Audreythe2nd

It's a blurry line currently I'm sure, but they are probably to some extent obliged to follow EU policies while the negotiations are happening, so they might have no legal recourse to deny them funding either while they are technically still in the EU. I'd be very surprised if filming for this season was delayed or if they moved locations. The *most* I could see happening is moving to another studio somewhere in Ireland, but even so... I think it's too late in the process (this year anyway) to do anything about it. My bet is that they just push forward, apply for all the funding they've had access to in the past, and hope for the best. ETA: Ah, here we go - turns out it won't matter at all. http://www.ew.com/article/2016/06/24/brexit-game-thrones “We do not anticipate that the result of the EU Referendum will have any material effect on HBO producing Game of Thrones.”

I've been saying for the longest time that Jaime wasn't going back to KL this season. Or possibly ever. But as for this little diversion, I suspect it might have to do with making sure what he promised Edmure in regards to him being sent to Casterly Rock is carried out.

You guys realize that because you don't like option three, that's the one that's most likely to happen right? :-D (I'm serious, I think it would be just up the show's alley to have the person we least want to kill Ramsay kill Ramsay, as opposed to Jon or Sansa).

Explain a recently horrible thing that Cersei has done that we have *evidence* that Jaime has been privvy to that he's just brushed aside? He knows she's untrustworthy in a general sense, but since going after Tyrion at the trial (which yes, Jaime WAS disturbed by, since he, you know helped him escape despite her wishes) we don't have any evidence of specific things that Jaime knows about. Going after the Faith Militant isn't exactly going against innocent people for petty reasons. I don't think in the show Jaime knows how responsible for the whole situation she is (which, if you want to say that defies logic, fine, but I think they've painted Jaime as somewhat in the dark here). The only other thing I can think of is how she wanted Sansa dead (still does), but Jaime does have a problem with that - he sent Brienne to protect her and was going to let her take an army up North to help her! So what else is there? Cersei hasn't actually done anything truly terrible in Jaime's company since he's returned this season. I think to say that Jaime has so blinders on is accurate, but Jaime has NOT been portrayed as a "violence for the sake of violence" sort of person since Season 2 - he hasn't really seen Cersei's true nature more recently to show how it contrasts with his own mindsets.

I have a different interpretation of that - I think they simply wanted to avoid giving away that Cersei is going to die (or when/if/how). The prophecy literally spells that out. Why not leave that a mystery, especially since the three children dying is prophecy enough.

True enough. But I'm just saying that there isn't some abundance of evidence to have people believe in this so *resolutely* without considering any other possibilities (other than - "Hey! Isn't this a cool idea? It has circularity, I like it, therefore it must be what happens.") The prophecy isn't even IN the show. Again, I'm not saying that it's not going to happen - I'm just saying that people have, for some reason, failed to consider other possibilities when I think the show *is* telegraphing those other possibilities.

I think people take for granted that Jaime is going to kill Cersei like crazy. To the point where it's hilarious. There is almost no foreshadowing in the show whatsoever that this is going to happen, and the show likes to project this stuff about 50 years in advance. They've projected that Cersei is going to use wildfire since Season 2 for instance. It's not out of the realm of possibility that it happens, but I by no means think it's a done deal. A ton of fan theories have been debunked this season, and I think we're going to see even more of them be debunked as the rest of the show progresses. My suspicion is that this is one of them (and it will be the one that people are most pissed off about).

Yes. He says "the things we do for love" while making terrible threats, capitalizing on his really poor reputation (and don't kid yourself - what Edmure says to Jaime bothers him; it DOES matter to him what other people think to some extent, so the little show he put on wasn't entirely easy for him either, I'm sure), all for the purpose of stopping a fight and not having to storm the castle because Brienne was in there. Yes, "The things I do for love" indeed. If you're not picking up on the duality, you're losing a lot of the subtext in a really fantastic scene (not to mention some foreshadowing... Jaime's going to end up making a choice - either go back to Cersei or follow Brienne. I'm calling it now.)

I think the answer is, as you said, the Brotherhood. My suspicion is that while Jaime is somewhere still in the Riverlands (look at the trailer with the celebration with the Freys at the Twins - Lannister soldiers; I think he is going to stop there before heading back to KL and be detained by something), Brienne is in fact going to run into the BwB and be reunited with the man she killed once - ie. the Hound. In both episodes that the Hound has appeared in, he name-dropped her. If they ran into her, he would certainly recognize her. Yes, they BwB is heading North - doesn't mean we don't see them somewhere along the way first...and both they and Brienne are headed in that direction (the Twins are north of RR too, which, again, would theoretically keep Jaime in the area). That's not to say I think the conflict is going to be the same as it was in the books. I think it will simply be a mechanism to keep certain characters in the same area for a little while longer, until perhaps they can all meet up again once more.

People need to understand the *why* of this scene. There were interviews about it from the actors/directors today and yesterday. Yes, Jaime wants to get back to Cersei. But that wasn't what this scene was about. The thing that a lot of viewers have missed, for some odd reason, is that Jaime is not in favour of large scale violence. He is (or rather, WAS, which is rather key) capable of doing small acts of violence for selfish means. But since Season 3, when he lost his hand, he hasn't really been about that, and there has been far more evidence of a reasoned, diplomatic Jaime than people have caught on to. This finally came to a head these last two episodes at Riverrun, when he talks to the Blackfish (even before Brienne shows up). He wants to give BF a chance to save his men's lives. The BF stubbornly refuses. Then Brienne shows up and suggests a method as to how SHE can try to resolve this peacefully and Jaime is all for it. But if she fails, she will be on the opposite side to Jaime and they might have to fight each other (which is a horrible thought for both of them). This is key to understanding his motivations in Edmure's scene. Jaime does not want to storm that castle, one reason being he does not want to fight Brienne. And he doesn't want violence at all in any case. And when it looked like Brienne was going to fail, he tried one more tactic (again, the non-violent one) Hasn't anyone noticed that he played it totally diplomatically at first with Edmure? His first instinct was not to threaten him, but to reason with him. But Edmure really, really lays into him, about his reputation, about what an evil man Jaime is. And this is when the flip was switched - reasoning with Edmure, offering him noble promises was not going to work, because Edmure showed him exactly what he thought of him. So that's what he realized he needed to use - his terrible reputation as an awful human being. So he'd slaughter everyone to get back to his gross incest relationship, including Edmure's whole family, he'd catapult babies, etc. etc. It's irony. He threatened violence for the end of achieving the least violent outcome because he doesn't want the violent solution in the first place (By the by, you notice he told Edmure a blatant lie when he said that he didn't care about anyone who was in that castle? Brienne was in there. Telling.). And understanding that is absolutely KEY to understanding his character. Now, some may have noticed that Cersei *literally* chooses violence in this episode when Jaime essentially chooses the most peaceful solution he can. That's not an accidental contrast. Or don't listen to me; listen to NCW talking about this scene: http://www.ew.com/article/2016/06/12/game-thrones-jaime-brienne-reunion Now, at the end of the day, you can still think of Jaime as an unrepentant asshole. That's everyone's right and I think he's meant to be a conflicting character in any case. But I think it's important to understand the motivations and the subtext of what's being written and acted out here, if only so that when the plot turns a certain way down the road, people aren't totally surprised acting like they didn't see that coming. (And no, I don't even think Jaime is going to kill Cersei - I don't think that's what this character development is about; I think it's to show contrast to her. I think his actual plot is going to be much, much more complicated than that).

Chris24601, I disagree with you respectfully and wholeheartedly. I don't think Brienne's Riverlands story is done. You think the moved her there (where she just so happens to be in the books) to fail, have a convo with Jaime, and return to Sansa? For what purpose? I think in both the book and the show her story from this point forward, is in large part about her and Jaime. Not just that, but in large part. Jaime is not going to end up choosing Cersei. I'm fairly confident of that. This is the show's brand of ridiculously ironic foreshadowing. See: Robb Stark making a plan to attack Casterly Rock by aligning with the Freys to do it. Plus a ton of other examples. Lol. This is not what they are doing. Jaime IS on a redemption arc, and his actions contrasted with Cersei's actions in this episode show it. What everyone else sees as them saying "why bother" with his redemption, I see as them dragging out the final piece of it (his tie to Cersei) until they are narratively ready for him to let it go. And he's going to let it go SOON; I suspect Brienne is the catalyst. In the books, when faced with the prospect of returning to KL and his duties to Tommen and the KG (a slightly different circumstance, but it has almost the exact same spirit) he goes with Brienne. Yes, the situation is different because of no LSH in the show - it doesn't matter. I think this is the plot point from the books people need to take stronger note of because it gets Jaime in a totally different direction from KL (we can assume). At this late stage, I really don't think they are going to change that movement and have him head in the other direction (especially since, as you said, D&D know the ending and purposely made Jaime go to the Riverlands to reunite with Brienne in the first place). If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. If I'm right, I read the writing on the wall correctly.

Yes. Lest we forget the following things: a) she's not in the North in the books, doesn't even know Sansa, b) she's with Jaime in the books, c) the show sent her to the Riverlands to purposely meet up with Jaime regardless of her starting the season in the North. So you know... I think points A and B are still going to come into play here. And I don't think Jaime is going back to King's Landing.

They're not pointless if they contribute to that chess board being knocked over.

Lol, well put. Of course people can ship for fun, and I didn't mean to imply that they couldn't! Sorry, I feel like I was responding to something specific, something that was dismissive of Brienne's actual feelings in the matter (and not that one can't be critical of those feelings either) and I was just pointing out where her story is more likely to go - though that's not even an absolute certainty - but I can't think of what it was now. Ah well!

It's not really about the sexual harassment thing, it's more of a story thing. It's some fun attention being thrown Brienne's way (that she's not totally receptive too) but there is the spectre of someone else hanging over the story/pairing. Yes, Jaime tried to kill her. Yes, he was less than kind to her in the beginning. He also saved her life twice, and then the show deliberately sought to call attention to the fact that "you LOVE him." I'm just trying to argue that this isn't something that's likely to go away just because Tormund stares at her lasciviously. Not trying to take away anyone's fun, just trying to distinguish between fun and probably important, story-wise. But anyway. We shall see, won't we?

Just saying, you can analyze Tormund's facial expression, you can act like Brienne's going to come around to him (in spite of her, "Seriously, this guy is creeping me out" reaction not once, not twice, but three times), you can rationalize it by saying Jaime was mean to her or called her ugly... she's in love with the one-handed ponce (heh) regardless, and that's not going to be an insignificant piece of information to the plot. Sorry, just a feeling I have. :) The T/B stuff is making me laugh though. So much devotion based on a few moments of comic relief.

I know that, which is fine. I was just pointing out a counter-interpretation of the current state of that relationship, in which Brienne doesn't seem very receptive to those affections, therefore not "happy." But I've already overthought what was obviously just supposed to be a joke by the writers enough. Just trying to say that I don't think she's going to be into that redbeard, sorry. :)

Sure. Darker interpretation (in my view) is that it was Bran warging into Hodor the whole time he was holding the door. Therefore, it was against Hodor's will.

We're all people who leer at women despite their obvious discomfort and convince ourselves they are into us regardless?... Well, I guess that does sum up society, so OK. Tormund has no chance. Chance percentage is about 0%. And no offense to the actor who plays Hodor, but I think he's also interpreting the scene wrong. I guess people can see it how they want to see it, however. I prefer the darker interpretation, because I think it makes more sense based on what we've been shown.

Not to be a total downer, but I think the effort to paint Hodor as some kind of hero (maybe in order to make our aching hearts feel better) are missing the actual tragedy of it. Hodor wasn't a hero; he was Bran's pawn. That's why they had Meera shouting that Bran needed to warg into Hodor, and 3EC saying for Bran to listen to his friend. Then we have present-day Hodor's eyes go white briefly, he stands up decisively and starts acting useful. This is BRAN, it's not Hodor. If it was Hodor, he would still be rocking back and forth on the ground in a panic, because poor dude knows every time they are attacked this could be the time he dies, because he's freaking seen it already. The argument that Bran warged into Hodor and then warged out of him because Hodor's eyes turned white and then normal again is invalid because this is what has *always* happened when Bran has warged into Hodor. It was Bran using Hodor's mind-controlled body to hold that door; Hodor didn't have a say, he never had a say, and that's what makes this part of the story so damn dark. Lol. YUP. Seriously, she couldn't BE any less pleased with the way Tormund has been ogling her. How are people missing that detail, lol.

All the comments and the misuse of Jaime's character... I just don't think so. I don't think we're seeing what's happening on the show correctly due in large part to a preconceived idea of what's happening in the books, and how it happens in the books. I think there is going to be a really big twist this season with Jaime that even book readers don't see coming, and I think they've set it up differently to make it surprising. I can't quite guess what it is, but all I know is that Jaime and Cersei aren't acting... quite... right around each other. I can't explain it, it's a feeling that I have. I think we're underestimating Jaime here, and what's more, I think they want us to underestimate him.