Who Killed Malcom X? - General Discussion

[AgentRXS]

Decades after the assassination of African American leader Malcolm X, an activist embarks on a complex mission seeking truth in the name of justice.

Release Date: February 7,2020

[Guest]

Well, I guess I know what I'll be doing this weekend. 

Really looking forward to this one!

[AgentRXS]

It was about what I expected. I felt so bad for the guy who took the fall and missed out on 22 years with his family and is having hard time reconnecting with them. Also, Betty Shabazz was a stronger woman than I could ever possibly be. I cannot imagine losing my husband and my home within a course of a week and not completely falling apart. The reporters that attempted to interview her immediately after he was killed were trash for harassing her with their stupid questions.

Overall, it was what I expected--because it happened so long ago, most of the key players involved are dead, and so nothing can really be resolved at this point. It did kind of amaze me that the remaining living NOI/former NOI members knew the suspected "true story" all these years, but just didn't care. And I found Cory Booker's reaction to news of the suspected "true assassin" very interesting--wondered what that was all about.

[DoctorAtomic]

I'm on 4 now. I didn't know the one actual shooter named the others, but yeah, you're not going to find them. 

All the footage of X was amazing. He can talk. 

Zero issues with him being real about his opinion on JFK. 

So basically NOI was a racket for EM's family and they knew X too legit to play ball. 

On 2/11/2020 at 10:01 AM, AgentRXS said:

It did kind of amaze me that the remaining living NOI/former NOI members knew the suspected "true story" all these years, but just didn't care.

The one guy at the Indian restaurant taking about whether you 'obey' or not struck me as way way suspect. 

You got to make people call you honorable all the time, how honorable are you really. 

Edited February 13, 2020 by DoctorAtomic

[DoctorAtomic]

Wow was any one in the ballroom not on the payroll? 

What a sad story. The shooter going on to live his life I can buy, but all those people knew? And the framed up guys got their lives robbed. Theres your religion cowards. 

You know for damn sure anyone calling Malcom X a thug in 2020 used the n word in 1965.

I mean those guys are saying leave it in the history books. But the book is wrong! 

And fucking Bradley died. I mean I guess you should be allowed to make atonement in your life, but what about the guy who can only interact with his family through FB? Who pays for the two decades he lost? Bradley wasn't saying he was sorry. 

 

Edited February 13, 2020 by DoctorAtomic

[DoctorAtomic]

You cannot be telling me Malcolm X was only 40 when he was murdered. 

[AgentRXS]

6 hours ago, DoctorAtomic said:

You cannot be telling me Malcolm X was only 40

Actually, only 39.

 

7 hours ago, DoctorAtomic said:

I mean those guys are saying leave it in the history books. But the book is wrong! 

And fucking Bradley died. I mean I guess you should be allowed to make atonement in your life, but what about the guy who can only interact with his family through FB? Who pays for the two decades he lost? Bradley wasn't saying he was sorry. 

It disgusted me that, despite all they preached about unity, that the NOI failed those men and their families.  It's bad enough that it was set up for those two to be the fall guys, but to not even assist with taking care of their families while raking in money hand over fist? Man, that is low.

[DoctorAtomic]

I don't get why the old timers were ok with those guys taking the fall. Why were the assassins so valuable that everyone knew it was them but never said anything? 

Let's assume that everyone knew Malcolm had to go. The order was given, the team knew what they were supposed to do and they do their time. Why do you need fall guys at that point? To cover it up? But they were all NOI anyway. 

[AgentRXS]

I also forgot to add that it was beyond the pale that the cop got mad at the undercover agent/ bodyguard for having basic human decency and attempting CPR. Yeah, it was a futile effort but anyone with a conscience would try to help the man the best they can. To say he shouldn't have tended to him because he was a "thug"--wow,

On 2/14/2020 at 12:12 AM, DoctorAtomic said:

I don't get why the old timers were ok with those guys taking the fall. Why were the assassins so valuable that everyone knew it was them but never said anything? 

Yeah, it was unreal how many people were ok with the ruination of innocent people's lives to protect the identity of the other 3 true assassins. Whatever the reasoning for that, it likely will never be documented on camera.

[DoctorAtomic]

I think they all really believed Malcolm X should be eliminated by any means necessary and they kept telling the guy to leave it alone because they knew they were all complicit. Someone had to select and organize the 5 and come up with a plan. And it was always going to be Newark. 

So did the other cop (not the thug one) think he legitimately arrested the right people? Obviously at the time, the one real killer wasn't talking, until he realized that the other two were going down, and he didn't have the info from the informants, but it wasn't clear. 

The one thing they never got into was how cultish NOI was, which would lead to them protecting the killers. I certainly don't have a problem with disenfranchised people being pissed off and getting together to want to effect change, but EM had some whacked out religious ideas. 

I think they missed a huge chunk of it - one of the old timers was adamant that EM would have never ordered the hit, and the filmmaker said, 'how do you know, you never met him.' And then the son kept saying 'let it go.' I think there was way more going on than we saw. 

Did they ever say if the petition to exonerate the fall guy ever passed? 

 

 

Edited February 14, 2020 by DoctorAtomic

[Queena]

I've been knowing this information for years, but it was painful to see it all on screen. 

 

The NOI is a cult in every sense. I've been trying to tell my people that for years. Now they're mixed in with scientology. Which let's you know even more that it's a cult and a money making scheme. 

[truthaboutluv]

On 2/15/2020 at 7:23 AM, Queena said:

I've been knowing this information for years, but it was painful to see it all on screen. 

I'm still getting through the documentary, on Episode 5 now, but yeah, while I didn't know all the details of the four other shooters and the two innocent guys going to jail for years, I've known since I was a kid and saw the movie Malcolm X that the NOI was behind Malcolm's assassination. Honestly I thought everyone knew that. 

On 2/13/2020 at 2:50 PM, DoctorAtomic said:

So basically NOI was a racket for EM's family and they knew X too legit to play ball. 

Basically. And yeah, also something I learned watching the movie. 

On 2/13/2020 at 2:50 PM, DoctorAtomic said:

The one guy at the Indian restaurant taking about whether you 'obey' or not struck me as way way suspect. 

I'm convinced he was one of the four other shooters or at least was in on the plot up to his ears, somehow. Yeah, dude was creepy because there was an undertone of little remorse from him about everything that happened, even at this old age. And that makes me question just how evil he could have been in his younger days. 

On 2/14/2020 at 11:51 AM, DoctorAtomic said:

I think they all really believed Malcolm X should be eliminated by any means necessary and they kept telling the guy to leave it alone because they knew they were all complicit. Someone had to select and organize the 5 and come up with a plan. And it was always going to be Newark. 

Basically. And they gave themselves away in the way so many of them talked about that time and Malcolm's split from the NOI and the things he was saying about Elijah. Even the ones who had "former" below their name and would passively state that Malcolm's murder was wrong were still clearly militant in how they felt Malcolm had wronged Elijah.

That one guy, Lance Shabazz, I wanted to reach through my screen and slap him upside his head.  Talking about Malcolm's arrogance and big head. Yeah, well your precious Elijah was an adulterer, rumored child rapist and complete misogynist who made millions off the backs of members who many were still living in meager means. So shut the fuck up. 

On 2/14/2020 at 11:51 AM, DoctorAtomic said:

The one thing they never got into was how cultish NOI was

I feel like it was heavily inferred with the whole background of the regimented army stuff, their being told what they could eat and how strict it all was and that there was a strict order to everything, etc. 

On 2/14/2020 at 11:51 AM, DoctorAtomic said:

I certainly don't have a problem with disenfranchised people being pissed off and getting together to want to effect change, but EM had some whacked out religious ideas. 

Personally, I couldn't help feeling that Elijah's targeting of so many criminalized black males was no coincidence and that like any cult and cult leader, he saw them as perfect tools for that sort of manipulation and indoctrination. And when he needed a killing done, well guys with criminal histories would come well in handy. 

The biggest thing I learned in the documentary was the whole situation with Muhammad Ali. That was kind of depressing to watch because it made Ali seem like very easy manipulated man who was so easily used by the NOI. 

Edited February 23, 2020 by truthaboutluv

[DoctorAtomic]

2 hours ago, truthaboutluv said:

I feel like it was heavily inferred with the whole background of the regimented army stuff, their being told what they could eat and how strict it all was and that there was a strict order to everything, etc. 

What I meant was that the presenter himself was muslim, which we should protect every person in the USA to practice their chosen religion, but because he was kind of 'second generation', he wasn't really challenging the OG NOIs he was interviewing. In the few times he did ask uncomfortable questions, they shut him down and he stopped. A professional journalist I think would have a different outcome. Though, the fact that any professional journalist was not involved is telling.

2 hours ago, truthaboutluv said:

The biggest thing I learned in the documentary was the whole situation with Muhammad Ali. That was kind of depressing to watch because it made Ali seem like very easy manipulated man who was so easily used by the NOI. 

You should watch the HBO documentary on Ali to round it out.

[truthaboutluv]

10 hours ago, DoctorAtomic said:

What I meant was that the presenter himself was muslim, which we should protect every person in the USA to practice their chosen religion, but because he was kind of 'second generation', he wasn't really challenging the OG NOIs he was interviewing. In the few times he did ask uncomfortable questions, they shut him down and he stopped. A professional journalist I think would have a different outcome. Though, the fact that any professional journalist was not involved is telling.

I see your point. And having just finished the whole thing, yeah the last episode really pissed me off. That this man got a hero's send-off and all the older men acting like what was done was done and he atoned and changed his life, so that should be enough, was bullshit. 

First of all, I liked when after the one guy went on and on about the whole atonement thing in the faith and how because of that they can't still hold mistakes over the person's head, the presenter asks him if  Bradley had ever indicated directly to him about this atonement for Malcolm's murder and he admits he didn't. Oh but he just knows he did. And then only for the closing credits to show that Bradley, right up his death, denied being involved in Malcolm's murder. So how then could he have atoned for it, if he was claiming he had nothing to do with it?

And the one man son talking about how people were arrested for the crime and when the presenter makes it clear that many of them knew that was bogus, his only response is to say that well there are many bogus convictions/cases. And so again, for them, just leave it alone. Bullshit. 

I think what most angered me about that attitude is that these men were still sitting up there saying they respected Malcolm and respected what he did for the black community. And it's like fuck out of here with that shit - no you didn't. Because if they did, they would want the truth of what really happened to him, to be public record. They would want that for those two men who had two decades of their lives taken away from them. 

But the fact is, as I said in the other post, it's clear that whether they're former members or not, they still hold a lot of those beliefs they had back in the 60s being active members of the NOI and that's that Malcolm was a traitor. And so some of them probably still believe he got what he deserved. That he went against their leader Elijah and paid for it. They won't come out and flat out say it, especially today where Malcolm is such a revered figure to African Americans. But yeah it's obvious that's what some of them believe.

[DoctorAtomic]

PBS Newshour today (23rd) has a segment on the documentary with the producer and the host.

They said the Manhattan DAs office is deciding whether to re-open the case.

6 hours ago, truthaboutluv said:

First of all, I liked when after the one guy went on and on about the whole atonement thing in the faith and how because of that they can't still hold mistakes over the person's head, the presenter asks him if  Bradley had ever indicated directly to him about this atonement for Malcolm's murder and he admits he didn't. Oh but he just knows he did. And then only for the closing credits to show that Bradley, right up his death, denied being involved in Malcolm's murder. So how then could he have atoned for it, if he was claiming he had nothing to do with it?

And then the old guy just got up and left. It wasn't even that pressing a question either. Then at the end the wife denied any requests for interview.

 

 

Edited February 23, 2020 by DoctorAtomic

[GHScorpiosRule]

I looked this up a couple weeks ago after reading this thread.

One of the things I found confusing, or rather, made me curious was why didn't the person who was doing the investigating/the one asking the questions, (I'm sorry, I'm blanking on his name-lack of sleep) not talk to any of Malcolm X's supporters about what they thought of the real assassin being free? It seemed he only spoke with members of the NOI, "former" members, and those that were Elijah Mohammed's followers? Of course they wouldn't care. They still think of Malcolm X as a "betrayer" or rather, "traitor."

I also found the reaction of the Lt. Governor? of NJ? was it? who attended Bradley's funeral, but seemed so...nonchalant, indifferent to learning who Bradley was, and that he could have been Malcolm X's assassin, to be...I don't know the word exactly, but I do know I was saying to my television: Really???? That's all you have to say?

It was a fascinating documentary, and I wish more time had passed so that we would know if the petition for the one innocent man, who grudgingly agreed to sign it, had passed. I feel really bad for him.

[truthaboutluv]

1 hour ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

One of the things I found confusing, or rather, made me curious was why didn't the person who was doing the investigating/the one asking the questions, (I'm sorry, I'm blanking on his name-lack of sleep) not talk to any of Malcolm X's supporters about what they thought of the real assassin being free? It seemed he only spoke with members of the NOI, "former" members, and those that were Elijah Mohammed's followers? Of course they wouldn't care. They still think of Malcolm X as a "betrayer" or rather, "traitor."

Good point. I think the only guy who seemed fully supportive of how culpable the NOI was, is the guy who was a history professor. I'm not sure he was a former member of the NOI. But I do see your point.

That it probably would have been more compelling if they'd interviewed those who still worked with and supported Malcolm after he left the NOI and people who work with promoting and spreading his message and memory to this day, e.g. the Malcolm X Foundation. I'm sure their perspectives would be interesting. 

1 hour ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

I also found the reaction of the Lt. Governor? of NJ? was it? who attended Bradley's funeral, but seemed so...nonchalant, indifferent to learning who Bradley was, and that he could have been Malcolm X's assassin, to be...I don't know the word exactly, but I do know I was saying to my television: Really???? That's all you have to say?

Especially since I bet this woman is probably someone who would readily attend any Malcolm X memorial events, especially if there is press present and she gets to get herself some media attention. And that's my thing with these people. 

This city has a school named after this man. His life and message is celebrated by so many African Americans and yet they all feel like, "eh, well it was a long time ago, so what"?

[DoctorAtomic]

The host isn't a professional journalist. He's a tour guide. This was essentially a hobby for him. 

There were way too many basic questions left on the table that a journalist would have pressed on or demonstrated the larger context. 

He didn't say much of anything about the cult like characteristics of the NOI, for example. 

I'll give him some slack in that I would guess budgetary constraints might have forced him to choose who to interview. I do agree talking to these men that were in their 20s back then was a good choice. 

I really hope this raises enough awareness that like a Vice will put something together proper. 

[DoctorAtomic]

Did anyone see the big verdict today?