shelley1234

I didn't know having plastic surgery negated one's personhood and made that person just that part they had enhanced. That seems odd to me.

And Javi as well. Fair is fair. Doesn't really matter if Kail is offended by his turning her into a body part. All women should be polled first.

I binged this show over the weekend and just in time for the finale. I agree that there is so much they need to cover to finish this off and only an hour to do it in. That would have been my answer to the question of if Reese has ever played a villain. I do think Reese often plays the nice, charming Southern belle well, however she also has been someone to play someone who has an edge to her as well. Election is one of my all time favorite movies and it is because of Reese. She plays the insanity that is Tracy Flick perfectly. Someone said in an earlier thread and then again in this thread that the character that Reese plays in this show could be seen as the grown up version of Flick. I'll co-sign that. I do think the cast is pretty spot on here. I think each woman just naturally exudes what is supposed to come from each character. I immediately felt like I knew these women. Earlier there was a debate about if Renata was a bully or not. Sure, in some ways she is. However, I think Madeline is much more of a bully than Renata is. And yep, Renata looks much more devilish because we get to see all the info from Jane's storyline as well. However, Renata just sees her daughter continuing to come home from school with physical signs that she is being abused. She sees the school dismissing it and not taking it seriously. She sees another mother at the school seemingly trying to punish her daughter for telling about who hurt her. So, Renata is a mama bear fighting for her cub. She's wrong, but she doesn't know that. And when we see Jane go to her...humble herself with an apology and share her side of it, we see Renata soften. I agree with the speculation that it is one of the twins who are hurting Amabella, if it is any of the kids who actually know. Amabella didn't expect to be put on the spot in front of everyone to say who hurt her, so she lied and picked the new kid. She couldn't back off her story then, but it's clear with her interactions with Ziggy since that he isn't the one hurting her. My only issue with it being one of the twins (if that is what ends up happening)....is that the boys haven't shown a lick of an angry or violent streak. If they were continuing a pattern of physically abusing someone at school....you'd see that aggression in other areas.

In my world just because you are married or used to be married to someone doesn't make it okay to reduce someone to a body part....if the same is not said for Kail who supposedly reduced her partner to his blackness and nothing else. It's all the same in my book. One is just done by Kail and one is done by anyone else. ETA: I don't think Kail was offended. They were clearly kidding with one another. I also have no indicated that her partner was offended by her saying she likes black men. Both are just very similar with what is being bashed and defended here IMO. #OffThisHamsterWheel

Nah, it was another one of those clips from the reunion show.....when Kail showed Javi her too small jacket and he made a quip about her ass in those pants. Divorced. He only remarked on her ass. So, he reduced her to her ass. Not a peep I heard about it. I think it's fine to say, but I also think it's fine to have a dating preference and to state it. I mean, if Kail is objectifying, so clearly is Javi. Goose. Gander.

I remember Javi making reference to liking Kail's ass in those pants of hers. Don't remember him getting roasted for remarking on liking her parts, whether she paid for them or not. So....nah. Anyhoo....moving on.

Not sure where your son came into this, so I am gonna leave that be. And I think it's fine to state a preference and notice a different response when that preference is black. I won't state what I find a dating preference here since this is a show about the moms, not us....but I think it's alright to be open about what you find attractive. It doesn't mean someone is just a race or just a dick (if that's what I'm into). I have the same response here when men the cast are dated as just called dicks, but it's the culture here. IMO. YMMV.

I just can't jump on board with that. I have preferences and it's not about fetishizing their characteristics because it is what I find attractive, nor does it mean I don't see anything else than that. And yes, is she saying it to be cute or get attention, sure....however the idea that her comment that she likes her men black isn't getting the same trashing as someone calling someone a fat, stretch marked mess is not the same and think it instead correlates black with a put down and I'm not cool with that.

Adam calling a woman a stretch marked bitch....or if Javi talked about someone's saggy vag is blatant put downs. Saying I like to date black men isn't. Comparing the two seems kinda racist IMO.

Dr. Drew is a fame whore. No one needs to give him advice on how to be a pandering fame whore. And MTV treats them like the revenue that they are. They are placated because they bring the drama and that brings the viewers. People flock to it and eat it up with a spoon. Totes MaGotes. As for Kail and her stating she likes black men....It's fine for someone to state they have a dating preference. Not a damn thing wrong with that.

Agree. Leah seems pretty healthy and maintaining relationships and putting the girls first. She isn't looking to fight with anyone and wants to find a way to have peace with everyone in her life. Corey's beard is a person all in itself. I laughed at Dr. Drew not knowing that was a Man Cave. I do wonder if at the conference....if Corey and Leah truly learned about how they need to protect her physically. The whole family seems at peace. It's refreshing. Leah also seems completely sober.

During every finale, I renew my loathing of Dr. Drew. He can go fuck himself. He's such a damn attention whore. He actively chooses to not learn the facts so he can make these little snippets about people. David is so good for Jenelle and Barb has no business being concerned? Jenelle is so better? Sure, she isn't a doped out heroin addict, but she's not better. She's in a relationship with someone with a barbaric history of DV. She fights constantly with Barb and Nathan....while blaming them 100% and saying how totally fine she is. And then when they were both leaving the stage, I heard Drew say to Jenelle and Barb....I want you two to hug. Seriously? He is a total hack. Those two have some significant and dynamic issues, but you want to flower it with a fake ass hug to make the show segment finish on a nice bow??? And of course, with the behind the scenes.....we know how that days ends for all of them. If Dr. Drew was a real doctor who cared about the people he is interviewing, it would be helpful to have him talk to Jace without Jenelle or Barb present....not on stage so that Jace would be more comfortable and ask him where he would like to live and what he would like to happen. I do believe that Jace tells both sides what he thinks they want to hear. Poor child still believes that he can be thrown away at any time and so he tries to make nice. Hate Dr. Drew. Hate. Fiery passion. Hate.

As the cast has aged and the vets mainly kept themselves in pretty good shape.....I don't think the age gap is that big a deal. Not like when Mark was still hanging around and it felt like it was someone's grandpa was hanging around.

If the worst Jenelle can say about Barb is that she didn't play a board game with her....while we get to visually watch her abuse and neglect her own children....well then Jenelle, you just made Barb's case for her in court. She has no business being anyone's mother....Jace or her other 2 children. While it is clear that Jenelle is jealous of the attention Jace gets from Barb for many many reasons, she accepts no responsibility in the situation. I think there is no question that Barb is a better mom to Jace than she ever was to Jenelle. Be grateful for it. It's clear she can't because everything is always about Jenelle. Her development is still stunted as a bratty teen. She's been there since day one of filming and I keep waiting for her to grow up, but alas....I have accepted that it is never going to happen.

Jenelle might wanna find some PERSPECTIVE. She is constantly painting herself in the victim role and never looking at her behavior that is a huge part of that. The same when Barb wanted her to take Jace to some Boy Scout thing because she was going to be helping Jenelle's sister with something. Jenelle sat on her stairs and cried about how Barb is doing things for her sister and WHY CAN'T YOU DO THINGS FOR ME. I don't know Jenelle. She's stopped her whole life for the past 7 years to RAISE YOUR CHILD. That brat needs some perspective....and probably LOTS of therapy.

I get it. I see why these girls in particular get lots of plastic surgery. They are on TV all the time and then are body shamed 24/7. It's sad, but it is what it is. It's why Kail and Amber surprise me none with their plastic surgeries.

Maci and Catelynn actually seem quite close.....talk often and seem to genuinely like one another. Amber they prob think is okay, but wouldn't exactly call friends.

Even if Nicole and Hunter are total selfish dbags.....it made no sense to not help with the puzzle. If they don't win money then it doesn't matter if they get to the final....if there is no big money to win. Idjits.

I think I'm one of the only people around these parts who openly admits liking Kail....and I openly laughed at the idea of her doing an MTV Challenge. It would be the biggest shit show ever. She has no athletic talent and her attitude would be a trainwreck....especially with no production to kiss her arse. Of all the teen moms....the only one I think could do well in one of those Challenges is Maci. She's done those tough mudders and what have you, so I at least think she wouldn't quit or be DQ'ed for every single thing TJ told them to do. I could see them though adding in some Teen Mom folk for their next season of Battle of the Exes. Trainwrecks they would be, but MTV loves them some trainwrecks!

I think it is a calculated move on Javi's part to keep his brand going, etc. I don't see them as a legit couple though.....from what I know of Javi and what I know of Madison. I actually have a lot of compassion for Madison and wish she would spend some time working on herself and her complete gaping lack of self-esteem. If not for her, then for her daughter. Now if Javi wants to become insta-dad for another woman and her baby....unlike Jo, I can tell you 1000% that Tony won't stand in the way of that at all. He's peace out of any responsibility in 2 hot seconds. I think MTV could add them to the Challenges anytime they wanted to. They added all those suckfest Are You The One? people. I don't think many TM folks would want to do the Challenge, nor would they do well. I guess the likes of some of dads who spend all their time in the gym could be okay....Adam, Nathan, Javi, etc. The rest? LOL.

Madison is a doormat. She got treated like shit and cheated on repeatedly by Tony during her season of the RW....but took it and then asked for more. After the season wrapped, they stayed together while he continued to cheat on her, they got pregnant and as soon as she popped the baby out, he got another one of his ex-girlfriends pregnant. Madison will take whatever abuse anyone will give her and ask for more. ETA: Also those who hate Chelsea's baby voice.....Madison's voice is gonna drive you up the wall and back down.

I'm stepping off this conversation since it is supposed to be able the show and not those commenting on it....so I'm out.

I'll continue to agree to disagree. I see most comments to be about the moms and their drama first and foremost. I think that is what drives people to click in and watch.

Madison who used to be with loser and manwhore Tony? Wow Madison sure knows how to pick the losers. Good job there girl.

I don't know who was on the other end of that phone call. It could have been somebody else at MTV....up the chain, etc. Maybe it was the police, maybe it wasn't. I did hear the producer tell Jenelle that they wanted her to bring Jace down so that they didn't HAVE to call the police. So, I take that as just as true as anything else. No need to say that to her if they already did call the police, so I'll call them liars about calling the police. Production made Barb do their dirty work.