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maraleia

S01.E06: WAC Pack

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The inmates campaign along racial lines for positions on a prisoners council, but Piper tries to stay above the increasingly raucous competition.

 

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So hard choice.  Free (I presume) legal representation, but the risk is the lawyer/potential future father in law, may not like you very much and thus may not have gotten you the best deal.  Or, objective, but more expensive legal representation.  Just not sure whether to trust him when he said Alex ratted on Piper or not.  And now Piper may forgive Alex.

 

And just when Piper thinks she's playing low and getting along, she gets screwed again.

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Free (I presume) legal representation, but the risk is the lawyer/potential future father in law, may not like you very much and thus may not have gotten you the best deal.

 

 

I'm still curious if he is a criminal lawyer by trade. I think probably not.

 

Also, the idea that anyone else could have named Piper is kind of absurd and I'm a little surprised Piper fell for it since she isn't an idiot. I guess she just wanted to believe

(since she very quickly accepted Larry was telling the truth when he confessed later in the season even though he has good reason to lie at that point)

.  Alex was the only one who saw her get off the plane. And was presumably the one who told her how to get the bag and all that. Even if what everyone else knows isn't inadmissable hearsay (statements by Piper, herself, may not be hearsay but almost anything Alex said to others would) it is pretty weak evidence to have third parties who were just told about what Piper did. Yeah, she met everyone and knew everyone but that isn't a crime. Hanging out with drug dealers isn't a crime. Alex was the only person to witness the only actual crime (that we know of) that she committed. How could it not be Alex who named her? And if it was anyone else why would she be in prison with such a weak case? Piper isn't a lawyer but she doesn't lack logical thinking skills.

 

This episode is probably the one where Alex is the most hateable. I find her sympathetic a lot of the time. And I can understand the justification for naming Piper. I wouldn't never name anyone I'd been in a relationship with. But Piper did live off of that lifestyle for two (?) years and I can see thinking it is justified for her to have to go down for it, as well. 

 

But the moment when she gives Piper a dirty look for daring to laugh at her joke drives me nuts. And Nicky saying Piper was an asshole (not that Nicky could have known better) because everyone is swallowing Alex's shit. When all along she knew she was the one who named Piper and Piper had every reason to be upset about it. She was intentionally trying to make Piper feel like shit for thinking the truth in order to be in the power position in the future. It is pretty easy to forget while watching that she is just straight up lying and manipulating. Not only is she guilty of what Piper suspected but she isn't even really mad at her, imo. She just knows that if you try to fight with Piper Piper will not back down. She is too stubborn and has way too much of a temper. But if you make her feel like a bad person she begins to feel guilty and retreats. That is something we have seen work on her again and again, usually unintentionally, and Alex and Larry have intentionally used it against her.

Edited by CherithCutestory

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I've been bingewatching OITNB this weekend for the first time.

 

At a minimum, at least one other person would have to potentially know about Piper's involvement: the person she was muling the drug money to.

 

Presumably Alex had told other people about using Piper as a mule either before the fact or in the aftermath, when she was pissed off about Piper abandoning her.

 

And given that Piper doesn't mind talking about herself, it's perfectly plausible to me that she directly talked to some of the others in the drug ring about her involvement.

 

We're told that 13 people were indicted in this ring. (I'm not sure if that's supposed to be 13 people, including Alex and Piper, or 13 other people.) So it's not implausible that one of these co-conspirators knew directly from Alex or Piper that Piper had been involved.

 

Everything Piper said would be admissible as a statement of a party-opponent. Anything that a co-conspirator of Piper said in furtherance of the conspiracy would also be admissible. So if Alex said in 2003/4 to the person who was going to end up with the money, "My girlfriend Piper is going to take the money from place X to Y. I'll meet up with her and you in Y and get you the money," that would be non-hearsay, and admissible against both Alex and Piper. 

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At a minimum, at least one other person would have to potentially know about Piper's involvement: the person she was muling the drug money to.

 

She muled the money to Alex. Whoever she got the suitcase from might recognize her (ten years later when she was partially disguised at the time?) but they wouldn't have known her name. Any good attorney could tear that witness to shreads. And that's assuming it wasn't just left in a locker somewhere.

 

Presumably Alex had told other people about using Piper as a mule either before the fact or in the aftermath, when she was pissed off about Piper abandoning her.

 

And given that Piper doesn't mind talking about herself, it's perfectly plausible to me that she directly talked to some of the others in the drug ring about her involvement.

 

 

"Her bitter ex told me but I didn't see her?" as the only evidence? That would never make it to trial.

 

To be the word of a co-conspirator has to have been during and in furtharance of the conspiracy. So, Alex taking the suitcase to Kubra and saying "Piper brought this" would count but it would not be enough all by itself to prosecute someone. "Alex Vause told me that her ex Piper Chapman brought the suitcase." Alex: "I plead the fifth." Piper: "I plead the fifth." You have a statement from ten years ago completely divorced from its source from someone who barely knew or remembered Piper. From someone who had recieved who knows how many suitcases of money delivered from pretty girls through Alex. And anything she said once the suitcase was delivered would not count. The conpsiracy has ended as soon as that happens.

 

Piper may have told someone. But she was smart enough to never do it again even though she stayed with Alex for two more years. And she was smart enough

to leave the room when she knew Kubra was about to talk business on his phone in the season 2 opener flashback.

She really did go to prison for one stupid mistake. But her stupidity wasn't Alex related. She was just never stupid enough to put herself in that position again despite a long-term continuing relationship.

 

Piper doesn't mind talking about herself? That is the exact opposite of Piper. No one in her life aside from Polly (who didn't know the extent of the drug stuff) had any clue about any of what happened. That was over two years of her life she spent with Alex and then she spent eight years never breathing a word about it. According to Polly, she's also been with a few more girls and she's never told anyone else about that, either (since the "lesbian" angle was such a shock). She shares almost no private information in prison (won't even admit she likes girls out loud) until she feels people are close friends. Even then some stuff she only shares after she is caught beating a wall until her fists are bloody. She's a WASP. She doesn't talk about things. She does everything she can to preserve her image.

 

Even if she had, there are a million reasons why she might want to claim that in order to fit in at the time. Without someone placing her with that bag at that airport (which is only Alex) it is a completely flimsy case.

 

There is absolutely no way Piper gets indicted without Alex saying she saw her at the airport with the bag.

Edited by CherithCutestory

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