BaseOps

S2 was the peak, for sure. But I think S5 is great (some missteps, yes, but also some of my all-time favourite episodes and storylines), and there's great moments throughout the rest. The S6 finale, for instance, is probably the best thing the show has produced. S11 is a low-point, but it's recovered nicely in my opinion. It can improve greatly, but it's still enjoyable and has really great moments. It's fun to still be following so many of these characters after so many years.

This. Grey's has never been much about 'liking' characters, but more rooting for them. Basically every single great Grey's character has been selfish, cheated, made bad choices, etc. Certainly all of my favourites have. If everyone was peachy and got along and made great deacons, we'd have no drama. I certainly know I can be selfish and annoying and make bad decisions at times. Part of the charm of this series (for me) has always been that the characters are complex and not always pleasant. That said, I'll wait to see the finale before I judge. I thought Mer was over the line with Amelia this week, but I thought Amelia was over the line with just about everything she said and did last season (nothing trumps her speech to Meredith right before Derek died.) I will forever remember S11 as 'the year Amelia yelled at everyone.' It was unbearable. She was similarly awful this season when Penny first came on (To Meredith: "You knew! How could you do this to me!") Also, people saying that Amelia does more to raise Mer's kids than her is just silly. We all know the writers ignore the kids (Sofia was ignored for over a year until she became a plot point. Anyone remember when Callie was drinking at Mer's house and Arizona came over to crash last season? When's the last time we saw Tucker?) We've had one or two mentions of Amelia and Maggie helping out, but to paint Meredith as a deadbeat mom is a real reach. Let's not forget that Amelia has also taken a sledgehammer to a wall while the kids were asleep AND brought Owen home and banged him on the couch downstairs, then fell asleep there. Real mom material...

Time-jump is confirmed here. EW has another article up, there's interesting stuff in this one. Also, it seems like they DO go through with the wedding:

It feels to me like we'll actually get some major Jo / Alex stuff in the finale, but maybe I'm just being optimistic. It sounds from the press release like we actually see Jo reveal her secret, and Camilla seemed to be excited about having a lot to do in the finale. But it seems odd to me that if they do any type of time jump, it'd make no sense for Jo to tell Alex why she said no. However, she also said everyone gets something to do in the finale... that means we're making time for Mer / Riggs, Amelia / Owen, Maggie / her sad Vagina, April / Jackson, Ben / Bailey, Callie / Arizona... maybe DeLuca, Steph, and Richard will get a few lines, too. I think it's going be a lot of Amelia / Owen with some significant moments for everyone else. There's a wedding and a birth... how much more can they fit into 42 minutes? Camilla said by the end of the season you definitely know where they stand, so either they break up or the secret isn't that huge and they end up together and maybe engaged.

Penny was listed on TVLine's May Sweeps scoreboard under 'Characters That Leave Town' after the last episode, and she isn't listed in the finale... I feel like her job is done. She caused this big Callie / Arizona debacle and she had her last line to Meredith: "Thank you for teaching me." I believe the writers consider that full circle. I hope think she's really gone. Also - I wouldn't hold your breath on picking up exactly where we left off. Not just for Jo / Alex, but this season in general has tended to just pick up days / weeks later whenever anything big happens (Mer's attack, Ben / Bailey drama + Ben being suspended, the entire custody case moving at warp speed...) They brush over and rush things now. I don't get how Jo will weeks later be spilling her secret though, so I do hope we see some immediate resolution, but I wouldn't count on it.

I really hope she doesn't show... but I feel like if they wait any longer, people are almost going to forget about it. I don't know. It just seems to strange for them to have mentioned that she was never found and then the whole Owen / Riggs story sort of just disappeared or tapered off. It's those types of inconsistencies that have really let me down this season. But it probably would be better suited for a moment when Riggs has some stronger love connection. I wonder what the major cliffhanger is going to be, because earlier in the season I had no doubt it would be Megan's arrival. This. To be fair, I'm not a big Amelia fan. Do the majority of Amelia fans like this pairing? I'm sure it's nice to see her happy, but it never seems to last. Her and Owen have just been so sloppily written as a 'couple'. Her jumping into a wedding this quickly seems weird to me.

But they could have easily cut it off after that episode. They had to have known when she signed back on that it was a long-term story for Callie. I think so, anyway. I mean I agree that her reentry was largely for that episode alone, in a sense, but I think they always had these long-term plans for Penny / Callie / Arizona. Not surprising... but very annoying. How much more Owen/Amelia will-they-won't-they can they possibly play?

I think the writers have had a good idea about who would and wouldn't be returning for at least a little while. We're all on the edge of our seats about Sara, but I don't think she'd leave it to negotiations to decide. If she thought she was walking away, she (and I believe) Shonda would want to craft a specific send-off for Callie. She has been a huge part of the series for 10+ years, and I believe Callie has always been one of Shonda's favourite characters. I think if she's in negotiations, it means she obviously wants to return. That doesn't mean things don't change, but I think this storyline was more crafted at the beginning of the season when things were more up in the air, and now it's more playing off of us not knowing. I hope the finale isn't a cliffhanger in that aspect and address Callie's status either way. What do we believe are the odds of Meghan turning up next week? I'm at 99.9% - only because the show does surprise me sometimes. I've been sure this was going to happen for a while now. I hate how the story progressed, though. It was so spotty and sort of disappeared. I can see this though: Riggs and Mer are keeping their hook-up a secret, Maggie confessed to Mer that she has a crush on him, and then his ex shows up. End of season. Will they really want to parallel season 1 that hard, though? (Mer sleeps with a guy and then his wife shows up.)

We always knew that about Meredith, though. She's never put a ton of emphasis on any blood relations, and in fact she's often done her best to distance herself from them. It's not like Derek really did either, to be fair - he didn't want Amelia there when she first came, if I recall. All they did was fight. His mother appeared one time in 11 years, and I think we got one other mention of him going to visit her. Isn't there a sister we've still never even seen? Meredith never had to let Amelia move in (she's a grown woman, like Maggie, who should have her own place) but she did. I dislike the way she acted last night, but I think generally she's been more accepting than I'd expert her to be. I actually hate it more when they force them to be so chummy because it feels so insincere to me. They clearly don't get along. I will say that last night I actually felt bad for Amelia probably for the first time ever... generally I felt like she deserved any rudeness that Meredith sent her way, especially after how horrible Amelia was last season. Last night, though, I felt like she was totally crushed by Meredith's words, and while I understood why Mer felt that way, Amelia didn't deserve it and it wasn't her fault. I'm glad Meredith was called out on it. I agree. Alex has matured a lot. He wanted to marry Izzie, and that was years ago. I can see why he wants to marry Jo (though I wish the writers did a better job of portraying their relationship.) I think he's always wanted something serious, and I liked seeing him sort of come to the realization last night that he was sick of waiting. I believe he really loves Jo and wants to have a family with her, and I still think that will happen. I feel like this 'secret' will be a short roadblock. I liked when Mer mentioned how it was nice that he & Jo weren't rushing anything and he said something like "what are you talking about, we've been together 100 years." In Grey's time, thats true. Couples rarely last as long as they have. I fully believe that Alex wants to be married to her.

That's interesting. I thought it was odd that they had her break up with Penny in 12x23 and abruptly end the 'will she/won't she?' thing hanging over the series regarding Sara's contract. Maybe they're going for a sudden dramatic exit.

So our new series regular next season: Jo's ex husband (or former pimp.)

She was a prostitute for several years (this could also be her secret...) No, I'm kidding (I think.) I can't remember if this was ever addressed actually...

I quite liked this episode. Aside from the Steph storyline, which I had no real interest in, I liked how everything moved along. The big divisive storyline is Meredith / Amelia, it seems. I really liked the first scene with Mer seeing Owen sell the trailer - I've been watching some older episodes recently, and a lot of stuff really did go down in that trailer. I felt Mer's pain there. Do I agree with how she treated Amelia? No way. Did I understand it? Yea. I know some fans feel the same way (saying that Amelia came in to replace Derek), and in a way I felt like the writers were almost nodding to that. What I really liked is that the writers also acknowledged how awful Meredith was being by having both Alex and Riggs point it out. I really wish they had kept Meredith in therapy, but I get that twisty Mer is more ripe for drama. It seems her and Amelia are fine by next week (a time jump?) but I wonder if we'll actually see the direct resolution of that 'get your own life' scene. Mer / Riggs... I liked that they held it off until now. I thought Riggs was really charming in this episode. When the actor was announced, everyone said he was put in for Meredith, so I'm glad that onscreen the writers didn't make it so obvious. Or, at least, they developed other connections for him and gave him a full season apart from Mer. I hope we'll see him soften her edges a bit, so to speak. I do like prickly Meredith here and there, but I want to see her happy. Alex / Jo... she seemed quite troubled when she said no to his proposal. I liked how all throughout the episode Alex was slowly realizing that he didn't want to wait anymore. I wish we had seen some actual Jo / Alex scenes lately to drive the point home, but I'll take what I can get. I loved him telling Meredith that he was going to have a big wedding and she'd be his best man. I wonder what Jo could possibly be hiding that would make her say no so abruptly. Bailey / Ben - Meh. I mean, whatever... Owen / Amelia - So a few weeks of on-again and now they're ready to get married? I used to really like Owen (I'm talking back in S5), so I'm happy to see him happy and not so shouty. But this just seems so under-developed and odd to me. They've had the entire season to give them a real love story and build to this, and instead we got weird on-again-off-again stagnation and now suddenly after being back together for 2 weeks they're ready to get married. Lets see how this pans out... Callie / Arizona - DID WE JUST GET RID OF PENNY!?!? Okay, well there's one major point for this episode. I did feel bad for Callie a bit, but I'm glad Arizona is standing her ground. I hated how Callie acted a lot of this season, and it's hard to feel sympathy when she was the one who initiated this whole thing and was willing to take Sofia away from Arizona. Now that it's happened to her (to a much smaller degree, mind you, because Arizona hasn't taken Sofia out of state like Callie wanted to) she's struggling. I hope she realizes in the finale what she was asking of Arizona when she decided to follow Penny with their daughter. Predictions for next week: A 3 month time jump. Amelia and Owen are getting married in Meredith's living room. Alex and Jo haven't spoken a single word since the last episode; he finally asks her why she said no. She tells him that she cheated with Cross, the blonde intern that had a crush on her. Meredith, already feeling dark & twisty envy on Amelia's wedding day, continuing on a secret affair with Riggs, gets word from Alex that Jo cheated. Meredith murders Jo and drags the body back to her house. Meanwhile, Maggie gets drunk waiting for the wedding and reveals to Riggs that she has a crush on him. He tells her he's been sleeping with Meredith and then Maggie cries and talks about her sad vagina. Meredith and Alex are hiding Jo's body in her bedroom; they have sex on Meredith's floor just as Maggie walks in to confront Mer about Riggs. At the same time, Ghost Jo rises and sees Alex and Meredith. "I KNEW IT! I KNEW IT!" Meanwhile, Callie sees Arizona across the room at the wedding. She apologizes. They get back together. April goes into labor. Ben delivers the baby. Bailey realizes he is a good doctor and loves him again. Jackson realizes he loves April. Richard says something wise. Just as things are looking peachy, Ghost Jo hovers down to the ceremony in the living room where Amelia and Owen are just about to say I do: Ghost Jo reveals she is Meghan, Owen's sister. Owen is overwhelmed and runs away (why? who cares...) Amelia rushes into the bathroom crying and rails a line of cocaine. She realizes Riggs was on the toilet the whole time!!! He asks if she's okay and they have sex. When they're done, Amelia is like 'Hey, by the way, your ex-wife is here. And she's a Ghost. And she's Jo. And your girlfriend Meredith killed her.' Riggs tries to head downstairs but runs into Maggie in the hallway, who is crying and tells her that she has loved him her entire life. Also, she mentions, Mer is boinking Alex now. Meredith comes out of her bedroom, Amelia comes out of the bathroom, Ghost Jo / Meghan hovers back upstairs, and all of them stare at Riggs. Steph isn't in the episode and no on cares. THE END.

Meredith and Derek began as a one-night stand; most of the couples on this show did, actually. I wouldn't hold my breathe for anything deep. I'm sure it will be a quick sex thing and then slowly develop.

Yea, I don't disagree with you... I actually liked the Mer / Cristina storyline as well. I thought it made sense for both of them. I haven't watched S10 in a while, but there were things I really disliked (Shane's storyline, for example. HATED.) Last year, to me, was awful. Even with the excuse of scrambling to fix things given Dempsey's departure, the writing was just atrocious. I couldn't even get through a lot of the episodes on rewatch, which has never happened before for me with this show. This season hasn't given me anything that I despise, you know? (Okay, maybe Penny...) I've just found it overall enjoyable, with some really good moments throughout... I do wish the writers would just sit down and get some shit together. Too many unnecessary characters, too much focus on hitting plot-points rather than following character logic, and too many characters that I love getting left with nothing to do are the big issues for me. Granted, those are some big issues indeed... but I certainly see why many casual fans are enjoying this season a lot more and why critics feel it's been refreshed. I can only hope S13 continues to improve and gets us all to a better place where the die-hard fans who take the time to really examine the show can enjoy it more.

We'll never have the quality of S2 again, but I think S12 - despite many obvious flaws - has been much, much better than the dreadful season 11 and probably S10. It's a lot more enjoyable, for me anyway. I do wish they'd improve several things, but I can see why the media and fans are praising the show this season. It does feel rejuvenated to me.

The PR says that she supports Amelia on a 'big day' in the finale, so I feel like things will be resolved by then. I'm thinking Owen proposes this week, Meredith begins to feel dark & twisty and hooks up with Riggs, and she gets over it by 12x24 in time for the Owen / Amelia wedding (ugh.) I do totally wish that they kept Meredith in therapy. It could have been a great storyline rather than a one-time thing and lord knows she needs it.

It's interesting that they're toying with the idea of everyone having only 'one great love'. I wonder how that will reverberate through the storylines... if Meredith hooks up with Riggs this week, does she then reject him like she did with Thorpe? Or do they mutually discuss their 'great loves' (Derek and Meghan) and decide they still deserve some happiness since those loves are gone? Is Jo Alex's 'one great love' (I still say it's Izzie lol). I can certainly see the possibility of big Callie / Arizona + Jackson / April reunions.

Some tidbits for the final 2 episodes:

My issue with their 'camaraderie' is it just seemed thrown together because none of them really had friends or anyone else to talk to. Aside from Steph / Jo, we never really saw how they developed a friendship - especially with Penny, she was just thrown in there seemingly at random. I don't want DeLuca to join their group... it wouldn't really make any sense. Also, at this point DeLuca has the personality of a cardboard box... we literally don't know anything about him. I wish they had made Cross a regular instead of DeLuca, honestly. At least he's fun. His crush on Jo was reductive, but I liked that he reminded me of George. We haven't had a fun male character since Mark left.

It doesn't seem like a big disaster to me - not something as huge as the shooting or plane crash, anyway.

She's a real trooper, honestly. She gets asked the same questions and gives the same answers, and she actually does it while remaining enthusiastic and seeming very kind and open. I know it's part of her job, but many actors / actresses look miserable doing this. Also, Jessica Capshaw had her baby.

I don't think either of them are journalists, that's why they're riding around on a street car with a c-list actress asking fan questions on a Facebook live stream for Cosmopolitan lol. I looked her up - the one 'interviewing' is Cosmo's Entertainment Director. I listened to it in the background while I made dinner... as much as I'm impartial to Jo, I really do appreciate how enthusiastic Camilla is about the show.

Moving a piece over from the Media thread - in a new interview, Camilla says this is 'one of her favourite finales', she says Jo is featured heavily and that it was one of the most intense episode's she's filmed. She also says that every character gets a good storyline in the finale.