katha

I'm not surprised. Not sure how it will work since they made Penelope a morally grey character and I'm not sure they will convincingly deal with the fallout of that. And so far, Colin has been a total nonentity. The danger of Pen totally overwhelming him with her presence is pretty great tbh. OTOH they can't drag it out even more without annoying the audience to death with her pining and his cluelessness. Hopefully it will cut down on the tiresome Featherington subplots that always had to be shoved in to keep Pen prominent. And I guess they will really move to an ensemble structure proper with setting up Francesca's first marriage and perhaps introducing Sophie for Benedict. Kate and Anthony can settle into married life while Eloise deals with her break ups from Pen and Theo.

Colin is not the sharpest tool in the shed, at least on the show. ;-) Or at least he comes across as still very naive and unobservant, to be more generous about it. So I guess that explains his obliviousness in part. And to be fair to the character, if you know someone from childhood/for a very long time, it's often difficult to get beyond the first impression you had of them. And then they stay that childhood friend in your perception, even though they have developed further. That said, I'm very interested how they will work out that dynamic on the show. Penelope comes across as so much more mature and life-hardened than Colin, in good and bad ways. I don't see them as a good fit at the moment tbh.

I think that is also tied to Kate's rather obsessive focus on Anthony and banning him from Edwina. As a strategy it's pretty stupid because it drew all of Edwina's attention towards him. She was already interested because he was one of the most eligible bachelors, wealthy and handsome. And then Kate made him all dangerous and exciting by trying to block him. If she'd just pointed out that Anthony is not interested in love and boring, while Lumley is a much more ardent suitor, perhaps she'd have actually steered Edwina in that direction.

Yeah, I thought they just desperately wanted the soap opera moment with the failed wedding and therefore things had to be dragged out in a very tedious manner. And that episode just goes on and on and on and nothing happens. It doesn't even provide proper characterization for Edwina IMO, even though she's so strongly focused. The sort of development she gets could have been accomplished in a few minutes, with having the broken engagement be the scandal and she could have questioned Kate and her role in life just as well without the trainwreck at the altar. It would have made the families overcoming the scandal also easier to believe, hushing up a broken engagement is easier than hushing up a publicly aborted wedding that the whole Ton attended... It also pulled focus from Kate and Anthony, particularly Kate, to center on the melodrama of it, because it's not like Edwina got all that much development IMO, just endless repetitions of the same scene.

Coming back late to this, but I thought the end of the episode was pretty much a hard knockdown for Kate. It was a neat commentary on the usual gender dynamics of the season by reversing them with the soiree. And then Anthony came and blew it up with sincerity. That's why Kate had the public meltdown, since she both could see that Edwina is now hooked and she reluctantly admired Anthony in that moment as well. Also, she totally and publicly lost control of the situation. Nothing she hates more. She also instantly acknowledges to Lady Danbury that she made a cake of herself by storming out. What I found interesting is that Anthony looks at her afterwards with what seems like empathy. Yeah, unconscious attraction probably mixed in, but also what seems like genuine concern for the fact that she's upset. He knows all about being overprotective towards sisters.

Yeah, the lack of writing for Kate is the major frustration of the season for me. Ashley has done interviews that show she has a deep understanding of the character, her issues and where she needs to go from here. And she made work whatever she could with her performance, but it's annoying that so much had to be done without words since the script is not focused on Kate as it should be. Kate is basically a Mr Darcy type. A closed off introvert who tries to repress her feelings at all costs. A character like that needs a little more careful presentation.

They are all very beautiful, but Nicola was the only one who was even vaguely on theme? I know the designers sponsor them and they have not much say in what they are wearing, but IMO both LV and Moschino could have put in some effort...

I think part of Anthony's frustration and (bad) reasoning for the proposal is his belief that Kate does not return his feelings. Or is only attracted to him, while he is falling in love. So I do think her admitting that it's reciprocated would have been a whole new ballgame. I don't know if the two of them would have done something constructive with it since they both have a truckload of issues LOL, but it would have changed things considerably. As messed up as it was, I do think it rang true with the theme that goes on throughout the season that Anthony is always further along in figuring out his feelings, checking in with reality and becoming self-aware about what he actually wants as opposed to what he should want. Kate is stuck in deep, deep denial for a very long time.

For people who are adapting romance novels, IMO the Bridgerton TPTB have surprisingly bad understanding about what makes romances work LOL. That's been to some degree a problem in both seasons. I do think the focus on the drama and the triangle and the lack of focus on Kate were great writing mistakes that dragged the season to some degree. What did save it for me is that the writing/scenes that were present for Anthony/Kate seemed to at least understand what makes them as a couple. And Bailey and Ashley really, really understand what makes them tick and elevated what was there with their performances. That doesn't change the fact that it should have been more. The progression from two people lashing out at each other because they are so similar was well done in the first two episodes. Then the gradual recognition not only of their attraction but also an understanding of their comparable roles in their families and the resulting outlook on life they share. And the fear of that ending with the disastrous proposal. Then it dragged on too long with the stupid wedding, that should have been used to actually have Kate and Anthony resolve their issues. After the failed wedding then basically Anthony helping Kate figure out what she wants to do in life, since she was so stuck in never doing anything for herself. I have already said that I liked the emotional progression there because usually the romance heroine has to teach the hero how to have feelings. I liked the subversion of the trope, that Anthony got there himself while Kate needed the help. So for all the nonsense, IMO at least season two didn't destroy the foundation of the central pairing. Whereas season one was an unmitigated disaster for me at that front the moment they decided that they won't get rid of the sexual assault. It would have been such an easy fix. And in the end though Daphne and Simon had nice chemistry, I just thought their relationship was toxic beyond belief. They had not solved what actually needed solving: The lies, manipulations and violations their relationship is based on. Simon wanting or not wanting kids became pretty much background noise to the much more severe issues they had that were presented on-screen and then never resolved.

Yeah, I thought Edwina basically just starting to develop a personality at 18/19 is a direct result of Kate protecting/controlling/smothering her to a point where she's both totally focused on finding the perfect match with unrealistic expectations and also acts like a typical teenager that feels entitled to things going her way without knowing about the family's difficult circumstances. In that sense Kate hurt her, even if it was done out of love and with the best of intentions.

Yeah, I think I can kind of cobble together why she's so stuck in her shame and guilt, but it's all happening in the background with not enough focus on her even though she has such major issues still at this point. Anthony even in season one was shown as someone who can compartmentalize to a certain extent and is aware that he needs some form of escape from the pressure he puts on himself. And his strained relationship with his mother indicates that he is aware how she contributed to the situation and does not shy away from assigning a portion of blame and responsibility to her. His family is also largely supportive of a potential match with Kate. Add in that he's a man of high rank and a considerable fortune, I think the obstacles to him realizing what he wants and that he is allowed to try to achieve it for himself are lower. Kate seems stuck in massive denial about various aspects of her life and relationships. Her grand masterplan for Edwina has just blown up for her. Edwina and Mary seem to blame and resent her for her actions at this point. She feels guilt and shame for her own feelings and for not being a good enough daughter/sister and not deserving of love because all her managing and sacrificing has not led to the results she wanted. I think her ambitions for Edwina and her marriage were so absolute and consuming for the last decade of her life that she didn't even allow herself to think about goals for herself. On top of that she is a 26 (an "old maid" as perceived by society) woman of lower rank, no fortune and I know the show does not want to acknowledge race and colonialism, but it's there all the same. I also think that no one in the Sharma household had yet figured out that something was dysfunctional about their dynamic, with Kate taking on everything for everyone. Edwina and Mary are just now waking up to it. The stakes for her are incredibly high. But as I said, this is mostly my speculation hammered together from scraps the show offers. Her being so frozen and panicked for two episodes should have been explored, yet it mostly just served as plot device.

They turned Kate from extrovert to introvert in the show, which is an interesting choice IMO and perhaps tied to Ashley's strengths as an actor. I did miss the warmth that Kate in the book had to some degree, but the way they really set up the emotional isolation for Kate in the show made it understandable why she is so very guarded. They also swapped up one set of insecurities in the book for another set of insecurities in the series, IMO even more severe ones. Then they didn't properly focus on them, just as a plot device or as background noise for Edwina's and Anthony's arcs, for the most part. That is not good, And I do think the almost total omission of Kate POV has served to create distance towards the character for some viewers. Could have been easily avoided. But yeah, the wedding night in the book starts with a big yikes. I thought they kept the best parts of Anthony's characterization from the book and did away with the more old-fashioned romance novel baggage, that worked very well. And since Daphne/Simon stayed dysfunctional in both the series and the book, it was a nice change to have Kate and Anthony be two adults who figure out that they want to be together. Since they both have issues they produce a lot of collateral damage, but it felt messy in a more aware sort of way. While IMO Daphne and Simon at the end of the first season basically still hadn't really addressed the toxicity in their marriage.

I really hope so. What bothers me on rewatch even more and makes the IMO inadequate focus on Kate even worse: Her plot reads like a barely prevented tragedy. Which is different from the book, as is the decision to make her closed off and introverted. It becomes painful to watch this woman basically wanting to erase herself out of existence. It's not about marriage or not, it's the transactional way Kate seems to view love and that she thinks she is only worthwhile to her family if she's in a constant state of self-sacrifice. Starting in episode 6, IMO it becomes almost unbearable to watch. And the lack of focus on her reinforces her view of herself on a structural level. Contrast that with Penelope, who is also on the sidelines in society, but gets lots of point of view and is centralized. Like in episode 7 Kate is constantly berated or she is berating herself, it feels like. The contrast with the gazebo scene where Anthony is totally focused on her is super effective and even moving because of that. Yet right after she drowns in so much shame and guilt that it results in that riding accident. Now, there's nothing inherently wrong with such a narrative and I think a big part of the chemistry Anthony and Kate have is tied to the fact that they overcome this mindset together that they are only worthwhile as human beings if they do their duty. But this is only really addressed and resolved for Anthony. I actually think Kate's issues cut even deeper but it's only present to bring the plot forward and takes place on the sidelines of other stories. I've seen some criticism of Ashley and I think she did great with what she was given, but the writing/lack of writing for Kate is often frustrating throughout the series.

Absolutely, Edwina was right to drag them to hell for their actions. There was no malice involved but the way Anthony and Kate are used to managing and making decisions for everyone stripped Edwina of agency and was a huge emotional betrayal. Just because they had good intentions does not justify anything. I think her massive anger at Kate is both that such a mess colliding with a lifelong bond cuts deeper and that Kate is in such determined denial about everything.

Yeah, I thought the great focus on Pen so early on is a mistake tbh. Colin is useless, but at least doesn't draw as much attention. I understand that NC is great and they like the Gossip Girl aspect, but I thought her story and Eloise and the Featherington plot took up way too much time. You can create an ensemble, which is how they shifted it from season 1 to season 2 structurally, without getting this dragged down by the supposed side plots. Penelope got more storyline and focus than Kate, that's the really troubling aspect. Anthony had a fantastic leading man arc IMO. Better than whatever confused mess Simon got last year since he was saddled with that unresolved sexual assault plot that for me sunk Daphne and Simon as a pairing for good. But Kate was really sidelined for much of the series. She didn't need flashbacks or anything, she just needed to be the center of her own story. And until episode 8, IMO she wasn't. I do think the appeal of Kate and Anthony, for those viewers who liked the pairing, is tied to the fact that Anthony very much tries to get her into the center of her own narrative. While she thinks that she's not worth it and should stay on the sidelines.

I thought they did a good job of establishing why Edwina and Anthony could be a good match in theory while not working in execution. It's a marriage of convenience but they like each other and IMO would be invested in making it successful. In their society that is a lot more than many other matches start with. Kate had taken herself out of the equation by declaring that she's going back to India no matter what. On paper it made sense for Anthony to propose to a pleasant girl he liked, while rationalizing away his attraction to Kate as a heat of the moment thing. Only once the engagement gets underway does he become aware of the emotional complications this will present long-term. Kate is still firmly in denial. The hurt they cause Edwina with their misguided reasoning is cringe. But I understand why Edwina's anger focuses on Kate. Their lifelong relationship and Kate being a quasi mother to her heightens the emotional betrayal. Anthony also never declared his love for Edwina, while Kate filled her head with fairy tales. It's not fair on Kate but rang emotionally true. However, yeah Kate is often pretty rigid and can come across as unlikable, but they have her in a series of scenes get berated by various people for her behavior. It explains her defensive attitude and I don't know how much I like it in combo with the IMO lack of proper focus on her.

Yeah, they've written themselves into a corner with Colin IMO. So far, he's been inept at about anything he tries and doesn't have many charming or otherwise redeeming traits. I'm always bored with him and he comes across as rather useless all around. And I don't understand why they did this, the actor seems allright. If they gave him something halfway decent I'm sure he could cope. Benedict also hasn't gotten super exciting material so far IMO, but they've added enough moments to make him an appealing character. Should have been possible with Colin as well. And yeah, for comparison, Anthony was a bit of a jerk in the first season, but he also had moments with his family, with Simon and came across as pretty distinct, if not always likable. And then they could just build on that. Colin is a total personality-free void so far. Well, apart from "easily duped." ;-)

Yeah, it's one of those plot contrivances. Everyone has to be a bit/a lot stupid for it to go on as it does. It does create a parallel between Kate and Anthony, though: The parentification of the eldest child, even if done unconciously. And it twists the kid and you never get the responsibility and power dynamics back to the way they were. Violet tries to be a mother to Anthony but to a certain point he is just blocking her and I liked that in this season she recognized why this is happening and how she contributed to it. Mary was oblivious to this dynamic, it seems, and only figures it out once we met the Sharmas on the show. And of course the burden is too big for both Kate and Anthony to take care of everyone like that and and creates really screwed views of themselves and their worth (totally tied to their real and perceived duties). They're also not able to recognize that it is not always needed anymore, compared to the crisis that started them on this path in the past. OTOH, the series also shows quite well how Violet and the Bridgerton siblings as well as Mary take for granted that Anthony/Kate will just deal with things. And then they get huffy if things go awry. ;-)

I like the Wallflower and the Hathaway series, they could do those. And it's cool because they can basically transition from the Wallflowers to the Hathaways. Hell, There's even a Christmas special already written. 😉 "Secrets of a Summer night" and "Mine Till Midnight" are my fave books by far, I don't think that's the popular opinion, but I think the couples in those are most relatable and not too bogged down by OTT self-made romancelandia problems. "Devil in Winter" could be good, but that is bogged down by Kleypas not wanting to acknowledge that the hero abducted and threatened rape of another woman in the prior book. A redemption arc might have been possible, but the book pretends that it's not necessary and he's always had a heart of gold or something. My suspension of disbelief does not go that far. Like the unacknowledged consent issues between Simon and Daphne it's kind of a deal breaker for me.

What I find frustrating is that Kate HAD this storyline, but it played out in the background and they didn't really ever properly focus on her until the very end. Edwina got more of a leading lady arc than Kate IMO. And this was absolutely not needed. What is interesting is that they flipped the narrative of the book in the sense that Anthony does the emotional work earlier and better than Kate in the series and then is helping her along on her emotional journey, which I thought was nice. But again, it would have been good if more attention was paid to Kate and she was more centralized as the heroine of the series. And yeah, two headstrong control freaks doesn't always make for the easiest relationship in real life, I'd guess. OTOH, they can check each other. You kinda saw how Anthony, but particularly Kate, had isolated themselves because they were too busy managing everything and forgot to live. A more easygoing person might just shrug and let it happen even when it becomes destructive. OTOH, Anthony started a positive way the dynamic can play out at the end where he kept on drawing Kate out of her usual MO. And I do think the sledgehammer way they both go about it is sometimes needed. We saw how a lot of what Violet/Daphne or Mary/Edwina tried for them just didn't reach.

Yeah, Penelope invented LW and did so banking on the fact that she can use both servant gossip and people/friends/family unwittingly telling her things that she can then use for her writing. Betraying confidences is her business model. Saying that she could have been even worse about that and hurt people even more than she already did, I don't know how much that carries tbh. And I do think at this point Pen has become rather conflicted about parts of what she is doing as well, recognizing that she is furthering the toxicity of a society that she claims to mock. I do think some of it is also their decision to make LW so much more malicious than she is in the books. Having her ruin lives makes for fun drama, but they don't seem quite committed to have that conflict play out with Penelope. And adding to that, while NC is great she also does not look like a teenager at all IMO. Penelope being a teen who starts the LW enterprise without quite realizing what the consequences will be and then also making decisions in the impetous way teenagers are wont to do would make her actions more understandable. But since Nicola reads as adult and making these decisions in a more calculated fashion...

Yeah, they are basically engaged in a game of chicken now.😉 I do think Kate getting so single-minded about thinking that she knows what is best for Edwina sends her on a collision course with reality no matter what outcome. She can't manage her sister forever and what will she do once Edwina is married and has to fend for herself. There is a fine line between protecting and smothering.

Structurally, Kate being so much in supporting roles in the series works to a certain extent because she is constantly casting herself as such. And it does come together when she is encouraged in the last episode to make herself the center of her own life at last. But yeah, for all that she is presented as headstrong and full of bravado, Kate in the series is also strangely passive and closed off. Edwina has to free both Anthony and Kate from that engagement tangle. Anthony from that point on is taking his life into his own hands. And if Kate had rejected him, he'd have been heartbroken but also open to healing and finding love again IMO. Because he reached a breakthrough regarding his whole outlook in life. And Kate is basically positioned as the supporting act in these character arcs for them, to me. Which is fine as long as you give her an arc of her own as well. But she's never properly centered in the show as she was in the book. So yeah, her insecurities in the show manifest themselves perhaps even more strongly than in the novel through her rigidity, her inability to let herself be open and vulnerable for so long. But they're of a reactive, background kind and give her too little room for development until the very end in episode 8 basically. It's the big writing mistake of the season IMO.

I fall somewhere in between when it comes to the execution of the Kate/Anthony romance. Agree that they told a different story in season two about two control freak micromanagers who had so thrown themselves into doing their duty and trying to make everyone else happy that they lost themselves. And it was very moving in parts. But I do think there was a bit of an imbalance that is frustrating. IMO Anthony absolutely got the leading man story arc and treatment. Everything about his journey is beautifully realized and acted. Kate did sometimes come across as a supporting act in various other people's plots, not only Anthony's. Because they kept her in "stubborn, rigid" mode for so long (too long for me), that can create a distance with the character. Simone Ashley, though she has been very positive otherwise, has made some comments where between the lines IMO you can pick up that she agrees that they left Kate's transformation and development too late by cramming it only into the last episodes and that it frustrated her as an actor.