The Tudors (2007) - General Discussion

[Scarlett45]

7 minutes ago, libgirl2 said:

I always wondered about it. I think for the first time, Katherine was married to a man of her choosing and was happy beyond belief. I think she indulged him, thinking it was all innocent, when maybe in the back of her mind part of her wondered about it, but so besotted was she that she couldn't admit it to herself. I also think she took part in some incidents because maybe a part of her figured she could make it seem like "just fun" and not anything more. Perhaps this was subconsciously?

When it finally hit her and she knew just what he was up to, I don't think she sent Elizabeth away in anger or to get her away from her abuser, I think she sent Elizabeth away to protect her marriage and soon to be born baby. And she probably also saw it as the best solution for Elizabeth before something ruined her. 

Yes, Katherine was finally “free” and married to a man she was in love with. It would be easy to not immediately see something was amiss. Also she saw Elizabeth as her very own daughter, she’s not going to see her as “sexual competition” right off the bat, or think her own damn husband she had been waiting on all those years would be so scummy. 
 

But everything else shows how great of a stepmother she was to Elizabeth and Edward (and friend go Mary given they were peers). I don’t think she was jealous or angry at her- but I can believe she sent her away (the girl wasn’t put outdoors obviously she was the King’s daughter with access to tons of funds) for a variety of reasons given the social structure of the time. Had Katherine lived they likely would’ve reconciled. 

[libgirl2]

10 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

Yes, Katherine was finally “free” and married to a man she was in love with. It would be easy to not immediately see something was amiss. Also she saw Elizabeth as her very own daughter, she’s not going to see her as “sexual competition” right off the bat, or think her own damn husband she had been waiting on all those years would be so scummy. 
 

But everything else shows how great of a stepmother she was to Elizabeth and Edward (and friend go Mary given they were peers). I don’t think she was jealous or angry at her- but I can believe she sent her away (the girl wasn’t put outdoors obviously she was the King’s daughter with access to tons of funds) for a variety of reasons given the social structure of the time. Had Katherine lived they likely would’ve reconciled. 

I think that would have too. 

[libgirl2]

I have also read different accounts about how Elizabeth felt about Thomas Seymour and what he did to her. Some accounts were that she was in love with him, others repulsed and others while initially charmed, she soon grew weary of it. 

I could see her possibly being taken with him. This a girl who was treated so poorly by her father and others might have welcomed his attentions (not that she was trying to seduce him!), perhaps had a crush on him or just hoped that he could be a father figure. When things went too far, did she realize what jeopardy she was putting herself into (and also jeopardizing her relationship with Katherine) or did she realize that he was abusing her? 

 

[Scarlett45]

On 8/21/2020 at 3:20 PM, libgirl2 said:

I have also read different accounts about how Elizabeth felt about Thomas Seymour and what he did to her. Some accounts were that she was in love with him, others repulsed and others while initially charmed, she soon grew weary of it. 

I could see her possibly being taken with him. This a girl who was treated so poorly by her father and others might have welcomed his attentions (not that she was trying to seduce him!), perhaps had a crush on him or just hoped that he could be a father figure. When things went too far, did she realize what jeopardy she was putting herself into (and also jeopardizing her relationship with Katherine) or did she realize that he was abusing her? 

 

It might have been a little of both. From all accounts Thomas Seymour was a handsome charming man- I could see a 13/14yrs old girl relishing in attention and thinking he was attractive, kinda liking that he saw her as a “woman” and not a little girl, but at the same time being creeped out at him crossing socially appropriate lines for their culture. 
 

Elizabeth was of marriageable age (so it wasn’t a “too young” thing) but Thomas was married to her step mother and her virtue had to be protected, so yeah he had no business treating her the way he was even by the standards of the day. And I can see Elizabeth really loving Katherine yet feeling displaced by her pregnancy and concerned about the baby she was having being her primary concern. 
 

Likely there were a lot of feelings, human relationships being what they are. 

[kieyra]

We did a full rewatch of this recently. It still holds up pretty well, although it’s such a relief when they decide to be a bit more historically accurate from season 2 onwards. 

Years later, I’ll still watch anything with Natalie Dormer in it. 

[ChelleGame]

On 10/11/2020 at 11:05 AM, kieyra said:

We did a full rewatch of this recently. It still holds up pretty well, although it’s such a relief when they decide to be a bit more historically accurate from season 2 onwards. 

Years later, I’ll still watch anything with Natalie Dormer in it. 

I just started the rewatch as well. I will be a Dormer fan forever because of her portrayal here.

On watching a second time, I was much more sympathetic and interested in the Catherine Howard story.

I read YOUNG AND DAMNED AND FAIR: The Life of Catherine Howard, Fifth Wife of Henry VIII by Gareth Russell.

A really well-written, well researched book. I saw Gareth speak on his tour and he's engaging and funny and serious about his research. Currently reading his new book about the Titanic.

Anyway, that book was on my mind when Catherine's story started.

[Spartan Girl]

To get myself properly pumped up for SIX!!! next month, I find myself rewatching this show, mostly season 1 and 2. I’m sorry but some of the headpieces the queens wear are hideous…and probably inaccurate lol.

Man, I just love Sarah Bolger’s Mary. She really was the master of keeping a straight face in public and finally letting her guard drop and break down when she was alone. I live for her relationship with Chapuys. And however inaccurately it was portrayed, her brief romance with Hot Captain Hook Duke Philip was probably the best romance on the whole show—which is really sad when you think about it.

Whatever I think of JRM, I can’t stop staring at his full rosebud lips. Whaaaat?