Spoilers and Spoiler Discussion

[Avaleigh]

It's kind of late for a spoiler thread, I know, but I just came across the episode descriptions for October and thought they were interesting enough to warrant discussion.

 

Season 5 Episode 5 "King of Norway"

Chalky (Michael Kenneth Williams) returns to Atlantic City with vengeance on his mind. Concerned about the ongoing threat from Luciano (Vincent Piazza), Nucky (Steve Buscemi) arranges a meeting with Maranzano (Giampiero
Judica) in New York. In Chicago, Eli’s (Shea Whigham) reunion with June (Nisi Sturgis) takes an unexpected turn after a dinner party hosted by Van Alden (Michael Shannon) and Sigrid (Christiane Seidel). Capone (Stephen Graham) looks to relocate his operation out of Chicago; Margaret (Kelly Macdonald) completes a deal with Carolyn Rothstein (Shae D’Lyn); Nucky gets bad news from Cuba. In 1897, young Nucky (Marc Pickering) looks to win over Mabel’s father (Burke Moses) while asking for expanded responsibilities as deputy sheriff.

Written by Steve Kornacki; directed by Ed Bianchi.

 

Season 5 Episode 6 "Devil You Know"

In Harlem, Chalky encounters Narcisse (Jeffrey Wright) in hopes of setting Daughter Maitland (Margot Bingham) free. Federal agents enlist Eli and Van Alden to help take down the Capone organization. Pained by a recent loss, Nucky turns to the bottle, and the company of a pair of barflies. In 1897, young Nucky vents his frustration to Mabel (Maya Kazan) after endorsing Jim Neary (Scott Francis Moreau), and roots out a young thief with Eli’s (Ryan Dinning) help.

Written by Howard Korder; directed by Jeremy Podeswa.

 

Season 5 Episode 7 "Friendless Child"

At war with Luciano, Nucky looks to hold onto his assets in Atlantic City. Willie (Ben Rosenfield) and Eli become involved in Nucky's war. Maranzano meets his fate. Nucky reads Gillian's (Gretchen Mol) letter from the hospital. In 1897, Mabel and Nucky argue about a young runaway from Trenton, while Nucky does a discreet favor for the Commodore (John Elllison Conlee).

Written by Riccardo DiLoreto & Cristine Chambers and Howard Korder; directed by Allen Coulter.

 

Season 5 Episode 8 "Eldorado" 

After a shakeup, Nucky looks to relocate to Manhattan from Atlantic City. Margaret impresses Nucky and a grain-company stockholder; Luciano tends to unfinished business while establishing a mob commission; Willie shares underworld details with his boss, the U.S. Attorney; Nucky visits Gillian at the hospital. In 1897, Nucky copes with a family crisis, while making a deal with the Commodore that will settle his future.

Written by Howard Korder & Terence Winter; directed by Tim Van Patten.

 

 

I'm curious about the loss that pains Nucky in episode 6. I'm assuming it's Sally since it appears that Eli, Willie, and Margaret are all still around as of the penultimate or finale episodes. I can't think of anyone else that he'd give a shit about unless it was another member of Eli's family that we don't know very well. I can see Nucky not being happy if something were to happen to Chalky but I can't see him turning to the bottle over it. I guess it could also be one of Margaret's kids but if that's the plan you'd think they'd already have reminded us of their presence. (Oh wow, I'm just realizing that they should both be teenagers now. Her son should be about college age IIRC like 17 or 18.)

 

I'm still on the fence about the presence of Margaret's character this season but I'll admit that I am interested in this deal she has with AR's widow. I really hope we get some info about AR's final days, his relationship with Margaret (and Carolyn), and some indication of how he'll ultimately be remembered by his associates. 

 

Seven years later and Chalky is still thinking about Daughter Maitland and wanting to help her? Am I wrong in thinking that she ended up betraying him last season when they were at that old house? I'm kind of bummed that he isn't in the last two episode descriptions.

 

I'm wondering how Nucky can be at war with Luciano at this point when it seems like Nucky doesn't even have any real muscle anymore.

 

Gillian got the writing paper in the second episode and Nucky doesn't read it until the penultimate? Plus, it appears that she'll be spending all season in the hospital since she's still there as of the finale. I was hoping we wouldn't have to endure too many hospital scenes but I suppose I'd be interested in a scene where she's on the couch talking to a doctor because I'm curious to know what sort of manipulative spin she'd try to put on her past. When she was talking to her fellow patient while they were in the tub and the women were reminiscing about how they would spend summer holidays, I got the impression that Gillian had probably told this woman a pack of lies about her background.

 

As for the stuff with the Commodore, Nucky, and Gillian, I'm very interested that this incident seems to have hurt his relationship with Mabel. I wonder if Mabel was the one to take Gillian in initially only to have it all go horribly wrong for some reason. Assuming that Gillian is the runaway that Nucky and Mabel argue about, I wonder if we're going to learn anything about what Gillian ran from and why her sad life in AC seemed preferable to returning to wherever she'd come from. 

 

 

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

Thanks for posting these! Some thoughts:

I hope Chalky makes it out of this season alive- I'm worried about him not being mentioned in the final two episodes. I am gonna be angry if they kill off Chalky, as he's become my favorite character since Richard was killed.

I agree that Gillian will likely be the runaway from Trenton. I also think Gillian is going to be Nucky's end game.

I hope Margaret gets a decent storyline again. I have high hopes for the character & AR's wife. I hope it includes some flashbacks where we see AR. I really miss the actor. He was phenomenal. I hope that Margaret's children are at least mentioned.

I'm super excited for the dinner party that Sigrid & VanAlden host for Eli and Mrs. Eli. I would totally watch a Sigrid/VanAlden spinoff.

[alynch]

I wouldn't read too much into character's being absent from the descriptions. Capone & Van Alden aren't mentioned in the last two either, and I'd be shocked if that storyline gets wrapped up with two episodes still to go.

[Pickles Aplenty]

 

In 1897, Mabel and Nucky argue about a young runaway from Trenton, while Nucky does a discreet favor for the Commodore (John Elllison Conlee).

 

I agree that Gillian will likely be the runaway from Trenton. I also think Gillian is going to be Nucky's end game.

You know, this would explain as much about Mabel as it would Gillian.  Didn't Gillian say that Mabel was "a saint" back in season one?  I can see Mabel wanting to take Gillian in and give her a good home, especially if they had no children of their own at this point (someone will have to refresh my memory of when Mabel gave birth to their son), and Nucky arguing with her because he isn't sure...until the Commodore sees Gillian, and Nucky realizes how useful she can be to him.  This would partly explain Mabel's breakdown, if she indeed loved Nucky and found out about the monstrous thing he did for the Commodore.  I can see her losing it once she realized how awful Nucky was at his core, not the good man she might have thought he was.  Hmm.

[jadecorleone]

According to the Wiki, Gillian is in fact from Trenton, so I would be anything she is the runaway in question. If the theories presented here are correct, its just makes me want to see Nucky go down that much more.

[hammaboo]

 

In 1897, Mabel and Nucky argue about a young runaway from Trenton, while Nucky does a discreet favor for the Commodore (John Elllison Conlee).

 

 

The back half of the sentence makes me think this will be the episode that kicked off and then ties up the whole Gillian/Nucky/Commodore story.

[Avaleigh]

I'm super excited for the dinner party that Sigrid & VanAlden host for Eli and Mrs. Eli.

This is what I'm most looking forward to seeing tomorrow. I'm interested in seeing how June and Sigrid get on. The deal between Margaret and Carolyn should be good too. I hope it isn't so simple as Carolyn just easily agreeing to whatever terms Margaret proposes. 

 

It also sounds like we'll be meeting 20 something year old Nucky in this episode. 

 

In 1897, young Nucky vents his frustration to Mabel (Maya Kazan) after endorsing Jim Neary (Scott Francis Moreau), and roots out a young thief with Eli’s (Ryan Dinning) help.

In episode 6 I wonder if this young thief will turn out to be Gillian? 

[alynch]

I wouldn't read too much into character's being absent from the descriptions. Capone & Van Alden aren't mentioned in the last two either, and I'd be shocked if that storyline gets wrapped up with two episodes still to go.

 

Base on episode five's events, I may have spoken a bit too soon here. We know Eli is back in Nucky's orbit in episode seven, so I can see a scenario where Van Alden dies during the Capone gambit and Eli high-tails it back to Atlantic City. We've seen Van Alden say that he has no intention of running again, so they may play it like he's prepared to accept his fate.

Edited October 6, 2014 by alynch

[TimWil]

Is it possible that Joe Harper, the teenager working for Mickey Doyle, is really Tommy Darmody? I think it is. Mickey? You in danger, girl.

[Avaleigh]

TimWil, did they show that character again in tonight's episode? Somehow I missed that.

[alynch]

Yeah, he was the fella Mickey sent to get Nucky to meet Chalky. He was also the kid mopping the floor as Mickey told of his rail-riding past prior to the Marshall showing up. Whoever he is, he's certainly been conspicuous enough to assume he'll mean something.

[ChipBach]

Is it possible that Joe Harper, the teenager working for Mickey Doyle, is really Tommy Darmody? I think it is. Mickey? You in danger, girl.

I hope not.  I'd like to believe that Darmondy Jr. was offered a better life in a loving home.  Seems kind of cheap if they feel they need to bring his character all the way back to Nucky & company...

[editorgrrl]

Yeah, he was the fella Mickey sent to get Nucky to meet Chalky. He was also the kid mopping the floor as Mickey told of his rail-riding past prior to the Marshall showing up. Whoever he is, he's certainly been conspicuous enough to assume he'll mean something.

 

Nucky met the kid, asked his name, then did a double-take as he walked away. It seemed to convey "Now where do I know this kid from? The name means nothing to me, but I know I know that face."

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

I'm slightly worried that we're going to find out at the end of the series that Jimmy was actually Nucky's son.

[Avaleigh]

I'm slightly worried that we're going to find out at the end of the series that Jimmy was actually Nucky's son.

Or maybe will see that there's the possibility but aren't given confirmation either way. OTOH I have a hard time imagining Nucky having the balls to criticize the Commodore in public about his attraction to children if Nucky had also raped Gillian when she was that age. Gillian does seem to hate Nucky as much as she hates the Commodore but she never called him The Lech or anything like that as she did with the Commodore. When they had their only scene together after Jimmy's death (not counting the scene when she's on drugs after Richard has shot up the house) and she's going down the list of all of the ways Nucky has hurt her in the past, it seems like that would have been the time to mention it.

 

I feel like the reveal might also just be that the Gillian thing left a permanent stain on Nucky's marriage. I can't see Nucky being stupid enough to tell Mabel that he's going to give the girl to the Commodore so I have to imagine that their argument in episode 7 is about something else and then maybe Mabel ends up finding out later somehow what happened. Maybe from Gillian after the fact. I'm guessing that Mabel wants Gillian to stay with them and Nucky doesn't? Maybe Mabel is the one who initially takes her in and Nucky thinks that it might not be good for their marriage to have her around.

 

Still, something about Nucky's comment about wanting to leave something behind coupled with the reappearance of Tommy Darmody makes me think that Nucky having been Jimmy's father isn't completely off of the table. 

 

But would Nucky really have killed his own son? If he thinks there's the possibility that he could have been Jimmy's father, it's hard for me to believe that he would have been able to kill him. I'm on the fence on this one but definitely think it could end up being a reveal they've been leading up to.

[alynch]

So I guess Willie's scenes in the finale got cut, eh?

 

Avaleigh, if you remember could you possibly link to where you initially found those descriptions?

 

ETA: No need. Google is my friend.

Edited October 27, 2014 by alynch

[NutMeg]

happy the thread is not closed, as I never read spoiler but am always intested afterwards to see what I would have been spoiled about. I "liked" a few posts because I like the thinking, even in cases when the outcome was different.