miss-vanilla
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Posts posted by miss-vanilla
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Not much I can say about this one. I feel like I should copy and paste my post from last weeks episode and that would pretty much cover it, after all that is what the show seems to be doing.
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20 hours ago, doram said:
Tyler bit Caroline as a human, he hadn't turned.
I Know, but hybrids are not the same as werewolves which is the whole point.
When Klaus was also in human form his bite was lethal to vampires. Hybrids trump werewolves.
Jules is a good example to show what I mean. When Damon and Alaric try to "out" her as a werewolf, why didn't she just bite Damon then and there at the bar? Because she has to wait until it was full moon when her bite would become lethal.
Watch from 2.50 onwards.
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Hybrids are not reliant on a full moon to turn, werewolves are.
The mythology of S2 was about the race to find the moonstone because a) if the vampires broke the curse they could roam in daylight and b) If the werewolves broke the curse they would no longer be slaves to the moon, which meant turning was choice that could be made at any time or not at all. If werewolves could turn at anytime they wanted they would be a much larger threat to vampires because it was heavily implied that werewolves were incredibly lethal to vampires...but for only one day per month. The rest of the time, one on one, a vamp would easily outmatch a werewolf.
I'm probably not articulating it very well, but this is what I understood regarding previously established werewolf mythology so therefore I thing the Tyler/Damon confrontation is consistent.
What I consider hard to believe is that Tyler was not ingesting vervain. Now that would been a smart move and would have saved his life.
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A werewolf bite is only effective when they are werewolves. As a human, Tylers bite is ineffective which is why the whole sun and moon curse was a thing in S2.
5 minutes ago, kariyaki said:It's the new moonstone!
haha! Yes it really is.
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Well supposedly a werewolf without a full moon is no match for a vampire. I think werewolves do heal quickly but it doesn't save them from instant death.
I think the show is intimating that Tyler was already dead when Damon put him in the boot of that car and he lied to Matt to send him on a wild goose chase to buy some time to escape and find the new macguffin.
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17 hours ago, ByTor said:
Please...no more Katherine!
Agreed, she was a really good character but her story has been told and all loose ends tied up. Keeping her around too long just made her annoying.
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Well I have tried really, really hard. I wanted to love this story and in the beginning I truly thought it had potential. It started excellently, the second episode was almost as good but then it has started to unravel.
I'm sad because I wanted this final season to be awesome, I wanted it to bring back all the feels I used to have and it it did fleetingly but we have since devolved into what has become the same old tired trap that has dogged this show intermittently for a few seasons now. They are telling the wrong stories and focusing on all the wrong characters. This season had the potential to really go back to the beginning and place the focus back on what we loved so much about this show in the first place which is the core cast and the interactions between them. What do we get? an hour of exposition about brand new characters that by the end of the show will not matter one iota to us, which is about 12 episodes from now. I understand the need to give some backstory but come on, those flashbacks were gratuitously long and ate up way too much screen time. I would swap at least half of them to see Bonnie and Enzo and witness their struggles, but I bet when we next see them Enzo will be miraculously himself with full humanity on show.
Damon and his memory confuzzled/controlled state is beyond confusing, inconsistent and flat out boring now. This is a main character and arguably the most interesting one on the show and he is nothing but a mindless drone for the 4th episode on the run. Taking that coupled with the lack of Benzo made it clear to me that this show has gone off the the same rails Damon has. The endless monologues and rhetoric has just slowed the whole thing down to a snails pace and it felt exactly like it was, filler.
Poor Tyler. I never had strong opinions on him either way but I respect the fact that he has always been around somewhere. What I don't respect is how he was literally brought into the story so Damon could kill him. Tyler being held up as beacon and yet another stick to beat Damon with in the narrative was cheap and unearned IMO and a total disservice to Tyler as a character in his own right.
What is also unearned is Damons current attitude. Some might view it as in character, but I don't. Damon is a pragmatist and will usually take the fastest and easiest route to get from A- B collateral damage be damned (as long as it isn't someone he cares about), but this Damon seems to have given up completely, or has he?
He talks of the pointlessness of fighting, of no hope, no redemption, and this might be consistent with how he views himself, but Damon has never been shown to give up on love. Love has been his driving force and he has been relentless in his pursuit of it and he finally found it. I find it really difficult to believe that he would choose to live without it rather than face the "hell" that Sybil showed him. Only last season Damon described living without Elena as a living hell, so why would he be scared of actual hell? Isn't all of our gang headed there anyway? Damon seemed to understand from the outset of this season that no amount of trying to atone or remorse would change the path of destiny because the sins they committed would never disappear, could never be erased and Sybil reinforced that sentiment to Stefan. Surely that sentiment would apply to Elena as well, she has blood on her hands too, much more than Georgie the 'intern' has anyhow.
Speaking of Georgie, she got sucked up into the vortex similar to that of Katherine, Silas, Vikki etc and the Nanny Siren reiterated that ONE act of sin (for want of a better word) is enough to send you to hell no matter what. I'm hoping we see her again, she was fun.
Was not surprised that the nanny turned out to be evil. Too good to be true characters are usually just that on this show so now i'm feeling sorry for Virginia St John, she really was the voice of reason. Too bad Enzo never really got to know probably the only sane and decent member of his family.
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2 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:
This is like the 107th "Damon goes off the rails evol" arc they have done and I really have no idea what the purpose is anymore. After following the character for so long and being asked to get invested, I, too, would find it sad if the conclusion was just "yup, evol". That`s it? Could have resolved that in Season 1 then.
But moreso, it is repetitve. They could have explored the idea of the Siren and hell and damnation without this gimmick. I would have loved to see the gang all working together for the final Season without the manufactured angst. Or, they could have just done it with Enzo and focused on Bonnie that way. Build the couple more. Build the friendship with Bamon and Denzo more.
And it`s not even fun. Charismatic jovial evil-doers can be fun but mind-controlled, Puritan-level-of-heal-fearing evil just comes across as bland. After having high hopes for Sybil to be a new and intriguing kind of creature, she disappointed me here. Stereotypical mean girl evil character with superpowers.
There doesn't seem to be much purpose at all. The overuse of reducing characters to mindless shells of themselves is pointless and overused. Like you said, it's not even fun. Damon is most fun when he is walking the fine line of his dubious morality with full agency and don't give a crap attitude. This version of him is resigned, morose and defeatest, the exact opposite of fun. Stefan for once called it spot on, he is a drone. If we are to take the writing at face value then I am disappointed. If they are going to take Damon to the darkest place, like he was in S1, they could at least make him exciting to watch but currently i'm just frustrated and quite frankly bored now. Who cares what Damon does, he isn't in control so therefore it's meaningless.
I'm also sick of this "you need to fight" mantra. What?
Since when has any of them been actually able to fight against mind control in any of it's forms? I was hoping to see a different spin on this type of storyline but as far as I can tell, the Sirens mind control is pretty much compulsion repackaged, so was Bonnies' urge to kill vampires last season.
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True, his lack of interest and expressed boredom while reading the sequel was funny.
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Ok, this episode took a step backwards for me, probably because I'm a tad confused as to what the heck is going on. More particularly what is Damon doing and how is Sybils mind control working on Damon and Enzo?
As far as I could tell, both of them were within her thrall, unable to resist her mind control hence why they were murder buddies on the rampage. They had no free will and therefore no choice but to do her bidding but Enzo can refuse and keep her at bay now? So why has he been murdering all Summer then? Apparently Enzo can prevent her from seeing inside his head but Damon can't, why? If she can't get to Enzo how has she been controlling him?
Damon has no humanity so therefore can't care, but he could fight against the control too if given the right motivation, yet he allowed Sybil into his mind which allowed her change all his memories. Why didn't he fight that? Is it because he can't care? Will the same happen to Enzo now that he has lost his humanity?
Also, Damon does not remember Elena but when Stefan mentions her "I'm not going to let Elena wake up to the fact that you killed her best friend" he seems to know exactly who Elena is because doesn't say who is Elena? Everyone spends time pleading with Damon to fight but not one person uses Elenas' name to leverage him, really? Stefan knows it worked before when Damon was about to snap Sarah Salvatores' neck, so why did no-one think to use Elena to snap him out of his funk? Tyler alluded to her but he didn't directly say her name and neither did Bonnie.
I don't understand the final scenes either where Damon is driving away then he seems to be feeling some mind control, then suddenly he is lying in the middle of the road again and killing Tyler. Was all that real or was it part of Sybils mind control? Ughh!
I guess I'm tired of seeing Damon (yet again) vilified by the writing and doing the heavy lifting for the sake of drama and angst. So far he has attacked Caroline, Bonnie, Stefan, Enzo, Sarah Salvatore and Tyler while Enzo has been left relatively unscathed (only allowed to be seen killing randoms). Why? Are they planning on redeeming Enzo whilst condemning Damon to the role of villain for eternity after 8 seasons of story telling? I hope not, I hope we get to see some evidence that Damon is playing some clever game behind the scenes otherwise I think I will be truly disappointed if the this ends up being the outcome for Damons' character after all.
This was a cruel episode pitting the gang against one another in sadistic ways, I hated it and found it all a bit sick tbh. I hope they move this on at a quicker pace going forward since I feel we didn't really advance the plot that much at all.
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Well I was blown away again by this one (minus the steroline stuff). Yes the plot has huge big holes in it if examined too closely but so what? I was entertained.
It might not last long but i'm going to enjoy it while I can
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I think I remember Enzo visiting Virginia and asking her exactly what was in the vault in the season 7 finale. Damon asks him what he learned and Enzo says something along the lines of "if I tell you, would it stop you from going in?". To which Damon replies "no".
so I think he did know before he followed Damon into the vault...I guess he didn't get the chance to spill to anyone else before he did that. Bonenzo reading the Odyssey together was a happy coincidence that he is using to leave clues for her. I liked it tbh
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I'm so happy to be back commenting on one of my favorite shows. I'm even happier that I can write some positive things after the dreck of last season.
TVD is back in business and long may it continue. Like someone else mentioned, all the hallmarks of KWs' writing were blatantly all over this episode in the horror and the dialogue. The abandoned abattoir was creepy as hell with all the human remains dangling from the meat hooks, it was so disturbing and very, very dark even for this show. The call backs to S1 were fun without being ott cheesy, even the fog was used. I wonder if we will see Damon's crow make an appearance, that would be ok in my book.
In fact I loved everything about the Denzo storyline. I thought both boys were doing the best they could to cope, even if they had very different strategies and each in their own way were very clever ideas. The Bonenzo and Delena flashbacks worked really well, I really felt the emotional weight of them when contrasted to the bleakness of the situations Damon and Enzo find themselves in.
I liked Bonnie and Stefan teaming up, those scenes were really well performed, especially the one in the car after they had come face to face with Denzo. The emotions and reactions were beautifully done and felt authentic for the characters. It makes such a difference when the story feels organic and rooted in 7 seasons of character development.
Alaric as an "Indiana Jones" figure was fun, but it does make sense for him to be involved in the mythology arc of the story given his previous characterisation, but the story with Caroline and his decision to want to move into her home felt like a bit of contrived storytelling. On a similar note, the Caroline/children/Alaric part is definitely the weak link so far, just as it was last season. I hope the writers learn from that and give those stories much less focus than they did last season and place the weight of storytelling on the most interesting part of the plot.
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I really wish I could write a hugely positive post but I guess all I can manage is that it was ok, and I suppose in a season that has been largely below average I guess ok is an upgrade.
The best parts of the episode yet again involved Enzo, Damon and Bonnie, even if they didn't all share screen time together as a trio they still shone individually and collectively. Enzo encouraging Bonnie to chase him was just damn hot, and their scenes in the cabin were also very emotional and believable to point I was genuinely worried for Enzo for a while there. The Damon and Enzo scenes were great, full of snappy dialogue and charm..they just bring it every time.
Unfortunately I just didn't feel the Defan scenes, probably because I still have a terrible hangover from all the crap leading up to these moments. I didn't like the speech inside the Armory much but I disliked the outside scene more. I blame it all on the writing for Stefan, which has been utterly dreadful this season and not only with regards to Defan, but for Steroline too.
Actually, when I look back on what went wrong with this season, many things track back to how Stefan was written and portrayed this season. His lack of self awareness, empathy and ability to forgive has been a running theme coupled with his propensity to judge, condemn and blindly seek revenge has proven not to be a good combination for him and massive reason as to why many of the larger plot arcs haven't landed.
In order for Defan in particular to work, the writers need to let go of this good brother verses bad brother thing they keep desperately clinging too. I like that the brothers are different, but the way scenes are weighted between them just makes it seem like Stefan's POV or way of doing things is the RIGHT way and Damon's is the WRONG way. Stefan is constantly allowed to monologue at Damon about how awful, terrible, selfish, scared Damon is while Damon is just silenced. When Damon is allowed to respond, it is mainly to absolve or confirm Stefan's POV just like the conversation outside of the vault. That conversation was all about Damon agreeing that Damon effs up Stefan's life constantly because Stefan has to constantly save Damon from himself which in turn screws his life up. It was about Damon giving Stefan a bona fide excuse to keep his hands clean, supported by the nonsensical narrative that led to this point, just so Steroline could have their reunion scene with Stefan's hero hair firmly in place.......because remember Stefan respects choices, and he now respects Damon's.
I want to believe that all this stuff with Defan will have Stefan come to the realisation that if you truly love someone, respecting their decisions does have limits especially when it involves life or death. His instincts drove him to vervain Caroline in the last episode, but it seems all that went out of the window once Caroline got a bit pissy with him about it and he reverted back to his factory settings. Damon's methods and decisions are questionable, and sometimes deeply unethical, but he does commit to them and usually he is right. Caroline and Alaric both ended up agreeing that using the twins power was the right decision, because sometimes things have to be done if loved ones are to survive. Put it this way, if my life were on the line, I know which brother I would want fighting for my survival.
I don't know, I get that they want Stefan to be this huge romantic lead figure, with morals and values, but he just comes across as a pontificating, hypocritical, selfish, ungrateful jerk most of the time, because the writers forget the history of his character. They need to pick a road and stick with it instead of trying to have their cake and eat it with this guy, because it is ruining the character. Damon comes across as more empathetic and moral because he generally sticks to what he believes, he sticks to his own code and is happy to live and die by it. For me that is more heroic and engaging than a character that flip flops and whose morality is fluid depending on what the plot calls for.
Moving on, I loved the DE montage stuff, because I'm a DE fan and I found it quite believable that Damon would lose all sense and reason when heard Elena calling out for him. This girl is who he lives and breathes for, so of course if there was a semblance of a possibility that she was there he would fall for that. Elena is his achilles heel, and he wouldn't forgive himself if he didn't at least make sure that it wasn't "real" Elena begging for help. Enzo coming to rescue Damon was awesome and exactly what I hoped would Stefan would do but no matter because Denzo will do nicely thank you.
I know this situation has been done before kinda, but i'm hoping for a different spin on it next season and if written well, it could prove to be really good. It obviously isn't the same as a flipping the humanity switch, because for one Damon looked more chillingly evil than i've ever seen him. No humanity Damon was a hedonistic, sexual, fun loving predator with a side of evil, but this guy looks pure evil. Bring it on!
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On 5/8/2016 at 11:02 PM, Artsda said:
TPTB ruined Elena for this Damon/Elena relationship, Stefan aside they had her repeatedly ignore the actions and things Damon did to her own brother, so-called best friends and family. Oh Damon killed Jeremy, oh well. So I don't think there's anyway this show doesn't end with them reuniting, Bonnie dead and Damon getting his happily ever after.
I have no problem with this POV, but the caveat of "Stefan aside" just makes no sense to me. In S3 Elena forgave Stefan some heinous stuff, committed against herself, her friends, and Countless women murdered including Andie Starr all in the name of first saving Damon and then revenge. Elena forgave all that and chose to beg Stefan with tears in her eyes to feel for her and come back into her life, and she chose him again. What everybody forgets about this Elena, was that she was human through all this and she lost herself on the altar of Stelena.
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I think you are absolutely right. I don't like that in order for these crazy plots to work in any way, they have to dumb down the gang or make them forget their own history. Back in the early days the gang as a whole seemed much more intelligent and Damon especially was very observant and intuitive. They were often beaten or outsmarted because the likes of Katherine or Klaus not because they were stupid or because they did dumb things (ok occasionally maybe), but because these villains were genius master planners with centuries of experience. It was believable back then.
Now, with everything they know, Damon had no clue that potentially Bonnie could become a vampire hunter after taking over a vampire hunter's last life? TBH, I'm not sure that would have stopped Damon anyway, so why not just play it like that rather than make the main character look stupid?
Caroline looked incredibly stupid, and vapid in this episode. Going on the run from a huntress who knows where you live, and who to use as bait is a pointless exercise no matter how far away you run. What have they done to this once vibrant character? she is dull as dish water now.
Next episode, they will all undoubtedly do even more stupid things.
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It makes no sense for Caroline to leave her family to run from huntress Bonnie. As proved when Stefan ran, the huntress still used Caroline and Damon as bait to draw him out. What is preventing Bonnie doing the same thing to Alaric and the children who are basically sitting ducks now.
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5 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:
I did the laughing/eye rolling combination when she bitched about how he was in Paris and Bora Bora sipping mai tais. I don't blame him for going to vacation spots. If you're on the run and you have to keep moving to escape someone who's tracking you, why would you go to shitty places if you could go somewhere nice? Like somehow she would have been less offended if he had been hiding in Antarctica freezing his ass off.
Well he wasn't being chased, Rayna was locked up and Caroline was aware of that. If he were truly running for his life, I would be completely on his side.
I wonder if she know he was in a relationship with Valerie?
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Yeah. The forgetting minor details of things is a common thing. I'm terrible when I read a book. I constantly have to go back pages to remember people and things because unless it is about the main event, I forget.
I remember forgetting the whole Caroline had a dad that tortured her then died thing until another poster on a forum reminded me that Caroline had lost both her parents.
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Yeah, I guess if we just close our eyes, and pretend that we haven't watched the rest of this show and view this episode at face value, it was entertaining. Well the Enzo/Bonnie/Damon stuff anyway.
Stefan has been douche all season, and everytime he opens his mouth he just keeps reinforcing that notion. I just can't with him and his scenes with Damon or Caroline. When it suits he doesn't want to let Caroline choose for herself, well fine I have no problem with that, but get the hell off your brothers back and stop criticizing everything he does, you are not helping. The Steroline scenes just lacked, I have never seen Caroline more boring.
I loved Damon's line " No more Stefaning this situation, I got to be me", hell yeah! Damon screws up, but he does it for the right reasons mostly, and, he will always try to fix his mistakes. (by screwing up again mostly, lol), but that's Damon, he least he does something, he isn't completely passive or ineffective.
Yes Bonnie is a threat to everyone right now, but she isn't dead. I love that pragmatism, it gets him into trouble as often as it saves the day, but he is at least making stuff happen.
The Bamon shippers were dealt a bit of a blow with the I love you like Elena does speech. I can't say I'm surprised given the narrative this season, and given that I was a DE shipper I was glad to hear that his love was almost familial in nature, It has been that that bond that has kept Damon from letting Bonnie die, much in the same way he couldn't let Stefan die for his happiness. I hope they keep this relationship on that footing, it is working really well, and those scenes are better than the Defan dynamic IMO.
Bonnie and Enzo had such lovely scenes together, until she staked him with a guitar- very creative Bonnie- I like it. Woah, talking of which, how great were those scenes at the top of the episode? Burning Enzo and beheading Caroline!!! They got me. Kat did a fantastic job in this whole episode, I bought all her scenes and she showed her range. Bravo.
Even Matt managed to be less annoying than usual........mostly.
Overall, some good dialogue, great acting, and awesome directing- well done Mr Paul Wesley. It's not enough to counter the terrible stuff and mythology that has come before that lead to where we are now, but hopefully the season will end well and next season will get back to basics.
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1 hour ago, Jack Sampson said:
Alaric is supposed to be in his mid 30s, right? Stefan wouldn't have to wait forever - and the dude has all the time in the world now that his mark is gone.
True, but the writers are not even trying with this story are they? Caroline is paying lip service to her feelings of betrayal by Stefan, her reactions to him are half-hearted at best, especially when you consider how powerfully Bonnie continues to hate Damon in the parallel storylines.
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I get why some feel the "Ick" factor with Caroline and Alaric, but I however don't really. I get the high-school teacher/student thing would and should be considered bad form but really? in this show where teenagers are being wooed left and right by vampires that are decades older and in the case of Klaroline centuries older?? Especially since Ric was never your typical high school teacher to these people, he was always one of the gang who fought side by side with them, and who admitted that he needed them (Elena and Jer especially) as much they needed him.
I like the bond between Alaric and Caroline, it has roots in their past, however the pregnancy thing just never really resonated with me tbh. That whole story should never have made it past the writers' story board sessions.
We all know this status quo isn't going to last, but so far despite the lack of romance in this relationship, it does have a sense of honesty to it that I liked. These two seem to know each other pretty well and seem comfortable in each others company. Caroline had some great one liners in this episode and for the first time in ages I enjoyed her screen time, so I will enjoy it while it lasts until Steroline rears it's ugly head and sucks all of her awesomeness away again.
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This. ^^ @TigerLynx
It's pathetic, as much as I have enjoyed the benzo chemistry you have to wonder why neither of them thought of doing this before. I mean how hard could it be to lure the Armory into one place to do this kind of spell? This isn't Bonnie's first rodeo but suddenly she is an Elena type damsel in distress that needs two vamps to save her life.
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@Bobbysgurl.
Bonnie talks a lot of smack, but to paraphrase her own words: If you're truly done, then be done. Bonnie is really testing the boundaries of her relationship with Damon. She's pushing hard to see if he will leave her again. She knows he's not going anywhere deep down in her soul.
This makes sense.
The one thing I get from Damon if I never get anything else is, if he felt in anyway hurt by the treatment he is receiving from Bonnie and Stefan they'd know it. Damon is not pushing back because he knows they will come around. To paraphrase Kai: They always come back, every 11 trillion times. I guess that's how the show their love.
Not sure about this. What we know about Damon is that he uses sarcasm, humour and dickish behaviour to mask what he really feels. Perhaps this is the problem, he doesn't let people in very often because it's easy to get hurt. Elena had a sixth sense for when Damon was hurting, and she honed in on it every time and tried to make him face it.
I agree that he probably knows or hopes that they will come around eventually.
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S08.E05: Coming Home Was a Mistake
in The Vampire Diaries [V]
I thought I heard an alarm system go off when Sybil escaped, it's just who the hell would respond? I might be mis-remebering that part though.