apinknightmare

Maybe Felicity gets hurt and does go to the hospital (that's why the Glades doctor is around?), but that particular vision of her isn't real? I mean, even not knowing the details I don't understand why they wouldn't take her to a hospital, because she was out with Oliver on personal business - there's no reason for her not to get legit medical attention unless somehow the hospitals have been compromised. As for Oliver having "visions," I thought this version of Vertigo was supposed to have something to do with willpower? Unless that was a plant to throw people off or they changed it once they started writing the eps. Or I guess it could be a side-effect.

I think their "raw discussion" and declarations or whatever will be real. God help these EPs if they oversold that part of it and it winds up being part of a hallucination.

I would think that since they already got us once on a PSYCH! moment that they probably would be pretty careful about doing it again, especially where Oliver and Felicity are concerned. If it is a hallucination, I'm guessing it'd be a pretty small part of the ep, so it'd be easy for us to tell what was real and what wasn't. Like, Oliver would wake up with Felicity standing over him, and she'd say something like, "Are you okay? You've been out since..." so we have a clear line of demarcation or whatever. Can we just have this episode now? I figuratively cannot wait any longer.

Also, didn't EBR say during the interview with IGN during CC that Felicity was lying dead on that table? I think she followed it up with a quick, "Or is she?" Some people speculated that she flatlined, but again, I HAVE to believe if she was seriously injured, Oliver would've taken her to an actual hospital. So maybe it is a hallucination/vision of her being dead. But like @Carrie Ann wrote, I don't know what would make him come out of that and think they shouldn't be together - she's as at risk working with Arrow as she is dating Oliver Queen. Unless, like we speculated, Oliver uses this as a (temporary) reason to push both Diggle and Felicity out of his life both as Oliver and Arrow. Although it seems too soon in the season to do that? And trying to figure this out is making my brain hurt, especially since whatever I come up with will wind up being pitifully wrong.

Oliver must have gotten ownership of Verdant back considering the Arrow cave is still in the foundry, unless there's some idiotic plot involving someone in the know purchasing Verdant as a cover, which...yeah, don't do that, show. The EPs said at the end of last season that Oliver's money troubles were going to be an issue for Team Arrow this year because he wouldn't be able to pay them, but they were either lying out of their asses or they changed their minds because they realized how utterly stupid and improbable Oliver being totally broke was.

Yeah, I'm wondering about the Felicity thing too, because a) why is no one doing anything to help her? If she's bleeding from the head, why would Oliver just be standing there frozen in his mangrief? I know they didn't bother to get her help after she cracked her head open in Streets of Fire, but come on, kids. And b) if she was out with Oliver on a date (not on Arrow business) and she got hurt like that, why would they not take her to an actual hospital? ETA: The EPs did say on a couple of occasions last week that Oliver and Felicity never actually made it to the main course during their date, so something must happen (although it might not involve Felicity going 'splodey).

Or else I'm just gonna imagine Ted Mosby appearing behind Amell and saying "you mean FIGURATIVELY". HAHA I like this theory, because it looks like Oliver goes in for a facepunch after he says that and I would be here for watching Oliver beat the shit out of himself (in a hallucination, of course).

It's pure conjecture at this point, although during the panel at SDCC, when they were discussing Digg being on the team and asking if he would ever leave to join the Suicide Squad, he did say something along the lines of Diggle being committed to Team Arrow, and that he'd never leave voluntarily. So, that might be foreshadowing, although for what (if anything), I guess we'll have to wait and see.

Not to be a downer, but I'm pretty sure Felicity gets her in the divorce.

This so much. And we're probably all going to be wrong, which is the real kick in the (mental) pants.

Well, the producers said that one of the questions this season is whether or not they can have lives outside of their work on the team (I know this is true of Oliver and Felicity, and I think Diggle, too). I can picture Oliver solely dedicating himself to Arrow (for a while, at least), and if he does love Felicity, maybe he wants her to leave because a) it's difficult for him to be around her and not be with her and b) he wants her to go out and have a life - she's just as dedicated to saving the city as he is. So, if he thinks he can't be Oliver Queen, I can see him retreating into himself and pushing everyone away. Not because he doesn't need them, but because he wants them to move on. Because he doesn't want them to give up (or lose, in Diggle's case) their lives to help him in his crusade.

I think it's something to do with fatherhood too. As someone said above, that's something that would be close to SA's heart, and would definitely be a tough subject. I posted this thought a couple of days ago, but I really do think that Team Arrow's going to break up this year (for a bit at least). Maybe this is the beginning of it? DR said at Comic Con that Diggle would never willingly leave Team Arrow, so, maybe it's an involuntary hiatus? She goes in the fourth ep, after a conversation with Oliver, who makes her think this might be a good time for her to go and visit Barry (I think Oliver must tell her he's The Flash, or allude to his powers).

I wouldn't mind watching them fight it out before engaging in copious amounts of man hugs.

I'm so glad Digg's right in the thick of things. I love angst and Team Arrow confrontations, but I can only take so much (and I hope they don't last too long). Preparing to be in the fetal position weeping for the first few eps.

Ah, see, I assumed the scary version of himself he saw had something to do with Felicity. I wonder if the willpower drug has something to do with him killing (or thinking of killing) again? I don't know why that would affect his relationship with Diggle though. My brain is tired.

I don't know the right way to explain it, because I don't think Felicity would be petulant or anything, but she's always encouraged him and told him he deserves good things. And given that MG said her reaction to the difficult truths Oliver tells her is interesting, I'm guessing she doesn't react the way he expects her to or already knows about some of it (due to hacking ARGUS? IDK). I just can't understand what could happen in the span of the night for HER to want to back off. Of course, maybe the ep takes place over a few days and they have some time to cool off after the date? I just feel like this decision is going to be made by Oliver when he's in an emotional state, IDK. Maybe Felicity just decides to go along with whatever Oliver's reasoning is, or maybe she disagrees but lets it go because she realizes he's not ready. I just think that Oliver's story and growth would be more emotionally rich if he were willingly giving up a relationship that was an option to him as opposed to Felicity wanting out of it too. But then she accepts it and tries to move on and starts to when she gets to know Ray Palmer a bit better. Although, per MG, her dilemma over being "Oliver's crush" suggests that she might not be sure of the depth/realness of his feelings for her? So maybe she tells him that and that feeds into Oliver being a one-woman man this year? The emotional crux of his decisions (or however AK phrased it) could be him making those decisions that show he truly loves her? I don't know, just thinking out loud about the ways this could play out. It's how I occupy my mind during my morning run to keep me from quitting.

These beautiful jerks need to stop with this. I'm already trying to figure out a way to fast forward real time. Digg's daughter is in this ep, yeah? Maybe it's got something to do with that? Or maybe they're discussing the fallout from the date? Maybe they're discussing the fallout from the date and/or the life Oliver can't have while he holds the baby (dream scenario, tbh)? No, I can't think about it. My heart.

It sounded like that might have been a joke?

So, this actually made me think. There's this from the CW press release about S3: This from EW: Now I'm wondering - does it specifically say anywhere that Felicity also decides not to pursue the relationship, or did we just assume that she agreed with Oliver because that Comicbook.com quote reads that we'll be sympathetic to both of their positions? We can tell just from the CW press release that Oliver's going to back off, but does Felicity? I honestly can't remember if there's been a direct quote about that. Maybe we're sympathetic of Oliver wanting to back away and we're sympathetic of Felicity wanting to pursue it? I mean, if Felicity actively says, "yeah, we shouldn't go there," then it seems to me that maybe Oliver wouldn't feel quite as threatened? Like, it's easier for him to say, "Yeah, maybe we shouldn't do this," knowing that she still wants it? If he knew she was still interested but was beginning to let go of the idea since Oliver was pushing her away and then Ray comes along, it seems like the "decisions it forces (Oliver) to make are the emotional crux of the episodes" thing actually becomes more emotional because Oliver's like, "Oh shit, I might really lose her?" Or maybe there's a quote out there about both Oliver and Felicity backing off, and I just thought of all this for nothing, haha.

See, I don't think Oliver and Felicity will be together at all this season - if they are, it won't be until the end. But if the EP's goal is to go all out and have them admit feelings for each other, that's not at all the way to go about putting the nail in the coffin of their relationship. If they wanted to do that - Oliver's "I love you" would remain ambiguous. If he flat-out admits to her that he loves her (which all signs are indicating that he will), the writers have given the audience hope that they'll be together. So, introducing Ray will be for naught - people might like them together, and some people might go all-out for that pairing, but now that we know Oliver and Felicity love each other, how can we not root for it? I mean, MG flat-out said he thinks they're in love with each other. From a writing standpoint, if Oliver admits that he loves Felicity, in order for him to grow as a person, he has to stay true to whatever reason it is that he gives her for not wanting to be with her. So, if he tells her he can't be with her because being the Arrow comes first, and he remains celibate for the year, IMO it's not because he's not satisfied with one-night stands, it's because he doesn't want to be in a romantic relationship if he can't be in one with her. And he can't be in one with her because his mission comes first (or whatever Arrowy reason he gives her). I think the producers got a taste of what happens when you mess with a large fanbase like they did in the finale. They're hyping up this love between Oliver and Felicity to the point where it's going to seriously backfire if they don't deliver. Now, they've been tempering expectations - SA said that admitting their feelings doesn't mean they can be together, every one of the EPs has said that Oliver (and to a certain extent, the rest of the team) isn't sure that he/they can have a life outside of their mission. This season is a lesson learned, I think. I would be very surprised if they put all of this out there not to follow through with it at some point. Maybe not this season, but next.

Yeah, I can't tell from that if there's one discussion or two. I don't know why, I just got the impression that things were pretty final between Oliver and Felicity at the end of the first ep, after the date, so I don't really know why they'd have a second discussion about their relationship? I think it has to do with Oliver telling Felicity about Barry and encouraging her to go visit him. Maybe it's also a bit of a coping mechanism? Pushing her toward Barry to try to get her out of the foundry because he's having trouble being around her after their 'declarations'? IDK.

I think she kept accidentally getting boob groped when they were wrapping their arms around each other for pics. And yeah, the dimples are nice. :)

Ah, I see. I wonder if it's got something to do with Oliver telling Felicity that Barry's The Flash (or has superpowers)? This quote from GG makes me think it might: I think the serious convo/end of pursuing the relationship will happen in the first ep. Maybe Oliver encourages her to get away for a little while (or pushes her toward Barry to help her move on?)?

This is probably going to come off in a way that I don't mean it, but what did they say that made you think they have two talks? I'm just curious if I missed something with all the information that's come out over the past couple of days. Based on this quote from AK, I always thought the the declaration would come during the conversation not to pursue things further (basically because I figured the use of the word 'raw' indicates an "I love you, but" scenario).

Personally, I don't have a problem with it. One of the EPs said that her crossover would provide closure between her and Barry or something like that. It just really makes me wonder about Oliver and Felicity's conversation, since she's off going on a date three weeks later (and I don't mean that judgmentally, I don't want her to wait for a guy that isn't ready). I'm just insanely curious.ETA: I just hope it's a thing where maybe Iris suggests a double date so Barry invites Felicity because she knows how he feels about Iris?