does a lot for her as a character. The other is the episode where she and JImmy strike out on their own and form their private practice, and how subtly it serves as a total blueprint of what their relationship really is. It's phenomenal.

ANyone else rewatching?

Intend to start, once we are within a couple months from the new season. I think Gilligan&Co. just started shooting. What's the likelihood that we see anything prior to 2022?

[SunnyBeBe]

I’ll rewatch for sure.  Not sure of the timing yet. 

[margol29]

I just finished a re-watch. I think I enjoyed it more than the first time I watched it. Kim comes to Jimmy's rescue a few times. Most recently with the confrontation with Lalo in their apartment. Oh Kim, you are so in the game!! I can't wait for the final season.

What happens to Kim? What happens to Lalo? What happens to Nacho and his papa? So many questions. Please don't make us wait another year!!!!

[Stats Queen]

I am doing a rewatch of Breaking Bad because I missed so many things and Easter Eggs in Better Call Saul.

I am up to the point where Jessie shows up a Gale’s apartment and, well, eliminates the threat.

My initial thoughts “Jessie is lucky there was no ring doorbell”.

My second thought was, someone will be recording hearing gun shots. However, between Ring and Next Door, I am just stunned about all the “gunshots” happening in my neck of the woods.

[Cinnabon]

3 minutes ago, Stats Queen said:

I am doing a rewatch of Breaking Bad because I missed so many things and Easter Eggs in Better Call Saul.

I am up to the point where Jessie shows up a Gale’s apartment and, well, eliminates the threat.

My initial thoughts “Jessie is lucky there was no ring doorbell”.

My second thought was, someone will be recording hearing gun shots. However, between Ring and Next Door, I am just stunned about all the “gunshots” happening in my neck of the woods.

That situation was also the impetus for Gus to kill Victor because someone may have seen him at the scene. And good riddance! I don’t know why I hated Victor more than Gus’s other associates.

[Lalo Lives]

My mental thesaurus seems to be limited to words with 4 letters…but the thought struck me that……dammit, what was the word?
Yes, FORESHADOWING!

so I’m watching MABEL and it dawned on me that Chuck foreshadowed , if that is the proper term, the burning down of his house. This was done with his little recollection of Jimmy’s little knock-off Daffy Ducky night light.

So an advanced person, at least chronologically, I get real proud of myself when I notice these things. It usually takes more than one viewing, and many times days, weeks, even years for the nugget to pop in my brain.

There are whole YouTube vids with Easter eggs. They usually repeat the same ones. Lots of copy and paste action going on.

What are some of your favorite examples? Of foreshadowing or whatever the term is.? Some really stealthy ones that slide under the radar. I mentioned somewhere else the Mike quote repeated by Jimmy thing in the recent teaser. The one where Jimmy was looking for guidance on the stress over the bail money camping trip for Lalo thing.

[SunnyBeBe]

I just started rewatch of BCS Season 1.  Man….the foreshadowing…..after Jimmy demands Chuck’s firm buy him out, Jimmy threatens, then walks out of the big conference room.  Howard follows behind him and attempts to calm Jimmy.  He said be careful of fighting so hard to win. You might forget to listen to your heart.  Isn’t that wild?   

[Lalo Lives]

26 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I just started rewatch of BCS Season 1.  Man….the foreshadowing…..after Jimmy demands Chuck’s firm buy him out, Jimmy threatens, then walks out of the big conference room.  Howard follows behind him and attempts to calm Jimmy.  He said be careful of fighting so hard to win. You might forget to listen to your heart.  Isn’t that wild?   

That’s playing the long game.

[SunnyBeBe]

Kim looked so different in season 1.
 

It seems that Albuquerque has a lot more green trees than I had realized.  
 

Man, I missed so much. I just realized Jimmy was using the name Saul long ago, before he was even an attorney in various scams. 

Edited July 27, 2022 by SunnyBeBe

[NotMySekrit2Tell]

I'd like to do a rewatch to see if I can see examples of the subtle sexism, destabilizing microaggressions, and generally toxic work environment some people claim Kim endured at HHM. I didn't really feel that way when the episodes were new.

[scenario]

1 hour ago, NotMySekrit2Tell said:

I'd like to do a rewatch to see if I can see examples of the subtle sexism, destabilizing microaggressions, and generally toxic work environment some people claim Kim endured at HHM. I didn't really feel that way when the episodes were new.

How often do we see Kim actually at work when she still worked for HHM? 

[gallimaufry]

5 hours ago, NotMySekrit2Tell said:

I'd like to do a rewatch to see if I can see examples of the subtle sexism, destabilizing microaggressions, and generally toxic work environment some people claim Kim endured at HHM. I didn't really feel that way when the episodes were new.

I don't think this was the nature of Kim's HHM experience at all.  Certainly, there were times that she was treated badly and was blamed by Howard for things we know she couldn't reasonably have controlled - such as when she lost the Kettlemans or when she didn't forewarn Howard and Cliff of Jimmy's end-run with the advertisement.  She also went uncredited in the Kettleman interview but then Howard is the face (and name) of the firm and Kim isn't so I feel like that goes with the territory.  But Howard also explained to her why he treated Jimmy as he did in 109, Chuck praised her repeatedly (usually to make Jimmy look bad by comparison but still), she seemed to have a good reputation from her interactions with the junior staff and had evidently built her career there over an extended period.  She also had her schooling paid by HHM, ultimately given to her as a gift - she rejected the gift so as not to feel indebted but it was still a positive gesture.  Ultimately, office politics is normal for any workplace.  However, I don't see sexism or microaggressions: Kim always knew exactly why she was being treated in the way she was even if she (and we) disagreed with the treatment.

[SunnyBeBe]

I’m rewatching BCS past seasons and have watched some out of order. Lol. I’m not sure why.  I was surprised to see a scene of Chuck and his ex wife talking about Carol Burnett!  They made several comments about her as they were preparing a dinner they had invited Jimmy to attend.  I think season 2.  

Edited August 3, 2022 by SunnyBeBe

[SunnyBeBe]

Can someone tell me who was the body that Mike located and reported to the police anonymously?  

[gallimaufry]

Just now, SunnyBeBe said:

Can someone tell me who was the body that Mike located and reported to the police anonymously?  

The good Samaritan Hector shot and buried in the desert after Mike raided the ice cream van but left the driver.

[SunnyBeBe]

3 minutes ago, gallimaufry said:

The good Samaritan Hector shot and buried in the desert after Mike raided the ice cream van but left the driver.

Right. I thought so.  Also, was there any relation to the cartel and the disappearance of the husband of the wife Mike met in the grief support group?  I thought they were the same guy, but she said her husband went missing 8 years earlier.  

[gallimaufry]

Just now, SunnyBeBe said:

Right. I thought so.  Also, was there any relation to the cartel and the disappearance of the husband of the wife Mike met in the grief support group?  I thought they were the same guy, but she said her husband went missing 8 years earlier.  

I think it was just that Mike realised from the discussion in grief group how terrible it would be for the family not to know and decided to do something.  It wasn't the husband that he found and the husband had no cartel connection.

[Simon Boccanegra]

I've been rewatching selected highlight episodes from the first few seasons. I see even more in hindsight how Jimmy and Chuck tend to regress to childish versions of themselves when one of them is really under the other's skin. In that scene when Kim comes over to Chuck's to pick up the Mesa Verde files (the "1216/1261" address scam having worked), and Jimmy accompanies her, Chuck starts off making his case like the distinguished middle-aged lawyer he is. But when Jimmy goes into his gaslighting routine, Chuck begins sounding like a preteen, with Kim in the role of Mother. It isn't that the things he's saying are immature; it's the tone, which always makes clear that it's about more than the issue of the moment. It's a whole lifetime of feeling like the misunderstood one. Michael McKean was really good at those shifts.  

It works in the other direction too. In 3-1, that young soldier played by Brendan Fehr comes to the Kim/Jimmy rainbow office and rips into Jimmy for tricking him with a fake WW2 hero to get base footage for a commercial. As their argument escalates, Jimmy begins projecting his resentment toward Chuck onto the soldier (who's set himself up as an arbiter of what's respectable and honorable). Even the soldier is weirded out.  

Chuck was universally respected, but wanted to be liked/loved too. Jimmy was widely liked/loved, but wanted to be respected too. Chuck had substance, and he envied Jimmy's flash and charm. Jimmy, vice versa.  

Another thing I've noticed, and I'm far from the first to comment on it, is that the casting of smaller roles in this series is so good. All those people just doing a job: the guy at the photocopy place, the insurance woman to whom Jimmy "lets slip" that Chuck had a meltdown in the hearing, the woman in hospital registration having trouble getting "Gene's" Social Security number to go through, dozens of others. Their faces, their expressions, their line readings, everything, tend to be documentary-perfect.

[SunnyBeBe]

I’m gaining some new perspectives on my rewatch, as well as appreciating the attention to detail.   I have also noticed that the writing incorporates a true application of things like case law, statutes, ethical requirements, etc.  As an attorney, I often get annoyed when the treatment of these things are butchered.  Of course, some things are played a little loose, but overall, it’s good.  
 

On this rewatch I’ve come to see that Jimmy led Kim down the wrong path. I know she gets a lot of flack for being meaner than Jimmy and taking the lead on the Howard debacle, but to me Jimmy created the monster. I never saw that in Kim prior to that season.  She seemed to snap after the Huel case and letter writing campaign to free him.  

[SunnyBeBe]

This time around, I have little sympathy for Zeigler.  Considering that he was sufficiently informed of the risks of the underground assignment, he was extremely foolish to ignore the precautions.  After he blabbed details to Lalo on the phone, I was done.  His actions begged for a reckoning.  Talk about a selfish jerk. I found him a huge liar and not responsible at all.  Mike was wrong to want to give him yet another chance.  Ugh…..

[Simon Boccanegra]

I had trouble maintaining sympathy for Ziegler the first time around, even. I think the only way to read him is that he was a brilliant mind in his work and startlingly naïve (to the point that "clueless" would not be hyperbole) in other ways. People like that can lead long, untroubled, successful lives, but this one got involved in things he never should have been near. Even in his last scene, it takes him so long to realize how much trouble he's in.

[scenario]

10 hours ago, Simon Boccanegra said:

I had trouble maintaining sympathy for Ziegler the first time around, even. I think the only way to read him is that he was a brilliant mind in his work and startlingly naïve (to the point that "clueless" would not be hyperbole) in other ways. People like that can lead long, untroubled, successful lives, but this one got involved in things he never should have been near. Even in his last scene, it takes him so long to realize how much trouble he's in.

Ziegler types are all around. He's a quiet Karen. The rules shouldn't apply to me. I'm special. The rules are inconvenient so I'll just ignore them. When your dealing with someone like Gus, that's a really bad idea. 

He probably never really understood why he was in trouble. He was shocked by the inevitable consequences of his own actions. 

[Cinnabon]

27 minutes ago, scenario said:

Ziegler types are all around. He's a quiet Karen. The rules shouldn't apply to me. I'm special. The rules are inconvenient so I'll just ignore them. When your dealing with someone like Gus, that's a really bad idea. 

He probably never really understood why he was in trouble. He was shocked by the inevitable consequences of his own actions. 

Wow. . . 

[SunnyBeBe]

This time around, I see more clearly how helping the little guy, as Jimmy and Kim purported to want, was just a mechanism to feed their egos..  It wasn’t really about the needy person, but the hero worship they wanted.  Normal attorneys like to help their clients, but the hero worship Jimmy thrived on was more about his own needs, not the client. And Kim was more about getting one over on someone, rather than getting justice.  Kim was right to leave her profession.  Her instincts generally were not good.  Her expertise was outweighed by her liabilities.   Kim am d Jimmy seem to have fundamental character flaws that limit their ability to live and work with others in any meaningful way.  

[scenario]

19 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

This time around, I see more clearly how helping the little guy, as Jimmy and Kim purported to want, was just a mechanism to feed their egos..  It wasn’t really about the needy person, but the hero worship they wanted.  Normal attorneys like to help their clients, but the hero worship Jimmy thrived on was more about his own needs, not the client. And Kim was more about getting one over on someone, rather than getting justice.  Kim was right to leave her profession.  Her instincts generally were not good.  Her expertise was outweighed by her liabilities.   Kim am d Jimmy seem to have fundamental character flaws that limit their ability to live and work with others in any meaningful way.  

My friend once asked my why I liked to reread books. This is why. With well written books, you see things differently or notice different things every time you read them. BCS is the same way. BCS is a character study. And Saul's decline is fascinating to me.  There really aren't many character studies on TV. Character studies are too slow for most people and you have to really watch and remember little things to really get them. 

BB was both a character study and study in violence. Different people got different things out of it. BCS is almost pure character study. 

[SunnyBeBe]

Who sent the guys who tried to kill Jimmy in the desert when he was bringing bail money for Lalo?  

[gallimaufry]

On 8/14/2022 at 5:10 AM, SunnyBeBe said:

Who sent the guys who tried to kill Jimmy in the desert when he was bringing bail money for Lalo?  

You've probably seen the subsequent episode by now but Gus infers that Juan Bolsa did it -- presumably recognising that Lalo behind bars and the more business-like Gus running things north of the border is a much better outcome than Lalo being free to continue his vendetta against the cartel's big "earner".

[PeterPirate]

I started a rewatch yesterday and have gone through the first two episodes.  It really is a treat to watch this show again knowing I will like the characters at the end.  

[Sailorgirl26]

On season four of a rewatch. I hated Chuck the first go-round, hate him even more this time. Of all of Jimmy's regrets, feeling bad about Chuck shouldn't have been one of them. 

I love what they did with the character of Howard. For so long we thought he was an arrogant jerk. Yes, he may have been born on third and thinks he hit a triple, but he really was a decent human being. Certainly some weaknesses of character, like taking the fall for Chuck about Jimmy being hired at HMM, but he did make it clear later that he respected "Charlie Hustle," and he legit cared about people, in his very Howard way. 

Edited August 21, 2022 by Sailorgirl26

[PeterPirate]

12 hours ago, Sailorgirl26 said:

I love what they did with the character of Howard. For so long we thought he was an arrogant jerk. Yes, he may have been born on third and thinks he hit a triple, but he really was a decent human being. Certainly some weaknesses of character, like taking the fall for Chuck about Jimmy being hired at HMM, but he did make it clear later that he respected "Charlie Hustle," and he legit cared about people, in his very Howard way. 

Howard did a great thing when he took a risk and purchased Chuck's share of HHM.  He may have been born on third base, but he stole home.  

[Cinnabon]

3 hours ago, PeterPirate said:

Howard did a great thing when he took a risk and purchased Chuck's share of HHM.  He may have been born on third base, but he stole home.  

He also didn’t tell any of their clients about Chuck’s illness for many years. I doubt their clients would’ve been happy had they known.

[gallimaufry]

34 minutes ago, Cinnabon said:

He also didn’t tell any of their clients about Chuck’s illness for many years. I doubt their clients would’ve been happy had they known.

Should he have though?  In 305, he indicates that it was confidential under the Family and Medical Leave Act.  Kim dunked on him for hiding Chuck's condition from their clients and there are certain times when he did that at Chuck's insistence - most notably with Mesa Verda - which explains why Kim would be bitter about that.  And of course, Howard was always concerned with the reputation of the firm.  But I don't see he did anything wrong or even especially dubious by keeping Chuck's condition confidential if he so wished just as if it were cancer instead of mental illness.

[Cinnabon]

1 hour ago, gallimaufry said:

Should he have though?  In 305, he indicates that it was confidential under the Family and Medical Leave Act.  Kim dunked on him for hiding Chuck's condition from their clients and there are certain times when he did that at Chuck's insistence - most notably with Mesa Verda - which explains why Kim would be bitter about that.  And of course, Howard was always concerned with the reputation of the firm.  But I don't see he did anything wrong or even especially dubious by keeping Chuck's condition confidential if he so wished just as if it were cancer instead of mental illness.

Sure, but he allowed Chuck to work on client cases and even represent them in court, when he knew Chuck was not himself. He didn’t need to tell the clients that Chuck was mentally ill, but shouldn’t have let him take the lead, imo. 

[jww]

In episode 1 Jimmy is explaining to the skateboarders how he got the name Slippin Jimmy and how everyone knew him by that name.  If that was the case how could he pull off the scam repeated times when it was well known what he was doing?

[Lalo Lives]

Got my youngest to start BB. Deal was I had to watch Inception and Get Out in return.

So I watched a couple eps with him. Bathtub, bike lock, cancer confession time frame. I think he’s hooked.

[Simon Boccanegra]

6 hours ago, jww said:

In episode 1 Jimmy is explaining to the skateboarders how he got the name Slippin Jimmy and how everyone knew him by that name.  If that was the case how could he pull off the scam repeated times when it was well known what he was doing?

Maybe he just meant it was well known among his lowlife pals (typified by Marco, whom we meet later), not business owners and professional people. He says in that same monologue "When he strolled down the street, all the corner boys would give him the high five." Corner boys usually refers to the lower echelon of the underworld (as in The Wire).