Previously.TV Contributor/Signer To Television Characters: LEARN ASL ALREADY

[Primetimer]

Lilit Marcus is not a crackpot. She just sees opportunities all over TV for ASL fluency.

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[shapeshifter]

FWIW, on page 2 of episode 2 of The Leftovers, I did post:

I was going to suggest Etch-A-Sketch, but growing up, I was the only kid who could easily write on one--probably something to do with being ambidextrous. But if we're considering other means of silent communication that might include a bit of a learning curve: How about American Sign Language?

Note I did not use the ASL acronym because I figured most wouldn't recognize it--which is a sad commentary on my part.

[Lilit]

I don't blame you - sometimes when I say "ASL" people go all "age/sex/location" because apparently it's still 1997? But I feel the need to say "American Sign Language" because so many people think sign language is universal. Basically, what I'm trying to say here is hi shapeshifter and glad we were on the same page about this.

[HeatherinThailand]

AMEN to this! In the first episode of Leftovers, I was like "Wait. This group has existed for a year, and they are still using notepads? ASL would be so much more efficient. And cost effective!" (Though I guess if they've got $130 grand in cash just lying around, maybe petty cash for notepads and pens isn't a problem.)

[Constantinople]

From the Pilot Episode thread

 

I'm surprised the Marlboro Cult doesn't use sign language given that they don't appear to object to communication, only to speaking.

Sure, I may not have used some fancy schmancy pants acronym, but I got the idea across.

Just sayin'

On a more serious note, I don't see why they showrunners/writers/powers that be/whatever didn't have the chain smoking cult use sign language. Presumably, most of the audience wouldn't understand it -- I don't -- but there are these things called subtitles.

Plus, I think it would give the cult a lot more start-up credibility with viewers. Anyone can put on a white bathrobe, chain smoke and passive aggressively bother their neighbors -- if my grandfather were still around he might be mistaken for a member -- but it takes some dedication to learn another language.

I also think it would also be a lot more interesting and effective watching someone teach Liv Tyler how to sign than watch her chop down a tree.

[A Boston Gal]

Even if the audience wouldn't understand ASL, the show could always use subtitles when it was important.

[Ronin Jackson]

 

Even if the audience wouldn't understand ASL, the show could always use subtitles when it was important.

 

The audience not understanding ASL is a fairly significant point. Also, most of the other characters don't understand ASL, and they couldn't communicate with them. Plus, if they were using ASL, audiences would just be more confounded than they already are about the group, thinking it was a strange group of deaf people smoking and wearing white.

Honestly, I'm not seeing a problem here. The show has enough legitimate shortcomings without harping on non issues and coming up with alternatives that can't be applied practically to the show.

I think the GR could invest in dry erase pads, though, since they apparently got enough cash in their coffers to buy up churches.

[wildechilde17]

I couldn't agree more as an AUSLAN (Australian Sign Language) signer I've never understood why in situations requiring constant speechlessness TV characters don't resort to sign languages. It doesn't have to be ASL either many Deaf children in hearing homes prior to attending schools for the hearing impaired or being exposed to signed languages create with their families home signs. Nicaraguan sign language is a perfect example of what happens when people can't communicate through voice but are willing and able to communicate. It makes sense and it would be nice to see some representation of signed languages in the media. In other news the next edition of the current Hawkeye comic, that I know Dave is fond of, is to be told entirely in ASL as Hawkeye has been canonically hearing impaired for at least part of his character existence.

[ganesh]

 

The show has enough legitimate shortcomings without harping on non issues and coming up with alternatives that can't be applied practically to the show.

I think the main point is that having them not speak is just a waste of time and arbitrary. There's no reason why, and they still freely communicate regardless of speaking. It's a hack by TPTB by having them write because they can only right so much, so it ends up having dialogue that only consists of a handful of cryptic phrases that are meaningless to the audience.

 

It's not a self-discipline thing because they're furiously writing and wasting paper. And they talked anyway. The endpoint is still the same. The scenes are entirely plodding and silent. It's not like if they were using sign language that they'd be suddenly full of dialogue. At least with a foreign language you can pick up on the actors emoting through their delivery. 

 

As it was pointed out, there's numerous and simpler options to communicate without speaking and writing on paper anyway. From a tv standpoint, regularly having scenes in your show in complete silence doesn't work that well. At least with Liv she was talking back to them, but otherwise, we get a scene where they look at pictures of Liv and write "she's pretty." Clearly, your vow of silence isn't based on an economy of words. 

 

This wasn't thought out and it's poorly executed. It would make more sense if they didn't talk to outsiders, but they're still communicating with the chief, when he visited. The chief has also clearly been investigating them for a while, but seemingly doesn't have any idea why they don't talk? No one else is investigating them? This is the only place where the cult exists? He doesn't have any theories.

 

If they were all using ASL it would be weird, but if they didn't establish similar motivation it still would be poorly executed. 

[Ronin Jackson]

I think the main point is that having them not speak is just a waste of time and arbitrary.

 

 

That I agree with, with the proviso that perhaps at some point there may be a suitable explanation offered for why they don't speak.  I'm certainly not expecting much on that end, given how little has been explained so far and Damon Lindelof's reputation for this sort of thing, and you make good points that it can't be a self disciplinary practice (like silent meditation retreats for example, which restrict any kind of communication).  

 

The GR using sign language wouldn't make it any better though.  They'd have to force the new recruits to learn it, which just adds another excessively complicated stipulation to the groups practices... it's already hard enough to believe that so many people would leave their lives behind to live like the GR without adding the need for them to learn a new form of communication.  If the scenes with Meg or Garvey communicating with them had them instead trying to decode sign language, it would not make the scenes any less plodding.  Most people are at least already equipped with the ability to read and write.  

[ganesh]

 

That I agree with, with the proviso that perhaps at some point there may be a suitable explanation offered for why they don't speak.

There's been numerous opportunities to clue the viewer over the space of 2 episodes though. Not a huge info dump, but some tidbits that we can infer from. If they're going to tell us down the road, then they're planning out the season poorly. 

 

The chief is the worst cop ever if he hasn't gotten to the bottom of this already. That's the first question I'd investigate. Why not arrest one or two of them for stalking? Just to see if anything falls out.